DIJ

I have just finished building a Raptor 90 (3D version) and have a couple of questions.

First, the main blade holder arms start hitting the flybar control rods (hoops) when the pitch is anywhere between 0 and full negative. i.e. when the pitch is set to -9 I can only tilt the flybar arm about half of it usual travel before arm of the main blade holder hits the side of the hoop. Is this normal?

Secondly, when setting up the pitch, how do I set up the mixing levers at zero degrees pitch. I read in another post for a raptor SE that the balls on the levers should be parallel to the flybar, is this the same for the Raptor 3D?

invertmast

My Feedback: (23)

yes thats normal.. but you will NOT be using full travel on the flybar arms. thats something like 20* i believe when i measured it. you will only be using 8* roughly of cyclic control..

DIJ

Thanks for that info, just what I was looking for.

With regards to whether the mixing levers should be level.................

I have just levelled out the swash, washout arms and the top mixing levers at zero pitch, but it would seem that by making the mixing levers (balls) Parallel with the flybar I have a another problem....

At +9 degrees pitch and when I apply cylic over about 5 degrees the top plastic ball link on the long links hits the top square part of the rotor head.

It looks to me that the only way I can remedy the problem is to increase the length of the long links to increase the clearance a little.
I will give this a go later tonight. BUT, this will of course mean that the mixings levers will no longer be Parallel with the flybar.

Can you tell me if the levers on the 3D raptor are supposed to be level? Any other suggestions? am I missing something?

Thanks

invertmast

My Feedback: (23)

the mixing levers shouldn't be level with the flybar.. only the Washout levers should be (the ones on the washout hub that move up and down). If memory serves me right, the angle between the long links and the mixing levers should be 90 degrees, then the links from the mixing arms to the blade grips should be set to put the blades at zero degrees pitch

DIJ

Well that would certainly help a little with the cleaance. Do you know if I should be fitting the mixing levers to the inner or outer holes on the flybar arm? the manual states the outer holes for standard and the inner ones for aggresive 3D
I am using the standard ones as I'm still only into mild 3D at the moment, but it looks like if I moved to the outer holes I would also gain some more clearance with the long links.

Thanks again for the help.

DIJ

Just lengthened the long links so the mixing arms are no longer paralell with the flybar, and I can now tilt the flybar within a few degrees of its stop, so that seems to be the answer to this problem.

The only remaining problem I have is that with -9 pitch and max or min elevator (6.5 degrees swash travel) the arm on the blade holder hits the hoops so that the flybar will only just tilt to the level position, but no further.
Is this normal?
If anyone can check this for me I would be very greatful.

Position flybar in line with boom, then Idle up, throttle full back, full back elevator.
Now check the available flybar tilt, the front end of my flybar will tilt to the end stop, but the rear end will not go any further than level (i.e. the flybar is paralell with the boom).



Also, I,m tempted to move the mixing arms to the inner holes on the flyabr arms, can anyone tell me what the difference is when flying it? I know the manual says outer hole = standard and inner holes = extreme 3D, but would this make the model very 'twitchy', and harder to fly. Anyone have the Raptor 3D and tried both?

Thanks for the help

invertmast

My Feedback: (23)

Get a pic of what is interfering with each other.. If your pulling back on the elevator and the front of the swashplate is tilting down you have your ele. reversed. The flybar will only tilt one direction a certain amount when you have a large control input like that. But i dont understand your problem 100%.. kinda hard to visualize..



you only need to run enough atv on the ail/ele. to get 8* of blade pitch change with a cyclic change...

put the blades at zero pitch and align the blades parallel w/ the boom. move your aileron cyclic to one extent. then read the pitch on your pitch gauge. this is your cyclic travel amount, it shouldn't be over 8* now do the same thing in the other direction.

Now rotate the head so the flybar is parallel to the tail boom. now push forward on the ele. cyclic and read the pitch on your pitch gauge. once again, no more than 8*. do the same of the other side.


I personally setup my heli's for 3D flight all the time. And use expo in the radio to tone it down if its to twitchy. That way your not having to redo your setup when your abilities get better and better. So i'd use the aggressive 3D ball position

DIJ

Thanks for your input invertmast, I think I might well move to the inner holes and dial in some expo as you suggest.

The swash directions are all ok, and the cyclic is only set to 6.5 degrees (I reduced it to help minimise the problem)

The first pic is with pitch and cyclic at zero degrees and all is well

The second is with Pitch at -9 and full back elevator (6.5 degrees)

I have circled where the blade arm hits the hoop, witch means the flybar will not tilt any further down where arrowed, but will tilt fully in opposite direction.

Do you think this is normal? Anyone with a raptor 3D able to verify this?

invertmast

My Feedback: (23)

Yep.. it was normal for me. I was running +/- 11 on my raptor and anytime i had the sticks at full extent it always bound up right there. as long as the hoop still wiggles in the spot, you'll be fine. I left mine that way w/o any problems thru many flights. And you shouldn't ever have full pitch and full cyclic in the heli at any given time anyways, so you shouldn't run into that problem with flying.

DIJ

So I guess its time to start learning collective management then

Unfortunately the hoops don't wiggle at that point, they arebeing pushed by the blade arm, still ok?
Thanks again, very much appreciated.

invertmast

My Feedback: (23)

Yea you should be fine. and yep.. now would be the time to learn collective management. oh and if you dont have a governor i highly suggest one! I'm running a CSM RL10 on my avant and it works great, i've got an Aerospire multigov goin on my 600N

DIJ

I fitted an RL20 to it as i bought one for my Titan and so i'm familiar with its setup. I did have some trouble setting it up on the Titan initially though, as the engine would hunt even with the sense pot almost fully down.
Spoke to Colin at CSM and he's an incredibly knowlegeable and helpful guy. He suggested I lower the integral gain, which i did and that did help somewhat. It's still not 100 percent smooth though, and I reckon the next thing to do is buy some higher nitro content fuel as i'm only running on 10 percent at the moment, and Colin reckons that may be a contributing factor.

Do you think i'll be ok with 10 fuel percent on the 90 with a os91sz h-ring non-pumped engine with CY MP5 pipe? I've got a gallon left so would like to use that up first. i'm still leaning so not doing anything to wild yet, but I could always use that up on the Titan I guess and buy something stronger for the 90.

The manual for the engine suggests 2 turns out to start with on both the medium and high needles, but i'm not sure if thats right with the MP5 pipe? anyone have this setup and can give me some advice?

invertmast

My Feedback: (23)

I've got a RL10 on my avant FX. i had the same problem you are talking about. i had to change the throttle geometry so when at 50% throttle the angle between the servo arm and the control pushrod was 60* angle. That got rid of my hunting problem completely and i was able to turn the gain up again. I would break in the engine on the nitro content you are going to fly it with (min. of 15%) but thats personal preference. The 2 turns out should be on the rich side by a large margin for break in.

DIJ

Thanks for that info, I will try the throttle linkage trick and see if that helps.
I think I will pick up some 15% nitro for the 90, and also change to it on the 50 when I run of the 10% I have left.