CYCLONE 30 design & build
#1
Thread Starter
CYCLONE 30 design & build
I had posted some pix of this airplane on another model aircraft newsgroup a while back but I don't think it was ever really shown here, clearly the best site for the design and scratch building of original ideas. Initially, my intention was to produce it as a limited production kit. This commercial nature precluded showing on RCUniverse.com, other than in the Product Announcements & Manufacturing News category. Now, for various reasons, I have abandoned the idea of a commercial kit. Since it is no longer a conflict with the site's policy, I would very much like to share this interesting design with everyone here.
Better late than never? Here it is.
This pix is a CAD image of the design. I work on a program called Alias-Wavefront, a high end surfacing software used in the auto design field - which was my career before retirement a little over a year ago.
Better late than never? Here it is.
This pix is a CAD image of the design. I work on a program called Alias-Wavefront, a high end surfacing software used in the auto design field - which was my career before retirement a little over a year ago.
#2
Thread Starter
RE: CYCLONE 30 design & build
The lasercutting was done by Bob Holman and vacforming by Merrill Brady at MM GliderTech. Great jobs they did.
This is the fuse going together with the Magnum 30 engine option. A fairly standard type of construction but with some innovations to get the shapes I wanted.
This is the fuse going together with the Magnum 30 engine option. A fairly standard type of construction but with some innovations to get the shapes I wanted.
#3
Thread Starter
RE: CYCLONE 30 design & build
Wing construction. Conventional D-tube section. The landing gear must mount on the wing so the wing mounting plate is integrated into the joining detail.
#4
Junior Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Nottingham, UNITED KINGDOM
Posts: 9
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: CYCLONE 30 design & build
Allan,
This is beautiful work and a great looking aircraft !. Will you be making plans available for purchase, and do you think this would make a good model to power electrically.
Your Cad work looks great. I'll enjoy watching your progress.
Steve
This is beautiful work and a great looking aircraft !. Will you be making plans available for purchase, and do you think this would make a good model to power electrically.
Your Cad work looks great. I'll enjoy watching your progress.
Steve
#5
Thread Starter
RE: CYCLONE 30 design & build
I have not considered producing plans for this model but I suppose it wouldn't be too hard to do. I have already made a general layout drawing for inclusion in the kit. One big reason I dropped the kitting plans was that the model is too complicated for a successful kit. It would have had too many lasercut sheets and too many fussy details to be commercially successful. The original goal was a kit at $70 or $80 for this small plane but my costs would have reached that level so the retail price would have had to be over $120, too much except for fanatic nuts like me.
I will be getting rid of some extra lasercut prototype parts later. I always order enough for several prototypes (it takes at least two to get a design good enough) and cutters like Bob Holman don't like to cut just one plane anyway -it isn't worth their efforts.
My second prototype would have had an AXI motor so electric should be a perfect option. Since one problem I have had with the Magnum powered version is overheating, I would definitely favor electric for this model.
I will be getting rid of some extra lasercut prototype parts later. I always order enough for several prototypes (it takes at least two to get a design good enough) and cutters like Bob Holman don't like to cut just one plane anyway -it isn't worth their efforts.
My second prototype would have had an AXI motor so electric should be a perfect option. Since one problem I have had with the Magnum powered version is overheating, I would definitely favor electric for this model.
#7
Thread Starter
RE: CYCLONE 30 design & build
The LO drawing already created doesn't show all the actual parts so a supplimental drawing would have to be done. Then there is the issue of the cowl and wheel pants, which could probably be vacformed by MM Glider Tech for me then sent on...
Let me think about this. I'm not sure I want to get into the plans business.
Here are some pix of the tail feathers being made up, and the fiberglass tape reinforcement of the wing centerline.
Let me think about this. I'm not sure I want to get into the plans business.
Here are some pix of the tail feathers being made up, and the fiberglass tape reinforcement of the wing centerline.
#8
Thread Starter
RE: CYCLONE 30 design & build
These show fitting the cowl and working with the vacformed wheel pants. Mounting the landing gear is easy with the blind nuts already installed in the plywood wing plate.
#9
Thread Starter
RE: CYCLONE 30 design & build
The wing saddle mount is made from six lasercut pieces of 1/8" balsa, pinned to the wing. The fuselage is then glued in place for a perfect fit. The rest of the wing flare will be made later of 1/16" balsa.
#11
Member
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Columbus,
MS
Posts: 45
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: CYCLONE 30 design & build
That plane is absolutely gorgeous! I would love to buy a plan set for it.
If you look at kit prices today, you will notice that many are over $100, especially for laser cut kits. A $120 laser cut kit would be right in the ballpark.
If you look at kit prices today, you will notice that many are over $100, especially for laser cut kits. A $120 laser cut kit would be right in the ballpark.
#12
Thread Starter
RE: CYCLONE 30 design & build
Mike, thanks for the compliment. I hear you on the plans issue and will look at what would have to be done to make something available.
Here are some more pix of the landing gear. The aluminum strut is from SIG and is the perfect size. The vacformed parts, including the cowl were produced by a lengthy proceedure. Unfortunately I done't have more pictures. First I designed everything on Alias Wavefront and printed out part drawings. Then I made base plates for the clay models, with a measuring grid glued on it. Templates were made from plywood and cardboard to transfer the shapes and sections to the clay, which was Chavant Automotive Styling clay - same as is used in the industries' styling studios. It takes a long time, lots of work and skill to get a smooth clay model. Each of the wheel pants has a left and a right side so, with the cowl, there were three clay models to create.
These were cast in silicon and then hard tooling plastic (PVC, as I recall) was cast into the silicon to make male vacforming tools. There was some repair, patching, etc. necessary on the tools before sending them off to Merill Brady for the parts. He pulled parts in various thicknesses, .040 being the final best choice.
Here are some more pix of the landing gear. The aluminum strut is from SIG and is the perfect size. The vacformed parts, including the cowl were produced by a lengthy proceedure. Unfortunately I done't have more pictures. First I designed everything on Alias Wavefront and printed out part drawings. Then I made base plates for the clay models, with a measuring grid glued on it. Templates were made from plywood and cardboard to transfer the shapes and sections to the clay, which was Chavant Automotive Styling clay - same as is used in the industries' styling studios. It takes a long time, lots of work and skill to get a smooth clay model. Each of the wheel pants has a left and a right side so, with the cowl, there were three clay models to create.
These were cast in silicon and then hard tooling plastic (PVC, as I recall) was cast into the silicon to make male vacforming tools. There was some repair, patching, etc. necessary on the tools before sending them off to Merill Brady for the parts. He pulled parts in various thicknesses, .040 being the final best choice.
#13
Thread Starter
RE: CYCLONE 30 design & build
By the way, anyone interested in the story behind this model can check out my old website at
http://www.checkerboardair.com/cbweb1006.htm
This shows the two original Cyclones, still hanging in my garage, that were the origination for the design. They are still great looking planes and always stir things up when I take them out to the club field.
The contact phone number on the website is no longer active but anyone who wants to contact me can PM me through this website or e-mail me at [email protected]. Eliminate the numbers to get the proper e-mail address.
http://www.checkerboardair.com/cbweb1006.htm
This shows the two original Cyclones, still hanging in my garage, that were the origination for the design. They are still great looking planes and always stir things up when I take them out to the club field.
The contact phone number on the website is no longer active but anyone who wants to contact me can PM me through this website or e-mail me at [email protected]. Eliminate the numbers to get the proper e-mail address.
#14
Thread Starter
RE: CYCLONE 30 design & build
On to some details... The top surfaces of the wing flares can be built up on the wing saddle. The scoops are for cooling and the big one got enlarged later to improve airflow over the engine. You can see how the firewall is recessed and the plastic cowl is limited to about 2" deep.
If I were doing it over, I would go with one deep scoop for the engine, eliminate all other holes from the engine compartment to force the cooling air where it is needed. Of course an electic motor would be a different situation but it would need some cooling too.
If I were doing it over, I would go with one deep scoop for the engine, eliminate all other holes from the engine compartment to force the cooling air where it is needed. Of course an electic motor would be a different situation but it would need some cooling too.
#15
Thread Starter
RE: CYCLONE 30 design & build
More details as the build progressed toward covering... The cowl and LG are in primer here. The radio and servos are installed and the engine is mounted on a break-in test stand. The engine compartment has been coated with marine epoxy for fuel proofing.
#16
Thread Starter
RE: CYCLONE 30 design & build
On to covering. I'm using Ultracote, Cub Yellow because this is a small plane and I want to be able to see it well in the air. After covering the fillets first, I made a newpaper pattern of the big side pieces to avoid cutting through the fillet area. Covering went well and it is ready for accent colors and graphics.
#18
Member
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Columbus,
MS
Posts: 45
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: CYCLONE 30 design & build
Definately a sharp looking plane!
A quick side note of red tails: I'm currently attached to the 332nd Air Wing stationed in Iraq. The 332nd is the same 332nd Fight Group from WW2, also known as the Tuskegee Airmen and Red Tails collectively.
A quick side note of red tails: I'm currently attached to the 332nd Air Wing stationed in Iraq. The 332nd is the same 332nd Fight Group from WW2, also known as the Tuskegee Airmen and Red Tails collectively.
#19
Thread Starter
RE: CYCLONE 30 design & build
Thanks for that information on the red tails. I didn't know that, I just liked the graphic look of that kind of paint scheme.
Speaking of graphics, here are the images I worked up for my prototype. I needed an instrument panel, with some generic gauges found on the internet - I had to create part of it and put it together on Photoshop. This image is only about 2.5" wide in the cockpit. I also created Cyclone logo for the wing and fuse sides, a "racing group" logo and some victory stars for the nose. (I have to post these here at a low rez)
These were simply printed out on label paper, applied to the plane then covered with clear Monocoat for durability.
Speaking of graphics, here are the images I worked up for my prototype. I needed an instrument panel, with some generic gauges found on the internet - I had to create part of it and put it together on Photoshop. This image is only about 2.5" wide in the cockpit. I also created Cyclone logo for the wing and fuse sides, a "racing group" logo and some victory stars for the nose. (I have to post these here at a low rez)
These were simply printed out on label paper, applied to the plane then covered with clear Monocoat for durability.
#20
Thread Starter
RE: CYCLONE 30 design & build
The big day! We can now see what all this was working toward.
By the way, I have rounded up some EXTRA PARTS, for prototypes I will not be building, and will be making these available to interested people. PM me or e-mail me at [email protected] for information on these parts, and plans. The parts include lasercut sheets, vacformed parts, and other materials.
Here's the pictures!
By the way, I have rounded up some EXTRA PARTS, for prototypes I will not be building, and will be making these available to interested people. PM me or e-mail me at [email protected] for information on these parts, and plans. The parts include lasercut sheets, vacformed parts, and other materials.
Here's the pictures!
#21
Thread Starter
RE: CYCLONE 30 design & build
The model exhibited chronic overheating, resulting in repeated emergency landings so I had to enlarge the one scoop that actually carries the air past the engine. This helped but overheating is still an issue and the last flight tore the landing gear off. The plane is still awaiting repairs at the moment.
#22
Member
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Columbus,
MS
Posts: 45
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: CYCLONE 30 design & build
I hope that eliminates the overheating problem.
I wonder if tilting the top of the baffle back towards the back of the cylinder head will help the flow of air?
I wonder if tilting the top of the baffle back towards the back of the cylinder head will help the flow of air?
#24
Member
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Columbus,
MS
Posts: 45
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: CYCLONE 30 design & build
I knew there was a rule-of-thumb for exit to opening area, but forgot what it was. Heh.
Allen has some extra cooling exits on the bottom of the fuselage behind the cowl. What I'm thinking is that the incoming air needs to be routed by the engine before it can go out the extra outlets. For example, many years ago I scratch built a BD-8 with a completely enclosed, side mounted engine. The cowl had a large cooling exit on the bottom but the engine still ran hot during initial flight tests. I figured that the incoming air was taking easiest route around the bottom of the engine to the exit area. I finally put in a piece of plywood lengthwise under the engine to block off the easy air path. That forced all the incoming air around the engine cylinder before exiting out of the bottom of the cowl and eliminated the hot engine problems.
It might not be there isn't enough exit area, but the some of the incoming air is moving directly to the cooling exits without going by the engine first?
Allen has some extra cooling exits on the bottom of the fuselage behind the cowl. What I'm thinking is that the incoming air needs to be routed by the engine before it can go out the extra outlets. For example, many years ago I scratch built a BD-8 with a completely enclosed, side mounted engine. The cowl had a large cooling exit on the bottom but the engine still ran hot during initial flight tests. I figured that the incoming air was taking easiest route around the bottom of the engine to the exit area. I finally put in a piece of plywood lengthwise under the engine to block off the easy air path. That forced all the incoming air around the engine cylinder before exiting out of the bottom of the cowl and eliminated the hot engine problems.
It might not be there isn't enough exit area, but the some of the incoming air is moving directly to the cooling exits without going by the engine first?
#25
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Riyadh, SAUDI ARABIA
Posts: 135
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: CYCLONE 30 design & build
short cowls may suffer this situation, if possible to create some bumps just before the exit area so this will create some vacuum and accelerate air flow.