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Thread: Ziroli DC-3


  1. #26
    Kregg's Avatar
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    RE: Ziroli DC-3

    I'm also working on a Ziroli DC-3. Mine is all framed up and starting on the sheeting. Man! That is a lot of sheeting. I spent $150 bucks just on balsa for the sheeting alone. Mine will have a pair or Zenoah G45 that I already have broken in from other projects. I will post some pixs soon. We all need to keep this thread going and compare notes along the way.

    What about push rods that are 4 feet long for the tail surfaces? That will be a real trick to keep the slop out.

    FYI: In a earlier post someone asked about scale pilots and another replied that they should be 1/6th scale. That is not correct according to my Ziroli plans. 140" span, 99" fuse = 1/8th scale. Unless he scaled it up even more!
    I was the Virtual Cockpits guy.

  2. #27
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    RE: Ziroli DC-3

    Hi Kregg ;Thanks for the clairification on the scale numbers.I'm going to use Sul518 High Stress Golden Rods that are 60" long.I'm going to run them through the formers on each side .Pushing these rods will be a set of HS 700 Hitech 1/4 scale servos.Pics in a few days...Steve..
    Steve Daly
    MAAC #14007
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    RE: Ziroli DC-3

    Lookin good cmsrp ;Do you have constuction of the DC-3 on hold?.
    Yep, dont know if I'm going to complete this bird or sell it??? I have so much to do and so little time at the moment. Would be good to see it fly though...

    What about push rods that are 4 feet long for the tail surfaces? That will be a real trick to keep the slop out.
    I wondered this myself; Anyone thought of putting the servo's down the back?????

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    RE: Ziroli DC-3

    Great work I just completed the C130 (see post) and have been flying. I am considering the C47, B17 and B29 for next projects. Please keep informing of progress including flying and pics.

    Any suggestions for the next one.. More engines more fun..

    Bigger Boat Bigger Fish.. OOPS wrong board..

  5. #30
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    RE: Ziroli DC-3

    I considered installing the servos in the rear but decided against it because of the tail weight.
    Steve Daly
    MAAC #14007
    Challenger2 C-IECP

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    RE: Ziroli DC-3

    I considered installing the servos in the rear but decided against it because of the tail weight
    That was my concern, but being that I dont know anyone else here in Aus with a Zirolli DC-3, I didnt know how these planes finish up (balance and weight)...
    Are they commonly tail heavy?

  7. #32
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    RE: Ziroli DC-3

    Thats why they use G-38"s,US 41's ,Q-42's, cmsrp.for the extra weight and then some so Ive heard.Maybe somebody out there has experienced that problem and has some numbers.
    Steve Daly
    MAAC #14007
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    RE: Ziroli DC-3

    I agree about the tail weight issue. I'm sure it will be substantially tail heavy. I've heard of these ships requiring SEVERAL pounds of nose cone weight. I hope we find someone with live experience with this aircraft. That would be very helpful. I was going to make my fiberglass nose cone removable, for access to the nose weights. This would also be a good spot for the batteries, receiver and such, helping the balance issue.

    What does everyone think about cutting the fuse formers for the windows along the side? Will this affect the structural integrity after it has been sheeted and glassed? I'm debating about cutting the holes for a true window (seeing inside) or just creating a shallow shadow box style window well that sits back about a 1/2 inch from the window. I'm leaning toward the shadow box style since I do not plan on finishing the interior of the fuse. The boxes could be painted a dark gray and it would create the illusion while not cutting completely through a few of the formers.
    I was the Virtual Cockpits guy.

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    RE: Ziroli DC-3

    I like the recessed box around the window idea Kregg.I too am not going to finish the rear interior.I will do the cockpit area though.Has anyone considered the new Saito 200 twin cylinder for power?I think they may have enough power and at 160 mm(6 1/4") I believe they may fit ok.They'll turn up to 18x10 props around 8000 I think.I recall reading an article by Greg Hahn were he said G-23's would be enough power for the Ziroli DC3 , so maybe these 200 twins would be a possibility?What do ya all think?..Steve
    Steve Daly
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    Challenger2 C-IECP

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    RE: Ziroli DC-3

    Just installed the pushrods for the elevators
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    Steve Daly
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    Challenger2 C-IECP

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    RE: Ziroli DC-3

    Steve,
    Yours is looking good. I just ordered the 60!QUOT! Sullivan push-rods as well. My fuse is in the same stage as yours except that I'm just building the rear control surfaces. Perhaps you could share your thoughts on the tail control surface connections. This is my first aircraft with the scale hinge line made from steel rods.

    Is the rudder and elevator removable after the fuse is sheeted? The control rod and horn connection onto the hinge rod will be inaccessible once I plank the fuse. That must make these connections permanent and they must be done right the first time. This is a confusing area. Will you finish these control surfaces including the covering before you attach these to the stabilizers? The control arm with a wheel collar on the steel rod does not seam very reliable. I will file a flat spot and maybe even solder the wheel collar onto the rod, but there will be a lot of stress on this little connection. Seems week. Perhaps you could post some detailed pix of this area as you do it? It would be most appreciated.

    If it helps you, I could take pixs of the wing sections and the fuse connections. I have these areas built and attached, but not sheeted.
    Thx,
    Kregg
    I was the Virtual Cockpits guy.

  12. #37
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    RE: Ziroli DC-3

    Hi Kregg;I was planning to make my control surfaces semi-permanent on the tail.If one were to silver solder a control horn onto the rudder hinge rod and then make a slot on the fuse under the rudder could make it removeable along with makeing it installable after sheeting the fuse and covering the rudder.You would also have to make an access hole through F-14 to hook up the rudder pushrod.One could make a removeable tailcone also,or just install it when everything else is completed.The thing is you have to glass the fuse with the stabilizer and fin attached .That would be the way I'm thinking on going.I will finish sheeting and covering and then glass it before I attach any of the control surfaces permentaly.Plus I like to paint everthing seperate also. I still have to add the rudder push rod on mine yet.
    Some pics of your wing sections and fuse connections would be great Kregg.Thats what I'm working on at the moment..
    As soon as I get back at the tail section I'll post some pics...Steve
    Steve Daly
    MAAC #14007
    Challenger2 C-IECP

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    RE: Ziroli DC-3

    Just sizing up a Saito 170R on the firewall were the US 41's are going.Looks like one could consider using these engines.They'd have the power I would think.This particular engine flew a 20 lb SR 9 with ease....Steve
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    Steve Daly
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    RE: Ziroli DC-3

    Steve,
    Below you will find a few pix of my assembly with the wing and such. If you want details on a certain area, just let me know.
    Kregg
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    I was the Virtual Cockpits guy.

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    RE: Ziroli DC-3

    Great pics..Thanks Steve
    Steve Daly
    MAAC #14007
    Challenger2 C-IECP

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    RE: Ziroli DC-3

    Hi,

    In order to campare notes, can somebody please inform me what is the weight of the fuselage when it is already epoxied?

    Thanks

    Reuben

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    RE: Ziroli DC-3

    Nice,, very nice!! This one is on the to do list. One suggestion, if that green plastic bottle is for your retract air, you may want to consider changing it to an aluminum tank. Robart carries them, as well as others. I witnessed the side of a fuse blowing out one hot summer day that had a plastic air bottle in the plane. That convinced me. Ever since, I have used aluminum.

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    RE: Ziroli DC-3

    Mr. Scale: Thanks for the tip on the air bottle. I was using this because of the needed tank size. I did not think that Robart made one big enough. Their large one #192 has only 43 cubic inches Are you sure this is big enough for several gear cycles?

    F86_SABRE: I do not know anyone that has a fuse that is finished per your question. I will let you know when I get to that point, but it will not be until early next year. This is a big project....
    I was the Virtual Cockpits guy.

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    RE: Ziroli DC-3

    Kregg; I think the 192 bottle would do the trick.I guess one could double up two of them but I think one would do it.I'm going to order an air system soon and am just getting the one with the variable rate valve..
    Ditto on the fuse weight..wont know it for a while...Steve
    Steve Daly
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    Challenger2 C-IECP

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    RE: Ziroli DC-3

    OK guys...when you arrive at that stage maybe then we can compare notes on the fuselage weight. Meanwhile, I started assembling the wing centresection and I hope to have it to retract level sometime next week.

    What engines will you guys be using? I am trying to find an engine that might not have its head sticking out...well...if I am lucky...not too far out from the cowl. At the moment I am considering the new MVVS 35cc gas engine or the Brison 2.4. At the moment this is a sore point for me because I am still undecided.

    Regards

    Reuben

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    RE: Ziroli DC-3

    To F86 Sabre
    I too dreaded cutting the bottoms of the cowls to permit the heads sticking out problem initally and I even contacted Laser in the UK to see and they said thier 240 V twin would fit ok and would fly it ok if you kept it light, although I had my doughts if it would fit.I've also heard of the discontinued Enya V twin 240 fitting in the cowls ok.But up in the air I think now Id have more confidence with a couple of gassers.You dont see the cylinder heads stickin out when she's flying over head anyways with a couple of reliable gas engines sippin on the gas...purring away...
    Steve Daly
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    Challenger2 C-IECP

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    RE: Ziroli DC-3

    Hi Steve,

    I fully agree with what you stated and I will go all the way to go for a pair of gassers. I'd rather have the plane in one piece. On the other hand I will explore the possibilities of limiting how much I will cut away from the cowl.
    Today, I managed to assemble the wing centresection and placed it on the fuselage. Its a big bird!! By the middle of next week I hope to have this part all strengthened up and glued thoroughly. In the meantime, I gave my friend the task of bushing the wheels for me because I did not wish that the wheel hub shaft tunnel distort in time given that the plane will not be a light plane and the wheel hub is cast aluminum.
    With regards to sheet covering the wings I had in mind in using the Mick Reeves PRO-SKIN fiberglass sheet covering. That should make the building faster, stronger and lighter. Take a look:
    http://www.mrmodels.fsnet.co.uk/pro.htm
    Meanwhile, I have to locate some shots of lowered DC-3 flaps to see if they can be possibly copied.

    Later Steve and happy building.

    Regards

    Reuben

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    RE: Ziroli DC-3

    Hi,
    Just a question concerning the wing... Can anybody tell me if rib #W18 should have its trailing edge resting on the 3/8" sqr balsa running underneath the ribs (presumably for washout purposes)? It seems that this square balsa stop just behind rib #W17.

    Thanks.

    Reuben

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    RE: Ziroli DC-3

    My nose flips up like the D18 with an inside panel which I have mounted my ignition switches and charge jacks. Behind that batteries and about 5# of weight. Total aircraft weight is 53#. These aircraft are like flying telemasters no problems. I also have 2 elevator servos, rudder pull pull servo, and tail wheel steering in the tail cone behind the tail wheel. All of this has a flush cover on the bottom for service.
    Here in central Florida I fly the aircraft inverted a lot. Aircraft is very fast with 18 10 3 blades on electronic G 38's. Wheel landings are a must and unlike the D 18 the DC 3 will not eat you up on takeoff.

  25. #50
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    RE: Ziroli DC-3

    Hey alsez; Sounds like a slick setup.Can you show any pics of your flipup nosecone?The rudder pull pull sounds good also.So where did you place your elevator and rudder servos? And a pic of your cover for that bottom area would be nice...
    Steve Daly
    MAAC #14007
    Challenger2 C-IECP


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