jones75

can you please tell me the modifications that you made to the SE to make it 3D like that. It would really help.

thanx.

da king

My Feedback: (5)

First, i replaced the ply rib's with balsa. Next i used 1/4 sq balsa stick's and built up the aileron's(stock size), added an inch to the back of the rudder and moved the hinge line to 50/50 on the elevator and added counterbalancer's. Then I had to add the carbon gear to clear the 14 or 15 inch prop. Other than that, it's pretty stock !!! All kit wood.

I do have two hs 81 on the tail and 2 3004's in the wing. I want to build a new one with 3004's all the way around and a nice cover job. I have so-lite and ultracote light on there and am happy with the covering, just not the scheme.

3lb's being pulled my a 14 or 15 inch prop help's a little too. hehe.

DK

LSP972

My Feedback: (13)

I'll second Prawnik's request; I would love to have a Yak 18 kit.

I bought a SkyBolt off eBay last year and paid dearly for it; and the only reason I won the auction was because I screwed up and bid $25,000!!! I meant to bid $250- and would have been outbid. I was also outbid on a Zlin and Kommander a while back; and didn't even bother to bid on a Yak that eventually sold for over $300.

C'mon, Sig; help us out here. But I'm not holding my breath; I asked about this when I called them back in February on another matter, and was told that there are no plans to bring back any discontinued kits. The fact is that the older Sig kits are definitely NOT for the faint of heart or the impatient. Great Planes has done a good job of simplifying kit design so they build fast with few hassles; but they are not in the same league as a carefully-built Sig kit. Unfortunately, it would seem that most folks today want plug'n'play. I'm afraid we kit fans, especially those who appreciate the older "builder's kits", are pretty much on our own these days.

You guys do know that an Australian firm owns Sig now? They had no kits at Toledo (at least that I saw), but plenty of ARFs. The Sundancer 50 is a neat-looking biplane; but Cox will have an Ultimate the same size that looks just as good and will be $80 less. I meant to go back and try to get some pictures of those very nice large (for Cox) Cox ARFs, but simply forgot. They had a big Pitts S-12 that was absolutely gorgeous; look for them this summer.

We need to face the fact that ARFs are "where its at" for the manufacturers today. They're in business to make money, and kits are slow sellers; I was told that exact phrase by two guys in the booths, who each worked for a large firm.

One of my flying buddies is a very talented machinist/carpenter; he is working on a two-axis CNC router table with a system that will allow us to transfer a plan into a CAD file to cut our own kits from plans. If that puppy works out like he is planning....[8D]

piper_chuck

My Feedback: (12)

It seems that the big, traditional kit companies are slowly getting out of that business. They are either moving to ARFs, or going under. One bright spot is that many individuals are filling this hole by starting up their own businesses. If one looks around, it's possible to find all sorts of interesting kits out there, they're just not coming from the names that have been around for years. An example is Bob Haris with his Early RC Models Bob Harris www.earlyrcmodels.com. The demand is obviously too small to capture the attention of the big names, but as long as people keep buying, there should be kits to build. The only difference is we don't find most of this stuff through the big name retailers.

acobra

My Feedback: (40)

Frank
Steve:
Yes, I know they are now foreign owned. Last year at Toledo I talked with Mike and told him I was wanting to stop by the plant and take a tour as my flying buddy had done a few years ago, (He couldn't keep form talking about how great he was treated) But Mike told me since they were (are) now foreign owned there was NO WAY TO TAKE A TOUR. I guess they lost that modeler friendliness that Glen and Hazel had............too bad.

LSP972

My Feedback: (13)

Yeah, when I called the fellow was curt and professional. Not rude or impolite by any means, but not "friendly".

Keep in mind I'm not complaining; just reinforcing your observation that the place is all business these days. Still, I'll take curt competence over friendly sloth any day, where my purchases are concerned...

Volfy

My Feedback: (23)

Sad to hear an American RC icon getting bought out by a foreign company. Most of the kits I've built have been Sig, and I've always wanted to stop by to check out Hazel's Clipwing Cub or Spacewalker, if I ever chance upon their neck of the wood.

Thesedays, kit building is no longer the prerequisite entrance exam to RC flying, as it once was. Whatever your feeling about that, there is no denying the fact.

Still, I was talking to All American Kit Cutter the other day, and he said their production has been going full bore for quite some time, and the fastest turn-around on any of the Hostetler kits I asked about was 4weeks. Apparently, there are still quite a number of dedicated bulders out there. Granted, these custom kit cutters cater to mostly experienced scale and "giant scale" kit builders. No one in his right mind would try to produce and sell a .40 trainer kit, when a RTF ARF package cost less and likely built far better than any novice kit builder can muster. Unfortunately, with a few rare exceptions (e.g. the 4star series), .25-.60 sport kits pretty much fall into the same category.

So if you really want to build kits, there are ways to do it, but do expect the selection in the low-end of the market to continue to dwindle.

piper_chuck

My Feedback: (12)

Are you telling me I should sell the Kobra and Patriot kits that are on their way to me from Tower right now? What about the other 11 kits (ranging from .15 to .45 size) I've already got, should I sell them too? Actually, from what I've read I'd have no trouble selling a few of them. I bought a Suprafly in the 80's that's still waiting to be built. Last summer I managed to get my hands on a Pilot Twin Ace kit. Eventually, I will make time to build them...

RCKen

My Feedback: (9)

Piper,
Bite you tongue man!!! There is no way that you should SELL you kits!! You should GIVE them away, to ME!!!!

PacificNWSkyPilot

My Feedback: (19)

I've built for more than 25 years now. Everything you can imagine, big and small. ALL of us older builders have learned that if the model is from SIG, it's going to fly, and fly well. EVERY model SIG puts out does that. By and large, they have always had modelers and flyers creating models that fly at SIG mfg. I was the first to point a flinger at ARFs and shake it ominously, warning of the downfall of our hobby. But I have to admit, I just bought my very first ARF last week, and it is the SIG Sun Dancer Bipe. My spare time is just that...very spare. I like building, but I love flying. I've built a Hog Bipe before, and I know for a fact that by the time I had it ready to add the radio that I had better than 500 bucks into it. Fancy covering job, glues, you name it. My hobby dealer just got me my Sun Dancer ARF Bipe for under 400 bucks, shipping included (Tax, of course, not included). This Bipe is amazing. The paint job on the fiberglass cowling alone is enough to convince me. Covering job you'd half-kill yourself trying to do. Right down to the super-nice foamy tires which I personally am so fond of. I could NEVER build that Bipe for that price.
Getting back to my earlier reference to my finger-pointing, ARFs may have brought some of the lazier element into the hobby, but it has brought folks that cannot find the extra time to build and who dearly love to fly into the hobby as well, and I have to admit, I'm pleased by the renewed interest locally. It was just getting harder and harder to find people who want to build, or perhaps, who CAN take the time to build. I'm certainly all for SIG kitting everything they have that's an ARF for those who want to build them, but I'm delighted that SIG took the initiative and found a way to keep me flying when my time is at a premium. And best of all, I get to fly SIG stuff!! My Spacewalker II is going to have a few new brothers.
I'm glad I read this thread, I had no idea that they were about to come out with a .50 size Sun Dancer Bipe. I'm also hot for that new Little Something Extra ARF in a .30 size....Turquoise, of course. Can't seem to get one of them yet, but still waiting for one!

Hey, what can I say??? SIG rules the modeling skies, and I'm a loyal follower.

Jim

piper_chuck

My Feedback: (12)

Now I understand

Pilot Chad

My Feedback: (4)

I am going to be adding to this thread very soon with my Flying Auburn Tiger.

TexasAirBoss

My Feedback: (22)

I had the Colt, the Kougar and a Kadet Jr.

I am currently building the Bonanza.

I have a Kommander and a Cessna 170 kit that Sig got from Berkeley

I am considering another Kougar as the winds were gusting to nearly 30kts today. Kougars seem to defy the wind. Although the Goldberg Chipmunk did OK. But a Koug can actually be relaxing in 30kts.

Hats off to Glen and Hazel Sig, their good will still brightens our lives.

kelldog

My Feedback: (1)

Still cannot figure out progress!With all the modern inovations around to save us time,we have less time. Maybe we are starting to spend more time paying for them then the time they save us!How in the dickens did they have the time to build a whole plane in their only beloved hobby 20 years ago.Or is it just the way it is today INSTANT GRATIFICATION!!! Try starting at your wifes toes tonight and work your way up!Take your time and it will pay off.Such is rc. Talk about money in arfs,right,its all for china!How about companys that produce the thousands of items needed for your own personall kit. As far as I am concerned it would be embarrising for me and a waste not to try to INOVATE which is the way it use to be in this great land of ours.A well built sig kit takes less TIME because it last LONGER,less money too!
The hurrier I go the behinder I get sindrome!
kelldog
































g

PacificNWSkyPilot

My Feedback: (19)

All valid points. In fact, I rarely shop at Wal-Mart anymore because I feel it is killing the smaller stores in our town. I shop at local stores for everything i possibly can. I got rid of our Toyota and I bought a Ford for that reason. I buy toilet paper from companies that are based in Maine so our folks have jobs. I don't buy chains or chokers or tires for my heavy equipment unless the chains and the chain ends and the tires are made in the USA. I set the tone for my company by promoting only Medical and Dental equipment made in the USA if it is at all possible. I buy gas from our small local gas station to keep the money in our town.
And then I watch the Dexter Shoe Company close up shop and move to the Dominican Republic and put hundreds and hundreds of my friends and half of the town of Dexter, Maine out of work, all while the government we elected tries to pass more bills like NAFTA, and I write every congressman or woman I can get the address of and tell them what they are doing to the people.
The sad part? To my knowledge, by the time I get to the not shopping at Wal-Mart, I'm out-doing everybody I know in my efforts to keep my money-flow inside my town, my state, and the USA.. I pay a little extra just to do that, and the same for every other item on that list. So I'm not going to feel bad that I no longer take months of my spare time for building and choose to buy a few ARFs that are not built here. The hobby industry is among the smallest cottage industries in the world, and if everybody in that whole industry lost their jobs while everybody else in American industry who lost theirs to Wal-Mart got theirs back, America would be BOOMING. But that's NOT gonna happen unless we can find a way to force our legislators to do what's right instead of what makes them money or gets them re-elected.
I'm doing my part. Other then these ARFs, I don't buy anything made outside the USA without a fight. I cuss when I send away for something long-standing American-made and find out when it arrives that that company is now owned by somebody in Japan or China. I don't buy anything from Tower Hobbies if I can shop at my local Hobby shop and keep him in business. I dare say that too many modelers are going the Tower Hobbies route, and it's not as though you don't know what the result will be in the end. I'd love to see you walk into a local bookstore or meat market and ask them to match Wal-Mart prices the way I see folks pressing the local hobby stores to match Tower prices.
Buying a few ARFs might be affecting a couple of American jobs, but it's doubtful that it's more than that. When you shop at Wal-Mart, you ARE putting Americans out of jobs. No maybes about it. I wonder if Americans will start giving any of this serious thought BEFORE or AFTER the economy crashes? You're right about the immediate gratification thing, as long as we can shop cheap, we think it's going to be fine, even when we can see what we're doing. You can't send all the money out of a country and expect it to be fine in the end.
Do this, just for a week. Watch everything you buy. Read labels. See who owns the establishment where you're shopping. Make note of every item you buy, and whether it's American, and especially if it's not. If it's not, you're paying for jobs in other countries, and taking jobs away from Americans. What brand of car do you drive? Every item you buy, take a good look. I think that in that week you'll start to see what I'm getting at here.
Sorry to be so controversial. I just care about America, and I want to point out that it's easy to talk the talk in this case and really hard to walk the walk. I'm relentless about it, and yet even I still have my one weak point, my hobby. I like JR radios, I like Saitos, and now ARFs.
Jim

LSP972

My Feedback: (13)

Well, Jim, nationalism is a good theory. I too subscribed to it; until that POS Dodge Intrepid (which we bought due to my insistence on 'buying American' and over her objections that she wanted a reliable car) stranded my wife on the side of the road for the third time. I traded that abortion in on a Toyota, which of course has been trouble-free. The brand-new Chevrolet Malibu that the state issued to me is another cheaply-made POS; rattling like a wagon at 15,000 miles, among other things. I will not buy another American brand vehicle.

You can point a finger at any number of causes; greedy, lazy union workers, or management techniques that caused the lazy, greedy attitude, or an overabundance of lawyers which have spawned an entire product liability industry, or corporate greed, or corporate desperation to keep prices down in the face of spiralling upward overhead due to lawyers, political correctness, or government meddling... the list is endless. But the root cause is the same- we have met the enemy, and he is us.

And while I desire as much as the next guy to "buy American", the sad truth is that I need to make my money stretch as far as possible, getting the most bang for the buck; and buying American doesn't do that, sometimes from a quality standpoint, sometimes from a economical standpoint, many times from both.

The blunt truth is that not much is manufactured here anymore because it is simply too expensive to do so, thanks primarily to govenment regulation. Talk to someone who owns a small business. If he will, he can tell you horror stories about how the government makes his life miserable. It almost seems deliberate, if you look at it enough.

Force our legislators to do what's right? Not a chance; the rot is too deep.

Jim, I tried to walk the walk; and ended up taking it in the shorts.

RCKen

My Feedback: (9)

I am a small business owner and Steve it correct, I could tell you horror stories. Since this is an open forum I won't go into it here, but I will talk on PM's if you want more info. Sometimes it seems that Ole Uncle Sam wants us out of business.

As for my vehicles, we own 2 Nissans. I had thought about the "buy American" stuff before I bought, but came to this conclusion. A lot of the "American" vehicles out there that we were looking at were made in Mexico or had major sub-assemblies made out of this country, yet the Nissan Frontier I drive was 100% made in Smyrna, Tennessee. Go figure.

Both of the last 2 administrations have shipped American jobs overseas, but IMHO Clinton took the cake with NAFTA. IMHO it's going to take a grass-roots movement to get the attention of our government and bring American jobs back to this country.

OK, I'll get off of my soapbox now.

PacificNWSkyPilot

My Feedback: (19)

Steve,
You're right, and therein lies the problem. You bought a Dodge.

No, seriously, all of America seems to be caught in between good jobs being shipped away and some shoddy workmanship as the competition for those imported products. And without being a professional researcher it's really hard to tell what's being made where. For instance, the Nissan Frontier RCKen referred to was made entirely here in the USA, but the money he spent for it is being sent overseas, with the exception of the worker's salaries and benefits, which isn't a small consideration either.

With such a mixed up mess, I'm at least glad the SIG is an American company, so at least some of the money is staying in America. And I really do like my ARF Sun Dancer Bipe, and as long as I'm going to be buying ARFs in the future, I plan to buy them from American companies like SIG. I just can't resist that Little Something Extra, and I'm all worked up over the rumors of a new Sun Dancer .50 sized ARF.
In the meantime, I'm still going to shop American where it will do other locals good, like our local supermarket and NOT the Wal-Mart super-supermarket, like the local small engine shop and NOT the Wal-Mart Lawn and garden Mart. It really DOES make a difference to this country in the long run. Ask the folks who have the hometown stores in your area, ask them what Wal-Mart has done to them. Then think about what that translates to if ALL the local stores are being killed by Wally-World (and believe me, they are.) at the same time..

Beyond that I'll try my best to sort out the rest of the mess our politicians have left us in with NAFTA and the proposed CAFTA (Did that go through yet?) Ergh.

Getting back to the thread, SIG still rules the skies!

Jimbo

LSP972

My Feedback: (13)

Uh, Sig is now owned by Australians, Jim.

PacificNWSkyPilot

My Feedback: (19)

No more Hazel, eh? That's just sad.

Hmmmm, NOW what do I do??

Well, there MUST be some American-based companies selling some ARFs that I like somewhere around here.

Do those Australians live here in the US, running SIG from right there in Iowa? Or are they long-distance owners?

In any case, I guess I could find worse things to send my money out of the US for...

By the way, I am one of those small-business owners you're talking about.

Jim

LSP972

My Feedback: (13)

Dunno where the Australian owners are domiciled, Jim.

Doesn't matter to me; their kits AND their ARFs are at the top of the heap as far as I'm concerned, and I will continue to buy them.

I believe Vector Flight is the only firm actually producing ARFs in this hemisphere, and they're in Canada. Your desire to "buy American" is laudable, Jim; but methinks you're pissing into the wind as far as modeling stuff goes.

Just curious; what radio do you use?

PacificNWSkyPilot

My Feedback: (19)

I went to JR at least 10 to 12 years ago, right about the time my old Futaba Gold was getting a ton of hits from all kinds of stuff, probably because they had not yet narrow-banded theirs. I've never looked back. Is there anything good that's American-made yet? It'll probably still be some years before my JR radios wear out, since they were just sent in and overhauled this past year.

In all honesty, I really haven't been super-obsessed about keeping my hobby all-American made. R/C planes are delicate and require the best you can give them just to keep them in the air. That's where I choose to buy whatever suits me, from wherever I feel like.

I'll check out Vector Flight, though. I like Canada, and I live pretty near the border.

Jim Surra

kelldog

My Feedback: (1)

Sorry guys you are missing something here.IF we make the same low tech product as china how can we expect to keep a higher standard of living.If they steal our education and high tech secrects HANG THEM!!!!!THOSE ARE ACTS OF WAR!!!!We must forge ahead again like granpa did and make metals in 0 gravity on the moon and pharmaceutical drugs etc. Cars that other countries only dreamed of.Dont protect our borders,we will buy there products cheap, and buy ours expensive.Should we really worry if we cant compete selling a straw woven mat.Worry when france is starting to kick are butt making sattellites that have more stations.Lets get the world by the balls again by american INNOVATION!!!Then relax when you get home from work and build that relaxing sig kit with a chicken in the pot. kelldog

piper_chuck

My Feedback: (12)

We give them much more than they could steal. The problem is ours, not theirs.

kelldog

My Feedback: (1)

Yes it is our problem,we make the same dam products to compete.A fox wont STEAL an egg from the henn house and bring it back to its den if he cant fit it in his mouth.Henry Ford made a car nobody had.Did china steal designs then! KELLDOG