hkbii

Howdie gents. Heres some S.L.I.C.E screming little I.C engins. Sub zero.09 .hkbii.

longdan

You will have to recruit 40 new members first

vicman

My Feedback: (10)

LOL that might be the litmus test to see how large the (1-.5)Z-25 society/community really is.

eroc144

My Feedback: (1)

Now THAT'S funny!

EG

planebuilder66

My Feedback: (8)

Small
Nitro
Flight

SNF, it's maybe not off to a good acronym, it rymes with DNF= did not finish.
Just chucked it out there.

tangerine-jack

I'm cool with all the ideas posted so far, but no electric. Electric has it's place in modern RC flying, but is not what the purpose of this organization is about. It's about glow powered aircraft, RC, CL or free flight, ARF or kit or scratch, .09 or less displacement, but not electric. We should preserve the past, but encourage new ideas into engine tuning, airframe development etc. Healthy growth with roots in our own history. I don't see where electric fits in, different animal alltogether.

We cannot please everybody with this group, it is just not possible to do that. But I can live with less than my personal vision as others can see things I don't. Not everybody will be able to attend flyins, or meetings or whatever, and that's ok. I'll probably be the first one not to be able to go to an event I probably set up, it wouldn't be the first time.

SLICE. Hmmm. I like that.

planebuilder66

My Feedback: (8)

But in general, today after my last stop fixing chillers, I ended up in manchester hobbies, they sell no 1/2A items, but I needed fuel, so in I went. While there I jumped into a conversation with a customer who was talking to the employees of the store, now, I didn't want to steer this older guy from his dreams but to help him along the way. It seems that his wife bought him a kadet LT40 kit a few years ago, he finally retired and decided to give the hobby a try, he was in looking for floats, when he said he's never flown before, except real aircraft, I recommended he first learn to crawl before running. Funny thing is he agreed. My interuption into the conversation was due to the employee not knowing what the customer was saying, the employee told him right out front that the LT40 was too much for him and instantly recommended a electric piper cub. I jumped in at that point and helped him out and answered any and all of his questions, I wish I had more time to go over more things with him but I was running late to get to the office so we shook hands and he thanked me for the help and off I went. I realize that in this hobby, you get out what you put in, sitting behind the PC answering questions online gets the idea going, but to make it happen we all need to get in the trenches on a regular basis, I have two friends who own hobby shops, one of the two I believe would help promote 1/2A, he still does but not as much since norvel went away. But awareness is the key, It's like the "Alice's Resturant " syndrome, if one guy walks in and say's I want 1/2A, then he's wierd, if two guys walk in and ask for 1/2A, well he'll call them colorful(PC term) but if 10 guys walk in and ask for it, then it's a market movement, and he'll react seeing the growth of the market in the area.
Just my on view on this idea.

digital_trucker

I like the sound of S.L.I.C.E. too, any other suggestions?

planebuilder; yep, exactly what I've been saying. This has to be a real-world entity. If it never gets beyond an online presence it'll disappear in fairly short order, and quite frankly there's nothing it could do online that the various 1/2 forums aren't ALREADY doing. Eventually (once we get organized) we'd need a presence at trade shows, swap meets, etc. We'd also need to sponsor events (the reedie races spring to mind rather quickly). When we get to the point of having a presence at shows, we'd also need planes there to show. Fun-fly types, sporty jobs, scale, the whole thing.

If we're not going to do this right it'll just be a monumental waste of time and effort.


...an LT40 too much for a trainer?!?

planebuilder66

My Feedback: (8)

Yeah, that's why I jumped into the conversation after the employee said that.

skyraider71

I might get lambasted for this, but here goes: I feel that a small engine society should include
displacements up to .15 c.i.d. With many 1/2A engines leaving the market, It opens up more posibilities.
When you guys get the details ironed out, I will join!

planebuilder66

My Feedback: (8)

I'm not going to burn anyones input, .15 is the top range of small model planes, if someone wanted to include .20 and up, then it would be pushing it, but all is fair and fun in this hobby. I see the herr little extra is rated for the .074, which at production time was a good match, but most guys put a .15 in them because the .074 is no longer in production, so the .15 wieghs the same as a .10, go for it. But in the 1/2A crowd it takes disipline to not flame people who chose to power an airframe with 3 times the size recommended, instead we should promote the practice but reinforce the idea of trying a fun little .061 plane and KISS. The best times I've had at the field are with 2 channel .049 surestart planes, I'd fly 4 flights with the little .049 to every 1 flight on the 1/3 pitts bipe with a 45cc gasser, it's just more fun and relaxing knowing that if something goes wrong and it goes down, I don't lose $1300, with a 1/2A, maybe a $50 airframe that I built from a kit and a prop. O-well my stupidity, but not too expensive. So what do you think guys,...
.15 O.K.?

digital_trucker

I think we should stick with single cylinder displacements of .09 and below. Part of my reasoning in trying to put together this society is not only to preserve the heritage of micro engines, but to inspire and promote further developments in engines, airframes, and other techniques in the future. If we decide to allow larger displacements and/or electrics, we'd be right back where we are now in short order.

digital_trucker

So are we all happy with name S.L.I.C.E. - Screaming Little Internal Combustion Engines ?

planebuilder66

My Feedback: (8)

Actually, I read the lst 1/2A from front to rear, that was awsome and that's the way this new venture should be, sure it wont always be action packed at every second but it will grow if we all give it a honest try. I travel alot inside CT, I always carry a MX450XS as my copilot, just incase I get bored. I guess I have room in the E350 for a 1/2A plane so I can get more people interested in the hobby of 1/2A, maybe build a LST 1/2A and give people a try at the sticks, you have no Idea how many people stop and watch when I fly at a park with a heli or a small electric, it seems like I turn around and there's 3-5 people standing by waiting to ask questions, if I had a trainer it would put the icing on the cake, so to say.

Rick W

My Feedback: (20)

Hey all,

Glad the 15 size was brought up since most of my intrest now is in the 15 area. Lots of 15 engines out there. I'll join which ever way it goes. I haven't read each and every post so how about "1/2 a Modelers Society" this covers all phases of 1/2 modeling. If this has already been mentioned please don't throw rocks this way.

Rick

planebuilder66

My Feedback: (8)

I personally don't abolish the .15 idea, but I get a notion of where this community is headed, I don't speak for anyone but myself so it'll have to be a sub-level area of the socitey. I personally would like to see a common area where people could download plans and build planes, get help, and go the step further and have meets to share the culture of 1/2A + other. If I bring a pica jungmister to a meet I shouldn't be hung at the gallows, as long as I bring a 1/2A plane as well.

fizzwater2

My Feedback: (61)

I like the MICA name, for what it's worth.

planebuilder66

My Feedback: (8)

I guess we need a mission statement and a name, but first we need to know the real question?!

How serious are you?
Don't go to divorce court over this function but get involved in it, more than just toting a small plane once in a while, it has to be frequent and share the benifits and drawbacks to 1/2A, in this economy, price plays a big part, so small aircraft usually win, and when it comes to glow, they always win.

LittleRock

Twenty years ago the SMALL organization was created by Joe Wagner and the late Randy Randolph. The idea was to promote small planes with small engines. Their thinking was geared toward .010 to .049 engines because these were readily available at the time. The first event in Dallas had a limit of .20 or equal size electrics. Now electric dominates but the interest is still there for I.C. engines. This organization is already in place so maybe an effort within would further the interest and development of new small engines. I for one still fly small glow and diesel engines (occasionally an electric) but enjoy the small engines the most. Read the upcoming article in Flying Models Magazine to learn more. There are SMALL events in the U.S. and Canada plus countries over seas. Why start a new organization when this one has existed for all this time. It needs a shot in the arm and this may be it. Just a thought !

Steve Staples

Uncas

My Feedback: (1)

I think the name needs to reference these three concept:

1. small engine or micro engine or small piston engines . . .

2. flight or flyers or aeronautics or aircraft . . .

3. association or organization or brotherhood or society . . . .

Something like:
Brotherhood of Flyers for Small Engines or
Small Engine Aircraft Association

You can substitute as desired but I think you need to mix the small/micro engine concept with flight.

planebuilder66

My Feedback: (8)

SMALL, a, I'll google it. He's kind of right, why start new when a group already exists? Unless it defunct and the laughing stock. You could start new but tack it on as a upcoming generation, kinda like "NXT SMALL STEP".

tangerine-jack

Digital Trucker and I had a long phone conversation tonight about this subject. We talked about SMALL and it is a good organization, but the fact that engines are .20 and electrics dominate defeat the purpose of a 1/2A preservation society. It's not just about small airplanes, it's about preserving the Cox style glow engine flight. Other makes of engines are of course accepted and encouraged, but electric and .15 size defeats any real impetus of a member to get into the .049 style of flying. Why mess with a .049 glow when you can fly electric or the smoother, more powerful .15? Current availability has zero to do with anything, SAM has encouraged reproduction Brown Jr and Cyclone engines, why not a society of glow nuts that encourage repro .049s? That is the point of this group, 1/2A glow, regardless if it's in a foamy, ARF or whatever, it is the power plant combo that makes the cut.

I believe that IC engines of .09 or smaller should be the focal point of the group. Electric is certainly giving RC flying a boost, but it's not what this forming group is about. You could drive a corvette to a mustang show, but don't expect to win a trophy, in fact, don't expect to be part of the show at all. The same is true with SAM, you could bring a 3D lecky to thier fly in, but you wouldn't expect them to let you fly. All special interest groups form because of a well, special interest. In this case the special interest is 1/2A internal combustion engines.

We can get way ahead of ourselves about competitions, national meetings etc, but we must decide on the basics first, a name, a mission, a physical address, a webmaster and a "coordinator" to bring the pieces together. The rest will come on the heels of that, things like dues, a club store for selling hats and patches, newsletters, hobby store discounts and such. Those things are a little ways off yet and nothing to worry about at this time.

I am very glad to see the interest this is generating and the constructive input from everybody! I see no reason why this will not work. There has got to be a lot of 1/2A enthusiest out there that are not on this forum but can be reached by other means through an organization such as we are proposing. I am willing to do the nuts and bolts work, so that part at least has been worked out.

Keep the ideas coming! there is no hurry to get off the ground, but we don't want to spend forever planing without ever doing. Things can be modified later as the organization grows and things prove to work or not as time passes.

tangerine-jack

Well said, we intend no harm or ill feelings toward any given interest of any member of this forum. The intent is to start a specialized interest organization within the hobby of RC flying. I myself travel with a small lecky, and I have larger aircraft as well, so if there are torches and pitchforks pointed at anybody it should be me first. I do have an intense interest in preserving the .049 glow style of flying, and that is what we are trying to do.

digital_trucker

LittleRock - S.M.A.L.L. appears to be little more than a BBS, essentially a small aircraft forum...which is fine as far as it goes, but what we're talking about is a true organised SIG (special interest group) along the lines of SAM and IMAA. It's the only way we're going to become a market force, and becoming a market force is the only way we're ever going to see a good engine smaller than .09.

SICA - Small IC Association
MICA - Micro IC Association
SEA - Small Engine Association
IMES - International Micro Engine Society
IMEA - International Micro Engine Association
SLICE - Screaming Little IC Engines

More ideas?

We also don't want to forget the VERY important part about promoting innovation and advancement in small engines and other equipment suitable for small IC flight. In addition to repro items like engines, glow heads, and props.....we will eventually have enough of a market force to induce engine manufacturers to build better engines (hopefully).

planebuilder66

My Feedback: (8)

I hear ya, I like cox engines, they're stupid simple, part of the equation of how they survived for so long. But this place is kind of the birth place of whatever the new society becomes, so what do you think, form a mission statement in black and white and then a name, or the other way around? I would put a bold statement together first, then worry about a name for the orginization. Why let people on only to find out they're excluded unless they join the masses(or mouses) to be part of.
#1- A clear displacement range
#2- A clear age range of engines
#3- A purpose for the requirements
#4- A stratagy for growth
#5- A plan to help grow the intrest.
and the forgotten one
#6-Real world proof of interaction amongst the community.