Seagull's "Dual Ace"
03-12-2006, 06:42 PM
#51
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RE: Seagull's "Dual Ace"
Well I ended up going with OS .46's. They were on the shelf and I did not want to wait for the TT.
Just for everyones benefit. If you choose the newer OS .46 with the remote needle valve, you have to modify the engine mounts that come with the kit. You can not put the engine 11.2 cm from the firewall if you use the OS. Since the mounts that come with the kit are quite beefy I modified the mount by taking half the surface off the part of the engine mount where the needle valve hits the mount, with a band saw. You can also relocate the needle valve or use differant engine mounts, I figured it was easier to modify the mount. I did not have a camera charged so I do not have any pictures of the mount yet.
Just for everyones benefit. If you choose the newer OS .46 with the remote needle valve, you have to modify the engine mounts that come with the kit. You can not put the engine 11.2 cm from the firewall if you use the OS. Since the mounts that come with the kit are quite beefy I modified the mount by taking half the surface off the part of the engine mount where the needle valve hits the mount, with a band saw. You can also relocate the needle valve or use differant engine mounts, I figured it was easier to modify the mount. I did not have a camera charged so I do not have any pictures of the mount yet.
03-14-2006, 01:20 PM
#52
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RE: Seagull's "Dual Ace"
The big problem with this plane is that when you set it up with standard .46's and do everything by the manual the plane is REALLY tail heavy. My solution was to build a battery tray for the nose of the plane. I just could not bring myself to rely on the 4 nose cone mounting blocks that got CA'ed in place to carry 20 ounces of lead. Yes you read correctly 20 ounces of lead. So what I will be doing is placing a larger 3300 maH Ni-MH battery in the tray and any additional weight that my be required. I am certin that I can get the required weight down to 6-8 ounces. I will post more when I know for sure.
03-14-2006, 11:48 PM
#54
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RE: Seagull's "Dual Ace"
Has anyone else had a problem getting this plane to balance?
I am not to that point yet. I have not had a chance to work on the plane since I bought the engines and I want to bench the engines really well before they go onto the plane. I suppose I am half way completed and have not had any real problems with the kit except the engine mounts and the pictures in the manual need a little description at times. I am going to put three blade props on the plane for the look. I figure it will have more than enough power. Stinks that I can not use the supplied spinners but I think it will look better with the 3-blades on it. Will probably order some polished spinners when I get a chance.
I am not to that point yet. I have not had a chance to work on the plane since I bought the engines and I want to bench the engines really well before they go onto the plane. I suppose I am half way completed and have not had any real problems with the kit except the engine mounts and the pictures in the manual need a little description at times. I am going to put three blade props on the plane for the look. I figure it will have more than enough power. Stinks that I can not use the supplied spinners but I think it will look better with the 3-blades on it. Will probably order some polished spinners when I get a chance.
03-14-2006, 11:56 PM
#55
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RE: Seagull's "Dual Ace"
Blindsides:
Du-Bro has some excellent plastic spinners for three bladed props. Tru-Turns run about $30 each for 3b spinners. Spin-Right and Dave Brown also will supply 3b spinners, but check the balance. I've seen them 'way off.
Bill.
Du-Bro has some excellent plastic spinners for three bladed props. Tru-Turns run about $30 each for 3b spinners. Spin-Right and Dave Brown also will supply 3b spinners, but check the balance. I've seen them 'way off.
Bill.
03-16-2006, 04:41 PM
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RE: Seagull's "Dual Ace"
Well I built my battery tray and put 2-1650 maH Ni-MH AA packs running in parallel thru sperate switches, I still had to add 9 3/4 ounces of weight to balance it at 85 mm back from the leading edge at the cabin, mid point in the range. But I am happy, I was able to cut the weight by more than half of what it was going to require if I left everything in the position the manual calls for. It is not the 6-8 oz. I was shooting for but if I decide to move back to the 90 mm location I will be at 7 oz. So I can live with that.
03-19-2006, 05:31 PM
#59
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RE: Seagull's "Dual Ace"
ORIGINAL: tailskid
according to another thread, the correct CG is at 95mm not the 80-90 found in the manual! That sure is good news....
according to another thread, the correct CG is at 95mm not the 80-90 found in the manual! That sure is good news....
EXACTLY!!!! The correct CG is 95 mm!! But you may still need to add a little weight to balance.
03-19-2006, 09:01 PM
#64
RE: Seagull's "Dual Ace"
You're going to move the servos in front of the spar.... not a bad idea at all. I was really suprised to see that it required any nose weight at all, I was guessing it would come in rather nose heavy as far fwd. as the engines are.
Andy
Andy
03-19-2006, 10:23 PM
#65
RE: Seagull's "Dual Ace"
tailskid: some ideas I have........
Replace your small 700Mah flight pack battery with a much larger (and heavier!) battery. You will get increased flight time and more amps for the servos in exchange for dead weight.
Replace the ultralight front wheel, with the heaviest wheel (same diameter) you can find at your lhs.
Get those "heavy hub flywheels" that fit inside the spinners. They will keep your engines idling low and smooth (at the sacrifice of slower spool up) but will help balance your plane.
All these are in exchange for "dead weight" for other weight that actually has some benefits associated with it.
-Tom
Replace your small 700Mah flight pack battery with a much larger (and heavier!) battery. You will get increased flight time and more amps for the servos in exchange for dead weight.
Replace the ultralight front wheel, with the heaviest wheel (same diameter) you can find at your lhs.
Get those "heavy hub flywheels" that fit inside the spinners. They will keep your engines idling low and smooth (at the sacrifice of slower spool up) but will help balance your plane.
All these are in exchange for "dead weight" for other weight that actually has some benefits associated with it.
-Tom
03-20-2006, 02:26 AM
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RE: Seagull's "Dual Ace"
I re-ballanced at the 95mm location (30% mark for the CG) I was able to reduce my nose weight to just the battery packs in the tray and a total of 4 1/2 oz. of lead this is a BIG change for the original 20 oz. I made my initial flights today and it flew very nice balanced at this point. This is a nice flying plane :-) I am very happy with it.
03-21-2006, 08:02 PM
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RE: Seagull's "Dual Ace"
I finished mine today. 10.5 ounces of lead with the battery in the nose of the plane. I ended up using Pro Spin polished aluminum spinners and it really set the bird off!
03-22-2006, 10:49 AM
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RE: Seagull's "Dual Ace"
Just an FYI, I also have 2 aluminum spinners on the bird, but as I said earlier on in this thread, I made a battery tray that I screwed to the nose above the nose gear and cut a hole in the nose wall for my battery leads to run through. I put 2 1650 Ni-MH AA 4 cell packs in paralle in the nose in this tray and an additional 4.5 oz of dead lead. That done my bird balanced on the great planes balancer inverted at 95mm.
03-23-2006, 08:05 PM
#71
RE: Seagull's "Dual Ace"
Ran a tank through the engines today - two new Evolution .46NT's and they not only started easily (hand fliping) but idled well and both seemed to be in sync with each other NIB! From the full throttle (11,000) feel, this bird will be overpowered! Maybe test flight Friday
03-26-2006, 03:59 PM
#72
RE: Seagull's "Dual Ace"
two test flights Saturday....both had one engine quit! First landing was excellent, the second one a bit 'rough' (too fast a rate of decent) and all three gears folded. Wing blocks split, nose pulled out the screws holding the mount 
BUT, it flew GREAT while the engines were running.
BUT, it flew GREAT while the engines were running.
03-27-2006, 09:05 AM
#73
RE: Seagull's "Dual Ace"
ORIGINAL: tailskid
two test flights Saturday....both had one engine quit! First landing was excellent, the second one a bit 'rough' (too fast a rate of decent) and all three gears folded. Wing blocks split, nose pulled out the screws holding the mount
BUT, it flew GREAT while the engines were running.
two test flights Saturday....both had one engine quit! First landing was excellent, the second one a bit 'rough' (too fast a rate of decent) and all three gears folded. Wing blocks split, nose pulled out the screws holding the mount
BUT, it flew GREAT while the engines were running.
thanks
Happy landings[sm=thumbup.gif]
G-Pete
03-27-2006, 08:48 PM
#74
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RE: Seagull's "Dual Ace"
Take a look at the Piper Cheyenne for a good "look a like". Twin turboprop, tip tanks, make sure that you do not pull up the "T" tail version. A few simple modifications and you will have a nice stand off scale. Bought one at the LHS and have been reading all of the threads, lots of good info! Plan to use O S .46AX for power.
Thanks to all for shareing your experiences. flyalot
Thanks to all for shareing your experiences. flyalot
03-27-2006, 10:34 PM
#75
RE: Seagull's "Dual Ace"
G-Pete, I think I ran out of elevator because I was on very low rates - which made flying very pleasureable. I came in 'dead stick' (killed the only live engine) a bit hot, climbed to slow it down, then decended too fast, pulled up and it didn't flair much
While flying this bird was glued to the rails! VERY smooth and at 1/2 throttle, very fast. Rolled nicely and almost axle-like.
I would put 99% of the blame on the pilot for misjudging the landing - darn wind - it quit when I was turning final - could have used some assistance slowing it down. I don't think the CG at 95 helped or hurt my cause. Next weekend I intend to test the CG and see if it is nose heavy.
Jerry
While flying this bird was glued to the rails! VERY smooth and at 1/2 throttle, very fast. Rolled nicely and almost axle-like.
I would put 99% of the blame on the pilot for misjudging the landing - darn wind - it quit when I was turning final - could have used some assistance slowing it down. I don't think the CG at 95 helped or hurt my cause. Next weekend I intend to test the CG and see if it is nose heavy.
Jerry