Magazine Construction Article & Plans
#1
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Magazine Construction Article & Plans
I am submitting a construction article with CAD plan to a magazine for publication and was curious what line sizes you fellas use. I have habitually drawn everything with "0" line size and a .010" border but the full sized version I recently had printed looks a bit light. Do you use larger line sizes for better contrast?
Also, what price should I expect for an article that is properly formatted, spell & grammar checked, with decent pics and CAD plan? The magazine folks (I think) won't need to do a whole lot of work to publish it.
Also, what price should I expect for an article that is properly formatted, spell & grammar checked, with decent pics and CAD plan? The magazine folks (I think) won't need to do a whole lot of work to publish it.
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For the lines to come out well on a mylar or vellum and blackline print nicely you'll need to use .020 inch lines. I'm printed a couple of my designs onto vellum and done blacklines from them and the .020 prints a nice clean but dense line.
For artistic merit it's not a bad idea to print the major outlines at .030 so they stand out.
For artistic merit it's not a bad idea to print the major outlines at .030 so they stand out.
#3
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Line Weights
Dickee
I think you have handed RCU a loaded question. In my opinion, there isn't a factor which works both ways. In order to look good both places, you actually have to make up two drawings, one full size, and one set up for the publisher's artwork frame (N.T.S.) for a page.
At Pasadena a couple years back, a fellow gave a talk on how to prepare something for publication. When it came to computer generated plans, he spouted off some random old-timey numbers (in Leroy pen diameters to which I understand) for line weights. "These are the accepted values for originals and publication now" was mentioned. I stood up, and yelled he was full of it, as you cannot set up any plotter built since the 1980's for one pen size and expect it to thin or thicken the lines with simple proportioning. You have to create two files. One for full size and one for publication to make such linework look correct.
"Oh no, we do this all the time as I understand"
Me.. What type of software and plotter do you use for such then?
Him: A standard H-P inkjet.
Me: Then it can't be done, as one parameter, affects the appearances no matter what size of drawing you are making up. ... back in the old days you could draw up something by hand using specified line weights, and upon PHOTOGRAPHIC reduction, the lines would thin. It can't be done automatically today.
With that a host of others stood up. One fellow said it is possible at his place of business, but he worked for Lockheed. The other five guys with simple home and office plotters and printers mentioned the moderator was wrong then. It cannot be done as mentioned, and to make up good apperances, two files must be made.
You need to locate or get out one of those Koh-i-noor wrappers, describing pen diameters. They give them away at blueprint offices around here. For actual plan sizes, I use a #3 pen for the extreme outline of wings, fuselage, hoz-stab, etc. and this equates to about a 0.030" wide line. For ribs, parts, descriptive bends, I use a #1 pen or about .018" wide. For text, leaders, centerlines, hidden or dashed lines, a #0 or a 0.008 to 0.010" line is used. Anything thinner than a 0.008" will not blueprint very well.
I mailed the moderator off a plan which had just been completed. Did it full size and reduced to page size. About one week later, he wrote back indicating that after he investigated what was mentioned by the audience. The audience was totally correct. In the past they had been mailing off the disk to a firm in Pennsylvania for plotting, and some one there did two copies also. One for sale and one for publication. The moderator was unaware totally that this is how things were being done. With that, they re-did their "Authors and Plans Standards" to reflect the updated system.
OH, and mentioned by the moderator also during this enlightening was page size. They would only permit plans to be done on multiples of 8 1/2" by 11" sheets. 22" by 17" was one acceptable, 44" by 34" was another, etc. "BULLONEY, I yelled back. You tell me where that size of paper can be found and who makes a compatible plotter?" No answer. The same five in the audience mentioned only 24" wide and 36" wide rolls of papers were readily available.
My thought in all this is to set line width via colors. You may think of colors to illustrate something, but they are more commonly used in engineering to set black line widths. Make all your expected colors be consistant throughout the plan. A red or #1 line is 0.010" wide, a yellow or #2 line is 0.020" wide etc., and let the receiver set the thicknesses. The end-user can then set yellow for one line weight, and it will be that weight throughout the whole plan or for the publication. My customers all demand standard black linework to set to 0.010" and all variances to be done via polyline widths. They do not know how to re-set up the plotter to colored linewidths. Mine at home, uses colors for line widths, as do many engineering offices. It is hell to pick a wide polyline in Autocad, and in using colors, it is much easier. There are just too many variables nowadays in plotter set-ups to indicate a set line width. You have to set up to match the receiver.
There are three Kinkos, four blueprint shops, and numerous engineers within 15 minutes of here. They ALL set up their plotters for lines differently. There really is no consistancy nor standards for set up, only in final appearances. My thought is to just let it go out the door. You will be thought a poor draughtsman, until they figure out your set-up.
If you go to the Jo Jusko site for plans, there is a glider I did years ago for free download. The whole thing is one line weight, with polylines used to vary the thicknesses. It makes for a better appearing plan, as compared to so many "stick line" computer drawings.
Wm.
I think you have handed RCU a loaded question. In my opinion, there isn't a factor which works both ways. In order to look good both places, you actually have to make up two drawings, one full size, and one set up for the publisher's artwork frame (N.T.S.) for a page.
At Pasadena a couple years back, a fellow gave a talk on how to prepare something for publication. When it came to computer generated plans, he spouted off some random old-timey numbers (in Leroy pen diameters to which I understand) for line weights. "These are the accepted values for originals and publication now" was mentioned. I stood up, and yelled he was full of it, as you cannot set up any plotter built since the 1980's for one pen size and expect it to thin or thicken the lines with simple proportioning. You have to create two files. One for full size and one for publication to make such linework look correct.
"Oh no, we do this all the time as I understand"
Me.. What type of software and plotter do you use for such then?
Him: A standard H-P inkjet.
Me: Then it can't be done, as one parameter, affects the appearances no matter what size of drawing you are making up. ... back in the old days you could draw up something by hand using specified line weights, and upon PHOTOGRAPHIC reduction, the lines would thin. It can't be done automatically today.
With that a host of others stood up. One fellow said it is possible at his place of business, but he worked for Lockheed. The other five guys with simple home and office plotters and printers mentioned the moderator was wrong then. It cannot be done as mentioned, and to make up good apperances, two files must be made.
You need to locate or get out one of those Koh-i-noor wrappers, describing pen diameters. They give them away at blueprint offices around here. For actual plan sizes, I use a #3 pen for the extreme outline of wings, fuselage, hoz-stab, etc. and this equates to about a 0.030" wide line. For ribs, parts, descriptive bends, I use a #1 pen or about .018" wide. For text, leaders, centerlines, hidden or dashed lines, a #0 or a 0.008 to 0.010" line is used. Anything thinner than a 0.008" will not blueprint very well.
I mailed the moderator off a plan which had just been completed. Did it full size and reduced to page size. About one week later, he wrote back indicating that after he investigated what was mentioned by the audience. The audience was totally correct. In the past they had been mailing off the disk to a firm in Pennsylvania for plotting, and some one there did two copies also. One for sale and one for publication. The moderator was unaware totally that this is how things were being done. With that, they re-did their "Authors and Plans Standards" to reflect the updated system.
OH, and mentioned by the moderator also during this enlightening was page size. They would only permit plans to be done on multiples of 8 1/2" by 11" sheets. 22" by 17" was one acceptable, 44" by 34" was another, etc. "BULLONEY, I yelled back. You tell me where that size of paper can be found and who makes a compatible plotter?" No answer. The same five in the audience mentioned only 24" wide and 36" wide rolls of papers were readily available.
My thought in all this is to set line width via colors. You may think of colors to illustrate something, but they are more commonly used in engineering to set black line widths. Make all your expected colors be consistant throughout the plan. A red or #1 line is 0.010" wide, a yellow or #2 line is 0.020" wide etc., and let the receiver set the thicknesses. The end-user can then set yellow for one line weight, and it will be that weight throughout the whole plan or for the publication. My customers all demand standard black linework to set to 0.010" and all variances to be done via polyline widths. They do not know how to re-set up the plotter to colored linewidths. Mine at home, uses colors for line widths, as do many engineering offices. It is hell to pick a wide polyline in Autocad, and in using colors, it is much easier. There are just too many variables nowadays in plotter set-ups to indicate a set line width. You have to set up to match the receiver.
There are three Kinkos, four blueprint shops, and numerous engineers within 15 minutes of here. They ALL set up their plotters for lines differently. There really is no consistancy nor standards for set up, only in final appearances. My thought is to just let it go out the door. You will be thought a poor draughtsman, until they figure out your set-up.
If you go to the Jo Jusko site for plans, there is a glider I did years ago for free download. The whole thing is one line weight, with polylines used to vary the thicknesses. It makes for a better appearing plan, as compared to so many "stick line" computer drawings.
Wm.
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DOH!!!! I've always wondered why some of the plans I download have such colorful presentations...... Now I know.
Coosbay, at what point are the colors turned back into line widths? And is it the plotter that does that directly? If so then what programing options do you use for this? I'd like to learn more about this for my own drawing efforts.
Coosbay, at what point are the colors turned back into line widths? And is it the plotter that does that directly? If so then what programing options do you use for this? I'd like to learn more about this for my own drawing efforts.
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At work we use AutoCAD 2000 and have different colours represent different line width's if we print monochrome. You do this is the Print Style manager.
One plotter can use many print styles and we have one for monochrome, one for Colour, one for full size and one for reduced prints etc. The list is pretty long and we can use any of these print styles on any of our 3 plotters or many printers.
(I am an Electrical Engineer in a Design Office).
One plotter can use many print styles and we have one for monochrome, one for Colour, one for full size and one for reduced prints etc. The list is pretty long and we can use any of these print styles on any of our 3 plotters or many printers.
(I am an Electrical Engineer in a Design Office).
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line width
I recently had an construction article published in the 2002 December RMC; RYAN'S REBEL. For my plans, which were drawn in CadKey (similar to AutoCad), I plotted them on vellum using a line width of 0.050" and this worked very well. My plans were pretty basic and lines were not near one another. If the plans you have show plenty of detail, I would consider a line width less than 0.050" but not less than 0.030"
Ryan
Ryan's Rebel
Ryan
Ryan's Rebel
#7
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Plotter set-ups
Ryan:
I don't offer to publish anything, as all my CAD work is done for commercial resale purposes. My work has predominently been done at home on my own facilities, and the finished product, if a plan, is handed over to the customer, or send electronically via e:mail. I cannot offer a simple line type plan, as the customer usually wants detail drawings in perspective, special logos, hatches, wood grain, etc. to better emphasize building methods. I haven't used CadKey, DesignCAD, TurboCAD, etc. in years now, but always fall back to the use of Autocad. I have an interest into the set-ups used by these installations, and would like to know what equipment is being used, how configured, and what additional software is being used as a driver etc.
Others:
Most plotters/printers since the 1980's used in the CAD field are color or pen number controlled. Pen type plotters operate under theirown style language, and most often need some sort of DOS interface active driver. The pen plotters have their advantages, especially when in combo with firms operating CNC, but are becoming fewer in number everyday. The pen plotters hold from one to eight replaceable pens of varying diameters. Pen hole number coding of 1 to 8 relates directly to color numbers one to eight of red, yellow, green, cyan etc. These primary eight colors are the same for pen and injet type colors. NOW, the colors have absolutely nothing to do with what gets applied to the paper. It is just a simple system of identifying writing functions on the plotter used since the first commercial plotters of about 1959. You lay on a green line and pen hole three will operate. Pen plotters operate on direct software control, and thus for whatever software you are using, you need the compatible or included driver. There are a couple of softwares out there which work within Windows (any version) that call out for a secondary plotter driver like the WinLine, but BOY is it expensive and will only work with certain plotters.
Inkjet, crystal jet, laser and thermal plotters retained the pen numbering system, but expanded it from one to 256. Most of these (other than for Autocad) operated within some Windows environment, and thus the plotting parameters are Windows controlled. As mentioned, to access this controller, you must go through Windows, My Computer, Settings, Control Panel, Printers, etc. to revise or set up.
Normally, line widths are controlled by calling out specific colors within the CAD program (except for polylines within Autocad), which in turn the plotter converts into the applicable pen hole or jet. In pen plotters it is simple, as you grab the correctly numbered Koh-i-noor pen and screw into the correctly associated position, and go. Thus everything looking cyan on your drawing will be plotted to whatever is inserted into hole #4 on your plotter. Except for the border to the sheet or some large text, normally my widest line on a model A/C plan is a number 3 pen or 0.030" wide.
In a jet or laser type plotter, you go to control panel and SPECIFY the line width. Most generally at initial set-up for the plotter/printer driver everything is set to a line of 0.010" wide and plot through all 256 colors. For cyan #4, if a color plotter it will mix and plot in cyan at 0.010" width. If you own a black plotter, or can set your color type to all black, it will plot a black line to 0.010" width. THEN, with Windows based inkjet plotters, you can most often change further the settings for cyan #4 to plot out a line at 0.018" wide. Thus, you need not alter your drawing, but instead call out cyan, and when plotted the line will come out wider automatically. An additional option with injet plotters with 256 colors is that you may specify color #151 to be 0.022" wide, but 60% of intensity, or slightly gray. This varying of intensity is used mainly for those who want to make their finished drawings useable in the Ozalid blueprinting process. Yet a third option available with certain Windows software is they can set the linetype per color. A color #4 can be a solid black line of 0.018" wide. A color #14 can be a black line of 0.018" wide to a dashed pattern. A color #40 can be a centerline black line of 0.018" wide. A color #44 can be set to a 80% black line of 0.018" wide in dashed. They are all the same width but to different parameters. I attend an Autocad class about every 2-3 years for an update as to revisions, and most instructors present the Waa-zoo features, not the basic set ups for items like a plotter. You have to learn this yourself.
When you begin work at an engineering office, some $5 per hour 19 year old draftsman will hand you a page with the firm's linework parameters. At that firm, you will base your drawings using those parameters, as what you see on the monitor is variable and different looking at each station connected to the main computer, but it will all plot out exactly the same afterwards. If you go home and bring a disk to the office for plotting, you need to have the linework based upon that firm's parameters. If you go to yet another firm, you will be set with yet different parameters. And you then need to take the information on the same disk and change it to match this next plotter. There are just too many possible set-ups to be consistant throughout the industry. Now if you have a later interest into getting parts on your plan being used for laser cutting, that is yet a whole 'nother set-up.
There are a bunch of other features not mentioned here which apply to plotter/printer set ups. Scale factors, rotation of drawing to plotting, mirror image, setting the image onto the page coming out the plotter, greyscaling, color=black, type of media (mylar, vellum, transparent paper, linen, celluloid), paper space (Autocad), extra thickness of black, and Calcomp plotters have some hardware based text fonts available. Much of this gets omitted at the classroom level. You need to join into the discussions on the web at CADALOG or at Lorand.net to find out how others are handling the variables.
The object in all this is to not only make an accurate drawing, but to make one that looks good also. A presentable and buildable plan is easier to sell than an accurate but poor appearing one, for as once the plan is in the hands of the purchaser he will find out what the true worth of the effort was. Many firms tend to hang onto thier older software and equipment for a few years, as Iffn' that information was needed again by a new client, they can plot if all out and begin from where they left off. Thus once set-ups get established in a firm they seldom change, as the work could look screwy years later.
Wm.
An Autocad user since R-8, 1988.
CAD user since 1977.
I don't offer to publish anything, as all my CAD work is done for commercial resale purposes. My work has predominently been done at home on my own facilities, and the finished product, if a plan, is handed over to the customer, or send electronically via e:mail. I cannot offer a simple line type plan, as the customer usually wants detail drawings in perspective, special logos, hatches, wood grain, etc. to better emphasize building methods. I haven't used CadKey, DesignCAD, TurboCAD, etc. in years now, but always fall back to the use of Autocad. I have an interest into the set-ups used by these installations, and would like to know what equipment is being used, how configured, and what additional software is being used as a driver etc.
Others:
Most plotters/printers since the 1980's used in the CAD field are color or pen number controlled. Pen type plotters operate under theirown style language, and most often need some sort of DOS interface active driver. The pen plotters have their advantages, especially when in combo with firms operating CNC, but are becoming fewer in number everyday. The pen plotters hold from one to eight replaceable pens of varying diameters. Pen hole number coding of 1 to 8 relates directly to color numbers one to eight of red, yellow, green, cyan etc. These primary eight colors are the same for pen and injet type colors. NOW, the colors have absolutely nothing to do with what gets applied to the paper. It is just a simple system of identifying writing functions on the plotter used since the first commercial plotters of about 1959. You lay on a green line and pen hole three will operate. Pen plotters operate on direct software control, and thus for whatever software you are using, you need the compatible or included driver. There are a couple of softwares out there which work within Windows (any version) that call out for a secondary plotter driver like the WinLine, but BOY is it expensive and will only work with certain plotters.
Inkjet, crystal jet, laser and thermal plotters retained the pen numbering system, but expanded it from one to 256. Most of these (other than for Autocad) operated within some Windows environment, and thus the plotting parameters are Windows controlled. As mentioned, to access this controller, you must go through Windows, My Computer, Settings, Control Panel, Printers, etc. to revise or set up.
Normally, line widths are controlled by calling out specific colors within the CAD program (except for polylines within Autocad), which in turn the plotter converts into the applicable pen hole or jet. In pen plotters it is simple, as you grab the correctly numbered Koh-i-noor pen and screw into the correctly associated position, and go. Thus everything looking cyan on your drawing will be plotted to whatever is inserted into hole #4 on your plotter. Except for the border to the sheet or some large text, normally my widest line on a model A/C plan is a number 3 pen or 0.030" wide.
In a jet or laser type plotter, you go to control panel and SPECIFY the line width. Most generally at initial set-up for the plotter/printer driver everything is set to a line of 0.010" wide and plot through all 256 colors. For cyan #4, if a color plotter it will mix and plot in cyan at 0.010" width. If you own a black plotter, or can set your color type to all black, it will plot a black line to 0.010" width. THEN, with Windows based inkjet plotters, you can most often change further the settings for cyan #4 to plot out a line at 0.018" wide. Thus, you need not alter your drawing, but instead call out cyan, and when plotted the line will come out wider automatically. An additional option with injet plotters with 256 colors is that you may specify color #151 to be 0.022" wide, but 60% of intensity, or slightly gray. This varying of intensity is used mainly for those who want to make their finished drawings useable in the Ozalid blueprinting process. Yet a third option available with certain Windows software is they can set the linetype per color. A color #4 can be a solid black line of 0.018" wide. A color #14 can be a black line of 0.018" wide to a dashed pattern. A color #40 can be a centerline black line of 0.018" wide. A color #44 can be set to a 80% black line of 0.018" wide in dashed. They are all the same width but to different parameters. I attend an Autocad class about every 2-3 years for an update as to revisions, and most instructors present the Waa-zoo features, not the basic set ups for items like a plotter. You have to learn this yourself.
When you begin work at an engineering office, some $5 per hour 19 year old draftsman will hand you a page with the firm's linework parameters. At that firm, you will base your drawings using those parameters, as what you see on the monitor is variable and different looking at each station connected to the main computer, but it will all plot out exactly the same afterwards. If you go home and bring a disk to the office for plotting, you need to have the linework based upon that firm's parameters. If you go to yet another firm, you will be set with yet different parameters. And you then need to take the information on the same disk and change it to match this next plotter. There are just too many possible set-ups to be consistant throughout the industry. Now if you have a later interest into getting parts on your plan being used for laser cutting, that is yet a whole 'nother set-up.
There are a bunch of other features not mentioned here which apply to plotter/printer set ups. Scale factors, rotation of drawing to plotting, mirror image, setting the image onto the page coming out the plotter, greyscaling, color=black, type of media (mylar, vellum, transparent paper, linen, celluloid), paper space (Autocad), extra thickness of black, and Calcomp plotters have some hardware based text fonts available. Much of this gets omitted at the classroom level. You need to join into the discussions on the web at CADALOG or at Lorand.net to find out how others are handling the variables.
The object in all this is to not only make an accurate drawing, but to make one that looks good also. A presentable and buildable plan is easier to sell than an accurate but poor appearing one, for as once the plan is in the hands of the purchaser he will find out what the true worth of the effort was. Many firms tend to hang onto thier older software and equipment for a few years, as Iffn' that information was needed again by a new client, they can plot if all out and begin from where they left off. Thus once set-ups get established in a firm they seldom change, as the work could look screwy years later.
Wm.
An Autocad user since R-8, 1988.
CAD user since 1977.
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Thanks Coosbay. That was very informative and helps a lot.
I may look into this myself as to how I can apply it. Most of my printing is on my home inkjet so I need to set the widths in my TurboCAD but now and then I can access the big 36 inch inkjet plotter at work for printing out larger vellums ( I keep a roll of my own at work. Those Philistines only use it for posters and charts ). This info may apply more to the work issue..... I'll have to look into it.
Thanks again for the detailed answer. That was a nice insight into a very large chunk of the industry that I've been sheltered from what with being self CAD trained and working in isolation.
I may look into this myself as to how I can apply it. Most of my printing is on my home inkjet so I need to set the widths in my TurboCAD but now and then I can access the big 36 inch inkjet plotter at work for printing out larger vellums ( I keep a roll of my own at work. Those Philistines only use it for posters and charts ). This info may apply more to the work issue..... I'll have to look into it.
Thanks again for the detailed answer. That was a nice insight into a very large chunk of the industry that I've been sheltered from what with being self CAD trained and working in isolation.
#9
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My Feedback: (1)
Home-work
BRUCE:
You got the idea. Just pull up the "about to plot" program on the At Work computer, and jot down all the lines, colors, widths parameters in the set-up program onto some paper. Take the notes home, and set up your home plot program the same, and you can then easily be on to same format. No surprizes. Think in red, yellow, blue, etc. lines as set out by work, and you then can print out portions at home on the deskjet, and take a disk to work and plot out the whole to same format.
If the work plotter is set up for a green line to be 0.022' wide, set up your home deskjet the same. Then it begins to work.
Ought to take a look at some of the H-P little pen plotters for sale now. They are going for about $25 each, and are like fleas on the back of a dog. Everyone has one, knows of it's capabilities and limits.
Wm.
You got the idea. Just pull up the "about to plot" program on the At Work computer, and jot down all the lines, colors, widths parameters in the set-up program onto some paper. Take the notes home, and set up your home plot program the same, and you can then easily be on to same format. No surprizes. Think in red, yellow, blue, etc. lines as set out by work, and you then can print out portions at home on the deskjet, and take a disk to work and plot out the whole to same format.
If the work plotter is set up for a green line to be 0.022' wide, set up your home deskjet the same. Then it begins to work.
Ought to take a look at some of the H-P little pen plotters for sale now. They are going for about $25 each, and are like fleas on the back of a dog. Everyone has one, knows of it's capabilities and limits.
Wm.
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Thanks very much everyone for your very detailed information. It will take me a while to digest all that info and lock in on how mine will be done.
I had my plan printed at Kinko's on their 36" wide "digital" printer. Not sure what that means but it was QUICK and cheap (5 bucks + tax for 34" x 44".) It looks like a laser print to me but boy, was I happy with it! It was only a test since the drawing still lacks some detail (does anyone here ever say a drawing is really complete?)
Does anyone wanna relate their experiences with what the magazines pay?
Thanks again!
I had my plan printed at Kinko's on their 36" wide "digital" printer. Not sure what that means but it was QUICK and cheap (5 bucks + tax for 34" x 44".) It looks like a laser print to me but boy, was I happy with it! It was only a test since the drawing still lacks some detail (does anyone here ever say a drawing is really complete?)
Does anyone wanna relate their experiences with what the magazines pay?
Thanks again!
#11
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Magazine Construction Article & Plans
DICKEE:
A digital copy machine is probably a OCE' 9400 or OCE' 9800 machine worth tens of thousands. It scans your work, writes the information to a hard drive, then laser plots out. Shouldn't
take but 5 minutes for first sheet. It then can make multiple copies rather quickly.
Wm.
A digital copy machine is probably a OCE' 9400 or OCE' 9800 machine worth tens of thousands. It scans your work, writes the information to a hard drive, then laser plots out. Shouldn't
take but 5 minutes for first sheet. It then can make multiple copies rather quickly.
Wm.
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Originally posted by CoosBayLumber
A digital copy machine is probably a OCE' 9400 or OCE' 9800 machine worth tens of thousands. It scans your work, writes the information to a hard drive, then laser plots out. Shouldn't
take but 5 minutes for first sheet. It then can make multiple copies rather quickly.
A digital copy machine is probably a OCE' 9400 or OCE' 9800 machine worth tens of thousands. It scans your work, writes the information to a hard drive, then laser plots out. Shouldn't
take but 5 minutes for first sheet. It then can make multiple copies rather quickly.
I handed the guy a floppy with my 187K .kdf file on it and he handed me the print and my floppy back (with a .pdf file on it as well!) in no more than 3 or 4 minutes! Unreal.
Now that we're talking mag. plans, do you manually draw in balsa & ply grain features? I noticed on your Super Sinbad plan you drew in some grain that was a bunch of little straight lines. Is that what you do for the mags. or will they take a plan with no grain showing. I wish there were "hatches" available of the various materials.
Thanks for your responses!