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Warbirds & Classics Over Michigan, June 5th and 6th 2010

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Warbirds & Classics Over Michigan, June 5th and 6th 2010

Old 05-23-2010, 08:29 PM
  #1  
CorsairJock
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Default Warbirds & Classics Over Michigan, June 5th and 6th 2010

That time of year again: Michigan's BIGGEST/ most attended Warbird event. As usual, it is a weekend long one, AND FREE CAMPING is allowed on site (but there are no hookups).
No entry fee (for pilots), no judging, just fly with (or against) fellow warbirds (and classics?)

1st, C.A.R.D.S. website:
http://www.cardsrc.com/2010/wom/

NOTE: the words "& Classics" has been added this year. I don't know why the CD felt something needed to be added, since it already has a very large following. My worry is that it will detract some (but hopefully not too much) from the warbird theme.

2nd, Interactive Map (you can enter starting address and it will provide step by step driving instructions and maps):
http://maps.yahoo.com/#mvt=h&lat=42....I%2048837-9440

This is about 15 miles south west of Lansing, Michigan (state capitol), and easily accessed from I-69.

This flying site is as good as it gets: main runway is east/ west and about 1000 feet long, alternate north/ south runway (used only when crosswing are excessive on main) about 500 feet. Pilot have their backs to the sun.

3rd, Weather (will be updated as event time approaches):
http://www.weather.com/weather/weekend/USMI0342?role=

4th, links to past events:
2009:
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_88...tm.htm#8820242
2008:
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=7533281
2007:
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_59...tm.htm#5923736
2006:
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_43...tm.htm#4342111
2005:
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=1879895
2004:
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_18...tm.htm#1879895
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Old 05-27-2010, 04:42 PM
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Default RE: Warbirds & Classics Over Michigan, June 5th and 6th 2010

NO ELECTRIC AIRCRAFT WILL BE ALLOWED TO FLY DURING THIS EVENT!!!

Just found out today via e-mail with C.A.R.D.S. member.

He also informed me that this is stated on the event Poster. WHAT POSTER? It sure can't be found at the club website, NOR is anything stated in the AMA event description.

OK, Count Me Out!!! 3 out of 4 of my '60 size' warbirds are electric powered. The other has a Saito 100.

These warbirds will NOT be at this event (Hangar 9 Corsair, Top Flite Mustang, Top Flite P-47, Global/ VQ Bf-108):
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Old 05-27-2010, 09:39 PM
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Default RE: Warbirds & Classics Over Michigan, June 5th and 6th 2010

WHY WOULD THEY DO THIS JIM?????
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Old 05-31-2010, 01:30 PM
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Default RE: Warbirds & Classics Over Michigan, June 5th and 6th 2010

ORIGINAL: prop wash

WHY WOULD THEY DO THIS JIM?????
Tom, I can only speculate, as no reason was given. My guess is that the reasoning for an ‘electric free warbird event’ is the recent popularity of park flyers, which I admit CAN be an overwhelming and annoying, because of their shear numbers and the fact that they (like helicopters) tend to loiter over the runway. Maybe they don't belong at a regular R/C flying site, since by design: they are intended to be flown from parks and/ or small areas.

But, IF that is the case: a more common sense approach would be to ban or limit park flyers (as defined by AMA: any aircraft 2 lbs or less, etc.), IMO. But, it is these very types of aircraft that are getting so many newcomers into the hobby right now.

Of course, another possible reason (as someone suggested in another thread): someone doesn't like me?

Whatever, what really ticks me off is that I have done so much to promote this event in past years.

I influenced Daryll (from Sierra retracts) into participating a couple of years ago, and he showed up with an electric powered Bronco and really put quite the crowd pleasing shows with it.

Last year, I influenced Sam Parfitt (author of ROAD TRIPS: 2010) into coming and camping out there. My wife and I even made breakfast for him, and offered to do the same this year (sorry Sam, I won't be there).

This year, I had talked 2 different groups (families) into coming as spectators, but they no longer want to go to it since they are more intrested in electric warbirds. BTW: the CARDS do not charge fees to pilots, they charge to spectators ($5 a carload).

EVERY year (including this year) I start a thread about it here at RCU, to promote this event and usually follow up with pictures, since no-one in the CARDS seem to want to do it. And over the years, I've met many warbird pilots who were there because they heard about it from the threads here at RCU.

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Old 05-31-2010, 01:53 PM
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Default RE: Warbirds & Classics Over Michigan, June 5th and 6th 2010

Well Jim, I would have to say that that is the stupidest thing I have ever seen. I can't believe that they would eliminate the electrics. If there was an issue with size of the plane then put a wing size requirement. I personally am not a huge electric fan but I wouldn't even think about eliminating them from my Warbird Fly-In. That will eliminate a lot of nice looking Warbirds that is for sure. I don't think that was a well thought out plan.

You can always come on down here to my event in September, Jim.

Joe
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Old 05-31-2010, 09:14 PM
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Default RE: Warbirds & Classics Over Michigan, June 5th and 6th 2010

It does state that open (including electric) flying is permitted after 5:00pm on Saturday, and after 1:00PM Sunday.
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Old 06-01-2010, 04:40 AM
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Default RE: Warbirds & Classics Over Michigan, June 5th and 6th 2010

ORIGINAL: ram3500-RCU
It does state that open (including electric) flying is permitted after 5:00pm on Saturday, and after 1:00PM Sunday.
Those are non-event times. That is: the event is over for the day, and open flying will be allowed, so the 3D guys will be out there as well, trainees, etc.
No, I certianly wouldn't count that time as being a warbird event, I've been there before: the locals can't wait to get their field back for some hot-dogging.
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Old 06-01-2010, 09:09 AM
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Default RE: Warbirds & Classics Over Michigan, June 5th and 6th 2010

I think the problem was to many foamies,made it hard for the big planes to fly, I think they should just limit the foamies
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Old 06-01-2010, 10:02 AM
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Default RE: Warbirds & Classics Over Michigan, June 5th and 6th 2010

I agree with Jester.

I don't think it was targeted to all electrics, just the small foamies.

At most of the events that I fly, Warbirds Over Delaware, Joe Nall, Indiana Warbird Campaign, etc. the foamie warbirds fly after hours.


I was at this event last year and the Foamies did get way out of hand, not just for the giant scale but for all sizes.


That being said, this is also a flight line control issue. It is up to the flight line boss to control the skies.


I hope they can resolve this.


See everyone there this weekend!
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Old 06-01-2010, 06:21 PM
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Default RE: Warbirds & Classics Over Michigan, June 5th and 6th 2010

ORIGINAL: jetster
I think the problem was to many foamies,made it hard for the big planes to fly, I think they should just limit the foamies
Then the solution is simple: instead of targeting ALL electrics, prohibit 'Park Flyers'. AMA has a new pilot category: "Park Pilot Program". To qualify for this reduced cost membership ($29.95/ year), such pilots must fly aircraft with the following restrictions: "Aircraft must not exceed 2 pounds, 60 mph, and may not be powered with an internal combustion engine". So to eliminate the 'electric foamies', prohibit "Park Flyers as defined by the AMA under the Park Pilot Program".

So simple, a caveman can do it ( but NOT a CARDS man )
Here's to common sense: Deliveryman, take the Miller High Life away from the CARDS.

ORIGINAL: hdwideglide03
.............................. You can always come on down here to my event in September, Jim.
Joe
Thanks for the invite Joe, but the Cincy area is a little too far for me (300+ miles?). I sometimes DO travel that far to events, but only when I am headed in that general direction anyway for something else.
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Old 06-01-2010, 07:09 PM
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Default RE: Warbirds & Classics Over Michigan, June 5th and 6th 2010


ORIGINAL: CorsairJock

Here's to common sense: Deliveryman, take the Miller High Life away from the CARDS.

ORIGINAL: hdwideglide03
.............................. You can always come on down here to my event in September, Jim.
Joe
Thanks for the invite Joe, but the Cincy area is a little too far for me (300+ miles?). I sometimes DO travel that far to events, but only when I am headed in that general direction anyway for something else.
First Jim the High Life comment. Absolutely hilarious!!!!!!!!!!!! Second, I understand on the distance.

Joe
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Old 06-01-2010, 07:24 PM
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Default RE: Warbirds & Classics Over Michigan, June 5th and 6th 2010

Well Jim,it appears that common sence lost out again.I must say that I enjoy your "E'S" at the War Bird day at Wheeler Indiana and wish I could get more pilots to come to our WBD.Last year we had a special time for the "Foamies" but the day was for war birds E G or glow.Too bad the "Cards" have caused a big problem.I sure won't be there.There are many other WBD's around to enjoy.Look at Sam Parfit [sp].
Tom
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Old 06-01-2010, 11:49 PM
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Default RE: Warbirds & Classics Over Michigan, June 5th and 6th 2010

About all I can really suggest is bring it up to Gerry Kesler, the CD for the event. If you want his phone number I can PM it to whoever, obviously I'm not going to post it here (and have never felt comfortable putting it on the website, it is on the brochures for the event though, so I will pass it on to those that ask). I honestly don't know the reasons behind the decision, although I do think it's related to not wanting to have some of the smaller electrics flying with the larger gas planes. And no, I honestly don't know why they didn't just restrict it to requiring a certain size plane.

I honestly don't have any real insights into the decision, because I wasn't around whenever it might have been discussed, so like I said, I'd suggest taking to Gerry about it. Obviously it's something that I personally suspect will be looked at again for future years, especially since it's getting more and more possible to get some much larger electric planes.

As for it not being on the website, well, obviously that is my fault, and I'm sorry about that. It comes from not paying enough attention myself and copying too much from last years stuff.

(FWIW, any comments I made in this post should be taken as my own personal comments, and not as a position from the CARDS club. )
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Old 06-02-2010, 02:42 PM
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Default RE: Warbirds & Classics Over Michigan, June 5th and 6th 2010

Well, it's good to see someone from the CARDS contributing to this thread, and I do really appreciate someone stepping forward and accepting responsibility (for the late internet notification of the 'no- electric power' clause).

I did send Gerry and e-mail about 2 days ago, at least I assume it was him (it was to the e-mail address provided in the AMA ads). In any event, even tho I refrained from abusive language: I haven't heard back from him.

I may take it up with Gerry in person: I am now planning on attending on Sunday, since I will be in the nieghborhood anyway. I will be on my way home from Howell, MI, where I will stay after attending/ participating in a warbird event near Pontiac, MI on Sat. I will be able to fly ALL of my warbirds there.

I will be able to get a few flights in on my Saito powered Top Flite P-47. I wonder if I will at least be able to display my Mustang?
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Old 06-02-2010, 04:27 PM
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Default RE: Warbirds & Classics Over Michigan, June 5th and 6th 2010

Corsair jock, I remember having a brief discussion with you at a show and your telling me how you sometimes flew some small electric stuff "just to p*** them (the CARDS) off". Maybe that has some bearing on their attitude towards electrics.
They put on a good show at a top notch facility
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Old 06-02-2010, 04:34 PM
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Default RE: Warbirds & Classics Over Michigan, June 5th and 6th 2010

ORIGINAL: JL1
Corsair jock, I remember having a brief discussion with you at a show and your telling me how you sometimes flew some small electric stuff ''just to p*** them (the CARDS) off''. Maybe that has some bearing on their attitude towards electrics.
They put on a good show at a top notch facility
WOW! That's quite the absurd accusation there JL1, what did I do to p*ss you off to the point of fabricating such a lie?
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Old 06-02-2010, 06:06 PM
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Default RE: Warbirds & Classics Over Michigan, June 5th and 6th 2010

Gee, you talked to me at a show
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Old 06-02-2010, 09:14 PM
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Default RE: Warbirds & Classics Over Michigan, June 5th and 6th 2010


ORIGINAL: CorsairJock

I may take it up with Gerry in person: I am now planning on attending on Sunday, since I will be in the nieghborhood anyway. I will be on my way home from Howell, MI, where I will stay after attending/ participating in a warbird event near Pontiac, MI on Sat. I will be able to fly ALL of my warbirds there.
I'm glad you found an event as an alternative for at least the one day. I've never emailed Gerry before, so have no idea how much he checks email. But obviously, getting feedback on things like this is what hopefully makes for a better event in future years.

Hopefully the weather works out for the weekend. Looks like after about 8am there shouldn't be much in the way of precipitation. NWS is saying about .05 inches of rain during the day.
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