What would you make?
 

OK guys think about this one for a minute. IF you owned and knew how to run it, a CNC machining center and could make anything you wanted for your model airplanes whether it be 1/2a or larger what would you make? For me it is of course my Sniper DR .049 conversions and the soon coming Sniper DR Mk2 conversions that will made more for the mass market than the Mk1. I also would like smaller 1"-1.25" aluminum spinners. So here is my list...

1) drum rotor Cox conversions
2) small spinners
3) Turbo Plug heads for Cox engines
4) .020 sized engine

LAter,
Tim

RE: What would you make?
 

Aluminum front cases (with ball bearing) for the TD line, and a good carb that would fit into them.

RE: What would you make?
 

Dave,

Would you believe ball bearing SLOW a TD down![:'(] I hear ya on the need for an aluminum instead of plastic piece and a good airbleed carb.

LAter,
Tim

RE: What would you make?
 

For the Cox engines..I would Chuck, all those Ball jointed ,Rod, and, piston Setups ,away, and make Rods ,and piston sets ,with a wristpin.You could Chop, the Castor oil content, in the Fuel, way down.Then,next project, Make a Rotary Disc (intake)Styled after a ROTAX engine ,probably an inline Twin(one in front of the other) ,with side carb, and ,side exhaust with a dual Header,and, twin Tuned pipes.

RE: What would you make?
 

Dave... If you had this dream engine would you perhaps be making an R/C Model Snow Mobile?

RE: What would you make?
 

How about licensing ProBroJoe's twin or quad 049 design off him and make a few semi kits? We aren't talking about a heap if them. Perhaps 40 to 50 would likely flood the market for some time even allowing for collectors.

Perhaps you make the CNC'd parts and pass them onto Joe, he adds his "designer fee" on top of that and sells the kit's out mail order to us, the Great Slavering Unwashed Public.

I'd likely be in for one twin and one quad.

RE: What would you make?
 

Tim, if I were you, I'd give Joe Clause a call and ask him what he would do. If you could become the next Kustom Kraftsmanship type company, maybe you could do well. How many fine thread NVAS would it take to pay off a $100,000 machine? Take a cue from COX, if they are getting out of DODGE then maybe devoting time to COX related stuff is like beating a dead horse?. At one time, if you wanted to play hard with 1/2A's, you needed to get acquainted with that crabby old guy from Southern Cal. ;) Nowadays, you have Eastern European 1/2A engines so having a KK type operation might be a dead issue. I would still want to pick Joe Ks' brain. Last time I called him, he lived in Fallbrook, Ca. If you strike out there, try San Marcos, Ca.

RE: What would you make?
 

Hank Nystrom (Texas Timers) is selling what may be the last of the KK NVAs, although everyone here knows that so I don't know why I'm saying it [sm=confused.gif]

http://www.texastimers.com/odds_ends/odds_ends_main.htm

Whatever happened to the Shuriken? Who made those things? Weren't they machined from bar stock? Sounds like a job for CNC. Maybe the files are still around somewhere?

RE: What would you make?
 

Fred Baldwin made it, or had it made. It didn't live up to the glitz and the hype, plus it was very heavy. Some guys that were into C/L speed tried it.....then moved on. Bar stock is a poor choice for a light crankcase, plus there must have been alot of steel in that engine, too. Who knows, it might have made a better diesel?

RE: What would you make?
 

Here are mine - just dreaming with no thoughts about practicality or marketability.

Small spinners
Under .15 sized 4-stroke
Small radial or twin

RE: What would you make?
 

Welcome to Daves World,his mind is a "OPEN BOOK".PLEASE fasten your Seat Belts,and, keep your Arms ,and ,Hands inside.He hopes ,You Enjoy the Ride :)

I`ll find some pics ,of, the Full scale sled,later..

RE: What would you make?
 

1cc 4 stroke and a 2cc twin for a cub,,cool, improbable, marketable to, well maybe a dozen of us or so ..a pipe dream I guess....I was in Targert the other day and on a clearance end cap was an appliance..cool idea...it toasts a split english muffin while in a little front cup it poaches?/fry's an egg at the same time...so you add a slice of canadian bacon and cheese and pop out an egg mcmuffin..........but how often are you gonna want one? and it was a pretty good sized appliance......good idea...no market....Rog

RE: What would you make?
 

Good Day All:

If the CNC unit was a CNC lathe then I would think making production runs of the Turbo plug head conversions for each of the Cox, Norvel, or Brand Whatever that fits your interest as the first items. These are critical for just continuing to operate the jewels we enjoy. The biggest cost of this is NOT the design or making, it is the marketing and distribution. Then I would focus on Pistons and rods as conversions. The problem with this is piston/cylinder fits. Some hand lapping with polishing compound might be required and this would rule out 90+% of the market. Replacement needle valve assemblies for all the Cox products would be helpful but not essential for now.

If it was a CNC vertical Mill with 4th and or 5th axis tooling then I would look at what existing plastic parts are key to continued operation and make micro molds for each of these. So a list would include but not be limited to 049/051/020/010 carb bodies (with thicker wall on the threaded intake), and props. I would be happy to buy a used injection molding machine and run the parts.

Regarding spinners, some of the Cox CL planes had lovely spinners. They are about 1 1/4" dia and are of rigid plastic. They were installed on engines with the prop stud and the hollow 5/16" long prop nut. The spinners then snap on the hollow prop nut. They really finish off a Mach None or Mini Pacer perfectly. Making a variety of sizes of these to fit on the hollow prop nut would cover almost all our planes. They could be molded in various colours or painted to suit. I have 5 or 6 in white and can post pics if you cannot recall these items.

So I feel the wish list should consist of what is essential to keep the existing fleet running and is not currently available and then move on to the "it would be neat to have" parts. I am very reluctant to build an 010 or 020 plane because of the plug availability. I am fortunate to have Nelson conversion heads and a recently discovered stash of more than a dozen regular Cox heads for 049/051. I will make some turbo head conversions in the future. Finding props for the 020 is not always easy, and 010 are just plain hard to come by. Maybe they are not, but see the remark about marketing and distribution.

So the big question really is, "When are you getting access to this fantasy CNC shop"?

Jim H

RE: What would you make?
 

Small Spinners....

I have wished someone would offer a line of several shapes for 1/2A'rs. There are many scale models I would do on 1/2A if there was just a spinner to accompany (Ryan PT-20, P-51, etc.).

The next big hurdle is scale wheels, especially since Williams Bros. is no more. Only sizes nowadays are for the big stuff.

Brian

RE: What would you make?
 

Williams Brothers is back in business. News of their demise spread like wildfire, but they haven't been very good at getting the word out that they're back. I found their new site when searching for vintage wheels. http://www.williamsbrothersmodelproducts.com/

RE: What would you make?
 

Williams BROS. Stuff, is supposed to come through Sig,to, Hi-Flight ,for Distribution,here in Canada.I ordered, Directly from Sig,,I had no luck, with my order for the Contest.I guess, I should check to see ,how they are making out, with ,THAT order,, from ,, LAST JANUARY !![sm=48_48.gif] They had everything I needed, except, for 2 wheels, that were supposed to be in stock, within 4 weeks ,of when I ordered ....[sm=48_48.gif]

RE: What would you make?
 

Hi guys,

Well I have both a CNC lathe and Mill, not the small one you can put in your basement, and COMBAT hit the nail on the head. These machines cost well over $100,000 each. Yea I know there a less expensive machines, but, you get what you pay for in this arena. Usually when you own these machines there not for hobby but every once in a while I sneek a project in. Such as the RI case I posted in an earlier post. (Beam Mount Sure Start.)

Setting up a job takes a lot of time and money. Materal cost and hourly rates are always going up so each run is more expenseve so it's not practable to turn out the smal lots used by the hobby. Dubro and other companys have that market.

When I build the Surestart cases there was a lot of hand finishing after the machining process. Even though the parts are done by the machine their not always finished when they drop out. They need polished, debured and other hand jobs such as pressing the bushing in the case and honning. TIME, TIME TIME which makes the cost go up so the product doesn't sell.

Building your own engine and parts is everyones dream, well almost everyones, but unless I'm building a hi-performance engine it's much cheaper for me to buy an engine and the quality today is good. . As far as hi-performance engines it's actually cheaper for me to buy a Nelson or Jett.

So I guess what I'm saying is it's not practial..."Didn't Combat say that."

Oh,I but the way, bring on your reedies I have the answer!!!

Rick

RE: What would you make?
 

Rick, as a fellow toolmaker and former plant manager of a job shop w/30 machining centers say nothing of the grinding and conventional equipment you and CP are right. However I won't shatter Tim's dream either. Those who want to play shall pay. Even Dub built a 1/2a. One went to Uncle Sam with the other going on his trophy case with a "not for sale" sign. Tim, Patrick, and even CP when you start putting a $70 per hour tag on all your kibbitzing you will start to get an idea of how much machine time really is.
About the plastic TD front end, if I were to replace it with a long term fix it would involve an investment casting, again $.

I totally dig your motor bro[sm=thumbup.gif]

RE: What would you make?
 

Well Tim if I could make anything I would probably start out with a giant run of widgets for the Govt. and make enough money to get on with the fun stuff.

Which would be:

1. An AAC cylinder and piston setup for the TeeDee .049. And so I could turn it 32,000 . . .and then a new crank that would not break at the normal TeeDee breakin' point of about 24,500.

2. Nelson heads for most engines.

3. Pretty little brass clunks for 1/2A tanks.

4. A manifold for Cox engines that would be light and collect the gases for #5.

5. A muffler/throttle for 1/2a that throttled the engines with an exhaust baffle.

RE: What would you make?
 

Good ideas! I hate to say this but Mr Clarence Lee probably isn't going to last forever.......who will step in and offer glow head repair and Nelson plug conversions for most engines?
An AAC TD would sell like hot cakes if it could run somewhere around 25-28,000 stock with a 5x3 on low nitro.

RE: What would you make?
 

I will do glo head repair. I have the kit and inserts and have been doing it for the local guys for a while now. I never charge more than the man CL. I do not plan to do any production runs of engines tho.[&:]
That is untill Tim asks nicely. Ya gotta choose who you work with. I may entertain LD too.;)

RE: What would you make?
 

Vic, have you tried to do the 11/32 plugs too?

RE: What would you make?
 

Don't know about that one - Sorry. Do you need something made?

RE: What would you make?
 

Thanks Vic

I thought about building a new piston and rod but after looking into it was to cost prohibitive. The biggist problem was the keeper for the wrist pin. As you know not all cox engines were created equal so a port could end up anywhere. I was going to use e-clips in the piston but machining the grove proved to be the down fall. Trying to grind a tool that small is a nightmare and to have one done, well you know. This would be a mulit step process in our shop. Lathe to the Mill then out of the shop to the grinder.

I suppose if I could get a pre-order for about 10,000 units I could spend a day of two building them.

Now, if I could build anything, lets see !!!!!!!! ABC piston and liner, heads for nelson plugs, oh ya....stay tuned!!!!

Rick

RE: What would you make?
 

Gonna need more than a machining center for those pistons though - more precision required than a turning operation will ever deliver. But yeah, it would be good to chuck those ball and socket joints!

MJD