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Tornado fuel problem

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Old 09-13-2009, 10:25 AM
  #1
rmiller6
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Default Tornado fuel problem

Hi,
I'm really hoping someone can help me.....I just got my son aRedcat Tornado (with the SH engine) and I'm getting really frustrated. The car was starting and running OKuntil after cool down of the second to lastbreak-in step when I couldnt get the engine started. I noticed that when I held my finger over the exhaust and pulled the starter that no fuel was running to the fuel line going to the carb.

I assumed I must have an air leak somewhere so I took both fuel lines off and checkedthem for leaks and both are fine. I can get the car started everytime by pouring fuel directly into the carb but the engine quits soon after because no fuel is running to the carb from the tank. The entire system seems OK. Iblew and sucked with my mouth (stupidI know) on the lines to check for leaks while it was partially connected also and everything seems OK as far as I can tell.

Should you be able to blow directly into the carb with the line connected directly to it? I can't seem to get any air to flow in that direction.Any help would be appreciated. My son is really bummed as we still havent had a chance to roost on his new toy yet! Thanks
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Old 09-13-2009, 10:38 AM
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Default RE: Tornado fuel problem

check the o-ring seal that's on top of the fuel tank under the cap. if there is dirt or something on it, it will prevent the cap from sealing tight, and you will not get any fuel pressure in the tank.
also make sure that there are no kinks in the fuel lines (i know, sounds dumb but a TINY kink can give you a major headache)
are you running a fuel filter? if you are, make sure that there is nothing in the filter that would block the flow of fuel.
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Old 09-13-2009, 10:48 AM
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rmiller6
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Default RE: Tornado fuel problem

The fuel tankseems OK and I don't have a filter at this point. IfIremove the fuel line from the carb, cover the exhaust, and pull the startergas comes right out of the linebut when I attach the line to the carb and pull the starter NOgas moves though the line at all. AlsoI can't blow air through the line connected to the carb.Should I be able to? Thanks
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Old 09-13-2009, 10:54 AM
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Default RE: Tornado fuel problem

i don't know, but maybe something got into the carb opening where the line goes on?
if fuel normally flows into the carb, you should be able to blow air into the carb as well.
from what you said, it sounds like there is a blockage in the carb opening where the line goes onto it.
i'd pull the carb line off, turn the car upside down and see if there is anything blocking the fuel from getting into the carb.
maybe a small peice of dirt worked it's way in there and is blocking it?

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Old 09-13-2009, 11:25 AM
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Default RE: Tornado fuel problem

Check the High Speed Needle. That will stop the fuel from getting to the carb if it is too far closed. I just looked at a new Sh and the factory has the needle setting at (High Side Needle 2 turns out from closed, and the Low speed needle 2 1/2 out from closed) Easy way to check and confirm that it is not the low side needle is just hold the throttle fully open when trying to prime, Holding the throtlle open fully will override the LSN. My bet is your High Speed needle is too far closed or you might have some trash in the banjo fitting or the needle.
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Old 09-13-2009, 07:44 PM
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Default RE: Tornado fuel problem


Quote:
ORIGINAL: rmiller6

Hi,
I'm really hoping someone can help me.....I just got my son a Redcat Tornado (with the SH engine) and I'm getting really frustrated. The car was starting and running OK until after cool down of the second to last break-in step when I couldnt get the engine started. I noticed that when I held my finger over the exhaust and pulled the starter that no fuel was running to the fuel line going to the carb.

I assumed I must have an air leak somewhere so I took both fuel lines off and checked them for leaks and both are fine. I can get the car started everytime by pouring fuel directly into the carb but the engine quits soon after because no fuel is running to the carb from the tank. The entire system seems OK. I blew and sucked with my mouth (stupid I know) on the lines to check for leaks while it was partially connected also and everything seems OK as far as I can tell.

Should you be able to blow directly into the carb with the line connected directly to it? I can't seem to get any air to flow in that direction. Any help would be appreciated. My son is really bummed as we still havent had a chance to roost on his new toy yet! Thanks

You already did alot of the checks that can be done.
Re-seat your HSP needle set it at 2.5 turns from seat (depending on the weather, you shouldn't have to turn it more than 1/4 turn lean or rich from now on, you're done with break in pretty much)
Set your LSN needle so it is flush with the collar then turn it about 1.5 to 1 turn in (1.5 should be good, but you will have to find out for your self what is the best.) Idealy you want that LSN at a point where the car takes off like a rocket with no hesitation from a stand still. Once you find that point (making small 1/16th turns at a time) you shouldn't ever have to mess with it again.
Set your Idle needle so there is a 1mm gap at the back of the carb when full brake is on. Idealy you want it set so the car is kind of bumping like it wants to go, but it not moving. Seems like an awful fast idle, but don't worry it's ok.

Also check your exhaust gasket and make sure it's not blown out or leaking fuel. Check the exhaust screws make sure they are tight.

Another thing to check is make sure that you can blow gently into the fuel tank from the exhaust side and fuel comes out the carb side (not hooked up to the carb). If no fuel comes out then you need to take the nipple out where the carb side fuel line hooks up to the tank and find a piece of wire you can feed down into the fuel tank and push the pieces of plastic out. Some times you get little burrs that block the fuel right in that 90 where the nipple screws in, it's from when they thread the nipple into the tank.

Try everything that everyone is suggesting and let us know how it works out for you.
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Old 09-13-2009, 09:01 PM
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Default RE: Tornado fuel problem

I'd like to point out that blowing into the lines by mouth is pretty common...lol....some people choose to prime their engine that way....

when I check for airleaks a remove the fuel line from the pipe and carb...I blow through the pipe end an hold my finger near the opening of the carb end...if I dont feel good air (even if I do I still sometimes) I cover the carb end with my finger and gently blow in the pipe end to see if the lid will pop up....if the lid pops up your good from were the line goes to the pipe and to the carb
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Old 09-13-2009, 09:16 PM
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Default RE: Tornado fuel problem

Quote:
ORIGINAL: firebird78

I'd like to point out that blowing into the lines by mouth is pretty common...lol....some people choose to prime their engine that way....
+1 - heck, I'm startin to like the taste of nitro! [sm=bananahead.gif]

seriously - if you pull the pressure line off the exhaust and blow in it (while the fuel line is connected to the carb), does the fuel move through the line? If fuel moves through the line when you blow on the pressure line, then it would seem like you are losing pressure in your exhaust - maybe an exhaust coupler? If fuel does not move through the line when you blow, then does it seem plugged? If it seems plugged, then the fuel pickup in the tank may be plugged as AAFH suggested, or the carb could be plugged. If it does not seem plugged, then it sound like the tank is leaking pressure - check the lid O ring as suggested.
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Old 09-14-2009, 06:28 PM
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rmiller6
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Default RE: Tornado fuel problem

Thanks everyone for the responses, this is a great forum for newbies like me! I finally figured out my problem. The idle screw was so far backed out (even though I never adusted it from the factory settings) that it was out of the carb barrel notch. The carb barrel was then able to move inward andthe LSN wasstuck closed. This is why I was unable to prime the engine and no gas was getting to the engine from the tank. So...after figuring that out I set all the needles as described above and just finished break-in.

I must still be way out of tune as the engine isproducing next to zerotorque. I was barely ableto drive in the grassand even during break-in I had to push the car to start it rolling at 1/4 throttle on pavement. It seems like the clutch is slipping but I didn't see any talk of a clutch adjustment in the manual. Is the clutch adjustable? I also don't seem to have the car running fast enough to make it shift into 2nd gear as I can't hear it. Is it clearly aubible when the car does shift?

One more concern I have is that the engine puts out next to no smoke (running 20% S&W fuel) but Ibelieve it's running rich by its boggish behavior and I cansee some raw fuel exiting the exhaust.Any suggestions?
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Old 09-14-2009, 06:57 PM
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Default RE: Tornado fuel problem

You really need to start over on the tune. Set it up like I suggested and go from there. You shouldn't have to tune anything but the HSP needle.
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Old 09-14-2009, 07:45 PM
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Default RE: Tornado fuel problem

+1 and yes when the tornado shifts you will hear the motor kick down in rpm.
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Old 10-01-2009, 10:45 AM
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Default RE: Tornado fuel problem

ok hi all i got my tornado S30 i was in the second step of the engine break in when i stopped the car to talk to my pal when i fired it back up about 10 minutes later my pal had the remote in hes hand and then opened the throttle all the way then engine shut down  i tried to start it back but never started .

its 6 degrees Celsius where i live im charging back the glow plug igniter i installed a new glow plug and ill try to start it back in a few hours

the pull start is working fine fuel gets from the tank to the engine except from being the glow plug or the igniter could it be something else (in case it wont start in a few hours )
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