superhornet59

okay... i want to get my next heli. something from walkera (cause i can get them off ebay for like 100 bucks).

so basicly, im looking for something somewhat smaller than a 30 (babye steps) but anything up to a 30 is okay i guess. it has to have ccpm, and be able to fly outdoors (and carry a wireless mico camera, im getting into aerial video/photography).

theres so many freakin dragonfly's i just cant decide! plus in the pictures at ehirobo... they all look the same size. its just too much, please someone help narrow the list down.

so far i looked at the 52 (too small for outdoors) the 22E (mabye... but im not sure if its stable enough outdoors) and ive just touched on the 36.

so far im leaning towards the 22E... it seems like a good bird, but just in case -can you guys narrow down
the list of what performs well and meets most of those criteria?

thanks alot guys, let the dizziness come to an end;

-Matt

soneebee

better get a 36 so you wont have problems with the tail motor replacement.. but since you want to go for heli that can carry video equipment better get a bigger one...like the 39 so it will have better power and stability....

superhornet59

hmmm i just noticed i can get an rtf raptor g2 for about the same price...

should i get that? it has an advantage because its high quality, and my local hobby shop will have replacement parts so i dont have to wait for them to ship.

this will be my first cp helicopter, so is a rappy g2 good? is it good for outdoor flying (and not just near ground, like up 150-200 feet where the winds get higher). i live near the great lakes (near toronto) and because of the lakes, were always getting wind. usualy nothing too heavy, but theres always a little breeze. a g2 can fly in those kind of conditions just fine (plus carrying a 1 ounce payload) right? and also, how high voltage can i run the g2 on without frying anything?

i dont think i need to worry too much about how powerful it is in terms of lifting capactiy, the entire camera system weigh just 1 ounce. thanks -Matt

soneebee

isnt the raptor g2 the walkera 36.. it seem to be the same heli only difference is the name... but the design and the parts are all the same.. it is like they got the Df36 and plugged in new decals and a new name but retain all the parts..

superhornet59

lol i should have known

im not sure how you can say that a raptor is a copy of a df lol, theres a df version of like every good heli out there

well, beyond looks, does anyone know if it is similair enough to a G2 where i could go to my hobby shop, by replacement parts for a raptor g2 and theyd fi perfectly on the 36?

superhornet59

oh my god it is the same thing! AHAHAHAHA

ok... so now will it fly pretty well in a light breeze (it gets a little higher at 150-200 feet) while carrying 1 ounce?

how is it on control, is it a pretty stable machine or am i going to be constantly battling the controls? like i said, its my first cp helicopter.

im a very quick learner, but nevertheless is this a fair entry into this level?

also, feel free to post any benefits/flaws in it so i know what to expect

thanks -Matt

EDIT: oh and just curious, but which helicopter is the 22E based on?

oh, found it. sais its a clone of the eagle 50. is it a good heli?

neweheliflyer

The No. 60 with brushless motor and lipo battery is good one too. It can carry a mini wireless camera. [link=http://www.linknety.com/modevideos/demo/zoom.php?id=16]Check this flying video[/link]

soneebee

well I guess it is a good replica of the DF36.. It will surely fall like a 36... I am not sure if what you are saying is that It is the original and the 36 is the copy... since the 36 is on the market since last year and this Raptor just came out well who knows it just came.. so who is the original and who is the copy now and if you look at the electrics.. man even the gyro is walkera... did you try to look at the battery plugs and the TX.. if walkera copied the TX then all the TX's on the walkera helis should be direct copies from companies like the VNR3D which is as you say is were the DF22E copied itself.. man if that was the case then a lot of this companies should have sued walkera for copyrights... but if you look at there electrics its the exact replica of the one walkera sells... And if you say the raptor G2 is the original how come all the CNC parts for the DF35/36 are named after there helis and not the raptor G2 as since you are saying it is the one that walkera copied there design from.. so the CNC parts from Microheli should have said raptor G2 and compatible with the DF36... so please try to look first before you judge the walkera brand...

superhornet59

well i mean pretty much any heli can carry a 1 ounce cam. i have a colco thunderbird that carry's one and i dont dont see much of a difference in performance (i have 2 flybars. using the shorter one, or the longer one but with the camera seems to be the same thing).
so im not worried about the weight, the big issue is more about how it performs in wind. i dont want a heli that will come down with a vengence in a 1mph wind.

i dont want a big heli yet, after this im probably moving to a caliber 30, so i still want to keep it small because its taking steps.

also im realy big on looks. i mean, i plan on making (among other things with the video system) a video about my high school, and get a whole bunch of realy cool fly-by's and aerial shots. im known well in my school for my work in photography (i am head photographer of the school) and my work in videos (i got sent to the breakfast of champions and got some cool dimploma things too) so with the influence i have there, i want to make a video about the school (which will include aerial footage). so anyway, if im taking a heli to school, i want it to look rreeeaaaly cool lol.

personaly, i dont like the looks of many helis. like, its the boom that usualy drives me nuts. its too thick. on the other hand in most micro helis which have tail motors, thin long boom makes them look real cool. thats a real big thing for me. the 22E has that look that i like so much, which is one of the reasons its one of my favourites.

lol im not the only person who chooses helis superficialy am i lol?

so anyway, the 36 looks like a good machine, but if i know that a 22E will get the job done well, its totaly my favourite.
the big thing is if it will fly well in a light breeze. i mean it seems to be an indoor-to-outdoor transition heli for people wanting to move up the performance ladder. it looks like it will do what i need it too, but i just need some confirmation from people with more experience.

thanks -Matt

superhornet59

soneebee, i dont exactly mean to judge the company as a whole, plus i didnt look at the release dates.

id understand if say all the raptors were based on walkeras, thats understandable. but isnt it difficult to believe that alot of the good electric helis have a walkera twin? i find it difficult o believe that one single company can design helis for so many others, its like, are the other companys even designing these helis or just getting them from walkera and focusing on gp's? isnt that wierd?

well anyway i just saw a pic of the 22E by the transmitter, it looks pretty small now lol!
mabye i should get the 36... okay heres my decision chart:

22E 36
I can fly it indoors and mabye outdoors Ican easily fly it outdoors
i like the 'cool factor' more power
cheaper replacement parts at local hobby shop
a good step up from micro helis might be too big of a step

lol i dont know, right now i think i should get the 36... and get the 22E when i muster up some more money and use it for rainy days.

so... is the 36 a good bet?

soneebee

The DF22E is a good heli.. it flies well and its stable enough to do your video footage.. it can lift good with the stock parts on it the only problem with this heli is the tail motor.. it kinda just burns out fast.. and if you are going to use lipos on it the more it will burn up fast.. so you will be needing extra N30 tail motors as replacement so you can always continue with you flights..
another factor is going into brushless on the 22E well it is possible to go brushless and it will give you better stability in flight better flight time but still the problem will be the tail motor.. my DF40 has the same configs as the DF22E and i keep on burning the small tail motor...

If you are getting the Df36.. well you wont have problems with tail burnouts.. and there are alot of parts that can be modified.. since this has been out for a couple of months now and a lot of CNC parts are already out for it.. so you wont have any problems when you are to modify it to a better heli.. note the only problem that i find on walkera are the electrics.. the TX/RX seem to have jitters and glitches so this are to be checked regularly and the servos that come with the DF36 seem to last a short time.. better get spares for that too...

I am not against any other companies or helis.. there are sometimes companies that get the rights to sell the item on a different brand.. like the RAPTOR G2 if you look at the parts on it you will see that this is a walkera DF36 on a different suit.. same with the Venom night ranger 3D it is the exact 22E on a different suite.. this are sold there in the US so it is the same heli with a different name.. i am not sure if this is a marketing strategy that they are doing but it is the same heli that we are talking about.. even the parts are the same.. so if you plan get the 22E you can aways get spares from the VNR3D....


dont worry about the stability on the helis.. it is stable as long as you know how to fly them..

Ah Clem

I have been flying a 22E (Eagle 50 version) and a Raptor G2 (the G2 only for the last day or so).

The 22E is small, light, agile and more work to fly. It will fly fine in very light winds, and can be flown in 10-15 mph winds, but this becomes so much work (for me anyway) that I prefer light wind or calm. The head parts are somewhat fragile. Mine is nice and reliable I have a Venom Night Ranger 3D, which is quite similar, and it was extremely reliable (I say was, because I dorked it and am rebuilding it).

Add heat sinks to the main and tail motors before you fly.

The G2 (aka Walkera 36) is probably the easiest thing I have ever flown, short of a coaxial. It appears to be a derivitive of the Shogun-may of the parts reportedly fit-I have not tested this yet. The servo gears are somewhat weak and it would be good practice to replace the servos immediatlely. The reciever should be removed and mounted on its side, instead of being double sticky taped under the tail boom (the foam tape on mine covered the vent holes in the reciever and the holes are there for a reason).

Again, I have only a few flights on the G2. Most of us are getting about five useful minutes on the stock battery. Not bad for an Nimh. A 2100 mah 3S Lipo will give you lots of time per charge (one person, whom I trust, reported 17 minutes of flight on one charge).

The gyro works very well, so far (I did not really expect this).

If you get one, follow the advice of those who have posted before us on the Walkera 36 thread: check every screw and nut, make sure that the tail belt roller turns freely, remove the metal sleeve from the motor (which insulates and covers the vents) and add heat sinks.

Again, this is a very smooth, very easy to fly helicopter. The only thing that I would change about the handling would be to speed up the cyclic (the brushless motor will, hopefully bring up the RPM, and then speed up the cyclic).

It is relaxing to fly.

My G2 came from:

http://www.raidentech.com/newbe63dz4dr.html

superhornet59

then i guess ill go for the 22E. im sure itll lift the camera without a problem, i dont want to get too far ahead (i want to move up slowly) and i like the idea that i still have the freedom fo fly indoors.

by the way, has anyone here ever done 3D flying but indoors? and i dont mean in like a gymnasium, i just mean in like your basement? like rolls and inverted flying could be done in that little space right?

and as far as the thing about whats original, i think its very plausible that other companies are getting rights to sell it. my question is why?
its most likely either because theyre lazy/ not interested in the ep market, or minus electronis, walkeras helis are exceptionaly great and they have an 'underground monopoly'

-Matt

balance_mind

What would be the best Sim that has the closest control with regards to the actual walkera helis?
I have seen soonebee playing one in his video.

soneebee

the one i was using was just FMS you can download it from the site its free... the heli i was using was the DF60 heli that came from the TREX 450 suit... it does do good but cannot compare it to the real heli.. the one on the sim seem to be harder to fly

balance_mind

That's FMS, never noticed it. Have tried the dragonfly version in the sim and it's so difficult to control especially compared to the real thing.
I could not find the DF60 in the Sim, which one did you use?

soneebee

its the align TREX 450 model that i used just replace the suit witht he DF60 .. so it look like the DF60 shell but runs more like the align.. with a little adjustment on the setting on it kinda functions kinda like the DF60

buacc

if you don't mind the size, i think walkera 60C is the best. All metal.... actually, i am thinking of this....

Sorry to say i haven't try it and i would like to see if anyone can test it before i buy. ^_^"

soneebee

The DF60C performs not that different from the DF60.. it only has a smoother head and tail.. but it can perform what the DF60 can do too..

superhornet59

that things about the size of a 30 heli (bit smaller) theres no real need for tat seeing my next heli will be a 30, so i need somethin smaller. a 22E is imho a great jump from micro to 30 -Matt

soneebee

the 22E is good enough for the price that they are selling it.. since it cost only $99 this is a great deal for a heli that can fly like any other electric helis.. very light but can be flown outdoors on calm days.. just dont let it run in 15-20Mph winds or you might not control it...

gordthebiker

I've got the 36 and the 22E.

You should go for the 36 if you want to learn quickly, the 22E is a very fast heli with super fast cyclic responses. My 36s ( I've got 2) can hang in the air whereas your fighting the 22E at times.

Also, you need to budget for better batteries & charger, replacing the radio/tx and loads of spares.

You'll need to take your time as this is your first heli and not one person yet has said that it's seems almost impossible when you start out and setup can be confusing. What about a cheap fixed pitch heli to bash around first? Putting a camera on a heli and flying up 150ft sounds great but it will be VERY difficult to actually do it.

Pics show size difference between the 36 and the 22E against my Futaba radio & one of the other pics is the 22E with separate components showing.

soneebee

I agree with gordthebiker all new fliers have a very difficult time flying a heli.. it really needs alot of practice and skill build up.. I think I have'nt heard of any newbies that got there heli flying high on the first try.. most of them had very bad crashes and experinces before they learn how to hover.. so flying and doing some good video shoots will take a good amount of skill... just making the heli point to the direction and movement will take great skill... goodluck superhornet59 hope you can take good videos on your project

superhornet59

ive already flown a fixed pitch. ive got my colco thudnerbird down cold. i only crashed it once (the first time i took it outdoors) and rather than replacing part, im gettin a new heli all together. ive been flying real helicopter simulators for a long time now, and i got a 3-fan design type thing (vectron blackhawk) which got me used to the much high responsivness and sensitivity of model helis. flying the t-bird was a breeze, i need to try something new.

and thanks for believeing in me soneebee [8D] but you guys are right, a small heli is much more nimble than a real heli, a real heli (relaively) lazily moves around, giving a somewhat stable shot. with a model heli, theres vibration, quick corrections, everything. its alot harder to get a smooth, proffessional looking shot.

i have; though, seen some of the videos from the dragonflyer IV. when they put the camera on it, vibration is obviously noticable. buuut, when you put on that SAVS system its a beautifuly smooth image. im going to employ a somewhat similair 'vibration dampening' system. of course thats only good for little jagged movements. when i start making bigger corrections, it will show.

therefore im thinking of loading up the heli with weights in a specific patter so that it slows it makes it alot less agile. that will mean that the heli will fly much more lazily, so though it will reduce the responsivness of the chopper, it should provide a beautiful picture.

i still think that my decision with the 22E is a good one. as far as buying extra gear... i love ebay, and my wallet loves it too

gordthebiker

If you've had a FP heli, go straight to the 36, you can load it up with the camera stuff easier and it has a bigger rotor disk for more stability in high altitude.

Also, you can upgrade it with CNC like I have for more more stability. I Look forward to your pictures and wish you the best of luck.