TexasTank

Greetings all,
I got in my IMEX King Tiger, what a beast, I love it. I'm wondering about having it historically accurate when it comes to placing the decals. In the instructions, it shows where, but I'm not sure how accurate it is. Also, I have 3 sets of numbers or so. I take it to go with just one? Any help appreciated.

Regards,
Joel

Airbrushler

i would just google king tigers and look for something you like

mondo

Depending on colour, size and shape, it's easy enough with the right reference books to know which unit the tactical are for and in turn where they should go.

Depends how close to a real tank you want. Post a picture of them and I can probably cross reference them.

sevoblast

This link will give you a host of units to shoot for. German but mostly self explanatory

http://www.tiif.de/

ausf

As with anything WWII German, the variations are more rule than exception. Best course with camo, markings and equipment is find a photo that fits your needs and copy it best you can.

Turret numbers can be white, red, black, outlined, silhouette, solid, stenciled, hand painted, painted out, painted over, depends on the unit and when.

MAUS45

Ausf, don't forget yellow and blue for the Turret numbers. It could be a Tiger II working in the "Battle of the Bulge"! Like you said these numbers could be anything including letters denoting Regimental or Platoon command tanks as well.

TexasTank

Thank you all. In black, I have the numbers 300 (2) and 131 (2). In yellow I have the number 113 (2) and in red (333) (2). I take it you would only want to use 1 set of numbers, not a "333" and a "113"? Anyone have an opinion on which numbers I should go with? I've been searching the web trying to find out more about the "units" with each number but no luck. Any help/input appreciated.

Best wishes,
Joel

mondo

Yes, only 1 set of numbers. For instance 333 is 3rd tank of the 3rd platoon in the 3rd company. 300, depending on the battalion would be the 3rd company command tank. So there were many tanks which wore the same numbers as the 3 digits tactical system was ubiquitous to the German military. Some SS units used a 4 digits system for a while and one used a single number and letter.

The black ones you have could be for 503 abt. The balkenkruz goes in the turret centre and the numbers forward of that.

The books that have the information you need is tigers in combat 1 & 2.

xvxpskowro

Like you said these numbers could be anything including letters denoting Regimental or Platoon command tanks as well.

rivetcounter

All Tiger II Abteilung bore a 3 digit turret number though towards the end of the war some Abteilung didn’t have turret numbers or only a small number of Tiger in a Zug had them this was down to several reasons such as lack of time and paint or hiding the identity of command tanks, whilst it’s true to say 300 would be a Zugführer there were instances where this was not the case.
For a short time a number of Tiger Abteilung bore a 4 digit number this was only ever with Tiger I in 1943 and was not solely used on SS Abteilung for instance the Tiger Abteilung from Großbeutschland also bore a 4 digit number, black numbers were used by a number of Tiger Abteilung and not confined to one this would also be true of white and yellow but could also be used to identify each Zug and again there were instances in some Zug were there may be one or two Tiger with different coloured turret numbers this happened with Tigers in the LAH during the” Wacht an Rheine” operation.

The Balkan cross was not always in the centre of the turret on Tiger II in some instances it was placed on the hull towards the front but more often it was not applied to the tank at all one Tiger II Abteilung s.Pz.Abt.506 had the Balkan cross incorporated in the turret number for instance 2+03 or 1+09 this was used in December 1944 during “Wacht am Rheine”

mondo

I was referring to it being in the center of the turret for 503 King Tigers only. That was the location specfied at battalion level. Afaik the regiment using tigers in GD was SS and not heer.

rivetcounter

Correct me if I misunderstand the Division GD, Großbeutschland was a Waffen SS Division is that correct

rivetcounter

Afaik, no idea what language that is so can’t translate.
You have claimed that Großdeutschland (GD) was an SS Tiger Abteilung, this is of cause completely wrong, Heers Großdeutschland throughout the war regained its Tiger Abteilung unlike other divisions which lost their Tiger Abteilung to become independent Abteilungen most notably was s.SS.Pz.Abt.101/501 LAH and s.SS.PzAbt.102/502 3[SUP]rd[/SUP] SS Totenkopf refused to relinquish its Tiger Abteilung and opted to keep the Tiger Abteilung within its structure s.SS.Pz.Abt103 never really formed and by Normandy most of its ranks and Tigers though few in numbers were incorporated into s.SS.Pz.Abt102.

Perhaps when Herr Schneider, wrote Tigers in Combat if he had used slang and abbreviation’s throughout his introduction to Volume 2 you would have understood, the book was about the 3 SS Division’s/Abteilungen plus Heer’s GD division and other independent Abteilung, in the table of Contents or ToC it clearly states Wehmacht or WH then Waffen SS or WSS or SS then it lists Schwere SS-Panzerabteilung or s.SS.Pz.Abt and lastly Units with single attached Tigers or USAT it’s not hard to understand.

Max-U52

Hey Joel, one place that's good to look is at decal sets for static kits. They call them "Color Profiles" and if you look at decal sets at the static online hobby shops you can find color profiles for tons of decal sets. The great thing is you don't need to look for 1/16 decals, as all you're after is the image of the tank so it doesn't matter what scale the decal is for. They make so many tank decals in 1/35 scale it ain't even funny. Try places like http://www.squadron.com/ and http://www.spruebrothers.com/ . Just search King Tiger and you'll find tons of kits and decals. I have my KT done as number 113 and no one has ever questioned it. Of course, I ain't never had Rivetcounter over for supper. Just teasin', Rivetcounter. Guys with your vast knowledge on historical accuracy are a real valuable resource to the hobby, so don't stop doin' what you do so well.

rivetcounter

Max, if you remove the two decals on the front mudguards and also the Balkan cross from the front plate, the turret number should be black and white outline but inline with the turret Balkan cross and more to the rear then add some Rotbrun (red Brown) striping to the camouflage I will come for supper and a few Leffe Blond beers.

Be very careful with colour profiles especially if they originate from Poland these are usually Vodka inspired and most defiantly not to be trusted as has been said the TiiF Forum has all the known/published pictures of Tigers listed on its pages.

If you can’t find in 1/16 scale the decals you want then contact Pedinghause in Germany (yes he speaks English) he can provide anything you want that is not available he has helped me on a number of occasions with 1/6 decals were nothing is available

Max-U52

Those are just the stickers that come with the tank, and I've known all along that I won't be keeping this paintjob. I'm not fanatical about it, and sometimes I'll make a minor change just because I feel like it, but I do try to at least stay within the realm of realism. For now a couple of my tigers have the knight on horseback but that won't stay, at least not with the toy-like appearance. I'm just learning about painting armor, but I have a lot of aircraft experience so that will help. Time to stop looking at RLM and start with the RAL. I usually do stuff like this, but I'm really looking forward to more tanks. I have a T1 going now and want to get to the PIV this winter.

rivetcounter

Max, nice Stuka though I have to admit that this is not my area, I know the Luftwaffe used splinter camo and they had Stuka tank busters and the man with the highest number of tank kills flew a Stuka, little more.

The charging Knight was used by s.H.PzAbt 505, from what I remember this was introduced on the steel wheel Tiger I and latter transferred to the Tiger II.

Max-U52

I had a feeling the knight didn't belong on my T1 early. I believe you refer to Gunther Rall. I have a bud in the UK that's really into Stukas and I got a lot of guidance on this one from him.



It would be great to know I can call on you for assistance when I do the PIV. Mine is just the stock Taigen PIV, do you know any cool schemes for that? The winter camo they put on it is not one of my favorites. This is the 1/48 version of the T1 I'm doing right now in 1/16, and the 48th is just an OOB build of the Tamiya kit. I did add the barrel, PE, tracks, etc, etc.



I'm already cheating on the 16th version because I really like the effect the camo on the roadwheels gives so I'm keepin' it, but the real tank didn't have camo on the roadwheels.

Max-U52

Sorry Joel, I didn't mean to hijack your thread like that.

Max-U52

Hey Joel,

If you like the knight scheme on the KT I have a set I can send you, and with what you have it should be easy to do and look pretty cool.

Rivetcounter, do you have a photo of the KT with the knight so Joel can check it out?

rivetcounter

Max, the 1/48 Tiger I you show pictures of S33 with the letter S meaning “Schwere” or heavy this depicts a Tiger I from 2[SUP]nd[/SUP] SS Pz. Div Das Reich during the battle of Kursk, this is very simple there are hundreds of pictures of Tigers during the battle of Kursk, all the markings on the Tiger are correct including the “Imp” on the turret this was latter dropped in Normandy.

http://www.tiif.de/thread.php?threadid=21&sid=
http://www.tiif.de/thread.php?threadid=82&sid=

TexasTank

Thank you all for the kind replies and help. Since the last few posts, I went ahead and applied decals. For the turret, on each side I used the first picture posted in this thread to go by, the numbers 131 with the Balkan Cross above it on each side. The black numbers and cross outlined by white look really great on the paint scheme. I just took it out for its first real run just now. They are building a subdivision behind me so I have lots of dirt and sand hills to test it on. Did really great. Thanks again,

Joel

Max-U52

Hey Joel, any chance for some video on those hills? I still haven't seen much footage of the torro KTs in the hands of guys like us. My KT is the Imex version with the Porsche turret, but I've got the torro with the Henschel on my wish list. Right after the Stug. And of course, they're ALL behind the Jagdtiger!!

But a more detailed review of your new KT would be really great. So far you're the only guy I know of that's purchased the new Imex/Torro King Tiger, so tell us about it!

TexasTank

Sure max, unless I get rained out I will sure do it. I a member of Vimeo so all my vids will be in HD fwiw. Just bare with me, I'm a new tank driver and video shooter. . Thanks for the offer on the knight but I have some left from my Tiger I. Thanks again.

Joel

TexasTank

I don't want to beat a dead horse here, but I wanted to post this. Looks like I picked wisely on number/cross placement. Mine are all the same as in these great photos.

http://www.network54.com/Forum/47207...+101+Jemappes.

Regards,
Joel