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  1. #1
    cap10b's Avatar
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    Brison 2.4 Numbers

    July 2, 2005

    Eagle Field NDRC
    Weather Hot Humid 92 degrees
    Partly Cloudy to sunny
    wind 15-18 mph

    Gas: Shell Premium (92 octane)
    Oil: Klotz KL200 Techniplate w/benol
    Mix 80:1 (1.6 oz/gal)

    Props:
    GRS 20x8 (Mejlek Copy) 7500
    20x8 Zinger 7600
    18x10 Zinger Pro 8000
    Head temp in cowl after flight 178 degrees with baffling

    Motor is standard TCSA with C&H Bilet Cap ignition
    Spark Plug CM6 .020 gap

    Muffler B&B Side muffler (103db at 3 meters, I know too loud I have changed it since to a Slimline Pitts wraparound muffer)

    A/C Kangke USA Texas Hurricane 15 lbs, pulls the plane with authority will hover buy strain to pull out it can do it but not
    with any speed.

    Next set up will be with 22x8 Zinger Pro and Slimline muffler hope to be under 100db at 3 meters

    Johnny


    I ran out of Altitude, Airspeed and Ideas !

  2. #2
    Richard L.'s Avatar
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    RE: Brison 2.4 Numbers

    Thanks. I am contemplating about getting this engine. What do you think the sweet spot for this engine is? 8K rpm or is that a little high?
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  3. #3
    cap10b's Avatar
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    RE: Brison 2.4 Numbers

    Richard,

    More specs

    Removed B&B two stack muffler and added a Slimline 45 degree Wrap around muffler

    20X8 GRS Carbon Matt Fibre competition propeller 7350 RPM
    22X8 Zinger pro 6500
    20X10 Zinger Pro 7000

    The 22X8 was a dog barely pulled thru the IMAC Basic routine, the 20X10 was great the motor pulled good but not as hard as the 20X8. The GRS 20X8 pulled the best the plane would run out of altitude with the 20x10 but would keep going with the 20x8. The 20x8 will hover and pulls out, but just barely.

    The sweet spot for this motor is 7200 rpm anything that stays near that rpm will pull. Lugging the motor down only makes it hot, Brison/Sach-Dolmar/A&M motors like to spin up and turn. 8000 RPM makes allot of noise but the plane doesnt got anywhere. an 18x8-14 might be better but your gonna be hot landing unless your flying a heavy warbird like 19-20 lbs. the 2.4 for brison is one of the best motors they make Gary beams when someone does something with a 2.4 because that motor is his baby he dreamed it up, he made the very first one, he loves em.


    Best of Luck

    JDS

    Opps all this is with a 78" Kangke USA Texas Hurricane that weighs about 15 lbs

    j







    I ran out of Altitude, Airspeed and Ideas !

  4. #4
    Richard L.'s Avatar
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    RE: Brison 2.4 Numbers

    Great! I have a 17 lbs 80" WM Zero that currently needs a good gasser, and this engine might be the ticket. I was thinking about going with either a Mejzlik 19x10 or a Bolly 19x10.
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  5. #5
    cap10b's Avatar
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    RE: Brison 2.4 Numbers

    Richard,
    You had a TF P-40 !!! Wow so did I, mine was done up in P-40F STUD out of the Squadron Signal pub. Loved that plane.
    I ran my 2.4 in an overweight (19lbs) Yellow A/C Cap10b w/smoke for two seasons. The 2.4 pulled like a mac truck. Ive crashed the heck out of my motor and keep rebuilding it, I've never spent more than $140 bucks to bring the motor back to brand new condition. Gary says you can't destroy one because there is always something you can save. I thought about a 19x10 and that prop should pull the Zeke pretty good. Try a Beila 19x10 or 20x8 ($40 -$45 ) from Aircraft International we have flown them and they really pull.



    Good Luck.

    jds


    I ran out of Altitude, Airspeed and Ideas !

  6. #6
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    RE: Brison 2.4 Numbers

    I just ordered a 2.4 for my H-9 Extra 260. Weighs 12# with a Saito 180...Should weigh around 13.5 with the 2.4.

    Any insights/suggestions to a new gasser owner?
    JR 9303; DX-7; 34% CA Extra 300L/DA100; H-9 33% Edge 540/DA100; EF Edge Profile/S-72; Reactor/S-91; Foamies

  7. #7
    cap10b's Avatar
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    RE: Brison 2.4 Numbers

    Hey Kolarshooter,
    Nothing of note just run em !! they love to run. Keep them cool, I have been installing more baffling to keep head external temp
    under 200 degrees. Around 170-180 on the infared heat gun runs good. Also a 2.4 does not like to lug they love to spin keep the
    rpm around 7200 static on the ground.

    Good Luck.

    JDS



    I ran out of Altitude, Airspeed and Ideas !

  8. #8
    kolarshooter's Avatar
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    RE: Brison 2.4 Numbers

    Great info. Thanx.

    Anyone else?

    So far, my experience ordering through Kangke has been disappointing. Hopefully this is not a reflection of the engine's performance/reliability.
    JR 9303; DX-7; 34% CA Extra 300L/DA100; H-9 33% Edge 540/DA100; EF Edge Profile/S-72; Reactor/S-91; Foamies

  9. #9

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    RE: Brison 2.4 Numbers

    I got 6,600 with a 20x8w APC and 7,000 with a Mejzlik 20x10 on my Brison 2.4. Haven't flown the plane with either prop, so I cant comment on performance.

  10. #10
    kolarshooter's Avatar
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    RE: Brison 2.4 Numbers

    Thanks for the data!
    JR 9303; DX-7; 34% CA Extra 300L/DA100; H-9 33% Edge 540/DA100; EF Edge Profile/S-72; Reactor/S-91; Foamies

  11. #11

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    RE: Brison 2.4 Numbers

    I have a Brison 2.4 with a b&b muffler on it. I can only turn a zinger 20x8 prop 6700 RPMs. And turn a master airscrew 20x6 7000 RPMs. The engine has a lot of carbon on the piston and head. The compression is a little weak but starts easy and will hover a 14 lb. 120 stinger with just enough power to pull out. My plug is brown so I think I have the top end about right. My question is will excess carbon cut the RPMs or is it the compression? Thanks Wayne M.

  12. #12

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    RE: Brison 2.4 Numbers

    I would recommend two things.
    Go with an APC propeller and you will enjoy a big difference in pull and RPM"s.

    While this may not be a recommended practice, I would recommend that you get some seafoam. I found it at NAPA autoparts stores. Spray it in the engine while it is running. It should break up some of the carbon. I have done this and liked the results.
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  13. #13

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    RE: Brison 2.4 Numbers

    Thanks Geistware, I got the seafoam yesterday but have not tryed it yet. I will have to squirt it in the carb because I couldnt find the spray type. I have a mejzlik 19x8 prop to try when the weather lets me. If my tack is right it should turn in the low 7000s. I plan on staying with the 20x6 prop during treatment of the seafoam to see if I can pick up any R.P.M.s Thanks again Wayne M.

  14. #14

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    RE: Brison 2.4 Numbers

    I tryed the seafoam and it did cut some of the carbon out of the engine. I decided to pull the head off the engine to clean it, Found the ring stuck in carbon. I ordered a Frank Bowman ring a little oversize to fit the block. Cleaned the engine and sanded the head and replaced the ring with Bowman ring. I have about 1/2 gal. of fuel run in it and it has picked uped to 7300 RPMs. I think it will keep getting better as the ring seats. I plan to try other props and will post the results. Wayne M.

  15. #15
    Richard L.'s Avatar
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    RE: Brison 2.4 Numbers

    I finally flew my Brison 2.4 today.

    Ambient Temp: 62°
    Gas: CITGO 92 Premium
    Oil: Bel-Ray H1R Synthetic 2-Stroke Racing Oil
    Mix: 80:1 (1.6 oz/gallon)
    Prop: Master Airscrew Classic 18x10
    Tach: New TNC

    First Flight: 8200 rpm static
    Second Flight: 8300 rpm static
    Third Flight: 8400 rpm static

    The MA 18x10 prop is too small. I will try a 19x10 and a 20x10 prop next.
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  16. #16
    cap10b's Avatar
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    RE: Brison 2.4 Numbers

    Richard,
    Try a CF 20x8 or there abouts you will see the motor really pull, 20x10 sort of lugged some on mine.

    Good numbers bud !

    JDS
    I ran out of Altitude, Airspeed and Ideas !

  17. #17
    Richard L.'s Avatar
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    RE: Brison 2.4 Numbers

    Thanks. I have a Bolly 19x10 carbon fiber on order. I also ordered an MA 20x10 Classic. Will see what rpm figures I get with those. I think a 20x8 will be too slow on a warbird.
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  18. #18
    cap10b's Avatar
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    RE: Brison 2.4 Numbers

    Richard,
    On a warbird I aggree, maybe an MA 18x8-14, also check out Aircraft International and try a Biela propeller. They really hold their pitch. The Bolly sounds good, I just ordered a Bolly 23x8 for my 3W-50I on my Yak 54.

    Cheers !

    JDS
    I ran out of Altitude, Airspeed and Ideas !

  19. #19
    Richard L.'s Avatar
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    RE: Brison 2.4 Numbers

    Those new Biela black props with yellow tips sure look good. I will order one, but currently I'm unsure of what size to get. I will wait to see what rpm I get out of the Bolly 19x10. Ideally, I want the rpm to be between 7000 and 7300 static.
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  20. #20
    Richard L.'s Avatar
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    RE: Brison 2.4 Numbers

    Tried a Bolly 19x10 carbon fiber today, and it still turned out to be too small:

    Ambient Temp: 65°F (18.3°C)
    Prop: Bolly 19x10 carbon fiber
    RPM: 8300 static

    Prop: Master Airscrew Classic 20x10
    RPM: 7100 static
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  21. #21
    cap10b's Avatar
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    RE: Brison 2.4 Numbers

    Richard,
    That's a strong motor you got ! AI sent my Biela 26x8 for a totaly different motor yesterday, I sure like these propellers.

    Load that Brison down !! 7100 - 7200 sounds good, I ran a Zinger Pro 20x10 on my Hurrican and it was too much for it. Only got
    about 6500 RPM and the 2.4 lugged on the upline the motor didnt pull at all at that RPM. Changed to a 20x8 carbon and ran
    around 7300 and the motor was happy. if your getting 7100 static on a MA 20x10 that's a really strong motor, thats 3.2 numbers !!
    Watch your temp if you have it cowled really tight, they don't like to run hot, I had to baffle the Hurricane to get the temp down below 179 degrees.

    Happy Landing !

    JDS





    I ran out of Altitude, Airspeed and Ideas !

  22. #22

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    RE: Brison 2.4 Numbers

    I see a lot of guys running 10" of pitch on their gassers for aerobatics (Extras, Caps, Yacks, 50cc, 80cc, 100cc), I think they run 10" of pitch because their motors are big and powerful and they feel it's the way to go, but I feel they would be better-off running a larger prop with less pitch, 8" even 6" of pitch, I say this because I have seen the benefits of larger props with less pitch on glow planes, larger props with less pitch pull better at low RPM and the plane is more stable in the air~ which is great for aerobatics, I have had planes twitch their tails or do other funny things~ but once I change to a larger prop with less pitch the problem goes away !! ,,,, on my Gee Bee Y I want speed, I don't care much about low speed performance, but I run a 20" prop because my cowl is so large, if my cowl was smaller I would run an 18x10 for more top-end speed,,,

    Richard, if you want that Zero to go faster try an 18x12, that will get your motor's RPM down in it's power band and the plane will benefit from the extra 2" of pitch, and I'm also betting if you bought a 20x10 carbon you would get something around 7400,,, my friend put a carbon prop of the same size he had in wood on his old Sachs 4.2 (106" P47) and he gained 690 RPM, the plane was some 15MPH faster on it's top-end..

    Jim

  23. #23
    Richard L.'s Avatar
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    RE: Brison 2.4 Numbers

    I will get a 20x10 or 19x12 carbon fiber prop, but I need to get rid of my Bolly 19x10 carbon prop first.
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  24. #24
    Richard L.'s Avatar
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    RE: Brison 2.4 Numbers

    Here you go, the Brison 2.4 in action: STREAMING VIDEO

    Awesome Engine!
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  25. #25
    cap10b's Avatar
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    RE: Brison 2.4 Numbers

    Richard,
    Motor sounds good to me, is that the MA 20x10 if so you instinctively pulled the power back on the second pass on the downwind leg because you can hear the motor ripping the propeller. That's pretty normal for Master Airscrew propellers on a powerful motor they just dont hold their pitch well. I would seriously consider changing to a stiffer brand of propeller.

    The WM Zero should weigh in at 17-19 lbs with retracts and flaps ? The 2.4 seems to pull just fine to me. Go arounds look ok, Accel and Decell sound ok on the downline. If your happy with the way if flys stay with what you have.

    How's the sound meter, I had an old B&B muffler on mine at first and was way over the club limit of 99 DB at 10 Feet I was some where at 103. Changed to a slim line and three blade and got down to 99 fairly easily.

    My LHS has a GS WM Zero on sale I may consider getting one after viewing this video.

    Congratulations you got a keeper.

    JDS

    I ran out of Altitude, Airspeed and Ideas !


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