bruehlmeier

Hi

I am absolutely fond of the power, the smooth run and the sound of a well adjusted YS 4-stroke engine. However, more and more people in the F3A scene seem to change to electric power. As far as I am concerned, I would like to be able to buy YS 4-stroke engines also in the future.

What is your opinion: Will there be any more developement regarding YS engines, or - in the worst case - are there no such engines available anymore on the market in 5 years?

Greetings from Switzerland, Matthias Bruehlmeier

Dave Shadel

I'm sure that the Yamada's will continue down the path that they have chosen, developing new and better engines for the market. Development of the electric power sources will certainly not stop either, with new battery technology emerging almost daily. So your guess is as good as mine.

Good Flying.

MustangAce

My Feedback: (3)

I hope you don't mind me piping in on this one.

There is no substitute for the SOUND of a real engine in a model airplane. Especially that of a YS. How could there not be a demand in the future for that??

bruehlmeier

MoustangAce,

You are absolute right, there is no substitute for the sound of a 4-stroke engine. That is also my opinion! However, is this going to be the opinion of as many people as before? Look at a rang list example given of a F3A competition. You see perhaps 15 electric engines, 3 OS140 and 1 or 2 YS engines. This is true for Germany and Switzerland (where I am from), and probably in part for the rest of Europe. Also, all friends of mine, which are hobby pilots as I am, did buy at least one electric powered model. Some completely changed to electric. I don't really know, if this is what you see in the U.S.A.

However, I do hope that there will be a balance, where we (the consumers) can chose both between 4-stroke and electric engines also in the future - in the same excellent qualitiy.

Dave Shadel

I believe what you will see is that modelers who must fly in noise restricted areas (cities) will end up almost exclusively electric. As populations increase, fewer places to fly gas powered models will be available, and electric will become the choice in all but the more remote areas.

At this point, it has been stated by MAJOR HOBBY DISTRIBUTORS in the USA, that 70% of R/C sales dollars in America are now in electric. This is NOT just in park fliers, but a combination of park fliers and serious electric models. Even if it's only 50%, it's big dollars. I have heard it stated that by 2010, more than 90% of R/C model airplanes will be electric powered.

I love the sound of real model engines (or any kind of engine) but the world is changing, and modeling is changing with it. We had better just get used to it.

nonstoprc

My Feedback: (90)

I observed the same in the flying field over past years. Less people are showing up in the field to fly glow/gas powered models. The intel we got is that people are flying park-fly ones close to their homes. Only die-hard glow/gas engine fans drive all the way to the field.

We even are considering cut monthly club expenses! Electric flying is coming and real.

--qc

k_jitsu

Dear colleagues,

of course, I completely agree with you. I think it's something more than the sound ... it's a different sensation. Also in Spain there are more and more serious electric airplanes. Some of my friends have partially changed to electric and I've had the opportunity of testing this machines and, I'm sorry, but something is missed. It's not the same.

By the way, now YS has the necessity of improve more than ever ... don't you think so?

Regards from Madrid

bruehlmeier

Thank to all of you for your comments. The post of Dave Schadel surprised me, because I thought a big country like the U.S.A. did not yet have so much noise problems with RC planes. However, noise is maybe not the whole problem. Electric drives are just much easier to handle, so people change even if there are no noise restrictions.

Probably, Dave is right that one cannot stop the changing world. However, this is not only a change, but it's also a loss. Or could you think of man bearing Pitts or a big model of a Pitts with an electric engine? I hope that k_jitsu is right and YS interprets the situation to even improve.

Regards Matthias

Mastertech

My Feedback: (31)

So Dave when will we see the YS electirc motors? I'm sure they'll just kick butt over anything else, like Mr Yamada has with his IC engines.

Dave Shadel

I suggested that very thing to Mr. Yamada two years ago and was met with exactly what I expected, a smile and nodding of his head. Any of you who have had any business dealings with the Japanese knows that can mean yes, no, or maybe.

Don't hold your breath for the introduction of anything electric from YS in the near future.

Mastertech

My Feedback: (31)

Yes Dave-san I understand. Spent many years in that part of the world. Loved it actually.

Dave Shadel

xx

nonstoprc

My Feedback: (90)

Maybe we can one day run strong and lightweight gasoline enines from YS, 4-strock? --qc

Zombie

Geez, Dave, if you have the man's ear, please ask him to fill the power/weight hole between the .63S and the 110. I had to get a Saito 100 for a plane because a .63 didn't quite have enough power, and the weight (and power) of the 110 was just too much. Tell him we need something in between hopefully around 20 ounces and power to kick a Saito 100.

Dave Shadel

YS has always had the mindset of bigger engines to make more horsepower, no surprises there. Bear in mind that the cost to build a 140 is essentially the same as it costs to build a 63. A little more materials cost but a very small amount more. Same labor to machine the parts and assemble the engine. They can sell the 140 at the wholesale level for 40% more than the 63. WHAT WOULD YOU WANT TO BUILD?

We have spoken with them at length about 2 strokes, gasoline, bigger, smaller, etc. etc. When they are convinced in their minds that it is right, it will become a viable product for their business.

nonstoprc

My Feedback: (90)

Hi Dave,

I sold my YS140 two years ago because it costs too much to fire it frequently, say 10 flights per week. I am flying IMAC with a 50cc gas motor now.

Another piece of news. ZDZ is preparing the introduction of the 40CC F3A gas engine in US by the end of this year (source: RCShowcase). Maybe YS is aware of this and preparing an answer?

--qc

Dave Shadel

Maybe, but only time will tell. They have talked about gas for awhile, but it will not happen within the next 18 months that I can tell. The next engine will be the 170DZ, which should be available early next summer.

btoby

how soon for a twin?

Dave Shadel

They had an overhead cam twin seven years ago. It made less HP than a single of the same displacement. I doubt you would ever see one anyway, as the market is pretty small for $1000+ glow plug engines.

btoby

point taken

RVM

Saito is releasing a gasser.

---

The reason you see the F3A pilots switching to electrics is because it is better for competitive flying. If you want to win, you have to ignore aesthetics (and cost) and focus strictly on performance - electric provides more performance benefits than gas or glow.

Dave Shadel

Except that they don't do well in the wind, at least at this point. Part of the reason for that is they must practice throttle management to conserve the batteries. In doing so, the aircraft is flying slowly between manuevers and is more susceptible to gusts due to poorer penetration. In calm air it probably makes little difference, though.

In the average fliers hands, electric is probably not ready for prime time in pattern just yet. The top F3A pilots all get it free anyway, and Joe Average pattern flier will follow suit just to say he has the same equipment. The big dogs will fly what they get paid to fly, whether it be fuel, gas, or electric. I know one very well known world class F3A flier who has already said he will move back from electric to fuel next contest season.

bruehlmeier

I can/must speak as one of the Joe average pattern fliers. The costs of electric prevents me from changing my only plane, which I really would like to change and which is indeed a bit too loud. This is a 1.85 m ultimate with a DA50. However, this size of an airplane cannot be changed to electric for me as an average user, because it is just too expensive.

JPal101

My Feedback: (32)

I currently have 2 YS110's and love them. I am looking at bigger planes that require a 140, I know about the 140 Sport but I have come across a 140FZ new in the box for a good price. Can you please tell me about this engine. I know YS no longer makes it and I am wondering why, I am assuming it is the same as my 110 internally but punched out to 1.4. Would you recommend it or should I just buy the Sport?

Dave Shadel

The 140 FZ was a good engine, but marketing dictates new product all the time, so it was replaced with the 140L. The L made more power but was harder to operate. The 140FZ shares the same plumbing as the L, which is somewhat more complex than the current 140 Sport and your 110. Bear in mind that any YS 140 is larger in both size and weight than your 110.

If you feel that the price is right, and it truly is a new engine and never run, I would buy it. Remember that if it has sat idle since new (maybe 7 or 8 years) it could require servicing before it will run properly due to deterioration of the assembly oil which may cause regulator issues. You won't know until you try running it.