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Dune Runner Powerless

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Old 07-23-2012, 05:52 PM
  #1
recsx
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Default Dune Runner Powerless

Hello people, Ijust purchased a brand new Dune Runner 30cc about a week ago and I have managed to get everything checked out and ready to run. I've ran it about half a dozen times and had issues with take off power and performance. I searched google and found information on how it should be set and done so according to those instruction and it ran much better, but still I cannot get take off power, it bogs like hell on take off and won;t even climb a simple 20% grade hill. Once I get moving it start to get into a semi good power band but soon looses momentum once I turn a hard corner. Now! I've searched youtube and found lots of racing videos where guy are racing 1/5th scale gas buggy's and man they have insane power, the actually pull wheelies on take off and while moving at a good speed. I know a stock car won;t have all that power that avid racers would have in souped up cars but man! common a brand new 30cc buggy should at least be able to spin the tires like hell on take off and mine does not. Man I remember when I was young and I had a Moped that had more power than that and it had to carry my big ass down the road.

Some help would be greatly appreciated.
PS: My buddies at the field laughed at me when I purchased this thing and said I should have bought an HPIand said Redcat was junk! let pull together and prove them wrong.

Thanks
Ray
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Old 07-24-2012, 07:52 AM
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Default RE: Dune Runner Powerless

Most of us are more experienced in the smaller scale vehicles. You may have better luck getting help in the giant scale forums.
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Old 07-24-2012, 03:14 PM
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Default RE: Dune Runner Powerless

nothin wrong with the redcat 1/5's.

I had bought a KM baja (hpi clone) and thought it was a great deal....till I raced a guy with a redcat rampage. That rampage smoked my baja in every way!


Now, on to your issue.

These engines are pretty simple overall. You have to look at the problem like if it was a weed wacker or chain saw.

You low-end power is very poor. This sounds like a engine running rich.

You have to have the choke off (once you have the motor started and idling)

You will want to adjust the low speed needle. there are 3 adjustments...the idle, low speed and high speed.

If the buggy is fine once its moving...then the high speed needle should be set right.

If adjusting the low speed needle makes no improvement....then there may be an air leak...

Check the gasket at the car(and the bolts) or check the muffler is on good.

If you buddies were good friends, they would help you diagnose the issue instead of wraggin on you. It sounds like they know 2 stroke motors, so they should be able to find the issue.
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Old 07-26-2012, 07:48 AM
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Default RE: Dune Runner Powerless

I hear you and have checked all of those and believe that I have the engine tuned to the best that it can be based on other YouTube videos of the same stock buggy. Isent an email out to Daves Motors and explained my situation and he told me the best thing I can do is put a Tuned Pipe on it and it will wake that engine up like no tomorrow. He said that stock it has about 1.47 HP and with a Tuned Pipe I can get close to 3 HP, thats nearly doubled. I searched again on YouTube and found guy's with the same buggy with a Tuned Pipe on it and wow! man they rip like crazy, now! that's what I was looking for.

So... this is what I was told to do;
1) Get a Tuned Pipe
2) Install Red Clutch springs to get the revs up before engaging.
3) Get a better air filter system to let more air in.

With those basic 3 things I am told that this buggy will turn into a beast that can actually wheelie on take off and at speeds.

Thanks for the info guys I am off to spend some money. PS: Oh ha! have to buy a bigger steering servo, the stock on is already starting to skip.


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ORIGINAL: nitrosportsandrunner

nothin wrong with the redcat 1/5's.

I had bought a KM baja (hpi clone) and thought it was a great deal....till I raced a guy with a redcat rampage. That rampage smoked my baja in every way!


Now, on to your issue.

These engines are pretty simple overall. You have to look at the problem like if it was a weed wacker or chain saw.

You low-end power is very poor. This sounds like a engine running rich.

You have to have the choke off (once you have the motor started and idling)

You will want to adjust the low speed needle. there are 3 adjustments...the idle, low speed and high speed.

If the buggy is fine once its moving...then the high speed needle should be set right.

If adjusting the low speed needle makes no improvement....then there may be an air leak...

Check the gasket at the car(and the bolts) or check the muffler is on good.

If you buddies were good friends, they would help you diagnose the issue instead of wraggin on you. It sounds like they know 2 stroke motors, so they should be able to find the issue.
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Old 07-26-2012, 04:26 PM
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Default RE: Dune Runner Powerless

yeh, the steering servos on redcats, and other lower cost 1/5's generally have to be upgraded. Heck, even most HPI baja owners upgrade their stock servos.

I might have been mistaken, i thought the buggy could hardly get moving from a stop? If thats the case, a tuned pipe wont do much.

I wonder if your clutch/shoes or bell is damaged? If it is, then its possible its not grabbing good.



side note, a tuned pipe wont increase HP as the guy said. Now, it will make a huge difference in performance. How? Tuned pipes are just that...they TUNE the power of the motor. Yes, there is some increase in actual HP, but it wont double as he suggested.

I had a KM baja. I put on a tuned pipe and the low end power felt like it doubled! See, the pipe allowed the motor to perform better at lower RPMs.

There are pipes to tune your motor for max HP at high rpms, and there are ones that tune for max torque on the low end.(which is the one I put on my baja)

Some will claim to tune over the entire powerband...and they do to a degree.

Just look at that stock muffler. Its just that a muffler....something that prevents the motor from breathing well. Nearly anything is an improvement over that block...lol

So, a pipe is worth the $$$. But make sure your clutch is grabbing as it should. Also, what does your exhaust looke like when your punch the throttle?
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Old 07-27-2012, 05:43 AM
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Default RE: Dune Runner Powerless

I guess I must have explained this wrong from the get go. Ibeleive the Dune Runner is performing as expected by the manufacturer, I just was not impressed with the lower end power band Iexpected this thing to spin like hell on take off like an electric or a glow would. Iwathced other videos of people who have the same buggy and by the looks of it theirs performs the same as mine. With the stock muffler it seems that the good power band is at about 1/3 of the total speed, this is when it really starts to fish tail and you can hear and see the power coming out of the motor. What I was looking for or asking about was getting the power at take off or lower end because in my eyes if you are going to race and do jumps and stunts you need that snap at the begining and mid range, not offten will you need it at blazing speeds and the stock setup does not have that.

I purchased a tuned pipe from Hobby King yesterday for about 30 bucks, it has good reviews. I will post back about it once I get it. Yes yes yes I know this is probably not the greatest thing out there but for 30 bucks you can't go wrong compared to $175 bucks like most other types, who knows it may just work well and if so then I saved big $$$.

Keep you posted. Cheers.
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Old 07-27-2012, 05:52 AM
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Default RE: Dune Runner Powerless

Hey nitrosportsandrunner do you sell Redcat products? I just noticed your SIG has a link to ebay store.
If this is the case then you must have tried many models. Have you tried or seen a stock Dune Runner 30cc go?
I am just asking cause then we may have a basis to compare what you have seen to what mine performs at.
Like I said in all my previous posts, I did a complete overview of the buggy and there does not seem to be anything wrong with it, I think what we have here is a case of Stock sickness, I think this is just the way it works out of the box and my description of it's performance is very low grade, meaning I am giving it a failing grade. It's just not what Iexpected I expected this thing to wale like a YZ Dirtbike.
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Old 07-27-2012, 07:31 AM
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Default RE: Dune Runner Powerless


Quote:
ORIGINAL: recsx

Hey nitrosportsandrunner do you sell Redcat products? I just noticed your SIG has a link to ebay store.
If this is the case then you must have tried many models. Have you tried or seen a stock Dune Runner 30cc go?
I am just asking cause then we may have a basis to compare what you have seen to what mine performs at.
Like I said in all my previous posts, I did a complete overview of the buggy and there does not seem to be anything wrong with it, I think what we have here is a case of Stock sickness, I think this is just the way it works out of the box and my description of it's performance is very low grade, meaning I am giving it a failing grade. It's just not what I expected I expected this thing to wale like a YZ Dirtbike.
Hi, yep I have an ebay store and sell Redcat products.
I havent owned a redcat 1/5 myself. Tho I have seen/heard a rampage MT before. It ran along with my KM baja and made my KM look like a joke.

If you can make a youtube vid...then post a link I can tell you if its just a tuning issue...or if the motor maybe has a serious issue.
With my KM baja (23cc motor, clone model, similar in some ways to the redcat) the tuned pipe did make a huge difference in the "off the line" performance. And I know there are a few aftermarket pipe offerings for the redcat 1/5's
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Old 07-29-2012, 03:40 PM
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Default RE: Dune Runner Powerless

I will post something once the Tune Pipe has come in and I have tested it, until then I'm not going to do much with it, I am sure the issue is with the muffler. My buddy has an HPI baja and his has way more power than mine on take off, but he was the first to notice that the baja sock mufler is WAY! bigger than the Redcat and this could be the reason for more power on take off not to mention an HPIis two wheel drive whereas the Redcat is 4x4.

In anyway I will post a vid once the pipe comes in and see what the difference is before and after.

Thanks again for the help.
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Old 07-30-2012, 08:00 AM
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Default RE: Dune Runner Powerless

Yes the tuned pipe a 8,000k clutch spring will really wake the motor up. Which pipe are you getting? Also what 2 stroke oil are you using? Get a good synthetic racing 2 stroke oil and you can mix 32 to 1 instead of 25 to 1 and you will see a power increase also. The HPI air filter will be the best to run also.
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Old 07-30-2012, 08:05 AM
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Default RE: Dune Runner Powerless

Also wanted to add that if you run a 8K spring will increase your take off power the you can switch your A and B gears around the first to gears swap and that will give you more top speed.
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Old 07-30-2012, 08:40 AM
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Default RE: Dune Runner Powerless

I don't really want to get more top speed I really just want more bottom end, If I swap the gears to get more top end I am sure this will reduce the bottom end torque.

I am using Lucas Semi Synthetic oil at 25:1 for now until my gallon is gone.


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ORIGINAL: rchobbyunlimited

Also wanted to add that if you run a 8K spring will increase your take off power the you can switch your A and B gears around the first to gears swap and that will give you more top speed.
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Old 07-30-2012, 09:15 PM
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Quote:
ORIGINAL: recsx

I don't really want to get more top speed I really just want more bottom end, If I swap the gears to get more top end I am sure this will reduce the bottom end torque.

I am using Lucas Semi Synthetic oil at 25:1 for now until my gallon is gone.


Quote:
ORIGINAL: rchobbyunlimited

Also wanted to add that if you run a 8K spring will increase your take off power the you can switch your A and B gears around the first to gears swap and that will give you more top speed.
No you will not give up any bottom end torque once you have changed to the 8k spring thats why I had said that after you change your clutch spring to the 8K then do this.

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Old 07-30-2012, 09:49 PM
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Default RE: Dune Runner Powerless

Wanted to ask what is your spark plug looking like? Have you done the plug test? Do a high speed run away form you immediatly turn the car around and do a high speed run back to you immediatly kill the  engine and pull the plug out. It should be a brown paper bag color to let you know that the engine is tuned right.
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Old 08-04-2012, 05:00 PM
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Default RE: Dune Runner Powerless

Yup, the plug is nice paper bag brown. Just to add a little bit here, I just spent the whole day today 12! hours! taketing this thing apart bolt by bolt and every screw, I did this because the last run I did I hit a little bit of wet grass and little after I put the buggy away. A few days later a went into my shed to get it and found that it was rusted beyond recognition!!!! it was so sad and depresing that Iended up taking the whole thing apart. Well! it was a good thing that I did, #1 I learned how the whole thing works and goes together #2 I realized that running these things on gravel type dirt is a VERYBAD THING!, my tires are finished like I mean they are rip to shreds from doing drifts on gravel and not to mention my sway arms are hevely pitted as well. Never the less I fixed everything up and lubed it all up with lithium greass. #3 before I pit the engine back in I played with the gears starting at the clutch end I would turn it and count the turns it would take to make one full turn of the main drive shaft ( the shaft comming off of the spur gear) from factory it would take 3 turn to make one full turn, Iended up shwaping all of the gears around ( not just 2 of them) but all four, I don't remember exactly the order because Ihad to try multiple combinations until Iended up getting about 3 and 1/3 turns of the gear at the clutch to one full turn of the main shaft. I have not tried it yet but to me this tells me that the engine will force a heck!!! of a lot less than before and will end up giving me more bottom end.

I haven't tried it yet because It ain't 100% back in one piece yet, while I was at it I used a new piece of yellow rink board plastic and made a one piece skid plate that I need to install first and I also painted my shock springs because the bare metal was rusting WAY! too easy and I have to wait for that to dry, perhaps tomorow I will be able to put the springs back on and give it a rip and I will post the results along with a video.

Thanks again guys
Cheers
Ray


Quote:
ORIGINAL: rchobbyunlimited

Wanted to ask what is your spark plug looking like? Have you done the plug test? Do a high speed run away form you immediatly turn the car around and do a high speed run back to you immediatly kill the engine and pull the plug out. It should be a brown paper bag color to let you know that the engine is tuned right.
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