mattfair

This is a little off topic. But I just moved into a new place, and have a room that will be dedicated to hobbies.
I need to get a workbench in there so I can work on my airplanes. I will be putting together a 1/4 scale p-51 from scratch.
What are some of your work areas that you use to put together your airplanes? What are things that you think there should in a hobby room?
Did you build your workbench from scratch or buy it?

Deadeye

The biggest things I can reccomend would be:

1) You can never have enough outlets. Make sure you have plenty.
2) Make your main bench unattached to the walls. A 'walkaround' bench is much better than one where you have access to only one or two sides. Many people buy hollow core doors, and set them on a stand of some type. Hollow core doors are cheap, strong, FLAT, and easy to push pins into.
3) When you think you have enough outlets, count them up and divide by half. Take that number, and install that many more outlets.
4) If you have a lighting choice, I would highly reccomend flourescent lights. They are bright, energy effiecient, and don't cast shadows as badly as incandescent light.
5) Install more outlets.

Hope this helps, and good luck with the workshop!

tom.laird

Hi,
I am also planning a new workshop for later in the year so here is a link to some pics I've collected while trying to get some ideas.

http://www.tomlaird.com/storage/

Also try searching for "workshop" "hanger" "storage" etc in the forums.

Another hint is to ignore the main subject in a photo, normally the plane, and look at the backgrounds. A quick look through a dozen or so mags can be quite usefull.

best regards

Tom Laird

Campy

My Feedback: (1)

My wife recently kicked me out of the basement into a 10 x 16 shed.

After installing a couple of permanent benches against 2 walls I was thinking about a walk around bench. Instead of building one, I saw a workbench on wheels at Home Depot for $100. It has a couple of large drawers in the bottom. I added a 24" x 60" piece of 5/8" ply to the top and Viola ! - instant MOVEABLE workbench with lockable wheels. On top of the ply I have a piece of 2' x 4' ceiling tile. I located several outlets high up at stragic points so I can use the tools. It is nice being able to easily move the work bench if I need additional space.

The only "negative" I found with this setup was:

Because the workbench height is at 39" I need a bar stool for sitting, But it is great for standing - no back strain from bending.


Now I need to figure out a heat source for the shed. It gets a "MITE NIPPY" here in Connecticut for working out there in the winter.

I tried an electric heater, but the shed only has 1 circuit to it and the flourescent lights dimmed substantially when I tried it. Putting another circuit into the shed for a heater is not a viable option right now.

I am leary about a salamander type heater as I also store the gasoline for the snow thrower and lawn mower in a corner of the shed near the door. I tried a Coleman fuel camping heater in the shed, but due to no insulation it isn't going to provide any heat without a fan.

SoCal GliderGuider

Campy, What did the wife do to the basement? As to heating the shed; run a duct from the house furnace. Personally I wouldn't have moved out of the basement. Or found another house with a basement and let the ex-wife have the original.

Matt, Get a shop vac and use it for dust collection. Also make a standing filter box out of a bathroom vent fan and a standard size furnace filter. You would be suprised where all that sanding dust goes to. Oh yes, install more outlets.

BMatthews

Campy, without a good insulation job you're just tossing money away trying to heat the shop with anything.

Running a duct from the house isn't a bad option if the shed is right against the house but if there's more than a couple of foot run that's not really an option. If you can do that then obviously the metal ducting will need to be well insulated as well.

I'm not a fan of fuel based heat for a closed room like that. Anything that burns will consume air and that's not good.

Another option if it's further out from the house is a small stand alone zero clearance natural gas stove. The beauty of these is that they are small and bring in their own combustion air coaxially to the exhaust so you don't consumen your warm inside air and there's no real danger to the blower gas. But I'd be looking to move that "junk" to a second smaller shed pretty quickly! ! !!

As far as shops go my current favourite idea is lower kitchen cabinets with a knee hole space or two and the backsplash type counter top. Some careful shimming and checking will ensure a straight and level top. This gives lots of lower side storage (go heavy on the drawer units even though they are a bit more expensive) and a great place to work on the sub assemblies. For assembly and other dutes I also agree that a walkaround table is good.

If I could only have one or the other I guess it would depend on the layout of the room. Long and skinny would get a kitchen counter setup to maximise space usage. Closer to square and I'd seriously consider a wider center table with narrow wall shelves for power tools like drill press, sander and grinders with storage under and above to best use the space. Things like a vise are also essential and need some room around them. A scroll saw or small bandsaw is another must have to me and that too needs space around it. I'd probably sit it on the corner of the big center table and shift it down to a lower shelf when it gets in the way during assembly when it's not really needed anyway.

Gray Beard

My Feedback: (-1)

When I started building again I was in A 10X12 shed. The first thing I did was wire it with A lot of outlets then insulated it within A inch of it's life then sheet rocked it. I live in the mountains and the weather is extream so I have an airconditioner in the window and an electric heater on the floor. It was/is A nice little workshop but I now have my old mobil home as A shop and life got even better. In both shops I have floresent lighting. If you have to be out there you may as well have it set up as well as you can, take the time and money and just do it.

the-plumber

Gray Beard -

Hotel Willow in Jamestown . . .

Still got that great restaurant ?

the-plumber

Matt -

Many of us have building rooms and even building shops and sheds. Have a look at mine and others to snag some ideas.

SoCal GliderGuider

Now Bruce if he were to shut off all of the other vents in the house and wrap a little insulation around a eight or twelve inch duct then I bet he could heat that darn shed! The house would get a little cold but heck he got kicked out anyway.

mattfair

How well do the air filters that you can buy in the stores good for collecting and filtering out all the sawdust?

the-plumber

Two different tasks : collecting sawdust and filtering shop air. No one machine does both very well; an air filter can only capture airborne particles, but a dust collector captures dust and chips at the site of creation.

The first thing to get is a dust collection system of some sort - capture as much dust as possible _before_ it gets loose into the shop air, and wear a cartridge-type respirator to deal with the stuff that evades capture. A surprising percentage of fine saw dust _will_ evade being captured by the dust collector no matter how well built.

When you can afford one, get a powered air filter.

Keep the respirator for paint and chemical fumes.

See the photo albums "Dust control" and "Large power tools" [link=http://home.mindspring.com/~the-plumber]here.[/link]

dicknadine

when the heaters in the model building shop poop out, there's nothing better than the dinning room table. One rule applies-- have a Forgiving Wife and make D*** sure that you clean up constantly. you also have to have 2 eyes- 1 for the plans and the other watching Sunday football. attached is the 61" Fokker Cll mess, in procces . dick

CoosBayLumber

My Feedback: (1)

Well, I did not read of luxuries by the experts so far.

Just where are the cup holders, the magazine holders, the radio outlet, and the all important easy chair located?

Can't build all the time. You need to let the glue set up every once in awhile.

Wm.

saramos

Hi Mattfair,

I am getting ready to put together a workshop in my garage. I've been thinking about what I want for some time. Here are the areas and features that I've been thinking about.
The garage is approximately 20 x 20. I will have to share some of the space for household storage and a smaller area for my wife to do some crafts. I also will have to store my table saw and compound miter saw too. I hope to fit most of this along one wall and some space up by the garage door. The rest I plan on using for my workshop. The basic design will be cabinets and countertop on two walls in a L configuration, and an island workstation.
For a primary buildboard, I plan on making an island bench 8 feet long, and 3-4 feet wide. I want it at a height that I can work at while standing. This will also mean that I will need a rolling stool or tall chair. I'll install recessed florescent lights above the buildboard. I'll top the board with sheet metal and use magnets and fixtures for building. I'll place power strips on both ends of the bench and perhaps midway on each side. I want the top to overhang the bench frame enough so I can use some clamp on fixtures like a dremel stand, a mini vise, and clamp on lamp.
Along the countertops and cabinets, I want to set up task specific areas. I want to create a cutting station. This area will have a miter saw, mini table saw, scroll saw, disk/belt sander, my drill press, and at some future time, I'll add a band saw.
I plan on doing mostly glass finished models, but I would still like to set up an area where I can cut film and fabric coverings. Perhaps a glass surface in that area.
I would like to have a spot where I can spray paint. I'm not sure if I'll have space for a separate spray booth, so I may end up making a booth that I can assemble on my bench, and disassemble for storage.
I want to set up a second smaller work area to work with molds for making fiberglass parts.
I also want to have a spot for doing vacuum forming, but I may just make a portable vacuum box that I can take to the kitchen and use the oven.
I want to set up an area for working on engines away from the sawdust. Perhaps a rolling bench with a test stand that I can roll outside. I'll set it up with DC power and fuel storage. This would be a good place for storing wrenches and the like.
Storage. I'll build some cabinets wide enough that I can store kits (I already have 5 kits waiting) and plans.
I'll build storage areas designed for hardware and fasteners, radio gear, coverings, resins and glass, wood, plastic and metal. I'll locate the storage areas with the corresponding task workstations. Under the main bench, I want to have storage for the current kit, glues, fillers, some wood, hand tools, sanding tools and the like, and a shop vac. I also want to have storage under the bench for sub assemblies like wings and tail feathers, while other work is on the bench.
Some luxuries I would like to add would be, a mini fridge, a tv with dvd/vhs player, and a computer, scanner, and printer.
The ultimate would be a mini lathe and mill, and a cnc cutter. Perhaps when I win that lottery

Scott

the-plumber

For that I go back up to the house, where the supply of Cent Cinquantinaire is always fresh.
<LCG>

the-plumber

Storage is always an issue. Always.

One tenet is to use flexible storage means. Cabinets that are perhaps configurable, shelving that can be rearranged to suit the items being stored, bins and parts boxes which can accomodate varying sizes of 'stuff'.

I used to use the thing in the first photo. Most folks have or will use a drawer unit like that. It works but is limited on the size of object it can accomodate. The one in the photo is empty, and I just haven't pawned it off on anyone yet. The problem with this type unit is that you can't get all of any one size fastener in one drawer. You can get maybe three lengths of 4-40 socket head machine screws, 4-40 flat washers, and 4-40 nylock nuts in one drawer. If you keep long 4-40 screws, they will occupy their own drawer and nothing else will fit in with them. The drawers are also pretty small, and you can't get very many fasteners in one drawer - maybe a hundred 4-40 X 1/2", but not much larger.

There had to be a better way, and The Redhead Herself found it for me.

It's a 'craft organizer caddy', made by Akro-Mils, item number 08426CW4PK. http://www.action2k.com/akromils.htm carries them these days, but Herself snagged these when Jo-Ann Fabrics carried the things.

They can be free-standing as they have a spring steel bottom 'foot' that snaps into the frame, or they can be bolted back-to-back to make a 12-drawer tote, or they can be wall mounted as in the photo below.

The individual drawers are actually divided compartments, with one floating divider you can put where you want.

The beauty of this system is that I can get _all_ the same type fastener in one drawer, i.e. all the socket head 4-40 machine screws, flat washers, and nylock nuts are in one handy container. I have two of these set up for nuts and bolts, where one caddy holds the socket head screws (the black anodized stuff) and the other caddy holds plated 4-40 fasteners - I don't usually mix and match fastener types or finishes.

One photo below shows a drawer with three different lengths of 1/4-20 socket head machine screws, flat and lock washers, nylock and plain nuts, and it must weigh five pounds; not a problem because the drawer locks into the caddy frame. The front compartment in each drawer is full width (8" or so).

The last photo shows a full-size drawer unit, available from places like Target and K-Mart. These two drawer units are actually made from two shallow drawer units and two deep drawer units - the basic units are stackable, have casters, and you can mix-n-match as you see fit. About 30 bucks per stack, IIRC. A shallow drawer will hold at _least_ : a covering heat gun, a 120 volt drill, soldering gun, and a flex shaft for the drill. A deep drawer will hold a _bunch_ of chemicals and paints.

More on storage in a subsequent post . . .

the-plumber

More on storage for hobby rooms and shops . . .

The other storage gizmo I use is standard track-type shelving units, where shelf brackets lock into slotted tracks. Normally these tracks are attached to a wall.

I figured out that if the tracks are attached to an upright 2'x4', with a foot attached to the bottom using a 90 degree screw-on shelf bracket, the upright will stay that way - upright.

Two of these upright things can be spaced say, 4' apart and joined with lengths of scrap wood across the 'toes' and across the tops of the upright 2'x4's, and it won't fall down of it's own accord.

I use the shelf 'system' two ways : the first is to simply stash large objects, like kit boxes, directly on the brackets, sans actual shelves. The second is more conventional, putting a ply shelf on the brackets to hold small stuff.

Thing is, the shelf unit is not attached to the wall, and I can move the whole thing around as needed.

I've loaded one of these 'creations' with up to 35 pounds on the top 'shelf', nothing below that, and it was quite stable despite being obviously top-heavy. The 'secret' is that 90 degree shelf bracket used to attach the 'foot' to the bottom of the upright 2'x4'. Those brackets aren't 90 degrees, they're more like 95 degrees, so that when used to attach a shelf to a wall the shelf slopes down at the back just a bit and nothing rolls off the shelf. That over-90-degrees bit is what makes the free-standing shelf unit stable.

Mind you, when I lived in Kalifornia I ran a couple of screws into the wall through the top of the uprights anyway, because out there the walls had a tendency to get underway now and then.

First photo is the basic construction, second is a close-up of the 'foot', third is an edge-on view as the shelf sits in the shop today, and the fourth is a vertical pan of the as-is shelf.

Red Scholefield

My Feedback: (9)

Here is my offering on the subject.

www.rcbatteryclinic.com/TEMP/WORKSHOP.doc

Present pictures of shop in two car garage (with room left for one car).

SoCal GliderGuider

Ihave no porblem with lots of storage. It's just remembering where what is stored!!!

the-plumber

Still got room for _her_ car under the models, I see.

Are those the new digs ?

the-plumber

I sometimes have trouble remembering what is stored, never mind where . . .

One thing that helped was snagging a label maker gizmo, the sort that uses a tape cartridge to print labels.

At least now I can see which drawer has the 4-40 socket head screws and which one has the 'other' 4-40 screws.

If I remember where my glasses are, that is . . .

Red Scholefield

My Feedback: (9)

Yes, we (she actually) decided to downsize. While I was not real enthused about it, it was the right thing to do. No pool to worry about, no lawn care to worry about - all part of a very modest home owners monthy fee. Now I'm glad we did. I was able to build a new shop (albeit slightly smaller) incorporating many things I never got around to in the old one (like strategiclly placed 12 volt outlets - 48 120V outlets in all in the shop area. This one has lots of storage overhead via pull down stairs in garage. Seven miles closer to flying field, same distance from Home Depot as I was before. . . and she is HAPPY! Insulated garage door and am able to bring shop to comfortable working temperature when outside is in low 30's with 1500 watt electric heater. Kerosun heater stands by in case it gets colder than that - rare here in FL. Garage faces North so I don't get direct sunlight in summer making it tolerable durning the warm months - with only celing fan.

dicknadine

why do you need a special room for model building. answer-- have a fantastic wife, who lets you use the dinning room table-- for model building that is. here's the latest on the 61", 1919 Fokker Cll. dick

Red Scholefield

My Feedback: (9)

And you should have seen the place he had before his wife let him use the dining room table! Now you know who is to blame for the balsa shortage. His creations while they may be just a bit off beat (if you CAN"T find it in Janes Encyclopdedia of Aviation, Dicks has probably built it) I can vouch are works of art. Now I know people will say I'm exagerating but maybe Dick will show you some more examples to get me off the hook.