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  1. #1

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    "New" Joss Stick

    I bought a Joss Stick on ebay with a Magnum 91 (2s). I flew it today for the first time. It has a 14x8 prop. Plane flies like a trainer. Maybe milder. Cannot knife edge without holding lots of down and a good bit of rudder. Loops are pretty tight, but rolls are awful trainer-like SLOW messes and lose a lot of altitude if you don't pull up in a climb first. Plane has flaps (about 1/3 or less of the aileron, uh, about 1/3 of each wing) so maybe the ailerons are too small now?? I only made 2 flights, as the carb barrel stop screw came loose first flight and it got dark on the second. I didn't try slow flight (with flaps) much because of time, but it will slow WAY down and float along happily at fast idle. The dihedral makes it roll over with rudder, you could fly it without the ailerons! Heck, it seems to bank as quick or maybe quicker with the rudder. Should I use rudder and ailerons in a roll?
    Is this the way sticks are supposed to fly??
    It is quite a switch from the profiles I usually fly (until I get too daring or stupid).

  2. #2

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    RE: "New" Joss Stick

    Unfortunately it was built with the dihedral and now your stuck with it.

    I've had two of them. My 1st one was the ARC version and it was assembled with NO dihedral and dual airlon servos. It was a smooth acrobatic flyer that had none of the barrel-roll tendancies yours does. Unfortunately my second one was identical to yours -- both the dihedral and torque-rod airlons. In my opinion it was a major step down when they converted the ARC to an ARF.

    I flew the first one with a 68 2-stoke -- forget it severly under-powered. I replaced the 68 with a Magnum XL 1.20 2-stroke. A significant improvement until the engine started to give me fits -- I became a dead-stick king with that airplane. I pulled the Magnum XL 1.20 and replaced it with the OS BX-1 (1.08) which was just as good as the Magnum for power. I flew the 2nd one with the OS BX-1.

    NO, this is not the way sticks are supposed to fly. RECOMMEND any future Joss Stick builders to insert a rib wedge between the wing halves to get rid of the dihedral and run dual-airlon servos. Also, I would recommend you replace the airlons with ones about 50% wider to enhance your aerobatic performance. Do not run an engine smaller than a 91 on this 9lb bird -- a 1.08 or 1.20 would be much better. Aside from that this is an excellant stick and is virtually indestructible with its foam wing..

    Jim Hilley
    AMA #671825
    RCCA# 758
    Twist 150 Brotherhood #14
    hilleyja@cebridge.net
    http://www.cma1193.com

  3. #3

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    RE: "New" Joss Stick

    Mine has two aileron servos, but one servo linked to both flaps. I'm thinking connecting the flaps to the ailerons and forgetting the flaps might help. Then again, I might throw in an OS 60 I have and use it as a trainer and put the 91 in a better plane. Problem is, it was REALLY hard to get it out of a spin. Maybe mechanically attach the flaps to the ailerons and ditch the flap servo, or add a second flap servo and mix them in as ailerons?? I'm obviously not a builder, so I'm unsure. I thought about pulling off the flaps and ailerons and making them both twice as big. That might be simple enough even for my awful/nonexistant build skills.

  4. #4

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    RE: "New" Joss Stick


    ORIGINAL: onrecess

    Mine has two aileron servos, but one servo linked to both flaps. I'm thinking connecting the flaps to the ailerons and forgetting the flaps might help. Then again, I might throw in an OS 60 I have and use it as a trainer and put the 91 in a better plane. Problem is, it was REALLY hard to get it out of a spin. Maybe mechanically attach the flaps to the ailerons and ditch the flap servo, or add a second flap servo and mix them in as ailerons?? I'm obviously not a builder, so I'm unsure. I thought about pulling off the flaps and ailerons and making them both twice as big. That might be simple enough even for my awful/nonexistant build skills.

    This bird floats like a butterfly -- you don't need the flaps, especially with the dihedral. I would recommend removing the flap servo and mechanically attached the surfaces to the airlons.
    Jim Hilley
    AMA #671825
    RCCA# 758
    Twist 150 Brotherhood #14
    hilleyja@cebridge.net
    http://www.cma1193.com

  5. #5

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    RE: "New" Joss Stick

    I think I'll try that, thanks.

  6. #6
    Ralph Morris's Avatar
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    RE: "New" Joss Stick

    Anyone still reading this thread? I recently acquired a Model-Tech Joss Stick ARF. It may be an older kit, since I bought it from an estate sale. It has a foam wing designed for only one aileron servo with torque rods, and no flaps. I'm sure that's how the original Joss Sticks were set up back in the '80s when I had a Mid-West Sweet Stick. The Sweet Stick had about the same amount of dihedral, but I put larger "barndoor" ailerons on it (with tip plates), and I don't recall that it had too much roll-coupling with rudder. Of course in those days we didn't have enough power to hold a knife edge, so I don't know what elevator correction might have been required. Nowadays we would put at least a .60 on the Sweet Stick.

    I thought about putting a wedge in the wing root of the Joss Stick to eliminate the dihedral, but wouldn't that cause the dowels to be too far apart? I don't want to have to "move" the holes in the fuse that they go into.

    Also, have you all attached the LG where the manual says; five inches aft of the firewall? That leaves the axle nearly 1-1/2 inches forward of the leading edge. I've always set up my taildraggers with the axle at the leading edge of the wing. A taildragger with the gear too far forward is hard to steer on takeoff and when you touch down on the main gear the tail will drop and a light airplane will be airborne again, and then stall if you're not quick with some down elevator, or bounce again if you give enough down to avoid the stall! Not an easy lander. I think I'll move mine to six inches aft of the firewall. That's still slightly ahead of the leading edge, and I'll have to add an additional piece of plywood inside the fuse to match the new LG position.

    I"ve made new full-span ailerons, much bigger than the ones that came with the ARF. I'm looking for a fairly high-torque servo to twist them with (Futaba or HiTech).

    I've also re-designed the tail feathers to more-closely resemble the actual Fokker airplanes of WWI, and to provide more rudder and elevator area at the expense of some fin and stabilizer area. The ARF came with a stabilizer 6-1/2 x 27 inches! That's a wing! No wonder "on recess" thought it flew like a trainer!

    I'm planning to install a 1/60 four-stroke swinging an 18 x 6 prop for maneuvers "beyond the stall."

    Keep \'em flying!

    Ralph N6UFB


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