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norvel 074 breakin fuel?

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norvel 074 breakin fuel?

Old 10-23-2002, 11:19 AM
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flyinrog
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Default norvel 074 breakin fuel?

so who recommends what, same breakin fuel as regular running? maybe cox fuel for a 1/2 pint or so, I have some 15% cool power but it is old and I dont think its any good,,, I tried it in my .15 enya and it just "farts", is there a special clip to get for a norvel glow head, and does the glow plug tool come with it like cox does/do??? I'm pretty sure cox glow fuel is 25% nitro .. Rog
Old 10-23-2002, 11:30 AM
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jettstarblue
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Default fuel for breakin(g)

Flyinrog,

I'm not real sure, but was told Cox fuel was 15%- though these thing don't like 15% as much as 25%. I got some Wildcat 25%, and they seemed to like it more than the 15%.
JUDGES??

As for break-in I add some extra castor (Sig, or Byron Originals Lube Booster) to the regular stuff.

Jetts
Old 10-23-2002, 11:32 AM
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2fast4u
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Default norvel 074 breakin fuel?

Just run a good clean 20/20 or 25/20 fuel in it and it will be fine. READ THE INSTRUCTIONS!!!! You may have to remove the head, oil and soak the piston and cylinder, then spin it for about 45 seconds with a starter (no plug) to loosen it up. Long story, just do it!!! Then run it on the ground, real rich for at least 2 to 4 tanks. These ceramic compounds are super hard and take a bit to break in, but last a real long time. Wrench does not come with it as I remember. Don't run Byron in a Norvel!!! It eats plugs. Good luck.
Old 10-25-2002, 01:24 PM
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flyinrog
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Default norvel 074 breakin fuel?

okay 2fast your gonna make me ask..... what fuel is it that you use in your norvels, I promise to read the instructions!, I bought this engine at your advice and that fact that cox is not my favorite brand, although I have a few and would like to get the best performance/service after proper breakin....thanks .. Rog
Old 10-28-2002, 04:03 AM
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MikeSell
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Default Norvel fuel

I used the recommended nvx fuel from norvel. Break in was good after about 1-2 hours bench run. I had no problem with the 25% nfx fuel from AP. Once broken in my best performance is with 35% Omega heli fuel. With over 30 air hours on norvels I've only shot one glow plug.
Old 10-28-2002, 04:30 AM
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Default norvel 074 breakin fuel?

hey flyinrog, Last time i was at the LHS they had the newer Dubro 1/2a glow plug clip for 7 or 8$....Very nice and well built...
Aaron
Old 10-28-2002, 01:28 PM
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2fast4u
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Default norvel 074 breakin fuel?

I use "RITCH's BREW" out of Houston Tx. with a 25% nitro and 20% all synthetic oil content. The fuel is almost clear and has NEVER caused me any problems. I use this fuel for break-is as well as full on race speeds. My little ones will idle well and my fast ones will scream, all with the same fuel. My big thing is that Byron fuel smokes Norvel plugs in a heart beat!!! Trust me on that. I have also had good luck with Cool Power all synthetic 15%-25%, but I add a touch of synthetic oil to the gallon if I'm running my Norvels on it.

This is a link to his site, I'm sure he can tell you where to get his fuel or even ship it to you. They make their own fuel in house and are always looking for new dealers to ship to. In 16 years, this is the best I have found, period.

http://www.ritchsbrew.com/rb.html
Old 08-27-2013, 07:29 PM
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Broke in my new Norvel .074. This little engine just loves Byron Genera-2. It has 20% oil and 15% nitro-methane. Mounted a Neodym 6" by 4" E prop. During initial break in my tach would show 15,460 r.p.m. within a rich side of the needle-valve setting. By leaning the mixture more the motor would peak at 16,520 r.p.m. Have now run 16 ounces of fuel...about an hours run time on the engine. At a rich setting now my tach shows 16,540. When I lean it out further to peak r.p.m. the engine will hold steadily at 17,220 ! It just keeps getting stronger and has more power output. This engine is absolutely stock out of the box. (I have two copper shims under the head.) Have been too chicken to do modifications to this little screamer ! The fuel-tank I am using is a 4 ounce Sullivan clunk tank. I am using no pressure lines off the muffler. Venturi suction alone is feeding the engine. Once it is really broken in I will put a 7" by 3" prop on it and hang it on an airplane.
Old 08-27-2013, 08:43 PM
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Do you have an airframe in mind for your gem?
Old 08-28-2013, 04:17 AM
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Have a design for an aerobatic profile. (Like the old U-control stunt ships.) Using a symmetrical airfoil. Four small servos. Radio-control gear has become very small and lightweight. Sold a design in a construction article years ago called an "Anteater." It's airfoil was just a flat slab ! No airfoil shape at all !....but it flew quite well.
Old 08-28-2013, 06:51 AM
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Want to thank you guys for the knowledge and instructions you have put on these forums about how to break in these Norvel engines. It made it MUCH easier for me to properly run it in. I removed the head and back plate. Took a small air bottle, (like you use to clean out the dust accumulation inside your computer.) Blew out the interior of my .074 engine. Put the back plate back on. Squirted pure castor-oil in on top of the piston. Put the piston at BDC. Filled this little engine with more castor-oil. Let this oil "pickle" for over 20 hours. (Yeah ! I know you told me to let it sit for 24 hours !) I flipped the engine over upside down over an old bath towel for 2 hours to let the excess oil drain out. Plunked down in my rocker to watch T.V. Now since I am retired I have nothing but time on my hands ! I would sit there for hours and spin that little prop clockwise. (I know !... this could have been done much faster with my electric-starter !) After several thousand "turns" it was time to see if this silly thing would run. Put it on my home made test-stand. Did not hook it up to the fuel-tank. Squirted a couple of drops of prime directly into the carburetor inlet. Flipped the prop by hand to check for hydraulic lockup. Took my Hornet starter and just touched the spinner. Braaap ! It lit right off ! What a bomb ! Hooked up the fuel-tank. Touched the electric-starter to it again. It started right up. I let it run a little rich for a couple of minutes. Ran the needle in to just below peak r.p.m. Ran it there for a minute. Eased the needle back to a richer mixture. Kept cycling it like this back and forth until it had an hour's run time. It just keeps getting stronger ! Shows 17,220 on my tachometer ! Most amazing !
Old 09-20-2013, 10:09 AM
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jpbugdust
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Put a 7" by 3" G/F 3 Series Master Airscrew prop on my NV .074 engine. Still running Byron Genera 2 fuel. (Has 15% nitromethane and 20% oil.) The motor peaks at 15,660 r.p.m. The lowest I can get a steady idle is at 3,880. Any lower than that and the motor will die. That small screw which has an offset head is needed. I took it out thinking I would get more peak r.p.m. WRONG ! All that happens is the intake inlet bar goes off center and the motor would LOSE r.p.m. ! This is one STRONG engine ! Am very impressed !
Old 09-20-2013, 11:14 AM
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Originally Posted by jpbugdust View Post
The lowest I can get a steady idle is at 3,880. Any lower than that and the motor will die. That small screw which has an offset head is needed. I took it out thinking I would get more peak r.p.m. WRONG ! All that happens is the intake inlet bar goes off center and the motor would LOSE r.p.m.
These engines are not designed to idle extremely low --- any RPM that allows you to easily set the plane down is sufficient.

The eccentric screw is actually an idle stop screw --- realistically, you should rely on end point adjustments on your servos rather than mechanically blocking movement of the throttle barrel. If you overdrive your servo beyond the mechanical stop, it will simply stall the servo and increase your current consumption. I remove the screw and set the throws on the servo to match my throttle requirements.
Old 09-20-2013, 01:08 PM
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Agreed, I think mechanical throttle stops are only of use on the test stand with a manual linkage. Beyond that they are undesirable, we have trim levers for this.
Old 09-22-2013, 08:18 AM
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I use a JR computer radio to set up my servo throws. I just hate to try to out think these factory engineers. Every time I start pulling itty-bitty little parts or screws out of my brand-new little engine I manage to fumble them off of my little workbench and they fall into the floor carpet at my feet ! (Thank goodness I have a little alnico-magnet on a string I can drag across the floor to "find" these parts again ! I got my new .074 head from Ronald Valentine. (It's is an absolute gem ! A work of art !) He told me I could use a "hot" glow-plug so I ordered an AT3 from Merlin. The only problem is that when the AT3 is screwed all the way in the head, the bottom of the glowplug is not flush with the hemispherical combustion chamber. It extends into the chamber about 1/64" inch. Is the glow-plug a "little" too long ? Or did I get the wrong glow-plug ? (I have not put this new head on my engine yet...the stock head and glow-plug are working very well.)
Old 09-23-2013, 03:25 AM
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Originally Posted by jpbugdust View Post
The lowest I can get a steady idle is at 3,880. Any lower than that and the motor will die. That small screw which has an offset head is needed. I took it out thinking I would get more peak r.p.m. WRONG ! All that happens is the intake inlet bar goes off center and the motor would LOSE r.p.m. ! This is one STRONG engine ! Am very impressed !
The lack of an adjustable low end makes it difficult to get a reliable idle and pickup. An adjustable airbleed can be added though and AndyW has shown how to do that. The throttle stop is not needed once you have the engine in a plane. I usually remove the intake mesh and look through the carb to set an appropriate full throttle setting.

Here is a short movie of an inverted fully cowled Norvel .074, spinning an APC 6.3x4 prop, running 20% castor and 10% Nitro. For a lower throttle setting skip to about 1:10;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=trSCx-6zlAo
Old 09-23-2013, 07:15 AM
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Thanks for that video. That is a nice airplane you are flying. And your flying field is BIG !
Old 09-23-2013, 07:49 AM
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I think the turbo plug sticking in too deep is just a buildup of machining errors. I could be Valentine or Merlin, or a bit of both. If you check with another brand plug you will know for sure. Nice video, I like seeing the little guys go for inspiration. I bet I would hit those shrubs and bring my chainsaw the next trip out.
Old 09-23-2013, 07:50 AM
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Just recently got back into 2-stroke motors. (Have been flying electric R.C. for years.) Bought a NV .074 for $70 from e-bay. Got a brand-new O.S. Max .10 for $41. It was easy to break-in. Am using a Neodym 7" by 3" propeller. PE450 on the O.S. Max. These are superb and are of high quality material. Ordered them from voconio #53416 on e-bay. What has surprised me is the price of 2-stroke fuel. Am paying $22 dollars a gallon at the local hobby shop ! (Byron Genera-2.) I bought some Davis diesel fuel so I can run my MVVS .15. $13 dollars a quart ! (Got the MVVS engine used from Czechoslovakia for $31.) The price of energy has just exploded. (Which is why a peasant like me runs little 1/2A engines...low fuel-consumption. If I tried to run a .60 sized engine it would probably bankrupt my puny bank account !)
Old 09-23-2013, 08:21 AM
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I can remember the price of 100 octane aviation fuel years ago. My brother Karl and I built a Quickie. It was powered by a 20 horsepower Onan. It would cruise at 105 m.p.h. indicated airspeed. The Onan only burned 1 and 1/2 gallons per hour. I flew it from Gardner, Kansas to Stromsburg, Nebraska. Visited my Uncle Neal. On the way back I stopped at York, Nebraska to refuel. The F.B.O. charged me $2.00 dollars a gallon ! (Which I thought was a rip-off price !) Boy ! If I could have foretold the future ! They are getting $5.65 a gallon now !
Old 09-23-2013, 12:19 PM
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Originally Posted by aspeed View Post
I think the turbo plug sticking in too deep is just a buildup of machining errors. I could be Valentine or Merlin, or a bit of both. If you check with another brand plug you will know for sure.
Yep, I agree.

If you have a LHS that carries Turbo plugs, you could always try a test fit rather than springing for another plug of a different brand.
Old 09-23-2013, 01:23 PM
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That is a good idea. Next time I buzz in there I will do that. That AT3 plug actually sticks out 1/32 " of an inch. It is only finger tight too. (I sure hate to send it back to Mr. Valentine. It is a real gem.)
Old 09-23-2013, 01:25 PM
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Talk about high prices ! With shipping and handling I paid $15.00 for that Merlin glow-plug !
Old 09-23-2013, 04:16 PM
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I think there is more money to be made on shipping and handling than on the plugs. Al Kelly is a nice guy, I get my Merlin plugs at the Toledo show for about $5. Here at a hobby shop, an OS P3 is $10 plus 13% tax. I try to fly .049 to .15 size stuff but the new digs here are very windy so I have to go to a .46 size if I want to get any flying in. A fast .15 is ok. The price of fuel isn't really that much of an issue for me. 3-4 flights and 16 oz of fuel in a .40 costs about the same as driving my car to the field.
Old 09-26-2013, 04:24 PM
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flyinrog
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Wow thought Id drop in on my 11 year old thread,especially since I havent flown in 4 years, I did join the AMA this year, looks like it was a waste, saw my flying bud the other day, and just said "where did the summer go?".he just said I know!..maybe next year...Rog

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