New Top Flite P-40 60 sized arf
03-29-2016, 08:35 PM
#631
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Location: Waterford, MI
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Yes, the manual shows CG being measured with the gear down but its a mistake to do so. Especially if you are using larger scale sized wheels that are far heavier than the stock foam ones that come with the ARF. I called TF when building mine and they said the stock wheels are so light they effect the CG minimally but if you are using anything else your asking for trouble if you do the CG with the gear down on this model. A little nose heavy on approach is perfectly fine. Keep the model in a nose down attitude on the final, more so than on other models...flaps fully deployed and drive it in with the throttle. Mines 14.3 lbs (yeah thats right) with YS 120AC swinging a 16X10X3 and flies well with the new airfoil vs the Gold edition kit but its no 3D foam plane...scale.
You can see my P40 in this video I made of our weekly warbird flying we do every Tuesday at our club. First you see my Zero, then my P40-shown in various stages of mods as I flew it as I did them. Final is # 43 in the vid...watch full res, full screen and sound up.
Enjoy, fellas!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_k7...c&spfreload=10
You can see my P40 in this video I made of our weekly warbird flying we do every Tuesday at our club. First you see my Zero, then my P40-shown in various stages of mods as I flew it as I did them. Final is # 43 in the vid...watch full res, full screen and sound up.
Enjoy, fellas!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_k7...c&spfreload=10
03-30-2016, 05:27 AM
#632
That looks like a fun group you fly with! I wish there was more interest in these planes in my club...I'm one of the few who flys anything other than foamy warbirds. We had a guy who is a 3D expert get a TF GS Corsair last summer but he wrecked it doing a go around.
You are of course correct about how to check the CG on a P-40, Corsair, etc. when using heavy wheels/struts. You're plane looks great, but I think mine will fly nicely at 11 lbs rather than 14+.
You are of course correct about how to check the CG on a P-40, Corsair, etc. when using heavy wheels/struts. You're plane looks great, but I think mine will fly nicely at 11 lbs rather than 14+.
03-30-2016, 05:45 AM
#633
Senior Member
Guys, it's so very simple to accurately measure where the CG is, why not find out it's location with the gear up and with the gear down. Then you'll have accurate info to work with.
As for the wheels being heavy or whatever, the suggested CG location doesn't change based on wheel weight or any single component's weight. Balancing at the suggested CG is something worth doing as suggested.
It's sensible to do the first flight with the CG at the suggested location with the gear the way the plane will be on takeoff and landing, with the gear down. Discovering exactly where it is with the gear up is interesting, but not really important at all. Shifting 2 or 3 ounces on an 11 pound model really won't turn it into a demon.
As for the wheels being heavy or whatever, the suggested CG location doesn't change based on wheel weight or any single component's weight. Balancing at the suggested CG is something worth doing as suggested.
It's sensible to do the first flight with the CG at the suggested location with the gear the way the plane will be on takeoff and landing, with the gear down. Discovering exactly where it is with the gear up is interesting, but not really important at all. Shifting 2 or 3 ounces on an 11 pound model really won't turn it into a demon.
03-30-2016, 09:42 AM
#634
I always balance at the suggested cg, but with the P-40 the gear swings back behind the CG enough that with the 4" robart tires I am using the plane will cause the cg to shift back enough to make the tail touch the ground while suspended from the vanessa rig. That is a significant change in balance. Your right if using foam wheels which weigh nothing.
03-30-2016, 10:08 AM
#635
I always balance at the suggested cg, but with the P-40 the gear swings back behind the CG enough that with the 4" robart tires I am using the plane will cause the cg to shift back enough to make the tail touch the ground while suspended from the vanessa rig. That is a significant change in balance. Your right if using foam wheels which weigh nothing.
03-30-2016, 09:12 PM
#639
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We're fortunate to have a great group to fly with but we built that over 20 years of getting together to fly warbirds...it didn't just happen. Non completive, sharing and fun with no egos will do it every time.
The P40 and other airplane designs with the gear retracting back wards balancing with the gear up is really the only way to do it right. Again, if your more of a sport flyer and use wire gear and the thin foam wheels the arf came with it won't matter much as they themselves weigh little but I'm more of a scale guy so, my wheels are robart 4.5 inch with home made hubs and home made scale oleos and that does make a huge difference in changing the CG..they are heavy but they are correct for scale.
At 14 lbs the plane flies quite well and with the YS120AC making 16lbs of thrust with the 3 blade it has almost unlimited vertical - you just have to be careful of tight turns and abrupt control surface changes, just like the full scale. Also penetrates much better in windy conditions and isn't knocked around as much as lighter models.
Enjoy your builds! Its all good...
The P40 and other airplane designs with the gear retracting back wards balancing with the gear up is really the only way to do it right. Again, if your more of a sport flyer and use wire gear and the thin foam wheels the arf came with it won't matter much as they themselves weigh little but I'm more of a scale guy so, my wheels are robart 4.5 inch with home made hubs and home made scale oleos and that does make a huge difference in changing the CG..they are heavy but they are correct for scale.
At 14 lbs the plane flies quite well and with the YS120AC making 16lbs of thrust with the 3 blade it has almost unlimited vertical - you just have to be careful of tight turns and abrupt control surface changes, just like the full scale. Also penetrates much better in windy conditions and isn't knocked around as much as lighter models.
Enjoy your builds! Its all good...
04-10-2016, 12:56 PM
#641
The Kansas winds stopped howling for the first time in a month and I flew the new plane 4 flights. The VVRC 20 pulled the plane with authority at full power and idled down well for landing. The plane has a beautiful presence in the air. The CG as specified in the manual is very nose heavy. I moved the 1600 mah LiFe back from under the tank to the back of the wing and it helped a little, but still nose heavy. Landings are very nice....full flaps and 1/4 throttle and fly it down to the runway and then reduce power and round out for a nice wheel landing just like the real deal. The EFlight landing gear seem to be a winner.
04-10-2016, 01:09 PM
#642
radfordc,
Congrats on a successful maiden. I wasn't worried at all. If you are running a 2-blade prop, we've found that the 17x8N APC prop really works well on the 20cc engines in the warbirds.
Looks like we'll be flying Wednesday and Thursday at the Sunchasers field and several guys will likely be coming out. You'd be very welcome to come over!
Congrats on a successful maiden. I wasn't worried at all. If you are running a 2-blade prop, we've found that the 17x8N APC prop really works well on the 20cc engines in the warbirds.
Looks like we'll be flying Wednesday and Thursday at the Sunchasers field and several guys will likely be coming out. You'd be very welcome to come over!
04-10-2016, 02:11 PM
#643
radfordc, congrads. I've had mine together for months and only have three flights. Too windy, rain, snow, either one or the other or all at once. Considering retiring and moving south.
04-16-2016, 07:08 PM
#646
The weather was ok today and got two flights on the P-40. Ran and flew good. Take offs were without incident. The air was a little rough but was able to do all manuvers ok. Both landing good ones on the main gear. Five flights on this plane with out problems. That is something for a warbird.
04-17-2016, 04:50 AM
#647
My project has been stalled by my retract setup: I engineered the wing to accept the old Robart mechanical rotating retracts with individual hi torq servos (a system that worked GREAT on my H-9 Hellcat), but I just can't get them to operate reliably enough to want to continue the project. Lack or room in the wing for servo AND wheels is biggest problem, linkages need to be straight.
ANYWAY, I modified the wing to accept this setup, and it would be a major problem to get my Lados to work in it, SO,.. I am on the fence about ordering a brand new wing for it, and installing my Lados into it. It would be quick and easy, I could be flying it by summer.
ANYWAY, I modified the wing to accept this setup, and it would be a major problem to get my Lados to work in it, SO,.. I am on the fence about ordering a brand new wing for it, and installing my Lados into it. It would be quick and easy, I could be flying it by summer.
04-24-2016, 10:06 AM
#649
Got one more flight on the P-40 the other days. There was a quartering cross wind from the left but the takeoff was ok. Flew great. Did all the warbird maneuvers. Rolls, loops, cuban eights, reverses, immulmans, split S. This particular DLE 20 is running really good and has plenty of power for this plane. The cross wind became stronger as I was flying so I ended up make a high speed landing with half flaps diagonal across the runway, but went well. The cross wind got worse and more cross, so I quit. Five flights total and all mixes and trims are about right. I really like the way this plane flys.