Degrees of Washout for Super Kaos 60 wing
09-08-2008, 11:25 AM
#1
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Degrees of Washout for Super Kaos 60 wing
Hi everybody,
I am about to begin my first scratch build of a Super Kaos 60. I have the RCM plans (which are identical to the Great Planes plans). My question is, how many degrees of wash out should I put into the wing tips for the proper washout. In the plans, there are blocks underneath the trailing edge. At the root of the wing, it calls for 7/8 inch block, in the middle of the wing, it calls for a 11/16 inch block and at the wing tip it calls for 1/2 inch block and I believe that the wing is built upside down on the plans. I was thinking that if I draw a centerline on each rib, I could use a piece of long balsa, prop it underneath the trailing edge of the root rib so that the center line is 7/8 inch high. Next, I would slide the other end of the balsa underneath the wing tip and position the trailing edge so that the center line is 1/2 inch high. By doing this, each wing rib would fall on the balsa strip and then the washout would be built through out the whole wing. Am I correct in this thinnking? I know some people would suggest that I use the covering to twist the wing and get the washout that way but I live here in Houston TX and it can get pretty hot and the covering becomes relaxed. If this is not the correct forum to ask, please forward it to the proper forum (such as pattern flying). Thanks a million!
Happy Flying
I am about to begin my first scratch build of a Super Kaos 60. I have the RCM plans (which are identical to the Great Planes plans). My question is, how many degrees of wash out should I put into the wing tips for the proper washout. In the plans, there are blocks underneath the trailing edge. At the root of the wing, it calls for 7/8 inch block, in the middle of the wing, it calls for a 11/16 inch block and at the wing tip it calls for 1/2 inch block and I believe that the wing is built upside down on the plans. I was thinking that if I draw a centerline on each rib, I could use a piece of long balsa, prop it underneath the trailing edge of the root rib so that the center line is 7/8 inch high. Next, I would slide the other end of the balsa underneath the wing tip and position the trailing edge so that the center line is 1/2 inch high. By doing this, each wing rib would fall on the balsa strip and then the washout would be built through out the whole wing. Am I correct in this thinnking? I know some people would suggest that I use the covering to twist the wing and get the washout that way but I live here in Houston TX and it can get pretty hot and the covering becomes relaxed. If this is not the correct forum to ask, please forward it to the proper forum (such as pattern flying). Thanks a million!
Happy Flying
09-08-2008, 03:05 PM
#2
RE: Degrees of Washout for Super Kaos 60 wing
Discuss this in the classic pattern forum. Plenty of guys there have flown or still have a Super Kaos 60. Are you sure there's washout, and Bridi wasn't just blocking up the wing for the build.
Jim
Jim
09-08-2008, 07:12 PM
#3
Senior Member
My Feedback: (1)
RE: Degrees of Washout for Super Kaos 60 wing
I think the whole of the Super series had zero degrees incidence and zero of washout.
The little wood blocks noted on plan are for "proping up" purposes as Jim mentioned. Odd though is that according to my estimates, they are assuming that the bottom of wing is built first.
Wm.
The little wood blocks noted on plan are for "proping up" purposes as Jim mentioned. Odd though is that according to my estimates, they are assuming that the bottom of wing is built first.
Wm.
09-09-2008, 08:24 AM
#4
Senior Member
Thread Starter
RE: Degrees of Washout for Super Kaos 60 wing
Hi everybody,
Thanks for the advice. I agree with you CoosBayLumber, it does seem that way. The only dihedral in the wing comes from the ribs getting smaller as you move out to the tip. The top part of the wing is flat. Not only are the blocks needed to accomplish this, but you must also build the back part of the wing first. In my assumption, it is easier to build the wing upside on the top spar, making sure that the centerlines of the ribs are equal height in front and back. This ensures that the top of the wing is flat and the proper dihedral is met. I learned that there is no washout in the Super Kaos so that makes my building easier. Any comments?
Happy Flying!
Thanks for the advice. I agree with you CoosBayLumber, it does seem that way. The only dihedral in the wing comes from the ribs getting smaller as you move out to the tip. The top part of the wing is flat. Not only are the blocks needed to accomplish this, but you must also build the back part of the wing first. In my assumption, it is easier to build the wing upside on the top spar, making sure that the centerlines of the ribs are equal height in front and back. This ensures that the top of the wing is flat and the proper dihedral is met. I learned that there is no washout in the Super Kaos so that makes my building easier. Any comments?
Happy Flying!
09-09-2008, 09:09 AM
#5
Senior Member
My Feedback: (1)
RE: Degrees of Washout for Super Kaos 60 wing
Was written someplace that it is supoesed to be easier on the Super serives to build the wing, flat on the plan, lay out the main (upper) spar, and then assume the upper spar to be straight and that you are thus building the bottom side first. Once dry, carefully flip over, and build the topside, complete with the blocks.
What I read made no mention as to when nor if to add on the sheet covering. But it sure shows on the plan. They also made a big deal about using Kraft servos, as all others may upset the C.G. or balance. On and on about them.
Wm.
What I read made no mention as to when nor if to add on the sheet covering. But it sure shows on the plan. They also made a big deal about using Kraft servos, as all others may upset the C.G. or balance. On and on about them.
Wm.
09-09-2008, 10:08 AM
#6
Senior Member
Thread Starter
RE: Degrees of Washout for Super Kaos 60 wing
Hi CoosBayLumber,
I would assume that since the ultrasport 60 and 1000 (both of which I have) use the Bridi Kaos wing or variation of it, construction of it should be the same. On the US wing, there is sheeting on top and bottom (LE and TE) and covering on the first three rib bays from the root rib. I am going to build the wing upside down on the top spar first, make sure the centerlines of the ribs are equal front to back in height, place the bottom spar on, reverify the centerline heights, and then start sheeting the bottom TE to lock the straightness into the wing. Sound good?
Thanks and happy flying!
I would assume that since the ultrasport 60 and 1000 (both of which I have) use the Bridi Kaos wing or variation of it, construction of it should be the same. On the US wing, there is sheeting on top and bottom (LE and TE) and covering on the first three rib bays from the root rib. I am going to build the wing upside down on the top spar first, make sure the centerlines of the ribs are equal front to back in height, place the bottom spar on, reverify the centerline heights, and then start sheeting the bottom TE to lock the straightness into the wing. Sound good?
Thanks and happy flying!
09-09-2008, 12:49 PM
#7
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RE: Degrees of Washout for Super Kaos 60 wing
SER00
I just want to add that a wing like a Kaos has with top and bottom LE planking is not going to
twist very willingly and stay put using the covering. That works good for open structure wings
and ones with, at most, single surface LE sheeting. If you want washout in a "D" tube wing, it needs to
get locked in when the sheeting is glued on. Same is true if you want NO twist in the wings,
make sure they are flat when you glue that second LE sheet on. Tough to change after that.
(& I am sure most builders reading this post know this already!)
Dave
I just want to add that a wing like a Kaos has with top and bottom LE planking is not going to
twist very willingly and stay put using the covering. That works good for open structure wings
and ones with, at most, single surface LE sheeting. If you want washout in a "D" tube wing, it needs to
get locked in when the sheeting is glued on. Same is true if you want NO twist in the wings,
make sure they are flat when you glue that second LE sheet on. Tough to change after that.
(& I am sure most builders reading this post know this already!)
Dave
09-09-2008, 07:41 PM
#8
Senior Member
My Feedback: (1)
RE: Degrees of Washout for Super Kaos 60 wing
Ser....
Sounds like the way I would do it. ... Somehow.
I do however like to weight things down, use slow setting glue and then in day or two lift it off the plan then. Maybe you are luckier than me, and can get away with the fast setting glues.
My only complaint is the way the tail feathers are made up. Seems a bit thick, simple, and heavy to use slab wood.
I worked on the plan for the very big Ultra Sport about in early 1990's, before it was sold off for production.
Wm.
Sounds like the way I would do it. ... Somehow.
I do however like to weight things down, use slow setting glue and then in day or two lift it off the plan then. Maybe you are luckier than me, and can get away with the fast setting glues.
My only complaint is the way the tail feathers are made up. Seems a bit thick, simple, and heavy to use slab wood.
I worked on the plan for the very big Ultra Sport about in early 1990's, before it was sold off for production.
Wm.
