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  1. #201
    Fili's Avatar
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    RE: OV-10 Bronco 81"

    Thank you Carlos Murphy, Yes it does help!
    Now for the nose. I was looking at the photos in Flyalan's post, wow! can't wait to do my panel lines, what a great collection of Bronco pics. Anyhoo, I found a few pics with the elongated nose and the MGs on the sponsoons. I see several version of the long nose. Can you tell me what the attachments are under that long nose? There were at least two different versions that I found. Any info would be greatly appreciated. Did they have FLIR then?
    Thanks!
    Phil
    CORSAIR Brotherhood #20

    Gimme a vector Victor....

  2. #202

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    RE: OV-10 Bronco 81"

    Glad to hear that my page and especially the drawings are of help. Have found a few photos buried in my shop that I yet to post. Nothing special but will post them soon.

    My OV-10 is coming along slowly. Too many parental duties that come first.

    I have started covering the nacells and horizontal stab with olive drab solartex. Looks pretty good and is easy to work with. Will be painting the undersides with white latex and coating the whole thing with Nelson's clear once the panel lines and nomenclature are done. Still working on gear doors. Found some good carbon fiber/fiberglass composit sheets to use for doors. Nice and stiff. Have the updated mains from Century Jet. They look much more scale than the originals. Cowls and wingtips are primed and wil again be painted with matching Olive Drab latex coated with Nelson's.

    Working on getting the Supertiger 75's bench ran. Using onboard glow, Graupner 3-blade props and slimline exhaust. Only had to trim just a little of the cowl to get the muffler in. Not much room left in the cowl using the Supertigers.

    Will post more pics eventually.

    Cheers
    Alan

  3. #203
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    RE: OV-10 Bronco 81"

    ORIGINAL: Fili:Gentleman, I elected to make the nose elongated as per the photo above from Scaleaero-RCU (to be different as well as for ease of balancing). But I have a question...... With the bellygun mounted on that version, there are no sponsons. Mr.Scaleaero-RCU, you said one of the NOG versions had MGs mounted on the sponsons. Did that version have the elongated nose, and please pardon my ignorance, what is the hardware under the nose?
    Sorry I have not followed back up with this thread. The "hardware" under the nose on my OV-10D+NOS NOGs is a laser target acquisition unit named FLIR for infrared radar. It has a laser marker which can be used for highlighting a target for smart artillary shells to see and follow as well as smart weapons like guided missles. The infrared unit also permits seeing in the dark with high resolution. The first of these was manufactured by Texas Instruments and was wedge shaped instead of domed as is seen on 155395. That was on 155396 in Nam for a proof of concept tour with the rastering mobile 20mm cannon under the belly without a domed cover.

    The D or long nose version was created from the A/B model with an extended nose to accomodate the FLIR unit's turret and servo motors.
    Ed Clayman,
    FliteMetal.com

  4. #204
    Fili's Avatar
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    RE: OV-10 Bronco 81"

    I do thank you for the info! I had a idea it might be FLIR but wasnt sure. Thanks again!
    Phil
    CORSAIR Brotherhood #20

    Gimme a vector Victor....

  5. #205

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    RE: OV-10 Bronco 81"

    ORIGINAL: ScaleAero-RCU

    Hi Trent:

    While I don't intend to sound as if bashing is at hand...I agree that Dan's architectural engineering tends to go a wee bit too far sometimes...while when I viewed other plans of his...things looked better than my impression of the OV-10.

    There are a few specific concerns...the two piece (front to rear) sectioning of the tail booms with nylon bolts. While anyone who has ever seen an OV-10 fly would know they yaw an awfully lot when they reach ground effect... it is going to catch most pilots by surprise at the last moment...unless they land it hot. With this yaw is going to come a pretty severe side load as the plane initially touches down and more or less yanks in the direction of the wheel initially touching. The resulting pull in the opposite direction creates a whipping action for the booms, horiz stab and all joints past the wing.

    1. Making the boom a single piece and gusseting the joints between the formers and attachment points with small balsa triangles will serve to strengthen it back there.

    2. Converting the wing into a three piece by clipping outside the nacelles will prove to unitize everything.

    3. The same yawing motion described earlier will work against the nose retract mounting location as well. The nose will get caught in the middle of that initial mains whipping action. To counter this you can create an elongated "z" doubler which will run from where it serves to strengthen the nose retract mounting...then runs back along the cockpit sides, then up just behind the observer/weapons officer's rear seat to a rib shaped piece in the wing's center section locked to the spar(s). This need be no more than lite ply laminated to the balsa along sides of the cockpit from the retract mount in front to becoming a doubler in the wing. Having built a prototype for my 1/6th OV-10D NOS-NOGs it became obvious this doubler would serve Dan's design even more because of its light weight design. At 1/6th the all up is targeted at 26# with a pair of Saito 120DP's.

    4. As for people who've built Dan's. Gregg Hahn flew one in team scale built by someone in Ohio back about five years ago. I believe it had MDS 108's and was an absolute rocket...far from prototypical speed and maneuvers that took a ton of sky instead of the tight pattern the OV-10 was designed to provide. The fastest the full scale is capable of flying outside of a dive was 287 mph and that was the D+ with Garretts.
    1-3) I paid a premium price for plans - if'n I wanted to engineer the darn things, I'd have drawn 'em myself.
    4) I bought the plans when Palmer 1st advertised them. After I received them, I called him with questions and was told by him that no one had built a completed model from his plans as yet. Further research revealed that the canopy was nowhere near production at that time.

    His plans for the OV-10 are beautiful. I almost kept them and framed them - but I really wanted to frame a model instead. Sat down at my computer with Rich's plans and a set from someone else (1960s) and fired up my CAD program. My wife came along and said
    "Hey, why don't you draw us a new house" - and now we've been IN that house 2 1/2 years! Where does the time go? As I remember, you were working on that Bronco then, too........
    Trent Combs
    Fly \'em until the last piece stops!

  6. #206
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    RE: OV-10 Bronco 81"

    Hi Trent:

    Yeah, I was lucky in that I met someone in Kingwood, TX with a set of those plans and over three hundred walkaround photos of the DEA's D+SLEP airframes that were in Conroe, TX for many years while they played the role currently performed by Cobra, Blackhawk, and some meaner airframes off shore every night. That saved me a lot of wasted time IMHO. I actually drew my own utilizing large format copiers and five multi-views to mean out all the artist creativity when compared to photos of the specific airframe I am replicating 155395. I spent five years pulling together documentation on 155395 before beginning construction on what eventually Twinman bought from a local I used to do team scale with. The team kinda sorta decided things needed to be precise and not kinda sorta precise...

    We've all been there, done that and have the tee shirt.

    Anyway, satisfied with the Z doubler I designed into mine was a good thing, I set out to redesign and begin construction on my own. The doubler provides a unitizing of the front end to offset the yaw that all Broncos suffer from via design. The doubler runs from the nose retract along the side then up behind the observer station and incorporated into the wing airfoil sandwiched into the spars. Broncos tend to float across axis when they encounter ground effect...even the full size. While the full size's legs absorb the negative effects of this, models of significant weight can't for long.

    I was fortunate in my documentation search over a five year period. Thanks to the USMC, retirees from Yuma Station, Cherry Point station, OV-10 Assn., FAC Assn., USAF Assn., North American docettes, NA retirees in Columbus, Ohio, proof of concept tour crew which took 155395-155396-155360 to Nam for real world testing of the M-197 and target acquisitioning system and the TI early FLIR unit which didn't raster. It was the Nam tour crews that made it all possible when it came down to docs for 155395. These guys are great and their international assn and museum served as a resource during my visits to reunions of pilots, maintenance and weapons specialists.

    My OV-10D NOGs NOS project is now awaiting completion of legs which I have been trying to resolve for the last three years without success. I'm currently working on creating a scale gear assembly kit that people can assemble from tubing, springs and a retract head of their choice utilizing a set of mains knuckles, a head yoke and the trailing arm tube with the correct attachment tang for the compression strut. The nose strut is a completed component which attaches to your choice of retract head with 105 degree swing. I just got tired of seeing what I'll refer to as monster knuckles being turned by people...some of whom were turning parts without so much as a line drawing of the scale struts. No, I'm not going into the retract business There are enough almost in it today. I actually stumbled into a CNC specialist in another project whom just might be the 1/6th scale or 1/5th scale Bronco builder's new best friend.

    Will return to my horse after finishing a B-25 and B-24 in el'natural finish...if you know what I mean Good to hear from you after all these years... I assume you know Todd Burley as Bakersfield isn't that large.
    Ed Clayman,
    FliteMetal.com

  7. #207

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    RE: OV-10 Bronco 81"

    Bronco fans, here is a snapshot of my test pilot Harry Hotschtick right after his successfull test
    flight of his Bronco with brand new wing installed. Harry likes the wing. The new wing is sans flaps and lighter than the previous one that met its demise after a close encounter with a large pine tree right after an engine out deal. All I can say is the Uravitch 81" Bronco is a big hit at our flying field down in Naples,Fl. I can hardly get the big grin off my face after a few low passes. I'll pass on all the details of the Bronc if anyone is interested. DWR.
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  8. #208
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    RE: OV-10 Bronco 81"

    Do show and Tell LOTS MORE PICS>>>>DID YOU BUILD IT OR Bash the ARF...ANy Comments good or bad are needed....WHat should one Change etc....GIve us all the STORY...
    R/C WARBIRDS / RC TANKS ENTHUSIAST
    VQ WARBIRDS, KMP, & RCV

  9. #209

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    RE: OV-10 Bronco 81"

    I built the Bronco from the short kit and plans. Built it originally with flaps and added extra lumber in the wing which I really didnt need. I sheeted the entire wing and that stiffened it up a bunch. I also added some stiffening in the verticle fins. I shot myself in the foot there also
    due to the aft CG shift. It ended up at 19.75 lbs dry. I used two OS .50SX engines. It flew OK but used up lots of runway. After an engine out crash caused by a faulty fuel pick up I decided to reduce the weight when I replaced the damaged wing by omitting the flaps. I had found the Bronco landed fine without them even at the heavier weight. Now the Bronco is
    18lbs dry and it flys great. Dont know why I got duplicate image of first pic. Third pic was taken after decals added. DWR.
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  10. #210

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    RE: OV-10 Bronco 81"

    Well my Bronco is still coming along. Took a couple of pics of the gear doors. Went with full length doors made out of a composite sheet. Tried using ply and balsa but the doors are 11" long and flexed a whole lot. The composite doors don't flex at all.
    Also added a front view with the painted cowl and one nacelle covered with solartex. Used latex on the cowl and will be coating the whole plane with Nelson's flat clear once everything is finished.

    See my page at:
    Alan's Bronco Pics

    The newest pics are on page 5.

  11. #211
    Fili's Avatar
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    RE: OV-10 Bronco 81"

    Finally got her covered and painted. Need to seal her up and run some plumbing and wires. Got cheap with the retracts and I'm not very happy. I think I 'll have to sell the dog or the kids, But I gotta do something. OS .91's, should have enough get up and go (grass field) Need to finish the FLIR in the nose. I figure I"ll incorporate the needed weight to balance her in that assy.
    Just got 6+ inches of snow, spring fever is starting to catch up, I'm getting excited about the maiden flight. These photos are form our annual Mall show.
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    Phil
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    Gimme a vector Victor....

  12. #212

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    RE: OV-10 Bronco 81"

    Looks GREAT, what you gona do for pilots? The gear DOSE look kinda wimpy for that size plane. Mine has fixed gear, bought it that way, yuck.

  13. #213
    Fili's Avatar
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    RE: OV-10 Bronco 81"

    As of now, no pilots....unless of course I find something I like. The retracts are the spring air. I should've save a few more clams and shopped......oh well..still more building season left.
    Phil
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  14. #214
    Fili's Avatar
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    RE: OV-10 Bronco 81"

    Hey, I read in a much earlier post about reinforcing the fins as some have expreienced them snapping off in flight (the Uravitch design). What has anyone out there in rcuniverse land done to about this and have you flown yours yet? Just getting a little concerened as maiden flight nears.....
    Phil
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  15. #215
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    RE: OV-10 Bronco 81"

    Interesting how these things get started. Perhaps the issue is one of the builder not following the instructions...

    The attachment beneath the stab is attached on both sides to the vertical fin. If anyone were the least bit concerned a single layer of carbon fiber-mat will provide all the strength anyone could ask for without altering the original plans and instructions for the stab. This is one of those how and not how-much issues. You could use fiber glass however it will result in a thicker than required method.

    I might add that Rich has stated that no one has ever approached him about this. This thread is somewhere around three or so years old at this point.

    Building a scale vertical fin and horizontal stab will serve to make it more resistant to hangar rash and issues with damage on the ground...
    Ed Clayman,
    FliteMetal.com

  16. #216
    Fili's Avatar
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    RE: OV-10 Bronco 81"

    What instructions?
    I built from the plans. The plan drawings have only the trailing edge of the fin completely throught the nacelle, the leading edge, per the drawing, ends at the top, not completely or even partially through, attached to the top sheeting (not good, in my opinion). When I read about fins ripping of in flight, and looking at the drawings, I could see how that could happen. I reinforced the area as best I could, and will cross my fingers during the maiden flight.
    I very well might take your advice on the carbon fiber strips for added peice of mind.
    There were many other issues in these plans that I, after careful inspection, modified to ensure failsafe operation, but I wished I had been warned beforehand re the fin installation.

    I beleive I read about reinforcing the fins in this thread.
    Phil
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    Gimme a vector Victor....

  17. #217
    Fili's Avatar
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    RE: Caution


    ORIGINAL: nemesis4u

    ACHTUNG!!! Caution!!!! I remembered that you'd better reinforce the horizontal stab/elevator mounts as 3 seperate people had elevators fly off in flight.... Just a warning..

    I knew I recalled something regarding the tail section.
    Phil
    CORSAIR Brotherhood #20

    Gimme a vector Victor....

  18. #218
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    RE: OV-10 Bronco 81"

    Use carbon fiber mat...not the hard strips. The mat will soak up CA like a sponge or resin for that matter. It can be virtually invisible when it is squeeged down flat with a playing card or pressed down with a piece of Siran Wrap.
    Ed Clayman,
    FliteMetal.com

  19. #219
    Fili's Avatar
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    RE: OV-10 Bronco 81"

    Thank You Sir
    Phil
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    Gimme a vector Victor....

  20. #220

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    RE: OV-10 Bronco 81"

    I know of one OV-10 where the horizontal stabiliser broke off in flight. I saw the aircraft a few flights before it happened and there was some flexing of both booms where they fixed to the wing. This would have consequently caused flexing around the horizontal stabiliser mounting, with the potential for a fatique failure at that point. The pilot was going to build another, he loved the aircraft, but ensure that the boom to wing mount is better and to modify the horizontal stab mounting to allow for a little flex in flight.

    Hope this is useful.

    Sarah

  21. #221

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    RE: OV-10 Bronco 81"

    FLYALAN,

    Just read your comments about operating gear doors on your Bronco. I have a Bronco in the planning stage. I build a P-61 Black Widow from Don Smith plans with functional gear doors. One air cylinder per set of doors is connected to a shaft running cross wise above the gear and doors. I used three nose gear steering arms per shaft. Two arms connected to each door, the other to the cylinder. I used a swithch from Bob Violet to close the doors after the strut hit it. Since the door cylinders are smaller, they fill before the gear cylinders on the "gear down" side. The switch is connected to the "gear up" side to close the doors.

    Hope this helps. I plan the same setup on the Bronco.

    TStick

  22. #222

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    RE: OV-10 Bronco 81"

    [size=3]TStick,

    I worked that out. Went with 1 cylinder per door (2 per gear) and hooked them up to another robart valve. Using a sequencer to activate the gear valve and door valve in the proper order. Thought about doing something like you mentioned but figured I would have to run air lines out to each nacelle for the door cylinders anyway so I went with this method. Only additional cost was the additional cylinders.

    cheers,

    Alan

  23. #223
    nemesis4u's Avatar
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    RE: OV-10 Bronco 81"

    Alan,,,,How is TopGun....Or how was it...Called your home for advice on the OV-10 and the Mrs..said you were at TopGun...
    How is the OV-10..and new News??????????
    anyone else have anything to report?
    I sold my plans and parts and finally ordered the ARF 81" OV-10///SHould be here Monday...I WILL Post Pictures of it...and give everyone a good review...
    R/C WARBIRDS / RC TANKS ENTHUSIAST
    VQ WARBIRDS, KMP, & RCV

  24. #224
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    RE: OV-10 Bronco 81"

    There will be photos posted within ScaleAero's Top Gun 05 and within the Flite-Metal special focus on Top Gun 05 section beginning on Friday. I'll see Alan and Rod on Friday morning. We're in New Orleans tonight in route to Top Gun. Will arrive in Lakeland tomorrow about noon.
    Ed Clayman,
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  25. #225
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    RE: OV-10 Bronco 81"

    Mine is ready for the maiden flight. Finished balancing her last weekend. Sunday was going to be the day, but the wx did not cooperate. Rain predicted for this sat, maybe sunday. I'll file a full report.
    Phil
    CORSAIR Brotherhood #20

    Gimme a vector Victor....


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