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Need help identifying old rigger

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Old 01-13-2018, 03:04 PM
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Gearheadwilly
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Default Need help identifying old rigger

Hello all, I recently picked up an apparently old(er) nitro hydro rigger. Looks to be in great shape. KB 35 engine, rudder bracket says MARINE SPECIALTIES. I've looked online for weeks and read everything I can find trying identify this boat. I would ultimately like to see it run and make waves again. Only missing parts are the exhaust pipe and remote. Engine turns but feels gummed up. Any ideas on year, make model? Value? (is it even worth messing with) I have a large collection of vintage rc cars and trucks but this is my first boat so any help is greatly appreciated. Sorry about the picture quality, I'll get a few better ones tomorrow if necessary. Thanks in advance. [img]1234[/img]​​​​
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Old 01-13-2018, 03:43 PM
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Your image link doesn’t work.
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Old 01-14-2018, 07:48 AM
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Ditto here. Did the OP use the “manage attachments” tool on the “advanced” post page to attach his image?



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Old 01-14-2018, 01:35 PM
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Seems like a great virus to me.
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Old 01-14-2018, 07:12 PM
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My apologies, I might have skipped a step. The aforementioned pictures.
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Old 01-17-2018, 03:05 PM
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Any ideas? Homemade/kit? Obviously the fuel tank is homemade, quality on the rest is decent. Also any thoughts on what coating would be on a wood boat from years ago? The only fiberglass on the entire boat is the canopy (engine cover) but the coating on the wood appears to be gel coat? There's a few paint chips and some staining I'd like to address before spring and I'm not sure what I could recoat or touch up with. In the pic you can see the tank and also the "remains" of an exhaust system I'm desperately trying to figure out. Any suggestions on what my options for exhaust are? I appreciate any help, thanks.
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Old 01-17-2018, 09:38 PM
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I took the pictures and your questions over to a different forum that is all boating and posted them there. Hopefully, we'll get you some answers
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Old 01-18-2018, 01:27 AM
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I found someone that thinks they know what you're dealing with, boat wise, but asked if you could post a better picture of the engine cover.
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Old 01-18-2018, 04:53 AM
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Great, here is a couple of the cover. I've checked for any markings etc and found nothing. The guy I bought it from said him and his grandfather were in a club that raced at a local pond when he was a kid. Approximately 20 years ago. What site/forum are you referring to? I'd like to check it out and learn more about the history of these interesting boats. Thanks.
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Old 01-18-2018, 06:40 AM
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Just got a very definitive answer from the one and only Andy Brown. Here's his post:
I'd say scratch built tub with Crapshooter sponsons. The turnfin is .21 Mongoose (1986) as is the engine plate with the large offset. Engine is mounted level with an S-bend shaft. Same as was done in the .21 Mongoose.This boat was probably built around 1986-87.
The twenty or so years ago would fall into that rough time frame as it's been 30 years, based on his build date.
If you have any questions on Andy's ability with riggers, here's part of his signature on the other website:
First R/C boat - Dumas Dragonfly 40. Built 1973. Designed Mongoose 1984, Eagle 1990, Jaguar 1994, Eagle SG 1996, SGX 2001.

IMPBA member since 1976. First Internats 1977. NAMBA member since 1977. First NAMBA Nats 1978. APBA member 1989.

Multiple Record holder in IMPBA, NAMBA, APBA. First IMPBA member to officially exceed 100 mph and 125 mph.4 time IMPBA US-1 National champion, Presidents Cup, Bill LeFeber award. Hydro Technical directer (wrote Hydro definitions), District 3 Director. Two time NAVIGA World Champion. Designed developed the highly successful MAC engine line. Helped a few other r/c boaters succeed. Designed and developed four uniquely different Riggers over the past 30 years. All have set records and won major championships.

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Old 01-18-2018, 07:18 AM
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Andy got back to me in minutes, the engine cover is from what he referred to as an 80ish Crapshooter. Unfortunately, I don't know who designed and marketed the Crapshooter to get more info on it
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Old 01-18-2018, 11:18 AM
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Wow, much appreciated thanks to Mr brown and yourself. that's more info than I've been able to find in weeks of searching. What type of coating would have been used back then? I can't find any suitable exhaust either. Might have to make one. Thank you for your help with this old girl.
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Old 01-18-2018, 12:46 PM
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I would have thought this rigger was a Dumas Kit [ lill rascal ] with a custom canopy.
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Old 01-18-2018, 01:06 PM
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I was thinking the same thing, at first anyway. A couple of things didn't really look Dumas though, hence my calling for "re-enforcements" that know more about riggers than I do
Actually, the guy that made and sold Crapshooters has a membership on the other site I frequent so, hopefully, he gets in on the "mystery boat info fest" that's going on

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Old 01-18-2018, 06:35 PM
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The lil rascal looks shorter than this boat and the outriggers seem smaller and less aerodynamic. Also the prop shaft goes through the hull of the boat near the middle, on my boat the shaft is through the rear. Total length minus prop and rudder is 29 1/4 inches, width is 14 1/4 inches at its widest point. What would a realistic estimate of top speed with the little K/B 3.5? Is it worth trying to build or modify an exhaust from something else or is it wise to just keep looking for an original style exhaust system?
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Old 01-18-2018, 08:00 PM
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I'd have to say Mr Brown hit the nail directly on the big pink head (see pic), big shock right? Not! Did some research and turns out he's a legend! It's an honor just to get his opinion and advice. I found your "mystery boat info fest" and I've tried to sign up and become a member but registration fails everytime. Pic is from the early 80s and is titled crapshooter 21. As it turns out my seemingly junk "cut up" exhaust is exactly how some of the fastest guys ran them all those years ago, that's extremely cool. Here I was, thinking I needed to replace it. Huge thanks to hydro junkie for going the extra mile for a newbie, people like you are a big part of what makes this hobby great for all of us.
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Old 01-18-2018, 09:14 PM
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you should be able to buy a 180 degree manifold and a tuned pipe , even from an r/c car engine as they mostly have the rear exhaust and use 180 degree headers.
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Old 01-18-2018, 11:39 PM
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DAMN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
HE FOUND MY PRIVATE STASH OF EXPERTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Andy doesn't think of himself as a legend, just a boater and business man that runs CMDi. Between him, Marty Davis(the person that designed and sold the Crapshooter in those days), Jerry Dunlap(who has designed, built and raced tunnel hulls, including many of the kits Dumas has sold over the past 30+ years) and the late Roger Newton(who hand drew plans for a majority of the scale hydroplanes seen on the water today), they pretty much defined what boat racing has become. I could name many others that have been as influential as this group but you probably don't need me to put you to sleep
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Old 01-18-2018, 11:41 PM
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Originally Posted by crapshooter View Post
you should be able to buy a 180 degree manifold and a tuned pipe , even from an r/c car engine as they mostly have the rear exhaust and use 180 degree headers.
One question:
Why? That was a record setting set up back in the day so why mess with it?
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Old 01-19-2018, 05:17 AM
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I'm going to leave it as is, from what I can gather these have always been highly respected boats. One big thing I found out last night while searching my feeble brain out was that 30 years ago when this boat was the one to have, they held major races at a place called just add water boats in Indianapolis Indiana. That business is 4 miles from my house, I bought this boat from a neighbor on my street and as previously stated he said they raced at a nearby pond. I'm thinking this boat was most likely in the water with some real titans of the time. Also Indianapolis was where crapshooters were made for some time. The whole "indy hydro" thing. I have no clue what the value is but it seems like a little piece of local history. Which is priceless and imo we are caretakers in situations like this, our job is to preserve and show our kids how things used to be. I have vintage rc's from the 50's, 60's and 70's I feel the same way about. Run them a couple times a year just out of respect for the guys (and gals) that helped get this hobby to the extreme point we're at now. I know I'm a nerd! I'd like to know what hydro junkie or Mr Brown would do with this boat? Gotta find a set of those wicked crapshooter decals from back in the day after I figure out what to touch up or recoat with.
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Old 01-19-2018, 05:33 AM
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For me it's very simple:
1) Remove the engine, radio gear and hardware from the boat and give it all a thorough cleaning/checkup
2) Clean the hull, inside and out
3) Take the hull to an automotive paint shop and have them match the color of the paint
4) Strip the old paint off the hull, check for rot or oil damage in the wood, repair as needed
5) Seal the hull with fresh epoxy, prime and repaint
6) If you can find the "Crapshooter" decals you want, install them and clear over the top to protect them
7) Install everything that was removed and head to the pond.
One thing you may want to do, if you plan to run this boat, is replace the radio gear with modern equivalents to what it has now. If it's that old, the servos may not work well and I'd be willing to bet the receiver is wide band, making it non-FCC compliant
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Old 01-19-2018, 06:00 AM
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Absolutely, I've been looking around for replacement radio gear this week. What's safe to strip the paint/epoxy without hurting the wood? What kind of speed realistically could I expect to see out of this setup? The few videos I can find look like these boats are absolutely flying around the pond. Thanks.
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Old 01-19-2018, 06:15 PM
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you can use house paint stripper on the hull as no doubt it would be some sort of enamel paint used . don,t expect great rigger speeds from this hull and power plant as it won,t happen unfortunetly unless a higher rpm engine is fitted along with a pipe that works. this is hull is now more of a collectors item and would look great restored and shelved.
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Old 01-21-2018, 11:29 AM
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Having never driven a boat of any kind, im sure the speed of this one will be plenty for me. Lol. If anything it's probably a bit faster and more challenging to drive than most people would recommend for your first boat (not to mention fragile). I'll restore it, use it on occasion and proudly display it with the rest of my old cars. I'm seeing alot of guys using Nelson's epoxy primer as a base after stripping the old paint off, is that what you would recommend? I'd like to do this right the first time and hopefully the only time, seeing how it won't be in the water often. The radio gear is 27 megahertz so as far as I can tell it's still OK to operate on (correct me if I'm wrong). I disassembled the engine soaked it and cleaned it up now its turning over smooth as butter, and with great compression. Planing on testing servos etc today and then tearing it apart so I can begin the strip and reseal/paint process this week. I'll update this thread as I go. No doubt I'll have a few questions for you "subject matter experts" along the way. Thanks.
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Old 01-21-2018, 08:24 PM
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I personally use West Systems epoxy due to the fact that it's made for marine use. Depending on who you ask, there are other kinds that others prefer
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