Jerking at full throttle from full stop
01-08-2012, 01:04 PM
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Jerking at full throttle from full stop
Ok...electric guys...is this normal? From a standstill, a full throttle pull on the TX makes the truck convulse. E-Maxx, Mamba monster on 16.8v NiMH.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wv9AW2D5rs[/youtube]
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wv9AW2D5rs[/youtube]
01-08-2012, 05:17 PM
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RE: Jerking at full throttle from full stop
I think something is going on with the esc... Mine only gets cogging when I go slow like you were at the start, if I plant it even with the NiMH that it comes with it just takes off. Also the fact it dies half way through the video and then you hear the esc start up again has me thinking something is up with the esc. I might be wrong but it is strange how it just shuts off and starts up again.
01-08-2012, 08:25 PM
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RE: Jerking at full throttle from full stop
no sir, that is not normal, although i doubt theres anything wrong with the truck or its electronics. i suspect batteries. i have the same truck and while the nimh batteries provide pretty crappy performance, they do not do that. grab some lipos. Oh, and were those batteries fully charged? i have never tried mine with the nimh batteries low. i already had lipos when i bought my emaxx, so i charged the nimh's up once and tried them just for ****s and giggles, but for no more than 2 minutes. cogging is normal , but not to that extent. change the batteries and expect power like this.......(and watch the cogging, this is normal)(exact same esc and motor in this truck)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bp67QY7BKmI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bp67QY7BKmI
01-09-2012, 02:49 AM
#6
RE: Jerking at full throttle from full stop
Not normal at all.
Ok what is happening is the battery can't supply the current draw that the setup is demanding.
U can clearly see this in the video when it cut out and turned back on.
Its drawing so much current from the battery the voltage is dropping so low under load it's shutting down.
Sounds like u have suspect batteries even then...
There are 3 was to fix this
1 smaller tyres
2 smaller pinion gear
3 lipo batteries
The best solution would be some cheap lipos, the other to fixes ultimately will slow it down.
I can't explain the difference a lipo will make, trust me.... U will get heaps more torque and top speed
Ok what is happening is the battery can't supply the current draw that the setup is demanding.
U can clearly see this in the video when it cut out and turned back on.
Its drawing so much current from the battery the voltage is dropping so low under load it's shutting down.
Sounds like u have suspect batteries even then...
There are 3 was to fix this
1 smaller tyres
2 smaller pinion gear
3 lipo batteries
The best solution would be some cheap lipos, the other to fixes ultimately will slow it down.
I can't explain the difference a lipo will make, trust me.... U will get heaps more torque and top speed
01-09-2012, 05:48 AM
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RE: Jerking at full throttle from full stop
I would suggest getting a pair of 2s LiPo batteries (4s total) and then try to run it.
Its normal to have a little cogging on the front end, especially if you ease into the throttle at first, even with LiPos. But a dead pull like that you should have tires spinning and a wheelstand on concrete.
Even though Traxxas sells the EMaxx and ERBE with a pair of NiMh batteries, they do not provide enough current for the MMM.
For the money, these SPC 2s batteries are tough to beat. I get 35-45 minutes of hard bashing run times out of them.
Its normal to have a little cogging on the front end, especially if you ease into the throttle at first, even with LiPos. But a dead pull like that you should have tires spinning and a wheelstand on concrete.
Even though Traxxas sells the EMaxx and ERBE with a pair of NiMh batteries, they do not provide enough current for the MMM.
For the money, these SPC 2s batteries are tough to beat. I get 35-45 minutes of hard bashing run times out of them.
01-09-2012, 08:38 AM
#8
RE: Jerking at full throttle from full stop
I agree with the other posts about the batteries not being up to snuff and lipos are needed. But if you have access to a Castle Link you can try altering some settings. There will be a setting for "Start Power", set this to Low. You could also imcrease Punch Control and Torque Control. This will essentially help draw less from the batteries on startup, if things improve you know your batteries are not up to par. Even after altering these settings it's still not recommended to keep running sub par batteries, it's just a way to help diagnose the issue and allow you to see it firsthand. The truck shouldve came with lipos or nothing at all to begin with.
01-09-2012, 09:55 AM
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RE: Jerking at full throttle from full stop
ORIGINAL: LaTuFu
I would suggest getting a pair of 2s LiPo batteries (4s total) and then try to run it.
Its normal to have a little cogging on the front end, especially if you ease into the throttle at first, even with LiPos. But a dead pull like that you should have tires spinning and a wheelstand on concrete.
Even though Traxxas sells the EMaxx and ERBE with a pair of NiMh batteries, they do not provide enough current for the MMM.
For the money, these SPC 2s batteries are tough to beat. I get 35-45 minutes of hard bashing run times out of them.
I would suggest getting a pair of 2s LiPo batteries (4s total) and then try to run it.
Its normal to have a little cogging on the front end, especially if you ease into the throttle at first, even with LiPos. But a dead pull like that you should have tires spinning and a wheelstand on concrete.
Even though Traxxas sells the EMaxx and ERBE with a pair of NiMh batteries, they do not provide enough current for the MMM.
For the money, these SPC 2s batteries are tough to beat. I get 35-45 minutes of hard bashing run times out of them.
Any idea if these are accurate on the c rating dump? The minimum is 30c, so if they've embellished on the c rating, it could damage the batteries and ESC, right?
I found these for $90 each.
SPC Li-Po Power,
Lithium Polymer (LiPo) Battery Pack
8200mAh, 30C, 3S, 11.1V
01-09-2012, 10:26 AM
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RE: Jerking at full throttle from full stop
I called the Castle tech line and pointed the guy toward the video, he watched it and he guided me through a bunch of diagnostic tests.
What we found:
When the throttle was punched, the RX was cutting out and momentarily going into the neutral failsafe mode causing the jerking, only a drop in voltage through the BEC in the ESC can cause that.
The cause of that is insufficient battery power.
The stock batteries SHOULD be good enough to run the e-maxx. He said I may have a bad/weak connection inside one of the batteries causing the voltage drop when the amperage draw is high.
To be sure, (since I don't have any Lipos) he wants me to change out the TX/RX with another radio and test again, just to rule out the stock radio as the problem.
What we found:
When the throttle was punched, the RX was cutting out and momentarily going into the neutral failsafe mode causing the jerking, only a drop in voltage through the BEC in the ESC can cause that.
The cause of that is insufficient battery power.
The stock batteries SHOULD be good enough to run the e-maxx. He said I may have a bad/weak connection inside one of the batteries causing the voltage drop when the amperage draw is high.
To be sure, (since I don't have any Lipos) he wants me to change out the TX/RX with another radio and test again, just to rule out the stock radio as the problem.
01-09-2012, 10:53 AM
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RE: Jerking at full throttle from full stop
ORIGINAL: crispyspa
Any idea if these are accurate on the c rating dump? The minimum is 30c, so if they've embellished on the c rating, it could damage the batteries and ESC, right?
I found these for $90 each.
SPC Li-Po Power,
Lithium Polymer (LiPo) Battery Pack
8200mAh, 30C, 3S, 11.1V
ORIGINAL: LaTuFu
I would suggest getting a pair of 2s LiPo batteries (4s total) and then try to run it.
Its normal to have a little cogging on the front end, especially if you ease into the throttle at first, even with LiPos. But a dead pull like that you should have tires spinning and a wheelstand on concrete.
Even though Traxxas sells the EMaxx and ERBE with a pair of NiMh batteries, they do not provide enough current for the MMM.
For the money, these SPC 2s batteries are tough to beat. I get 35-45 minutes of hard bashing run times out of them.
I would suggest getting a pair of 2s LiPo batteries (4s total) and then try to run it.
Its normal to have a little cogging on the front end, especially if you ease into the throttle at first, even with LiPos. But a dead pull like that you should have tires spinning and a wheelstand on concrete.
Even though Traxxas sells the EMaxx and ERBE with a pair of NiMh batteries, they do not provide enough current for the MMM.
For the money, these SPC 2s batteries are tough to beat. I get 35-45 minutes of hard bashing run times out of them.
Any idea if these are accurate on the c rating dump? The minimum is 30c, so if they've embellished on the c rating, it could damage the batteries and ESC, right?
I found these for $90 each.
SPC Li-Po Power,
Lithium Polymer (LiPo) Battery Pack
8200mAh, 30C, 3S, 11.1V
Regarding your comment in your other post, no matter what Traxxas says, their stock NiMh batteries are NOT sufficient to power the MMM. The momentary brownout in the Rx is proof that the voltage drop from the current draw is too much for the battery, and it causes the LVC. Castle is too kind to Traxxas (because their motors/escs are stock in the ERBE/EMBE) and won't say "these batteries suck." But if you read their independent documentation on their website, it says that NiMh batteries won't cut it.
I would strongly suggest that you stick to 4s at first with the EMBE. The EMBE is not nearly as durable as the ERBE on LiPo power, and the ERBE struggles to handle 6s power. Start off with 4s, or 5s (you can pair (1) 2s and (1) 3s battery) at the most. Most of the problems Iread about with people having constant breakdowns is 6s hard off road bashing. It is very hard on the truck. I would only do it if you accept that it is part of the deal and really don't mind wrenching on your truck. A lot.
01-09-2012, 11:09 AM
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RE: Jerking at full throttle from full stop
ORIGINAL: LaTuFu
Regarding your comment in your other post, no matter what Traxxas says, their stock NiMh batteries are NOT sufficient to power the MMM. The momentary brownout in the Rx is proof that the voltage drop from the current draw is too much for the battery, and it causes the LVC. Castle is too kind to Traxxas (because their motors/escs are stock in the ERBE/EMBE) and won't say ''these batteries suck.'' But if you read their independent documentation on their website, it says that NiMh batteries won't cut it.
I would strongly suggest that you stick to 4s at first with the EMBE. The EMBE is not nearly as durable as the ERBE on LiPo power, and the ERBE struggles to handle 6s power. Start off with 4s, or 5s (you can pair (1) 2s and (1) 3s battery) at the most. Most of the problems I read about with people having constant breakdowns is 6s hard off road bashing. It is very hard on the truck. I would only do it if you accept that it is part of the deal and really don't mind wrenching on your truck. A lot.
Regarding your comment in your other post, no matter what Traxxas says, their stock NiMh batteries are NOT sufficient to power the MMM. The momentary brownout in the Rx is proof that the voltage drop from the current draw is too much for the battery, and it causes the LVC. Castle is too kind to Traxxas (because their motors/escs are stock in the ERBE/EMBE) and won't say ''these batteries suck.'' But if you read their independent documentation on their website, it says that NiMh batteries won't cut it.
I would strongly suggest that you stick to 4s at first with the EMBE. The EMBE is not nearly as durable as the ERBE on LiPo power, and the ERBE struggles to handle 6s power. Start off with 4s, or 5s (you can pair (1) 2s and (1) 3s battery) at the most. Most of the problems I read about with people having constant breakdowns is 6s hard off road bashing. It is very hard on the truck. I would only do it if you accept that it is part of the deal and really don't mind wrenching on your truck. A lot.
Forgive my ignorance, (and this probably will be a
moment) but what is EMBE/EMBE?I do like wrenching on my trucks, but longevity and jaw dropping power usually don't get along.
I think (hope) I can control my throttle finger with 6s. LOL
01-09-2012, 12:35 PM
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RE: Jerking at full throttle from full stop
ERBE= E Revo Brushless Edition
EMBE= E Maxx Brushless Edition
The other thing I thought about after my last post...you could also try changing the ESC settings.
iirc, the MMM is set by default to the "Auto-Lipo" setting. It automatically sets LiPo cutoff at 3.2v per cell in this setting. If you're running NiMhs with this default setting, it will hit the LVC as the voltage sags in the NiMh. You could try changing the LVC setting to none and see if that helps any. (Just remember to change the setting back once you get LiPos.)
EMBE= E Maxx Brushless Edition
The other thing I thought about after my last post...you could also try changing the ESC settings.
iirc, the MMM is set by default to the "Auto-Lipo" setting. It automatically sets LiPo cutoff at 3.2v per cell in this setting. If you're running NiMhs with this default setting, it will hit the LVC as the voltage sags in the NiMh. You could try changing the LVC setting to none and see if that helps any. (Just remember to change the setting back once you get LiPos.)
01-09-2012, 01:21 PM
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RE: Jerking at full throttle from full stop
ORIGINAL: LaTuFu
The C ratings are very accurate on SPCs. SPC tests each batch individually and makes sure the packs are up to specs. They are a family owned company in the US. The owner is also an RC enthusiast, and he owns a Summit and Revo. So the batteries are designed and tested to meet the specs of the trucks he likes to drive.
Regarding your comment in your other post, no matter what Traxxas says, their stock NiMh batteries are NOT sufficient to power the MMM. The momentary brownout in the Rx is proof that the voltage drop from the current draw is too much for the battery, and it causes the LVC. Castle is too kind to Traxxas (because their motors/escs are stock in the ERBE/EMBE) and won't say ''these batteries suck.'' But if you read their independent documentation on their website, it says that NiMh batteries won't cut it.
I would strongly suggest that you stick to 4s at first with the EMBE. The EMBE is not nearly as durable as the ERBE on LiPo power, and the ERBE struggles to handle 6s power. Start off with 4s, or 5s (you can pair (1) 2s and (1) 3s battery) at the most. Most of the problems I read about with people having constant breakdowns is 6s hard off road bashing. It is very hard on the truck. I would only do it if you accept that it is part of the deal and really don't mind wrenching on your truck. A lot.
ORIGINAL: crispyspa
Any idea if these are accurate on the c rating dump? The minimum is 30c, so if they've embellished on the c rating, it could damage the batteries and ESC, right?
I found these for $90 each.
SPC Li-Po Power,
Lithium Polymer (LiPo) Battery Pack
8200mAh, 30C, 3S, 11.1V
ORIGINAL: LaTuFu
I would suggest getting a pair of 2s LiPo batteries (4s total) and then try to run it.
Its normal to have a little cogging on the front end, especially if you ease into the throttle at first, even with LiPos. But a dead pull like that you should have tires spinning and a wheelstand on concrete.
Even though Traxxas sells the EMaxx and ERBE with a pair of NiMh batteries, they do not provide enough current for the MMM.
For the money, these SPC 2s batteries are tough to beat. I get 35-45 minutes of hard bashing run times out of them.
I would suggest getting a pair of 2s LiPo batteries (4s total) and then try to run it.
Its normal to have a little cogging on the front end, especially if you ease into the throttle at first, even with LiPos. But a dead pull like that you should have tires spinning and a wheelstand on concrete.
Even though Traxxas sells the EMaxx and ERBE with a pair of NiMh batteries, they do not provide enough current for the MMM.
For the money, these SPC 2s batteries are tough to beat. I get 35-45 minutes of hard bashing run times out of them.
Any idea if these are accurate on the c rating dump? The minimum is 30c, so if they've embellished on the c rating, it could damage the batteries and ESC, right?
I found these for $90 each.
SPC Li-Po Power,
Lithium Polymer (LiPo) Battery Pack
8200mAh, 30C, 3S, 11.1V
Regarding your comment in your other post, no matter what Traxxas says, their stock NiMh batteries are NOT sufficient to power the MMM. The momentary brownout in the Rx is proof that the voltage drop from the current draw is too much for the battery, and it causes the LVC. Castle is too kind to Traxxas (because their motors/escs are stock in the ERBE/EMBE) and won't say ''these batteries suck.'' But if you read their independent documentation on their website, it says that NiMh batteries won't cut it.
I would strongly suggest that you stick to 4s at first with the EMBE. The EMBE is not nearly as durable as the ERBE on LiPo power, and the ERBE struggles to handle 6s power. Start off with 4s, or 5s (you can pair (1) 2s and (1) 3s battery) at the most. Most of the problems I read about with people having constant breakdowns is 6s hard off road bashing. It is very hard on the truck. I would only do it if you accept that it is part of the deal and really don't mind wrenching on your truck. A lot.
01-09-2012, 04:55 PM
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RE: Jerking at full throttle from full stop
stock shafts are garbage on 6s cvds solve this and i broke a rear diff ring landing a wide open backflip,but that was after 50 or so packs on a used diff lol
01-09-2012, 05:45 PM
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RE: Jerking at full throttle from full stop
ORIGINAL: pure speed:]
stock shafts are garbage on 6s cvds solve this and i broke a rear diff ring landing a wide open backflip,but that was after 50 or so packs on a used diff lol
stock shafts are garbage on 6s cvds solve this and i broke a rear diff ring landing a wide open backflip,but that was after 50 or so packs on a used diff lol
01-09-2012, 09:35 PM
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RE: Jerking at full throttle from full stop
ORIGINAL: LaTuFu
ERBE= E Revo Brushless Edition
EMBE= E Maxx Brushless Edition
The other thing I thought about after my last post...you could also try changing the ESC settings.
iirc, the MMM is set by default to the ''Auto-Lipo'' setting. It automatically sets LiPo cutoff at 3.2v per cell in this setting. If you're running NiMhs with this default setting, it will hit the LVC as the voltage sags in the NiMh. You could try changing the LVC setting to none and see if that helps any. (Just remember to change the setting back once you get LiPos.)
ERBE= E Revo Brushless Edition
EMBE= E Maxx Brushless Edition
The other thing I thought about after my last post...you could also try changing the ESC settings.
iirc, the MMM is set by default to the ''Auto-Lipo'' setting. It automatically sets LiPo cutoff at 3.2v per cell in this setting. If you're running NiMhs with this default setting, it will hit the LVC as the voltage sags in the NiMh. You could try changing the LVC setting to none and see if that helps any. (Just remember to change the setting back once you get LiPos.)
LOLThe low voltage cut off is set to "off"
I'm saving up for Lipos....collecting scrap steel, aluminum, aluminum cans and selling some old RC stuff on E-bay and Craigslist. I need Lipos before the Monster truck show. The LHS sets it up so a bunch of us can run our trucks during intermission. [8D]
01-10-2012, 08:32 AM
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RE: Jerking at full throttle from full stop
ORIGINAL: steed2
I hear this alot, the whole 6s kills a truck arguement. I run 6s in my flux and embe, without any problems. On top of this i run the slipper clutch on both these trucks fully tightened down. now i dont have experience with the erevo, and i thought it was tougher than the emaxx also, allthough the emaxx is happy running on 6s (from my personal expereince), where are you finding the erevo having problems with 6s? The driveline on these two trucks are almost identical.
I hear this alot, the whole 6s kills a truck arguement. I run 6s in my flux and embe, without any problems. On top of this i run the slipper clutch on both these trucks fully tightened down. now i dont have experience with the erevo, and i thought it was tougher than the emaxx also, allthough the emaxx is happy running on 6s (from my personal expereince), where are you finding the erevo having problems with 6s? The driveline on these two trucks are almost identical.
The overwhelming majority of "6s kills the truck" experiences that I have run across have been people new to the hobby, driving their first truck, and can't get a 6s battery setup dropped into their trucks fast enough. No break in, no tuning, no diff shimming, just plug it in and hammer the throttle. And they can't figure out why the truck is constantly breaking down. No matter what the situation looks like, suggesting to them that "driver error" is not an issue they think applies to them in any way.
01-10-2012, 09:42 AM
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RE: Jerking at full throttle from full stop
ORIGINAL: LaTuFu
No break in, no tuning, no diff shimming,
No break in, no tuning, no diff shimming,
Please elaborate:
What needs to be broken in? Motor?
Tuning of the suspension is a given, is there other tuning? I saw a section on motor timing in the castle book.
Diff shimming...In the 5 years I had my T-Maxx 2.5 (with the os.18tm), I never had problems with the diffs, then again I've never had the power of 6s.
01-10-2012, 11:02 AM
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RE: Jerking at full throttle from full stop
There really isn't any break-in requirements for a brushless motor, other than some 3 in 1 on the bearing.
But shimming the diffs seems to help prolong the life of the average diff.
Tuning the ESC programming with the Castle Link software is highly recommended. Setting it to all of the recommended bashing settings will reduce stress on the driveline components.
But shimming the diffs seems to help prolong the life of the average diff.
Tuning the ESC programming with the Castle Link software is highly recommended. Setting it to all of the recommended bashing settings will reduce stress on the driveline components.
01-10-2012, 11:07 AM
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RE: Jerking at full throttle from full stop
ORIGINAL: LaTuFu
And I run into a lot of guys like you that have no issues running 6s in their trucks. I'm willing to go out on a limb and guess that you've been driving RC vehicles for a few years, and have some experience under your belt. That seems to be the common thread with guys who run 6s no problem at all.
The overwhelming majority of ''6s kills the truck'' experiences that I have run across have been people new to the hobby, driving their first truck, and can't get a 6s battery setup dropped into their trucks fast enough. No break in, no tuning, no diff shimming, just plug it in and hammer the throttle. And they can't figure out why the truck is constantly breaking down. No matter what the situation looks like, suggesting to them that ''driver error'' is not an issue they think applies to them in any way.
ORIGINAL: steed2
I hear this alot, the whole 6s kills a truck arguement. I run 6s in my flux and embe, without any problems. On top of this i run the slipper clutch on both these trucks fully tightened down. now i dont have experience with the erevo, and i thought it was tougher than the emaxx also, allthough the emaxx is happy running on 6s (from my personal expereince), where are you finding the erevo having problems with 6s? The driveline on these two trucks are almost identical.
I hear this alot, the whole 6s kills a truck arguement. I run 6s in my flux and embe, without any problems. On top of this i run the slipper clutch on both these trucks fully tightened down. now i dont have experience with the erevo, and i thought it was tougher than the emaxx also, allthough the emaxx is happy running on 6s (from my personal expereince), where are you finding the erevo having problems with 6s? The driveline on these two trucks are almost identical.
The overwhelming majority of ''6s kills the truck'' experiences that I have run across have been people new to the hobby, driving their first truck, and can't get a 6s battery setup dropped into their trucks fast enough. No break in, no tuning, no diff shimming, just plug it in and hammer the throttle. And they can't figure out why the truck is constantly breaking down. No matter what the situation looks like, suggesting to them that ''driver error'' is not an issue they think applies to them in any way.
02-07-2012, 11:24 PM
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RE: Jerking at full throttle from full stop
Well, I got LiPOs I chose the Max Amps and Hyperion charger, What a difference in power. Here is the unboxing.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=phDdUWJXYIU[/youtube]
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=phDdUWJXYIU[/youtube]
02-08-2012, 03:16 AM
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RE: Jerking at full throttle from full stop
That's a lot of maxxamps stuff.... Most people I have encountered hate maxxamps for one reason or another but other then being a bit pricey I see nothing wrong with them and I have heard nothing but good things about that hyperion charger. Your E-Maxx will fly now.