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Biggie and Baldie:
The C-47 had an official nickname of "Skytrain," and the C-54 was the "Skymaster." C-53? I have no idea.
A single's a sin, gotta be a twin.
Bill.
The C-47 had an official nickname of "Skytrain," and the C-54 was the "Skymaster." C-53? I have no idea.
A single's a sin, gotta be a twin.
Bill.
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Hey Vince: Willie here sounds all right, may be we should let him join our team ? Now`s the time to hit you boys with a VC-117. Kept a log on every thing I worked on or flew on. That one I only worked on. Walked by it twice before I figured out what it was ! big max 1935
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OK for you, Biggie.
Haven't been called Willie for years. One of my A/C's called me WillieBill, but when I moved to the left seat that crap came to a screeching halt. I go by Bill, but you may call me whatever, I am no longer young enough or stupid enough to worry about it.
Wasn't the VC-117 a deluxe passenger version of the 707?
Bigger is not necessarily better, but it is bigger.
Bill.
Haven't been called Willie for years. One of my A/C's called me WillieBill, but when I moved to the left seat that crap came to a screeching halt. I go by Bill, but you may call me whatever, I am no longer young enough or stupid enough to worry about it.
Wasn't the VC-117 a deluxe passenger version of the 707?
Bigger is not necessarily better, but it is bigger.
Bill.
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Woops, Bill it is. The VC-117 that I saw was a plush-ed up Gooney with a small door, log says it was from Bolling AFB, by D.C. I remember we had jet jockey who`s first name was Colonel. He would radio in for landing instructions,and he would tell them he was LT. Colonel So & So. He always got a premium parking spot for field grades. The A.F. ruined his day, they made him Captain. Seems a Captain Colonel didn`t work!! Seem`s if were on first names mine is Max not Maxie By now
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So Max it is for you now.
The "V" in the designator told me it was the luxury transport, but I really thought the C-117 was the big Boeing. What was the mil desig of the 707?
When I went into a USN field I often used your light bird's trick, calling in I would ID myself as "Captain Robison" and as often as not I'd get a good parking spot. Of course the swabbies would get torqued when they saw a "Yewsaff" O-3 climb out of the plane.
Pleasant memories.
Gooney Bird, Dakota, Skymaster, been nice if were just faster.
Bill.
The "V" in the designator told me it was the luxury transport, but I really thought the C-117 was the big Boeing. What was the mil desig of the 707?
When I went into a USN field I often used your light bird's trick, calling in I would ID myself as "Captain Robison" and as often as not I'd get a good parking spot. Of course the swabbies would get torqued when they saw a "Yewsaff" O-3 climb out of the plane.
Pleasant memories.
Gooney Bird, Dakota, Skymaster, been nice if were just faster.
Bill.
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Max:
By-the-by, I did know Bolling Field. One runway beside the Potomac, all the Bolling buildings on one side. The USN had a bunch of buildings on the other side of the runway, they called it Anacostia.
Reminds me of the people who say "Gay," and the honest ones who aren't perverted say something else. Just two names for the same thing. Or place. Like LBJ. LBJohnson should have been inside LBJail. Haw!
Da Nang and Than Son Nuit, always glad to get oot! (out - lousy rhyme, sorry)
Bill.
By-the-by, I did know Bolling Field. One runway beside the Potomac, all the Bolling buildings on one side. The USN had a bunch of buildings on the other side of the runway, they called it Anacostia.
Reminds me of the people who say "Gay," and the honest ones who aren't perverted say something else. Just two names for the same thing. Or place. Like LBJ. LBJohnson should have been inside LBJail. Haw!
Da Nang and Than Son Nuit, always glad to get oot! (out - lousy rhyme, sorry)
Bill.
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One day when returning to Cam Rahn, after hauling a bunch of trash all over the country I saw someting strange on the ramp. It looked like a Lancaster, upon closer inspection, that is exactly what it was. An Australian Lancaster, outfitted for sub patrol I think. It had trashed an engine and had to make a stop at Cam Rahn for repair. You should have seen the weird looking Aussie bird that brought in a spare engine and mechanics a day later, I don't know what that thing was. The Lancaster stayed on the ramp for several days while the Aussie mechanics switched out the Merlin. I wish I had gotten some pictures of it, cause I have told the tale several times and I get strange looks everytime.
This is a hoot.
Vince
463rd Combat Support Group
Cam Rahn Bay, RVN
1971-72
This is a hoot.
Vince
463rd Combat Support Group
Cam Rahn Bay, RVN
1971-72
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Vince:
I knew the Aussies were still flying Lancs in the early 60's, but if I had heard this '70s story from anyone else I'd give them strange looks too.
The Merlins were just too expensive to operate. Not only the fuel burn, but they had a rated combat life of 200 hours TBO. I'm sure they would last longer just tooling around, but still way too rich for my blood. Current most common use of the Merlins probably has a TWO hour TBO - the Reno types.
Fly Merlin twins - cost'll put you on your pins.
Bill.
I knew the Aussies were still flying Lancs in the early 60's, but if I had heard this '70s story from anyone else I'd give them strange looks too.
The Merlins were just too expensive to operate. Not only the fuel burn, but they had a rated combat life of 200 hours TBO. I'm sure they would last longer just tooling around, but still way too rich for my blood. Current most common use of the Merlins probably has a TWO hour TBO - the Reno types.
Fly Merlin twins - cost'll put you on your pins.
Bill.
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Well boys my turn: Back in 56 & 57 I was in Thule , Greenland and we had a squadron of Canadian Lancasters on the ramp next to our F-89`s. Sure was pleasing to hear their run ups. They only had a few officers, most of the pilots were Sgts. We were all-weather interceptors,but we were grounded by weather, they would fly to Canada ( I think they called it Thor Bay?) for their weekly whiskey run ! When in Athens, Greece,there used to be Canadian plane ,that looked like a C-54, but It had Merlins on it.It was flying for U.N. Maybe a Canuck can verify ? Northstar ? Max
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Max:
The "C-54" with Merlins was probably a York. One of the first Brit transport designs after WW-2. Supposed to be used by BEA and BOAC, they both rejected it. Rejected for flying characteristics, cost of operation, and poor payload. It was also a taildragger.
A lot of them were used on the "Air Bridge," but other than that I think only the RAF used them.
Now I have a trivia question for you or Vince: what was the "Air Bridge?"
Don't be a dork, don't fly a York.
Bill.
The "C-54" with Merlins was probably a York. One of the first Brit transport designs after WW-2. Supposed to be used by BEA and BOAC, they both rejected it. Rejected for flying characteristics, cost of operation, and poor payload. It was also a taildragger.
A lot of them were used on the "Air Bridge," but other than that I think only the RAF used them.
Now I have a trivia question for you or Vince: what was the "Air Bridge?"
Don't be a dork, don't fly a York.
Bill.
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Bill,
The mil. version of the 707 was the C-135. The air refueling configuration was the KC-135. I saw the business end of the KC many times from the IP seat of the B-52. I used to fly as maintenance observer for the bombradier to collect that extra pay. During refueling I liked to go upstairs and sit in the IP seat to watch.
The mil. version of the 707 was the C-135. The air refueling configuration was the KC-135. I saw the business end of the KC many times from the IP seat of the B-52. I used to fly as maintenance observer for the bombradier to collect that extra pay. During refueling I liked to go upstairs and sit in the IP seat to watch.
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Crash:
Of course it was the 135. But I couldn't pull it out of the dank and dusty recesses of my mind.
How did you like the '52? I never went through transition to it, but the bootleg time I got surprised me very much. At first touch it was a slow reacting, almost unmanageable monster. But as you built time you found yourself first liking, then loving it. But it was still a slow reacting, almost unmanageable monster. You learned to think not seconds, but minutes ahead. And it became a sweet bird. Bummed rides out of Thailand to get the time.
When I came back to the ZI my main job, at Sheppard, was driving pencil-pushers around in a B-57. This was how they logged their mandatory hours. Mostly they'd sleep, leaving the work to me. This was an unofficial main job, of course. Also assisted running the base hobby shop as a colateral duty. My "Real" job was third or fifth assistant to the deputy to the base relief postal officer. In extremely busy times the assigned duty took about 5 minutes per week. The base commander wanted me to fly. I did build a lot of hours, though.
Twin jets? That's the best, you bets!
Bill.
Of course it was the 135. But I couldn't pull it out of the dank and dusty recesses of my mind.
How did you like the '52? I never went through transition to it, but the bootleg time I got surprised me very much. At first touch it was a slow reacting, almost unmanageable monster. But as you built time you found yourself first liking, then loving it. But it was still a slow reacting, almost unmanageable monster. You learned to think not seconds, but minutes ahead. And it became a sweet bird. Bummed rides out of Thailand to get the time.
When I came back to the ZI my main job, at Sheppard, was driving pencil-pushers around in a B-57. This was how they logged their mandatory hours. Mostly they'd sleep, leaving the work to me. This was an unofficial main job, of course. Also assisted running the base hobby shop as a colateral duty. My "Real" job was third or fifth assistant to the deputy to the base relief postal officer. In extremely busy times the assigned duty took about 5 minutes per week. The base commander wanted me to fly. I did build a lot of hours, though.
Twin jets? That's the best, you bets!
Bill.
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Multis......
Bill....the C-54 was the DC-4...powered by 4 P&W R-2000's.....no flt engineer ,just a 2-man crew.....very slooowwww.......always could tell them apart from a DC-6 just by how slow they flew.......A guy had one down here in the early 70's that was basically "0" timed...you could eat off the thing...it was immaculate.It was light brown with dark brown stripes.....Bill.....
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WBZ1:
Bill. look at post #34. "C-54" was used to describe a Canadian operated plane, we both knew it was not "Donald's Dog."
The C-54/DC-4 was admitted by Douglas Aircraft to be nothing more than an enlarged and higher powered DC-3, the DC-6 was what the DC-4 would have been if there had been more time for design/development of the '4. The DC-4 was rushed into production to fill an urgent need of the time.
But. The DC-4 did use a radio operator/navigator in the third crew seat for over-water flights. And in airliner service the CAA (later FAA) required a flight engineer on four engined planes. Or maybe it was union rules.
Then when Don and the boys had the time, out popped what I consider to be the ultimate piston airliner, the DC-7.
I would have liked to see your zero-timed '-4.
Power the DC-3 with four; it's still the same, only more.
Bill.
PS: Another way to differentiate the -4 and -6 was the cabin windows. The -4, with no cabin presure had squared windows, the pressurized -6 windows were rounded. I just remembered that. wr
Bill. look at post #34. "C-54" was used to describe a Canadian operated plane, we both knew it was not "Donald's Dog."
The C-54/DC-4 was admitted by Douglas Aircraft to be nothing more than an enlarged and higher powered DC-3, the DC-6 was what the DC-4 would have been if there had been more time for design/development of the '4. The DC-4 was rushed into production to fill an urgent need of the time.
But. The DC-4 did use a radio operator/navigator in the third crew seat for over-water flights. And in airliner service the CAA (later FAA) required a flight engineer on four engined planes. Or maybe it was union rules.
Then when Don and the boys had the time, out popped what I consider to be the ultimate piston airliner, the DC-7.
I would have liked to see your zero-timed '-4.
Power the DC-3 with four; it's still the same, only more.
Bill.
PS: Another way to differentiate the -4 and -6 was the cabin windows. The -4, with no cabin presure had squared windows, the pressurized -6 windows were rounded. I just remembered that. wr
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Skyfkier:
Do you want only the ones for which I hold a type rating? All that I have legal logged time in? Or do you want me to include the ones that I have at least 10 hours bootleg? If the last the military alone would start with the A-20 (bootleg) through the YF-12 (legal).
I don't think there is any thread that hasn't gone astray once or twice, but you're right. Thanks for the reminder.
In how many twins have I lingered? Man, I'm not sufficiently fingered! (to count them all)
Bill.
Do you want only the ones for which I hold a type rating? All that I have legal logged time in? Or do you want me to include the ones that I have at least 10 hours bootleg? If the last the military alone would start with the A-20 (bootleg) through the YF-12 (legal).
I don't think there is any thread that hasn't gone astray once or twice, but you're right. Thanks for the reminder.
In how many twins have I lingered? Man, I'm not sufficiently fingered! (to count them all)
Bill.
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Multi's.....
Skyflyer.....At this moment I'm flying a "Z" 102" B-25 and am getting set up to build a DS "Connie"...then am getting some plans put together for a DC-6 (Approx) 150" W/S....by the way ...what do you have?....Bill R.....I would love to build a DC-7 but closest I've been able to locate plans is for a DC-6......by the way the Douglas was very interested in putting the Allison 501's( L-188 Electra/C-130 Herc.) in the -7, but they werent ready in time.....Bill.....
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Bill:
Re the -7 and the Allison turboprops, probably just as well the engines weren't ready. Remember the early Electras and their tendency to disintegrate in cruise flight. Think that was traced to engine mountings, but don't remember. That killed the L-188 in commercial use. Had that happened to the -7 it probably would have been a commercial failure too. The Electra was developed into the successful Orion. Just as the deHavilland Comet, another commercial failure due to midair structural failure, later corrected, is still flying as the Nimrod.
Get a 3-view of the -7 and some pictures, maybe from Bob Banka, and bash the -6 plans. They're not that far apart.
Anybody's plans you can bash, screw up too bad it'll just crash.
Bill.
Re the -7 and the Allison turboprops, probably just as well the engines weren't ready. Remember the early Electras and their tendency to disintegrate in cruise flight. Think that was traced to engine mountings, but don't remember. That killed the L-188 in commercial use. Had that happened to the -7 it probably would have been a commercial failure too. The Electra was developed into the successful Orion. Just as the deHavilland Comet, another commercial failure due to midair structural failure, later corrected, is still flying as the Nimrod.
Get a 3-view of the -7 and some pictures, maybe from Bob Banka, and bash the -6 plans. They're not that far apart.
Anybody's plans you can bash, screw up too bad it'll just crash.
Bill.
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Bill:The one I saw in Athens looked just like a C-54,trike gear & all. I will find out later what it was called for sure. I know it was trimmed in red & white.The engines were high thrust with coolers under props.Came in & out several times. so I could`t have been hung over that much! Log says it was a C-118 I flew to Thule & back, from Mc Guire in New Jersey.Civy # DC-6. I flew from S.C. to Bermuda in C-121. That was nice ! You don`t hear much about DC-5, Marines had a few. Looked like a pretty C-123. High wing twin, trike gear. I suppose some one will kick us off here, but until then we can talk . Max
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Multi's....
BMax...C-121..Was that the "Connie?".....Got to help rebuild a C-118 from the AirForce(it was immaculate,looked like some Generals ride)...into a freighter...even had "anti-skid" system on it.....You could tell a military DC-6 from commercial(one of many ways) aircraft because back then the military used Mil5606 hyd fluid when commercial DC-6's were Skydrol...Bill R........As you said the Electra wings were departing the fuselage.......... due to vibration/inflexiblity @ higher airspeeds....as I recall they were slowed down to avoid future problems..I can say they were a miserable ride in turbulence......wings were stiff.....I must add those were fun days.....I worked on all kinds of planes and got to fly many of them along the way.....With the" aviation environment" as it is now, no way will that flexibilty be around any longer...which is truly sad in a ways........Bill...
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Max:
Vague thoughts about a later York with a trike set up, one of the attempts to get commercial acceptance - didn't work. Can't even remember who built it. Think A. V. Roe (later Avro). This was when deHavilland was building the Lancastrian. Another failure. (Or was it Avro with the Lancastrian?) Merlin engines. And while we are remembering great British airliners, let's not forget Bristol and the Brabazon. But Vickers was very successful with the Viscount.
And Bill:
When I was a kid I'd ride my bike to the airport and wander the flight line, bumming local VFR rides. Probably had several hundred hours before my first official instruction, soloed with less than four hours logged.
Then our society suffered the attack of the hungry lawyers. And it has not recovered.
So long as we are digressing from the original theme of the thread, what are your nominations for professions that seem to be primarily populated by scum? I nominate lawyers.
But I have known some lawyers who were really good people so let's stay on the light side.
I was standing by a street corner with a companion when a lawyer we both knew dashed into the street, into the path of a bus which struck and killed him. "Well," I said to Bob, "That's a start." "Yep," he agreed, "But the b******s breed like flies!"
My definition of heaven, someone else paying for my B-57.
Bill.
Vague thoughts about a later York with a trike set up, one of the attempts to get commercial acceptance - didn't work. Can't even remember who built it. Think A. V. Roe (later Avro). This was when deHavilland was building the Lancastrian. Another failure. (Or was it Avro with the Lancastrian?) Merlin engines. And while we are remembering great British airliners, let's not forget Bristol and the Brabazon. But Vickers was very successful with the Viscount.
And Bill:
When I was a kid I'd ride my bike to the airport and wander the flight line, bumming local VFR rides. Probably had several hundred hours before my first official instruction, soloed with less than four hours logged.
Then our society suffered the attack of the hungry lawyers. And it has not recovered.
So long as we are digressing from the original theme of the thread, what are your nominations for professions that seem to be primarily populated by scum? I nominate lawyers.
But I have known some lawyers who were really good people so let's stay on the light side.
I was standing by a street corner with a companion when a lawyer we both knew dashed into the street, into the path of a bus which struck and killed him. "Well," I said to Bob, "That's a start." "Yep," he agreed, "But the b******s breed like flies!"
My definition of heaven, someone else paying for my B-57.
Bill.
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warbird 1,vince ,& bill : yup C-121=Connie,flew to Kinley to refuel,had chow and mean while the mission was canceled, lot of unhappy troops.I thought how many civilian jobs would fly you to Burmuda for dinner then back home ! There must be some one out there that remembers the Merlin ,C-54. It is fixed in my military mind ! It did no good to try to talk to passengers or crew as it must have taken them a day for ears to work!I think worst ship A.F. bought was C-133, they used to fly out of Dover, Del. Have you been hit by lightning in flight ? Happened to us twice. max
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Vince:
And your Bristol had Hercules sleeve valve radials, they turned backwards.
Max:
There was a prototype B-17 built with Allison V-1710 engines, but I don't remember a C-54 with V-12 engines, either Packard Merlin or Allison.
In-flight lightning strike? Did I hear someone say aluminum sponge?
Chase lightning with your twin, a new way to lose skin.
Bill.
And your Bristol had Hercules sleeve valve radials, they turned backwards.
Max:
There was a prototype B-17 built with Allison V-1710 engines, but I don't remember a C-54 with V-12 engines, either Packard Merlin or Allison.
In-flight lightning strike? Did I hear someone say aluminum sponge?
Chase lightning with your twin, a new way to lose skin.
Bill.