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  1. #151

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    RE: NEW KMP TWIN - Adam Aircraft A500


    ORIGINAL: maxiemac

    Hello Kinverflyer - in this post you showed a pic of 'magnets' to hold the A500 cowls in place.

    Could you please share some more info on how these are installed? - with pics if possible - how do you get'em and approx. cost.

    btw: your post to see your construction methods was not available - seems you have to be a 'member' to access the link posted - any way around that?

    cheers - maxiemac
    Kinverflyer - thx for reply - do you have pics of the standoffs - we don't have Maplins in Australia but I'm sure we would have similar if I could see which type of standoff you used, and is it possible to see your build thread without joining your club - thx again.

    maxiemac

  2. #152

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    RE: NEW KMP TWIN - Adam Aircraft A500

    Hi Saul and Hal - and to any other Adam A500 builders - I've now 'really' discovered how crap the wood and undercarriage installation is. On a previous post I didn't think much needed to be done to the u/c but I now know it needs attention. It is my belief that after many many landings (or curse it - one that ended up sideways like I did) there is potential for this area to fail. Maybe I should be more thankful to discover what I have found so far with as little damage as there is.

    G.. only knows what the rest of the inaccessible areas are like. Having said that I recall no wood behind a rudder hinge point and only 'half' wood behind a wing mounting bolt??? This thing (as I suspect most ARF's) are built to a price - not a formula. (enough of the 'editorial')

    From the pics below you will see: 1st pic - crack across the join of the LH u/c platform to the front former - this is now loose and will have to replaced/strengthened. Other pics show the gaps between the wood and fibreglass 'inside' the rear former. I've stood the rear former back in postion for the photo for you to see what I'm talking about. The wood was not shaped to fit flush to the inside of the tail boom, therefore the glue line you see from the rear looks ok (not inside like I'm now seeing). On the inside only the rounded top is glued (sort of) to the boom, not the vertical sides of the rear u/c former.

    Another pic shows how the tongue fits into the front former and you will see the weak area at the corners. The triangular piece of balsa that supports these corners broke free so it seems to me this area also was not very strong. There was very little glue that was effective - or maybe it was ineffective glue?

    It looks to me all the u/c platform areas should be strengthened. I will now make new right and left u/c platforms and 'break' out the LH u/c platform to replace it. Next will be to fibreglass each rear former in place, 'glass the entire inside area' and try and glass as much as I can where the tongue goes into the front former and along each horizontal side to the inside of each tailplane boom when I replace each u/c platform. And I haven't looked at the front u/c leg platform yet.

    Why is all of this important? as I understand it only about 50 or so of this model were made for a worldwide market and if a model gets badly broken because of undercarriage support failure (notwithstanding the crap u/c supplied with the kit) there aint no more.

    deal with the above info as you wish

    cheers - maxiemac smile it don't hurt

    PS: good to see all the recent activity on this thread. Maybe a few more might like to have a say - then we'll all learn more?
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  3. #153

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    RE: NEW KMP TWIN - Adam Aircraft A500

    Enzo65 - your video was good and showed some of the Adam A500 flying characteristics very well - bravo - what engines did you use? and how did you mount them?

    What mufflers did you use and how did you route the 'Pitts" style mufflers out of each cowl and how did you fix your engine cowls to the fuselage - do have any other construction photos to share with us other Adam A500 builders?

    What setups were you doing with the laptop pc? - I can see from some of your photos a lot of work went into making this a/c ready to fly. Any advice would be welcome.

    cheers - maxiemac

  4. #154

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    RE: NEW KMP TWIN - Adam Aircraft A500

    Hey Saul, Hal & Kinverflyer - I've just done the research and there has only been three of us contributing to this thread since April 09 and before that not a lot, we have now been joined by enzo65 from Italy with his good video.

    Not a lot of resource to rely on - it's just you an' me babe. Doesn't mean no one else hasn't looked in - but nothing has been said?

    cheers - maxiemac smile it don't hurt

  5. #155
    Radical Departure's Avatar
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    RE: NEW KMP TWIN - Adam Aircraft A500

    Saul - It has been danged near impossible for me to get anything uploaded to rcu or youtube this morning. Don't know what the deal is but got tired of messing with it, though I want to use more colorful language to describe my sentiments, I'll bite my lip. That said, I set up a gallery on my domain, you can see the pics here.. A500 Gallery. No comments but you can deduce what you're looking at easily enough. Also put a short video on there which might give a bit more information. Hope this helps!

    Maxiemac - Nice wood eh!!! [:@] Going to do some work in that as well once I get to that part of the build. You know.. easily 60% of the time I've spent on this plane is fixing shoddy construction, maybe one of these days I can actually start building! And part of my problem is I'm trying to be too perfect with a kit thats filled with imperfections. If this is any indication of the thought that goes into KMP, this is likely my last KMP kit. Simply do not have the time or will to repair/rebuild kits as this one.

    You're right about not many being out there. As previously mentioned, in my email exchange with Andrew of KMP, there were only 48 made. 24 for the US and 24 for all other countries. Counting the prototype, Model Airplane review, the 3 folks on here, I suspect there are less than 10 of these planes flying. KMP has/had 9 kits left. Likely the ones Hobby Lobby are now selling. Figure a number still sitting in boxes, and I suspect there are a few that bought it, but are unable to build it so its sitting in a closet or such. All said, its not your average RC kit. The fact that anyone has got one flying when all is considered is kind of amazing in itself. Is there any 500 out there that has 10 or flights on it? My personal opinion, this is not a plane to fly every weekend, it'll fall apart. I doubt I'll put more than 10 flights on mine when completed, take it out few times a year for fun fly or such. As you said, when or if it really breaks, its done because you're not going to find replacement parts.

    Enough of my ranting.. gotta get back to work..
    Radical Departure..
    ..from controlled flight

  6. #156

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    RE: NEW KMP TWIN - Adam Aircraft A500

    Radical,

    Thank you. Those pics are VERY VERY helpful!

    Saul

  7. #157

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    RE: NEW KMP TWIN - Adam Aircraft A500

    I can up load any photos here if you wish.
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  8. #158
    Radical Departure's Avatar
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    RE: NEW KMP TWIN - Adam Aircraft A500

    Very nice work on the cowls! Have you had it in the air yet?
    Radical Departure..
    ..from controlled flight

  9. #159

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    RE: NEW KMP TWIN - Adam Aircraft A500

    I have one almost ready to maiden.

    It has 2 Magnum 160 twins in it and I fitted it with brakes to shorten run on after landing.

    I'm busy baffling the cowlings especially the rear motor as I know from past experience with the Cessna 337 the rear motor is very prone to over-heating. Also strengthening the landing gear plates as per my Tigercat which has proven trouble free in this area as opposed to its original state of weakness.
    Jet Central Turbines

  10. #160
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    RE: NEW KMP TWIN - Adam Aircraft A500

    Thank all for beatiful compliment !!!!

    This is ONLT the first flight......the A500 flight very well its have the same difficulty of scale model, bat if you know the scale plane you dont have problems to pilot.............


    for maxiemac :

    1) I use Slimline muffler for OS 90 surpass 4t I think this engine is better for this plane .. if you see the photo only 2 small hole for muffler like original plane see picture 2)engine with pump I dont have problem of tank position I put it in the position like kit 3) dont cut the cowl like "kinverflyer" its important for real scale model 4) the OS 4T no much vibration "the saito too much" 5) I fix the cowl with normal screw like kit, 6) I use pc laptop because I use weatronic Dual Receiver [link]http://www.weatronic-usa.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=14&Itemid=30[/link]

    note with 2 OS 91 Surpass with Rapicon fuel 15% I test and my plane pull 9 Kg

    Regards Enzo

    www.enzoriccio.it

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    Enzo Riccio
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  11. #161
    Radical Departure's Avatar
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    RE: NEW KMP TWIN - Adam Aircraft A500

    Another 500 flyer!! Welcome to the show Buckaroo! As you can see about 1/2 of the bunch have it flying and the rest of us are still building. Any pics or comments regarding your build would certainly be appreciated.

    Saul - Glad to help. Tricky parts so far was getting a good solid replacement door made, and getting a precise cut/trim on the new opening.

    Bit disappointing last night, weather good for painting so thought I would throw some on the ail. and flaps. Was planning on using duplicolor professional gloss white for the finish. Previously tried it on the wings and it was pretty 'clear' meaning it wasn't coating the grey primer areas very well. It uses a fan type nozzle, which seemed to waste paint, so got some dupicolor basic white and changed the nozzle last night. Not happy with the result. Could direct it better, but still way 'thin'. So need to back up and rethink my painting strategy. Kind of hacked me off because its supposed to be excellent paint for this type stuff. After searching 'net high and low for it, (everyone sold out of it, its the professional series, not standard duplicolor), found a company that had 8 cans so got all 8. Dang it.... so spent evening working on access door area of fuse, getting that trimmed and ready to fit the door to. I won't actually install it until near the build end because it'll just be in the way. Tonight I may work on getting the pushrod setup ready for the rudders, am pretty sure it can be done, have a way figured to drill a guide hole through the necessary formers without cutting into the boom. Just need to setup and try it. Will take some pics if get chance to work on it.
    Radical Departure..
    ..from controlled flight

  12. #162
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    RE: NEW KMP TWIN - Adam Aircraft A500

    enzo65,
    Very sweet setup!! I like the way you mounted radio gear and connections on the center section. Very interesting! Are you using the included retracts? Noticed you are using 2 air bottles. My kit came with 2, but instructions only show installing one. How do you have the second one tied in? And thats one hell of a receiver! I had never heard of them until now. Will have to check that a bit further. 9g's??? wow... wouldn't have thought that! Did you do any build up or reinforcing of certain areas, or build straight by the manual? A few of us are having to spend time strengthing wood and so forth, curious if you had done any of that on your plane. Also noticed.. looks like you're using pushrods on the rudder setup? How did that go with installing them? If not pushrods, how are they setup? It doesn't look pull-pull... anyway.. Great job!!!
    Radical Departure..
    ..from controlled flight

  13. #163
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    RE: NEW KMP TWIN - Adam Aircraft A500

    Radical Departure..

    thanks ....yes very hard work.....I use two bottle of air one for retract and one for air brake see the picture ...next time I change the air bottle to retract with one too big ........I use the original retract how you see ......for rudder push road I chnge I dont like on this scale plane push pull to rudder I have change with shaft to plywood is perfect no flutter and its light...if you use two servos on rudder is heavy to tail is no good for this plane []


    Enzo

    www.enzoriccio.it
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    [link]http://www.kmp.ca[/link]

  14. #164

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    RE: NEW KMP TWIN - Adam Aircraft A500

    How did yours balance in the end? Any weight needed?

  15. #165
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    RE: NEW KMP TWIN - Adam Aircraft A500

    Wow... am I feeling a bit ripped off?? enzo65, your landing gear is much different than what some of us got. Not seen a set like that on the kits I've seen so far. That set looks much stronger. Anyone else get a set like that?
    Radical Departure..
    ..from controlled flight

  16. #166
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    RE: NEW KMP TWIN - Adam Aircraft A500

    kinverflyer

    my A500 weigh is 9750 gr. and I put 400 gr in front ........bat is normal for this type of models ......the same weigh when I built the Cessna 337 Skymater to KMP ......

    Enzo
    www.enzoriccio.it
    Enzo Riccio
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  17. #167
    enzo65's Avatar
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    RE: NEW KMP TWIN - Adam Aircraft A500

    Radical Departure I change only wheel for install the brake bat the gear is standard...........I think

    Enzo
    www.enzoriccio.it

    Enzo Riccio
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  18. #168

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    RE: NEW KMP TWIN - Adam Aircraft A500

    Rad...D... I fixed the u/c platform and now know it's not quite the beasty I thought it was. The front end of the platform connects into two square holes with a piece of hardwood triangle stock for added support. Great in theory but in practice the glue came adrift through that violent sideways force (as said before lucky for me little damage happened). The rear end sits on those alum. brackets and bolts to them whilst the rear former is glued all round inside the boom. The wood fit to f/g was not great but adequate. I can now be thankful for this design as it turned out to be very easy to repair. I'm pretty sure when this part is assembled its all bolted together then glued into postion. The fact my rear former had broken away made it a lot easier to replace the part, reassemble and re-instal.....Weatronics receivers are used a lot by the jet guys over here.

    Mine has had about 22 flights since August last year from when it was heavy model inspected. It spent many periods laid up as I did other things, but tomorrow I'm off for a 500 mile drive to the next state (South Australia) to attend a scale competition where I am entering my Adam A500. This is a two day event and all being well I hope to rack up a lot more flights - I'll let you know how it went.

    And isn't Enzo65's installation brilliant - I'll bet lots of lire went into that setup. Just on the air system - notice how Enzo has used Festo fittings for his air lines - can't emphasise enough how important it is to use good quality air lines and fittings - there was no insides in my supplied air fill valve so I replaced it with a Festo fill/check valve fitting. The black air lines and plastic tees supplied in my kit were a joke. I've used the supplied air tank and it works fine for 6-8 retract/extend cycles, I've even assembled the plane, forgot to pump up the air after about 2 weeks and the gear worked - ok a bit slow but worked - I won't do that again. And lastly, like you, the oleos that Enzo has were certainly not in my kit and I didn't get 2 air tanks. I haven't needed brakes because with full flap and the right speed this thing flairs beautifully - but then again Enzo was flying off hard surface not grass.

    For Buckaroo (welcome) two 160's - that'll go ballistic - my engine cooling experience so far is, I have had to do nothing with the rear engine because those two big ducts seem to work fine. On the front cowl I cut extra slots next to the round opening with my dremel to aid cooling (inside the blue paint line so it's not as noticable). So far no burnt residue or hi-temp smells have been found. I use 18% oil, 14% Cool Power Synthetic and 4% castor oil to help carry the heat out.. Just an idea for those using IC engines - keep an eye on how much exhaust goes into the front retract wheel well - very easy for it get into the woodwork. I fitted a plastic screen around my front retract so no exhaust or dirt/mud from the front wheel gets inside the a/c.

    For Enzo - I take your point on servos at the rudders - I had not thought about what the effect was going to be, until after they were fitted. I looked at ways of fitting push rods but couldn't get the angle to the rudder with the right geometry, but I can now see on your a/c it can be done - I'll remember that next time. What is the part number or model number of your OS mufflers please.

    - gee this thread is getting addictive.

    cheers - maxiemac - smile it don't hurt

  19. #169
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    RE: NEW KMP TWIN - Adam Aircraft A500

    Good to know those type of repairs can be carried out successfully. And with 22 flights on it, guess it'll take more than I thought it would. The air line in my kit is blue.. every kit must be different! I'm going to check out the Fesco gear, like the looks of that. All in all a sweet setup Enzo has there.

    I'm leaning toward AR9100 w/ smartfly eq 3d to gang the flaps, smartfly eq II to gang the rudders. 80amp ESC w/BEC on both motors. Sync them up via JR 9303, should be a piece of cake. Didn't get much done last night, had to work late, spent just a bit of time getting a final trim on the access door. Have to attend an event this evening so it'll likely be saturday before I get back on it. Me and another fella building a rock buggy for a local 4x4 event end of this month, be working on that friday night. Need to win the lotto so I can stay home and work on my projects!
    Radical Departure..
    ..from controlled flight

  20. #170
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    RE: NEW KMP TWIN - Adam Aircraft A500

    Hello ,

    ok I know not need to brake on grass bat I flying in many events where no grass bat small asphalt runnway and is possible I need the brake, and I like in take off ....and when parking ......in many model show iwhre I partecipate is very important dont touch the plane with hands......bat simulate the running to real plane.
    You have right !!!! to many hard install the puchrod for rudder bat is possible .....
    This is the link for os muffler I use [link]http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXFH02&P=7[/link]
    Right the festo is the better for air control.....I need big air tank because I dont use mechanical valve to kit bat elettronic valve Jet-Tronics for retract and brake........[link]http://www.jet-tronics.de/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=47&Itemid=57[/link] and this valve for slowing open gear use many air.........


    ciao Enzo

    www.enzoriccio.it




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  21. #171

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    RE: NEW KMP TWIN - Adam Aircraft A500

    Many thanks for the information, finished weight are about the same.

  22. #172

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    RE: NEW KMP TWIN - Adam Aircraft A500

    Thanks guys for the welcome.

    RD my gear seems the same as enzo.

    Thnks Maxiemac for the tips- to fit the twins without cutting the cowls I had to rotate them slightly from horizontal so they dont lie exactly behind the intakes so a baffle system will help.

    I fitted brakes for the same reason as enzo - my KMP cessna 337 runs on forever on hard runways and I assume the A500 will do the same - also as enzo also says.
    to run up the engines before take-off will be awesome especially 2 twin cylinders.
    Will be watching this thread with interest.
    Jet Central Turbines

  23. #173

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    RE: NEW KMP TWIN - Adam Aircraft A500

    Hi all - per my post #166 - Had six good flights over the weekend, three on Saturday as general flying, one 'heart starter' Sunday morning followed by two competition flights. Haven't yet seen the scores as I left just after 2pm for the 500 mile drive home - but I did hear that our state won the comp.

    Now up to about 28 flights the last one giving me a 'heart flutter' as on rotation I heard a big bang from the model which I initially thought was a backfire (but at 8-9000 rpm I don't think four strokes backfire - do they?) anyway the engines kept going and I completed my round and landed safely. Upon taxiing back I noticed the rear engine wobbling around and I thought uh oh got a broken engine mount, that might have been the bang. Stopped the engines to find one half of one blade on the rear prop was missing.

    Don't know how, unless maybe the prop got a nick in it that I didn't see - prop can't touch the ground as there is plenty of clearance with the model tipped right back on its booms - only damage was one engine mount bolt unscrewed from the rear firewall, one other loose mount bolt and four loose engine to plastic engine mount bolts - caused by the vibration - all in all just another 'experience'- glad I used nyloc nuts and not the supplied standard nuts with washers - engine would definately have thrown itself thru the cowl - pics below show prop and mount plus a long distance shot at the field, doesn't show many of the models as most are way up the other end.

    cheers - maxiemac
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  24. #174

    Join Date
    Feb 2004
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    RE: NEW KMP TWIN - Adam Aircraft A500

    Thank goodness those engines are inline!!

    Saul

  25. #175

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
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    DURBAN, SOUTH AFRICA
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    RE: NEW KMP TWIN - Adam Aircraft A500

    Most likely a stone or something picked up by the front engine - I find nicks and damage often on pusher props - seems like they suck a lot of stuff up off the ground.
    Jet Central Turbines


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