stevenmax50

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Iam considering what tools Iwill need for the day Ieventually decide to try a build from plans. What would be the advantages/disadvantges when chosing between a scroll saw or a band saw? Or would Ineed both? Which would make a more precise cut.

prgonzalez

Steven,

Go to this website [link]http://www.airfieldmodels.com/[/link]. It has all information you need.

BMatthews

It's a matter of great personal preference. Myself I like a bandsaw. But getting one with a deeper useable throat isn't always easy. The old 3 wheel style saws were nice but the smaller ones put a lot of stress on the blades so they didn't last all that long. But a few years back I found suppliers were selling really thin blades which I bought for my own 3 wheel saw. They've lasted well and I actually can wear them out before the blades fail from bending fatigue like the original thicker ones did.

yel914

I see you're covering your bases with this question. Good idea. I also prefer a bandsaw, but I do professional woodworking so I'm biased. For models, a scoll saw is probably the way to go, but whatever you do, get the best saw you can afford. The joy of saving a few dollars won't outlast the frustration of having to use a bad tool. You might find some helpful info on scroll and bandsaws on the Fine Woodworking website. Good luck on the search.

planebow

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I have a 15" band saw and could not live without it now. Still use the scroll saw to cut out the inside of formers.

vertical grimmace

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I am going to add to the list, and like the others you really need both a bandsaw and a scroll. The bandsaw will get the most work.
I have to highly recommend a good Stanley low angle block plane. Have a good set of drill bits and taps. As far as other machines, a decent drill press is very important and a disc / belt sander combo. Speaking of sandpaper have a full array of grits handy and also a couple of sanding blocks. Your sanding block with be one of the most tools.

cougdave

I tend to prefer the scroll saw in my shop. I use my bandsaw for resawing wood for woodworking projects and for cutting out guitar parts, but the scrollsaw gets most of my work with balsa. Like the previous posters have mentioned, it can make inside cuts easily. Most formers, many firewalls, and quite a few larger ribs have inside cuts. I have the scroll saw set up right next to my drill press. They tend to work as a pair.I find that working slowly with a scroll saw is easier than working slowly with a bandsaw. Cutting quickly with any saw usually gives you problems with balsa. The bandsaw may be a bit quicker, but I find that I have a better touch with the scroll saw. It might be the smaller table, orthe thinner blades, but I can make smoother turns and more intricate cuts with it. (I also have a few years of intarsia, inlay and marquetry under my belt, so I have more experience with the scroll saw too.)

Other tools you might want to think about while you are stocking up include a flat workspace, big sanding bars, lots of sanding grits, good straightedges, a few square blocks, a couple of good squares and drafting triangles, a T square or two, a couple of decent levels and a good sharpening stone set for your hobby knives.
You can also never have too many clamps, clothespins, T pins, rubber bands, files, rasps, sanding blocks, sanding sticks, tweezers, forceps, needle nosed pliers, fine saws and dice.

A good level usually has a very straight, flat edge. It can come in handy for squaring up your building surface, setting up any jigs you need, and then can be pressed into service as a big long sanding block for leading and trailing edges. I also like two types of straightedges. I like a good long stiff ruler of three feet or so. THis can be used to check your building surface. (Stand it on edge, and lay it across your building surface. If you can see daylight under it, you are not flat.) It is also good at lining up things like leading and trailing edges, fuselage structures, wing spars and anything else that has to be straight, but is not laying flat over the plans. The other straightedge that is handy is a cork backed flexible steel rule. THis can be used for laying out a straight line on the plans, or it can also be worked over a three dimensional surface to make a straight line in one dimension. I use this all the time for marking out stringer notches on turtledecks, laying turbulators out on wings, setting up flexible pushrods through formers and many other tasks where you need a simple arc placed over a complexly curved surface.

For sanding tools, I use all types of blocks and sticks with different grades of paper attached. I also am always on the lookout for small files and rasps that let me shape corners and crevices. My favorite tools tend be small files, artist's sculpting tools, dental picks and bent pieces of wire and nails, all dipped in glue and then coated with abrasive grits. I was just in harbor freight, and saw a set of dental tools with abrasives bonded to them. I bought both sets immediately. You will always be trying to smooth, sand or shape something you can't reach... It's part of being a model builder. I use clothespins, c clamps, wood clamps, report clamps, clipboards with clamps, vise grips, small vises, fly tying vises, potato chip bag clamps, little wire clamps from the kitchen, rubber bands, string, bench dogs and a big hank of old rubber strip to hold things together while glue dries. I find that I also make a lot of cauls for my clamps and vises. Sometimes it is easier to make a caul that fits in a clamp or vise and is tha shape of the item you are clamping than it is to try to rig up a series of clamps to do the same job. (Sometimes, the waste material that a part has been cut from can be pressed back into service as a caul to hold things together smoothly) I usually cover the caul with Saran wrap or a monokote scrap to keep from gluing it solidly to the part. The fifty foot hank of rubber was from my freeflight days. I bought a batch of tan II that had no energy whatsoever. (I think it got cooked in the back of a delivery truck on its way or something. I will use it to wrap around an object I want to hold together. It is great for binding large irregular sections that need carefully applied pressures. (Curved leading edges on my Focke Wulff A-17 Mowe a few years back)

I use carpenter's squares, machinist's squares, levels, and any other blocks, angles or similar devices to hold parts vertically while gluing. My secret tool that I have never seen anybody else use is... Dice! I always check them on a surface plate with a square before putting them on my building board, but I have never actually had one that was out of whack more than a thou or so. I have stacks of them from my Grandparent's house, and my Uncle's house. I also seem to aquire them at auctions and other strange places. They are handy, quick jigs to stand up wing ribs on smaller airplanes like 1/2 A Texaco models and smaller freeflights. Some of them I have glued up to small bases, offsetting over the edge of the base a sixteenth of an inch or so. THis allows them to clear the capstrip on the bottom of a wing rib but still keep the rib standing square. I always double check the wing rib with a notched square or something similar when using this setup, but I don't think I have ever had to adjust it afterwards.

THese are just a few tools that will help you build straight, true models. I know you were asking about the saws, but I guess I got on a roll! I hope you get some ideas from this thread, and post some of your builds when you get going.

Good Luck,
Dave

vertical grimmace

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I would like to add if you get a bandsaw, find one with a rip fence and a miter gauge. If you can find one of those disc/belt sander combos with a miter gauge, that is quite handy as well.

Rodney

I have all three, band saw, scroll saw and table saw. The band saw gets used by far the most and the scroll saw very seldom. If I had to give one up, it would be the scroll saw. If you decide on the band saw, two things: make sure it is a two wheel and get as big a throat as you can, at least 12 inch but more is better. Also, when choosing blades for it, get the wider ones. It is seldom that you ever need a narrow blade and the wide blades cut more true and easy. If doing a lot of plywood cutting, get the metal cutting blades as they work very well in plywood as well as metal.

donnyman

You have received good suggestions.

But the best I can offer is you supply yourself with a lot of sandpaper, elbow grease and patience. without these the rest of the tools are a waste of money!

Good luck!

Kostas1

Which of the two is more precise ?

A scroll saw or a band saw ;

I am interested in trying scratch building a Cub or a Tripacer
so i will need to cut my own wood , from wood panels of balsa and ply....

WhiteRook

My Feedback: (38)

number one , a drill press , two , a band saw . i perfer a band saw over a skroll saw , because of the blade life

just my opinion

Kostas1

I asked about precision on a cut....

Anyway....you mentioned ' saw life ' ..... how often someone replaces it ?

beepee

Scratch building? Precision cutting? Sorry, so far everyone is wrong. For scratch building, the very best tool is an axe! Placed firmly in the middle of the television, the rest of the building process will go much more efficiently, whichever secondary tool you choose.

Bedford

Kostas1

yel914

Cute! Precision? I suppose you could argue that a scroll saw is more precise because the blades are smaller and it cuts slower than a bandsaw. Personally, I cut close to the line on a bandsaw, then sand the parts with a disk/belt combo sander. For me, a scroll saw is just too slow.

Rodney

Which is more accurate, band saw or scroll saw? Either one can be very accurate or very poor, depending on quality of the tool. I find either one can be very accurate. If you want precision on straight cuts, neither will surpass a good table saw. On my 10 inch table saw, I can rip material down to 1/16 inch wide or less by using a no clearance inset. I cut most of my spar/stringer material with the table saw, most other stuff with the band saw. The scroll saw seldom gets exercised.

ARUP

Bandsaw. Microlux table saw (worth every penny). Rarely use a scroll saw. Belt and disc sander. Hand drill. Flat building board. Assorted sized 'T' bar and similar sanders. Sharp razor blade knives various lengths. Zona, flush cut and pull saws. Various files. Lastly, good wood.

Kostas1

What's a table saw ;
This ;

Kostas1

Rodney,

i see that on the table saw , the actual saw is a disk....not a saw with a shape of ,let's say, wire....very thin i mean.

So, if you want to cut some airframe formers, for the wing.....can you make such small cuts ;

vertical grimmace

My Feedback: (1)

I am a professional wood worker as well. You really need to be trained properly in the use of a table saw. It is by far the most dangerous machine in the shop. Mainly because it is taken for granted. The next most dangerous is the Shaper, but most of the guys will not get near it that have little experience, so accidents rarely occur. In the last 10 years I have seen 6 different employees get in the blade on a table saw. The biggest threat though is a kickback. Again, technique is key here.
If you are planning to get a table saw, seek some training from an experienced woodworker in it's proper operation. Also, buy the best blade you can. A dull, poor quality blade on a table saw is very dangerous. Also make sure to stand in the propper operators position so if a kickback does occur, the material does not hammer the family jewels!

Jim_Purcha

My Feedback: (8)

I was given an old (1950's) Rockwell/beaver table saw from my Dad, which belonged to his late Uncle. Uncle Onysh had made a woodcart for the saw which 50-70 ib. castaluminum base. Great saw. butnosafety guards around theblade.I've used this saw since I was a kid with my dad.I had quite the kick. Worried about having it around my own kids I got rid of it for safety concerns. To get a new saw has heavy as this model I would have to spend upward to $800.00. The saw was similar to this without the guard.

Jim

kdc

All the advice so far is good, but I suggest a scrollsaw( fretsaw) is more useful and at the moment they are very cheap.

However you do not need either to start building from plans! You may find using hand tools is more satisfying and safer than power tools. Any type of hand fretsaw or coping saw will cut out the curves in the few ply items on most plans. A fine tooth saw -tenon saw, dovetail saw or preferably a japanese type pull saw will cut any straight lines you need. A piece of wood with a 'v' shaped cut out will help when used with a fretsaw etc. A carpenters bench hook is easily made to the traditional design with a few pieces of scrap wood to hold wood for straight cuts. Note that fretsaws and coping saws use the blades with teeth pointing downwards so they are 'pullsaws' and that coping saws cut much better this way. Coping saws have a stouter blade which could be used either way but they cut much straighter if used as pullsaws. ( thats not in most woodwork books! )

Wing ribs can be shaped easily in a pack with a razor plane and sanding block, so you really dont need a bandsaw! Of course it's nice to have all the tools to play with but it's not essential.
Spend your money on a hand fretsaw, razor plane, scalpel and if possible a Permagrit sanding block to start with. And some type of stout bench is nearly essential preferably with a carpenters vise (flush with top ) or a Workmate will do.

Then choose a traditional plan with only a few cut plywood parts, avoid some of the latest designs which have lots of complicated fretted out light ply parts which are designed for laser cutting. ( they seem to be deliberately designed to promote sales of expensive laser cut parts )

kdc

Woodworkers may be interested in these pics of variations of the traditional bench hook and 'V' The revised bench hook with a square piece underneath allows the use of a cramp and mounts any way round in the vise or Workmate.
The addition of a piece of 2 x 4 enables the V to fit in a Workmate ( for sitting down ) or preferably in an engineers vise for standing up -it's just the right height. And of course its easily removable and better than screwing directly to the bench.

I know this thread is about power tools but I suggest hand tools are more satisfying and safer to use for the occasional user! Just a few simple gadgets makes the use easier.

Kostas1

What is the name of the tool appearing on your last picture;

Can you cut with it a firewall template from ply with an inch of thickness ;