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is nitro on its way out?

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Old 10-15-2017, 02:08 PM
  #276
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I take the little card and load it on the computer, then I can't find the pictures for an hour. I figured how to load them on the sites pretty easy though. The computer radios are nice, but I tend to procrastinate hooking up the controls because of it. Lots of planes all ready to go without the battery pack and receiver because of that. I'm not quite 60 yet. I started these forums a few years ago just to sharpen up my typing.
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Old 10-15-2017, 06:14 PM
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Hey, Jim. I can program Dual rates, EPA's and stuff like that no .problem. Expo is nice to have, but I don't use it much. I don't care for the variable response from the controls you'll get. Then again, I don't fly 3D. I like to fly as if it were my butt in the cockpit. So, not a lot of negative G stuff either. Having the rudder on both sticks is an intriguing idea. I'm building another Rascal right now. I think I'll try that as I'm going to add a steerable tail wheel instead of the skid. I've been caught more than once trying to taxi with the left stick on a 3-channel bird!
Drove it right into the weeds one time. Ha!
No kids, though. I'm on my own here. Hence the slow learning curve. I'll figure it out...eventually.
May all your landings be greasers.
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Old 10-15-2017, 07:13 PM
  #278
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aspeed View Post
I take the little card and load it on the computer, then I can't find the pictures for an hour. I figured how to load them on the sites pretty easy though. The computer radios are nice, but I tend to procrastinate hooking up the controls because of it. Lots of planes all ready to go without the battery pack and receiver because of that. I'm not quite 60 yet. I started these forums a few years ago just to sharpen up my typing.
aspeed, 'sup? Don't you have to open a file or something to download the pictures onto? I really do not have a clue.
When it comes to control hook ups, I ty to go for the outer hole on the control horn, and ,say, the middle hole on the servo horn. I'm going for the best leverage so the servo doesn't have to work as hard, thereby keeping current draw to a minimum. not to mention less wear and tear on the servo itself. With that being said, all settings on the Tx are set at 100%. Then I go into the dual rate menu and adjust those for low and high rates. I try to keep as much servo throw as possible, while getting the recommended throws, in order to maintain as much resolution as possible. I don't use EPA if I can avoid it, Unless I want more up than down or whatever. But that's rarely the case.
Now, let's get those hanger queens in the air, shall we?
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Old 10-15-2017, 07:18 PM
  #279
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Originally Posted by born2build View Post
Hey, Jim. Wow,this is embarrassing. I don't even know how to download my pictures onto my laptop. I'm 64 years old and this is my first computer, seriously!
I don't really like the darn things all that much. To me,they're kinda spooky. There's nothing personal about a personal computer.
I love to build balsa models, and I love to take pictures, but I'm not exactly wild about all of this "interweb" stuff. Even programming my transmitter (Futaba 8J) can be a bit intimidating at times. But, it would be nice to be able to show you guys some of my stuff, not that it's all that special. What do you think, can I be saved, or am I too far gone already?
Stick with the computer, the net will open up a whole new world. To upload an image; click on the paper clip, click on choose a file, click on the pic. you want and click open. Happy surfing.
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Old 10-15-2017, 07:31 PM
  #280
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ochsm00
How ya doin'? I'm not going to toss my $500 laptop. No way!
The problem is I don't know how to get the pictures onto my laptop in the first place. I may be as dumb as a bag of hammers on this, but I'm pretty sure I need to do that first. Any help with this would greatly appreciated. Rick
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Old 10-16-2017, 09:31 PM
  #281
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Wow...just wow! I can't believe what I just did! I actually learned how to download photos onto my computer.
There were a lot of "but firsts" to do but I figured it out! Tomorrow, I'm going to take some shots of a couple of my planes and see if I can get them to upload here. Watch this space, fellas!
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Old 10-17-2017, 12:18 AM
  #282
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spiceflyer View Post
Ive been out the hobby for 5 years or so... Been flying ultralights.. But anyhow im back and wanting to get some planes in the air... about to join the local club down the road.. What I have been noticing is that nitro planes are getting over run by electric.. Even nitroplanes.com don't even sell nitro planes anymore.. That's just sad... I know towers does and some other places but its not looking good... I love nitro.. Ill never own a electric plane... I just don't think there anyway cool.. Im sure there more convenient, but man.. The smell and sound of a sweet 4 stroke is what makes the hobby for me... I even love the occasional dead stick landing and the oil on the planes... I really hope electric isn't phasing out nitros....
No. Glow planes are NOT on the way out.

(And please don't call them 'Nitro' - it is a 'marketing' term, mostly aimed at the R/C car people as the marketeers thought it was more 'trendy'. In fact many glow fuels, particularly here in Europe, don't contain any 'Nitro' at all and in the R/C world the 5-10% of nitromethane that is sometimes added is mostly there to improve the tickover in cold weather. Gasoline doesn't contain any )

On our large and popular UK site electrics are used mostly for small planes and the occasional powered glider (where it enables you to turn the motor off and then back on). The rest of the planes are glow, or if fairly large, gasoline. We used to fly more electrics, but many have gone back to glow/gasoline for the reasons below.

Why?
There is far too much 'faffing around' with electrics. Large lead-acid batteries as a power supply, chargers, waiting while it re-charges, having a couple of spare lipos so you don't have to wait, and those lipos all different for each plane, etc. etc. etc. You can see how complicated and tedious it all is by counting the near-endless questions about electric power on this and other R/C sites
And if I charge everything fully at home, by the time it's all done I've lost interest in going to the flying site at all.

And I use only a couple of GOOD makes of glow engines, they start near instantly and are perfectly reliable if you don't constantly mess with them, as some poor souls do. Mine get a couple of tankfuls of fuel run through them at home when brand new and that's it. I've not had an engine stop 'accidentally' in five years at least.

What with shavers, garden tools, phones, the R/C gear itself, etc. I seem to spend half my life waiting for something to charge and I'm not going to add to it with electric powered planes, though I do have a couple of small ones - a Sig Rascal made from the kit and a E-Flite foamy Hawker Sea Fury, plus a rarely flown BVM Electra EDF. Charging that in the field flattens TWO 110 amp/hour leisure batteries after about three flights which is why I don't fly it often, and carrying a gasoline generator would negate the whole purpose of electrics, as of course does starting your car and charging it from that.

And on the same basis if anyone thinks I am going to spend 50,000 to 100,000 dollars on a Tesla with an 'in actual practice'' out and return operating radius of only 100 miles they've got another think coming

Last edited by Mark Powell; 10-17-2017 at 12:30 AM.
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Old 10-17-2017, 06:09 AM
  #283
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I'm with you Mark! I do have two projects one 42" WS and one 60" WS, both twin engine models that will be electric because one came with the motors and the small one because it just too light to want to convert to glow. Everything else I have already built or will build is glow. I have glow engines on hand ranging from .020 ci (.0327 cc) to 1.08 ci (30 cc) so I'm pretty fixed for a while.
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Old 10-17-2017, 08:34 AM
  #284
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Hey, guys. Let's face it. Electrics are here to stay. They've gotten too good. I remember when Astroflight was virtually the only game in town. Overweight and underpowered, I was not impressed, to say the least. But now, with brushless motors, programmable ESC's, and lipo batteries, that's all changed. I think Mark may be overstating things a bit. There are advantages as well as disadvantages with both glow and electric power, of course. Electric is clean and quiet. Glow is messy and loud, just as an example. Typically, I fly only three sizes of electrics. Nothing bigger than a 450 sized motor with no more than 3S lipo's. And I can charge them up days before I go flying. Lipo's seem to hold their charge for a LOT longer than nicads ever could. Besides, I seldom put in more than 3 or four flights a day anyway. I do a lot of hanger flying between flights, and help the newbies and stuff.
Glow engines will always be with me. I've got too much skin in the game. I won't give them up without a gun to my head!
Well, I have a Sig Rascal on the bench that ain't gonna build itself so, see ya!
Rick
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Old 10-17-2017, 08:35 AM
  #285
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Hey, guys. Let's face it. Electrics are here to stay. They've gotten too good. I remember when Astroflight was virtually the only game in town. Overweight and underpowered, I was not impressed, to say the least. But now, with brushless motors, programmable ESC's, and lipo batteries, that's all changed. I think Mark may be overstating things a bit. There are advantages as well as disadvantages with both glow and electric power, of course. Electric is clean and quiet. Glow is messy and loud, just as an example. Typically, I fly only three sizes of electrics. Nothing bigger than a 450 sized motor with no more than 3S lipo's. And I can charge them up days before I go flying. Lipo's seem to hold their charge for a LOT longer than nicads ever could. Besides, I seldom put in more than 3 or four flights a day anyway. I do a lot of hanger flying between flights, and help the newbies and stuff.
Glow engines will always be with me. I've got too much skin in the game. I won't give them up without a gun to my head!
Well, I have a Sig Rascal on the bench that ain't gonna build itself so, see ya!
Rick
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Old 10-17-2017, 09:11 AM
  #286
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How did that happen? Like I said, computers are spooky.
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Old 10-17-2017, 11:03 AM
  #287
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Truth be told I have been on a twin engine electric kit kick lately, my next kit will probably be the SIG Dornier Do-217 just because I like SIG kits and I like the looks of it. I may also consider the Pat Tritle Ford Trimotor, the plans & short kit is about $100 and includes the vacuum formed scale engines. First, I have a bunch of glow projects to get built. The majority of my electric kit acquisitions have been in the 42" to 60" range, both the Trimotor and Dornier fit in this size range.

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Old 10-17-2017, 01:44 PM
  #288
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Help! I need someone to walk me through the uploading process so I can show you guys some of my stuff. Anyone?
I'll even buy you a beer!
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Old 10-18-2017, 12:31 AM
  #289
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Quote:
Originally Posted by born2build View Post
Hey, guys. Let's face it. Electrics are here to stay. They've gotten too good. I remember when Astroflight was virtually the only game in town. Overweight and underpowered, I was not impressed, to say the least. But now, with brushless motors, programmable ESC's, and lipo batteries, that's all changed. I think Mark may be overstating things a bit. There are advantages as well as disadvantages with both glow and electric power, of course. Electric is clean and quiet. Glow is messy and loud, just as an example. Typically, I fly only three sizes of electrics. Nothing bigger than a 450 sized motor with no more than 3S lipo's. And I can charge them up days before I go flying. Lipo's seem to hold their charge for a LOT longer than nicads ever could. Besides, I seldom put in more than 3 or four flights a day anyway. I do a lot of hanger flying between flights, and help the newbies and stuff.
Glow engines will always be with me. I've got too much skin in the game. I won't give them up without a gun to my head!
Well, I have a Sig Rascal on the bench that ain't gonna build itself so, see ya!
Rick
Basically I agree with you, but I see you only go electric up to 450 size, which is near enough what I said. (and do myself except for EDFs, which are greatly superior to the old glow ones).

And electric has certainly impacted OS. They have dropped all their small glow engines, including the excellent OS 30 four stroke. Also they make a range of electric motors/speed controllers now.

But on my local state owned and supported large 'public' field, which is open to all provided they have BMFA (UK equivalent of your AMA) insurance the use of electrics in anything except smaller planes has greatly declined in the last few years.

Incidentally, my electric Sig Rascal, made from the kit, is the only plane of any kind that get taken to the field every time I go. And it's about 12 years old now
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Old 10-18-2017, 04:51 AM
  #290
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Hi, Mark,
Actually, we're pretty much on the same page. I'm not saying you are wrong about the hassles of charging all those batteries.
I have two excellent chargers that can charge anything from my glow driver to my starter battery, and everything in between. So, the situation is under control. I think the secret to any success I may have experienced is to keep things as simple as is practical. Most all of the planes I have built and flown over these past thirty-odd years were no more than four channels, some three, like the Rascal I'm building right now, my second,and even some that were two channels. The Ace Mach None comes to mind.
Funny thing about the Rascal I'm building. It will get one of the O.S. outrunners you mentioned, although I'll be using a.Castle Creations ESC. Judging by the last Rascal I owned, I'll be able to cruise around 1/4 throttle, looking for lift, or open it up and enjoy some 3-channel aerobatics. Stall turns with a spin on the way down, rudder rolls and really BIG consecutive loops, and avalanches are all part of this lovely little bird's repertoire. Inverted flight is a little freaky. though, especially while turning. Scared myself more than once with that! Hope you are well. Happy landings! I've got to get back to sanding.
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Old 10-18-2017, 03:59 PM
  #291
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Quote:
Originally Posted by countilaw View Post
I've been flying glow engines for over 50 years. The only people I see and hear calling for the doom of glow engines are those too damn lazy to clean their planes and only play with foamy toys.

If you are in this hobby for your love of planes, the artistry of building one, and then seeing it fly-- You, my friend, are a true hobbyist. You are the one that loves seeing the fruits of your labor fly and fly the way you expected it to fly. If you enjoyed wiping the castor oil off the wings and fuselage while checking for any damage and all the while thinking of ways to make it better-- you are a true hobbyist.

If you are a person that orders your foamy or arf online, charge the battery, and go to the local park to fly it, and then throw it into the trunk of your car, where it will sit until you get the urge to play with it again -- well, you are just an over grown kid with a toy.

Now everyone can rant and rave about how I have insulted electric fliers (boys with toys).

And wait for it, wait for it - - - The "I don't have time to build !!!" excuse.

Frank
Those kids, who would never have gotten into the hobby except for electrics, are bringing new blood into my club. I welcome them. And yes some of them even end up building.
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Old 10-18-2017, 04:01 PM
  #292
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Quote:
Originally Posted by born2build View Post
Hi, Mark,
Actually, we're pretty much on the same page. I'm not saying you are wrong about the hassles of charging all those batteries.
I have two excellent chargers that can charge anything from my glow driver to my starter battery, and everything in between. So, the situation is under control. I think the secret to any success I may have experienced is to keep things as simple as is practical. Most all of the planes I have built and flown over these past thirty-odd years were no more than four channels, some three, like the Rascal I'm building right now, my second,and even some that were two channels. The Ace Mach None comes to mind.
Funny thing about the Rascal I'm building. It will get one of the O.S. outrunners you mentioned, although I'll be using a.Castle Creations ESC. Judging by the last Rascal I owned, I'll be able to cruise around 1/4 throttle, looking for lift, or open it up and enjoy some 3-channel aerobatics. Stall turns with a spin on the way down, rudder rolls and really BIG consecutive loops, and avalanches are all part of this lovely little bird's repertoire. Inverted flight is a little freaky. though, especially while turning. Scared myself more than once with that! Hope you are well. Happy landings! I've got to get back to sanding.
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Old 10-18-2017, 04:16 PM
  #293
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Quote:
Originally Posted by born2build View Post
Help! I need someone to walk me through the uploading process so I can show you guys some of my stuff. Anyone?
I'll even buy you a beer!
Click on the paper clip.
A window will come up with boxes "Choose a file" Click on that.
A window will come up of your "Pictures Library". Choose the picture you want and click on it.
Click open on the bottom right and the info will appear in the Choose a file box.
Click upload and you are done.
Post if you have trouble.
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Old 10-18-2017, 04:34 PM
  #294
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Quote:
Originally Posted by born2build View Post
ochsm00
How ya doin'? I'm not going to toss my $500 laptop. No way!
The problem is I don't know how to get the pictures onto my laptop in the first place. I may be as dumb as a bag of hammers on this, but I'm pretty sure I need to do that first. Any help with this would greatly appreciated. Rick
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Did a USB cord come with your camera?
Connect it to the camera and a USB port on your computer.
Turn on the camera and the computer should recognize the camera and tell you what to do.
We are talking a digital camera right?
If you're talking old photos they have to be scanned.

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Old 10-18-2017, 04:41 PM
  #295
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I've been using IC aka glow, nitro all my life and just built an electric plane. It sure is clean, but lipo packs are costly and don't last. Going to play with both now and see...
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Old 10-18-2017, 10:26 PM
  #296
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Old 10-18-2017, 10:52 PM
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Son of a gun! My first upload...ever! I'm tickled!
That is the T-Craft from a Great Planes kit. I did by my own electric conversion by simply adding a motor box to the firewall.
Easy peasy! It's using the O.S. 3815 1000kv outrunner swinging a standard APC 11x5 prop. A thunderbird 54 amp ESC handles the motor control chores A 3s 2200mah lipo powers everything, and a Futaba 8J was pressed into service for guidance. All up weight is (drumroll, please) 3lbs 4oz. This build was started in 2012, but after a major setback in my life, she's finally complete! I don't know when I'll be able to test fly it since I'm still recovering. It may not be until next year, I really don't know.
ochsnm00- Thank you! Where's the rest of your airplane? Ha!
You guys are the best! thank you all! Now, more sanding on the Rascal.
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Old 10-19-2017, 04:16 AM
  #298
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Quote:
Originally Posted by born2build View Post
Son of a gun! My first upload...ever! I'm tickled!
That is the T-Craft from a Great Planes kit. I did by my own electric conversion by simply adding a motor box to the firewall.
Easy peasy! It's using the O.S. 3815 1000kv outrunner swinging a standard APC 11x5 prop. A thunderbird 54 amp ESC handles the motor control chores A 3s 2200mah lipo powers everything, and a Futaba 8J was pressed into service for guidance. All up weight is (drumroll, please) 3lbs 4oz. This build was started in 2012, but after a major setback in my life, she's finally complete! I don't know when I'll be able to test fly it since I'm still recovering. It may not be until next year, I really don't know.
ochsnm00- Thank you! Where's the rest of your airplane? Ha!
You guys are the best! thank you all! Now, more sanding on the Rascal.
Congrats on the T-Craft! Looks great, and that weight is superbly light. Proof electric can be light.
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Old 10-19-2017, 04:36 AM
  #299
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Congrats on the T-Craft! Looks great, and that weight is superbly light. Proof electric can be light.
Thanks, buddy. When it comes to building flying models, I have three rules; Build it light, build it straight, and build it strong.
Well, it also has to look good and be fun to fly. By the way, With a 56 inch wingspan and nearly 500 square inches of wing area, the wing loading comes out at 15 ounces per square foot. I'm gonna go thermal hunting with this thing! Ha!
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Old 10-19-2017, 05:26 AM
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I went by the LHS to pick up a special order part and walked into a similar discussion as we are having here. The consensus is the electric ARFs, RTF, BNF have ruined the hobby. What kept the hobby going back in the day was commitment. When you had to put your own blood, sweat, and tears into a project you had a great deal of buy in and you stuck with the hobby out of the satisfaction you got from success. Now I guy can buy a RTF charge the battery in his car on the way home and fly the darn thing, no commitment necessary. If you have just a few dollars invested and no skin in the game the hobby becomes as disposable as last night's movie ticket.
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