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-   -   Seagull's "Dual Ace" (https://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/twin-multi-engine-rc-aircraft-192/3664845-seagulls-%22dual-ace%22.html)

cymaz 09-13-2013 05:11 AM

sorry double posted

cymaz 09-13-2013 05:24 AM

Pyro pete
Two powerful motors on a twin is going to be a real handful if one goes out. You won't hear it and you wont know which one if some distance off until you see it spin in. See video below from 8mins 10 sec. The engines sounded ok then port motor stops spinning the plane to port. The greater the power the more violent the spin. If you know which one has gone you have to have a plan, stick to it and lightening quick reactions. This poor guy didn't have a chance.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-hUiDMcCEQs

If you can get some stick time on a simulator twin and program it to cut a random engine. I'm not trying to put you off- it's just how it is. I was flying a club mates twin when the port engine stopped.Reduce engine power , rudder to live engine, use elevator and rudder GENTLY and hardly ever use aileron. Get it in gently and on finals I cut the remaining engine and dead stick it in. The great chance again is spinning it in as you slow to land.

cymaz 09-13-2013 05:33 AM

Pyro Pete
Same again...:mad:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bBDLP4onEuY Its good to watch as you now know how the plane will act

Pyropetepete 09-13-2013 09:38 AM


Originally Posted by cymaz (Post 11614619)
If you have a flight sim I would suggest you get some time on a twin and practice single engine flying if you can. Last week I was flying a club mates twin. Down wind turn the thing suddenly dropped a wing-one engine gone. There is no time to think and your reactions have to be almost automatic.

3" spinners on my D.A. - Just fine.

I fly mine on a pair of Irvine 40's and can easily cruise around on 1/3 throttle. I hope you will run the lights on a separate battery source. If you run a separate channel on each engine it makes setting idle so much easier. I did this with my Futaba 9 cap. Great if you have spare channels- post 1086.

Also take a look at my D.A on post 1060

I have a flight sim and flu all my current fleet on there. I also do as much as I can at the field. I have been playing with a twin in the sim and will keep doing so, thanks for the advice. Have been advised at the field about twins, one bit of advice was fly it high, if it goes you might have that extra time, might. 3'' is sweet, thank you. Yes nav lights will be on there own, I don't like mixing. Servos for motors will all be on there own as well. Will try and find your posts...


Originally Posted by redball8 (Post 11614758)
Might want to rethink the three-bladed props. I use them on my Dual Ace and they perform just fine. They're needed be cause of ground clearance; otherwise I cut a lot of grass on the taxi out to the runway!

Also had planned to put tuned pipes on my ST40's, but deferred. Reliability of either engine in a twin is very important, and I felt the pipes might increase the likelihood of losing one engine, or one up on the pipe and the other not.

What size do you recommend then?


Originally Posted by cymaz (Post 11614786)
Pyro pete
Two powerful motors on a twin is going to be a real handful if one goes out. You won't hear it and you wont know which one if some distance off until you see it spin in. See video below from 8mins 10 sec. The engines sounded ok then port motor stops spinning the plane to port. The greater the power the more violent the spin. If you know which one has gone you have to have a plan, stick to it and lightening quick reactions. This poor guy didn't have a chance.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-hUiDMcCEQs

If you can get some stick time on a simulator twin and program it to cut a random engine. I'm not trying to put you off- it's just how it is. I was flying a club mates twin when the port engine stopped.Reduce engine power , rudder to live engine, use elevator and rudder GENTLY and hardly ever use aileron. Get it in gently and on finals I cut the remaining engine and dead stick it in. The great chance again is spinning it in as you slow to land.


Originally Posted by cymaz (Post 11614790)
Pyro Pete
Same again...:mad:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bBDLP4onEuY Its good to watch as you now know how the plane will act

Understand your trying too advice and not scare, it does all the above an rightly so. Have also seen it happen in person. It's all part of the risk and fun

cymaz 09-16-2013 05:56 AM

I have irvine 40's in my DA :cool:

foodstick 09-16-2013 08:50 AM

Well I have the couple little repairs done on my Dual Ace after last weeks HARD landing ! Video was posted above. It mainly broke the Nose gear plastic pivot block, I did get into the plane and remove some nose weight, and I got out the dremel and managed to move the battery mounting area about 1.5 inches back. So hopefully it will be more forgiving on landings ... Getting one flare and then nothing after that is not fun !

cymaz 09-16-2013 08:57 AM

Balance point is in here for you, but mine is about 105-110mm back. With two spinners it causes more drag than than usual so needs some power and fly it in.

Pyropetepete 09-24-2013 06:36 AM

Sorry for not getting back here sooner, have been super busy. RX have arrived, well the both and been refunded for some reason. Have yet to take any photos, keep leaving camera at work. I am unsure still what size prop to get

redball8 09-30-2013 07:35 AM

I run 10x5 three-bladed Master Airscrews on SuperTigre 40's, for what it's worth. Ground clearance is main reason why.

Quigleywins 02-09-2014 04:51 PM

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Item condition:
New


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Ended:
10 Feb, 2014 10:13:37 AEDST


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Winning bid:
US $203.47 Approximately AU $227.26

[ 32 bids ]



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They are still around,this one just ended on E bay

Flight Risk 02-09-2014 09:08 PM

That seems like a fair price. Prices of all ARFs are going up.

Pyropetepete 05-25-2014 06:50 AM

I'm going to list mine on eBay shortly along with the parts i got for it as a bit of a kit. Never had time to build it

irocbsa 03-12-2015 04:59 PM

Resurrecting an old thread to look for parts. I need a set of nacelles for this plane. 1 would do actually. If anyone has a crashed plane and the want to make a little extra money let me know.

redball8 03-12-2015 06:14 PM

I have a couple of spare NIB nacelles for my Dual Ace, just never needed them. Say $50 shipped CONUS?

Also have a spare cockpit, cowl (nose cone) and canopy (windshield).

irocbsa 03-13-2015 01:34 PM

Sent you a PM on the other site. Thanks!

cymaz 03-13-2015 02:21 PM

Well, for all my talk about the risk of an engine going out on a twin, it finally happened to me a couple of weeks ago!

After all the times I rehearsed it in my head, I had to do it for real !

My DA was flyong into wind when it didn't respond to any elevator and didn't make any forward headway. It then just spun to the left...( left engine dead stick). I immediately shut the throttle to idle let it gain some speed and gently pulled up elevator. Luckily there was enough height, luckily it only spun the once on shutting the throttle. The plan was to land it. So it was a down wind landing at a fair rate of speed, right engine still on idle. I was lucky. The plane had enough air speed to keep the flying surfaces working and very little engine torque from the one remaining motor. Flaired out lovely....only damage was a broken prop !
So it can be recovered from a dead stick spin...phew:D

Flight Risk 03-13-2015 03:45 PM


Originally Posted by cymaz (Post 12001956)
Well, for all my talk about the risk of an engine going out on a twin, it finally happened to me a couple of weeks ago!

:D

I guess you're breathing again. Good to hear a positive outcome. Mine turned into kindling. :(

RevGQ 03-14-2015 12:49 AM

I have a complete kit.
[email protected]

Quigleywins 03-30-2016 06:02 AM

Just had a look from start to finish of this thread and its been a year since it was active . Report on the duel aces I have made the move to go Electric with the older of the two Will put some progress photos on when I get round to the next effort. Yours Paul T

Twin_Flyer 03-30-2016 07:14 AM

i still have one NIB. Will eventually get to it and it will be nitro powered unless the new small gas engines on the market fill the bill...

Bill S.

cymaz 03-30-2016 08:08 AM

Now discontinued, I believe. That's probably why no more builds have been posted..shame it's a great aeroplane.

dave.windymiller 10-06-2016 11:12 AM

1 Attachment(s)
Heres mine
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/atta...mentid=2184661
Im using 2 x LA40 which is at the bottom end of whats needed. Ive found one engine out is ok if i keep the speed up but with one la40 its barely enough. The two crashes ive had with it were when one engine cut on takeoff and without height, i struggled to get it to a height that was above trees. At low speed and height it suddenly flipped and spiraled in. 1st time it nosed intoa boggy field and apart from the nosecone, it was flyable again within minutes. 2nd time was a repeat but this time onto summer baked ground. The fus front of the cockpit was destryed and both engine pods badly damaged but wings and fus undamaged (tough ol bird!). Repaired and airworthy again!!!

The other mod i did was to mount the engine mounts on 1" blocks so the engines could sit further back on the mounts making them much stiffer and less prone to resonate. The planes a lot quieter for this

Dave M

cymaz 10-06-2016 01:20 PM

1 Attachment(s)
With a twin, as you know, engine reliability is paramount. I too have a DA.You have to do everything to keep fuel clean. The engines must not be allowed to run lean. I have Irvine 46 engines in mine, just the job.
I run up each engine individually, checking the rpm's with a tacho- make adjustments by going rich on the fast engine, rather than leaning the slow running engine. Then run them up together. I have a mix on my Tx so that I can adjust the low and WOT on each separate throttle.

http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/atta...mentid=2184670


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