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  1. #51

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    RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco

    Big Bird, I used 1/4 in. wire for my landing gear. It's a pain to work with but I was planning on using my ZDZ 80 for power, so the extra strength may be needed.
    Scott
    Waco Brotherhood #49

    I buy, I build, I fly, I crash. I buy, Ibuild, I fly, I crash. I buy, I build,................

  2. #52
    Big_Bird's Avatar
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    RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco


    ORIGINAL: mango12

    Big Bird, I used 1/4 in. wire for my landing gear. It's a pain to work with but I was planning on using my ZDZ 80 for power, so the extra strength may be needed.
    I think 1/4" is good for the front part of the gear. The rear support can still be 3/16". Do you have any photos of your progress?
    Ken
    WACO Brotherhood #70, Arlington TX home of the Dallas Cowboys, SupBowl45, Texas Rangers, World Series 2010, 2011

  3. #53

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    RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco

    No pictures yet, my wife has the camera. I did use 3/16" wire for the spreader bar on the L.G. I will post pix ASAP , but no comments about my shops neatness, o.k.? When used to breed parrots in the same building. Got rid of the birds, and gained a hangar!!!
    Scott
    Waco Brotherhood #49

    I buy, I build, I fly, I crash. I buy, Ibuild, I fly, I crash. I buy, I build,................

  4. #54

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    RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco

    Well I have run into my first real problem during construction. As I said earlier, I plan on using a ZDZ 80 for my powerplant. After installing F2 on the fuse I did some measuring to see how the engine will fit. If I install the engine on F 2, the prop shaft is 1&1/4" to short to clear the cowl. On the pther hand, if I install the engine on F 1, the prop clearance is perfect, but with the carb mounted on the rear of the engine, the carb will be located somewhere in the balsa spacer between F1 and F2, making adjustments nearly impossible. I contacted RCshowcase about putting a propshaft extension on the engine and they do not reccomend it. Any suggestions? Right now a different engine is out of the question.
    Scott
    Scott
    Waco Brotherhood #49

    I buy, I build, I fly, I crash. I buy, Ibuild, I fly, I crash. I buy, I build,................

  5. #55
    Big_Bird's Avatar
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    RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco

    Scott, I agree with RC Showcase, I don't like extensions because of potential vibration problems and extra stress on the crankshaft. Here is a photo again of my G-62 mount. As you can see F1 is only used as a cap for the balsa. The mounting block is actually mounted to a 1/2" thick F2.

    Now for information on how I mounted my ZDZ80RV on my 1/3 scale Super Decathlon. As you can see from the photos I made standoffs from 1" red oak dowel. There is a hole cut in the firewall to accept the bottom end of a soft drink can. I did this to provide adequate air flow for the carb and to prevent any fuel from getting into the fuselage. I have been flying this plane for over 2 years and this arrangement has worked out fine. Adjusting the carb has been no problem. I think that shortly after my first flight I never adjusted the carb again. I love the ZDZ80RV. Believe me, you may wind up with a rocket ship Waco with the 80.

    Note how I used bel cranks to operate the choke and throttle. On the SD, all of the radio equipment is hidden. This is the same for my 1/3 scale Bucker Jungmeister.
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    Ken
    WACO Brotherhood #70, Arlington TX home of the Dallas Cowboys, SupBowl45, Texas Rangers, World Series 2010, 2011

  6. #56

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    RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco

    Thanks Ken, thats exactly how I'm gonna do it!! Already got the stand offs cut, just gocenter drill them and I am ready to go. But lining up that drink can may be tricky, and I may put the bell cranks on the front side of the firewall. I'll let you know how it turns out.
    Scott
    Scott
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    I buy, I build, I fly, I crash. I buy, Ibuild, I fly, I crash. I buy, I build,................

  7. #57
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    RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco

    ORIGINAL: mango12

    Thanks Ken, thats exactly how I'm gonna do it!! Already got the stand offs cut, just gocenter drill them and I am ready to go. But lining up that drink can may be tricky, and I may put the bell cranks on the front side of the firewall. I'll let you know how it turns out.
    Scott
    It will be easier to line up if you make it out of a beer can (maneuver smoother) and it is the last one in the 6 pack. I made the mistake of it being the first one in the 6 pack and had to move the hole as you can see.

    I discovered that the horizontal stab and elevators were not drawn symmetrical. I copied one half on my light box and used it as the pattern for both sides. On my plans, if you lay a straight edge on the horizontal trailing edge, it curves off.

    Looking forward to seeing how your mount works out.
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    Ken
    WACO Brotherhood #70, Arlington TX home of the Dallas Cowboys, SupBowl45, Texas Rangers, World Series 2010, 2011

  8. #58
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    RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco

    John, here is what my final landing gear assembly looks like at the back of F3. The plans say to epoxy the groved LG blocks in place. Knowing that it is entirely possible that I might have to cut into the LG area to replace a badly bent wire, I think I'll only depend on the 6x32 screws with lock nuts to hold everything in place. I added the additional piece to the shock absorber block to allow for carry through of the 1/4" square balsa. The LG main wire is 1/4".
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    Ken
    WACO Brotherhood #70, Arlington TX home of the Dallas Cowboys, SupBowl45, Texas Rangers, World Series 2010, 2011

  9. #59
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    RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco

    It would be far easier to make smooth ailerons but they just wouldn't look right. I built 3 of the original Pica 1/5 scale YMF-5 kits and all included the molded plastic caps to go over the ailerons. These added a lot of realism realism to the model. There are 34 stiffeners on each aileron surface on the full scale plane.

    Now is the time for some brain storming from you guys. What kind of sticks, etc could be glued to the ailerons to simulate this. Possibly molds and vacuum formed parts? I've never done any vacuum forming. I don't mind gluing on 272 sticks. I have plenty of time.
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    Ken
    WACO Brotherhood #70, Arlington TX home of the Dallas Cowboys, SupBowl45, Texas Rangers, World Series 2010, 2011

  10. #60
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    RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco

    BB,

    Check out Evergreen Scale Models http://www.evergreenscalemodels.com/ (model train supplies) they have angle stock in a variety of sizes. You will need to pick the right size for your scale. Glue the angle to the surface (balsa, 1/64th" ply or styrene) with the corner up and by the time you add any putty, sand, primer, sand and paint, the corners will be rounded over and the angle/surface joints will be filled in to look like the real thing. Or if you find stock to vacumm form long enough for the airlerons, make a left and right master pattern and form the covers, that will give the rounded effect to the airleron corrigations. The pictures are of a full scale QFC/UBF airleron. Notice that every 3rd corrigation on the bottom side is open to allow condensation to escape. Good Luck.
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    John F Howard (aka skylarkmk1)
    AMA 10955, WACO Brotherhood #26, AWC, NWC

  11. #61
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    RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco

    BB,

    That is very similar to the Barth YMF mounting (see Giant Scale).
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    John F Howard (aka skylarkmk1)
    AMA 10955, WACO Brotherhood #26, AWC, NWC

  12. #62

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    RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco

    Hey Ken, on the plans it says that Sigs Morrisy Bravo has corrugated ailerons and you can order the parts from them. I assume that they are the correct scale. I finally got my engine mounted( ZDZ 80) and discovered that the wrap around muffeler, Pitts style, will not fit because of the short distance to the firewall !! I am not sure about some of the aftermarket mufflers as I have heard that some will fry the engine. I am also concerned about those ugly downpipes on the side mounted ones. I may be switching to a G62.
    Scott
    Waco Brotherhood #49

    I buy, I build, I fly, I crash. I buy, Ibuild, I fly, I crash. I buy, I build,................

  13. #63
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    RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco

    John, thanks for the information on evergreen. It looks like their site is primarily for dealers.

    One thing that I've considered is using a piece of square brass tubing as a guide and push a square balsa stick through it into a single edge razor blade. This would make the triangle stock. I could then round the ends of the stock to simulate the way the stiffeners look. The next decision will be what size square balsa stick to use.

    Scott, I know what you mean about the ugly pipes. I think mine turned out somewhat ugly. I have thought about turning the muffler upright and adding some curved pipes to bring the exhaust out. I can restore the cutout if necessary. Don't know if I'll go to that much trouble though. From a G-62 up the cowl is pretty tight.
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    Ken
    WACO Brotherhood #70, Arlington TX home of the Dallas Cowboys, SupBowl45, Texas Rangers, World Series 2010, 2011

  14. #64
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    RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco

    BB,

    I believe you are correct about Evergreen being mostly for the dealers, just wanted to show the different material available. Maybe your LHS can order you the quantity you need.

    On the other hand, with a little more work, the split balsa stock is a good way to go also. If I remember correctly the Pepino YMF is 1/4 scale and the corrugations on the full size were "about" 1/4" tall, you would need something like 1/8" sq. to split. This would leave a little more than 1/16th tall strips, but after filling, sanding, primer, sanding and paint it would be very close to being right on. That would be close to scale, but you may try a little larger for the visual effect. Remember, we are illusionists, if it looks right, it is right.
    John F Howard (aka skylarkmk1)
    AMA 10955, WACO Brotherhood #26, AWC, NWC

  15. #65
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    RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco

    John, all very good ideas. Thanks
    Ken
    WACO Brotherhood #70, Arlington TX home of the Dallas Cowboys, SupBowl45, Texas Rangers, World Series 2010, 2011

  16. #66
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    RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco

    Hi Ken: The angle stock from Evergreen is perfect for corrugations. I used it on my Little Toot bipe for the rudder and elevator. It's worth tracking down a source. I got mine at a model railroad shop.

    Continued good luck with your WACO and keep posting!

    Brad
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    All Scale, All the Time

  17. #67
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    RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco

    Thanks a lot Brad. The Little Toot looks good. I've known Tommy Meyers for over 20 years. I haven't seen him in more than a year.
    Ken
    WACO Brotherhood #70, Arlington TX home of the Dallas Cowboys, SupBowl45, Texas Rangers, World Series 2010, 2011

  18. #68
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    RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco

    John, I dropped by a hobby shop the other day that had the Evergreen plastic angle that you talked about. I think the right size is .080" (P/N 292). There are other sizes available. I still have to take more measurements to be sure. They also have PlastiStrut with several sizes.

    On another subject, I installed the tail wheel assembly that I built on the fuselage that my friend gave me just to see how it looked and I like it.

    Bedford, first flight yet?
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    Ken
    WACO Brotherhood #70, Arlington TX home of the Dallas Cowboys, SupBowl45, Texas Rangers, World Series 2010, 2011

  19. #69
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    RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco

    BB,

    Looking good. I was able to take a few pictures from the top inside (stabilizer has been removed) of a UBF being restored. The first picture shows the shock absorber (top of the picture) which is a series of rubber donuts with metal plates in between. The second picture shows the front pivot and the locking mechanism for the tail wheel (to lock it straight for take off and landing). The cables on the left and right are rudder, the loose ones across the tail wheel are elevator and the center goes to the tail wheel lock. The black back ground is the leather boot around the tail wheel as in picture 3 (different plane, also a UBF).
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    John F Howard (aka skylarkmk1)
    AMA 10955, WACO Brotherhood #26, AWC, NWC

  20. #70
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    RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco

    John, those are great photos. I was looking for the elevator push rod or pull-pull connections. Did the elevator use a push rod inside the fuselage? Of course, for safety reasons, I plan to use a push rod on each elevator half. Looking at the fuselage arrangement it looks like I might want to put the two elevator servos in the baggage compartment so that the push rods would have a pretty straight shot to the elevators. What do you think?

    Pull-pull for the rudder and tail wheel is very easy. I do that on my Jungmeister.
    Ken
    WACO Brotherhood #70, Arlington TX home of the Dallas Cowboys, SupBowl45, Texas Rangers, World Series 2010, 2011

  21. #71
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    RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco

    BB,

    The full size WACOs had a free turning tail wheel that was not steerable, it was only locked straight for take off and landing. The full size elevator is cable controled, pull-pull, those are the elevator cables crossing the tail wheel from lower left to upper right (the loose ends are by the shock system) in picture 1.

    I have not done any 1/4 scale aircraft so your method of control is up to you. Over in the Vintage & Antique, WACO YMF forum, with the Pica 1/5th, some builders are using a hidden elevator control system with both elevators connected together (central control horn on the joiner), other are using external control horns with push rods, either a single on one side with joined elevators or a single rod with a "Y" at the elevator end. My elevator will use the hidden system on my 1/6th Pica YMF with a single push rod and pull-pull on the rudder and tail wheel with a bellcrank for the pull-pull cables and a short pushrod to the bellcrank from the servo.

    You might want to take a look at the build thread on RC Scalebuilders, Other Designers, Rosenstock HKS WACO and the Barth YMF thread in giant scale here on RCU to see what they are using.
    John F Howard (aka skylarkmk1)
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  22. #72

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    RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco

    Ken,

    Have had had a minor set-back in the pursuit of first flight. The Q50 that it came with is not in as good condition as I had thought. The carb mounting threads are stripped in the cylinder body. I discovered this when getting everything tuned and ready for flight. The Q50 ultimately would not start.

    I am going to trial fit a G62 here soon. The challenge there is the carb and muffler are reversed. I don't mind re-arranging the throttle, but I am not looking forward to replacing the cowl to make the fit. If it doesn't work out, I will get the BB Q52 upgrade kit.

    Meanwhile I fly other things.

    Bedford

  23. #73
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    RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco

    OK guys and gals it's getting time for me to rake off a place on the bench and start building this beauty. My kit is complete. Here are a couple of pics of the parts and pieces.
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    Ken
    WACO Brotherhood #70, Arlington TX home of the Dallas Cowboys, SupBowl45, Texas Rangers, World Series 2010, 2011

  24. #74
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    RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco

    Before I closed up the top wing center section I took these progress photos of the dihedral braces and the 6x32 wing mount T nuts. As you may recall I'm making the wings one piece.
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    Ken
    WACO Brotherhood #70, Arlington TX home of the Dallas Cowboys, SupBowl45, Texas Rangers, World Series 2010, 2011

  25. #75
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    RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco

    If anyone is interested here is the top center section closed up.
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    Ken
    WACO Brotherhood #70, Arlington TX home of the Dallas Cowboys, SupBowl45, Texas Rangers, World Series 2010, 2011


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