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GREAT PLANES FLATOUTS

Old 01-13-2008, 08:25 AM
  #251  
wedgewing
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Default RE: GREAT PLANES FLATOUTS

fusebmx13

IMO The easiest way to go with a radio set up for a flatout (or any 4 channel) is to get a Futaba 4YF 4 channel radio.

http://www.rcuniverse.com/product_gu...smitter_id=162

no bells and whistles, but a very good radio that I still use to power 4 of my planes, including my flatout RCU Bipe. You can purchase it in a package that contains 3 micro servos and a receiver and you are all set for around $100. That my friend is the lowest price you will be looking at for something that works

Another option I have seen is say you may want to try out a co-axial helicopter like the E Flite Blade CX2. Most of these new helicopters come with everything you need to fly including a 2.4 ghz spectrum radio and one of spektum's AR6100 receivers. I looked at this the other day, because if I bought one, I would bind it to my DX7 radio and have this perfectly good E Flite radio sitting around that could be used for another plane. You would still have to buy servos and another receiver if you did not want to keep switching from plane to heli since that radio does not have a/c memory.

That is kind of out there from what you are asking, but for now I would say you are OK with the Futaba 4YF.

Fun planes
Old 01-14-2008, 05:21 AM
  #252  
eastcoast
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Default RE: GREAT PLANES FLATOUTS

Thanks wedgewing

so the spectrum6 mirco will be fine with the 7.5g servo's?,i well be mostly flyin outside,theres a club that flyies once a week here at the local gym,plannin too take my blade CP tonight actully...or should i put the 7.5's too the side and find some lighter servos.the lightest i can find is 6g and i don think 3gram's total well effect it that much?,im a total noob too this light stuff so forgive me .-_-. sorry you kinda lost me with your reply..lol

ohh and another thing!!!, has anybody done any mods to the wing too give it alittle reinforcement,...like say a 1 carbon rod runnin wing tip too wing tip,in the center of the wing?,just thinking that might help,,im going too give it one attempt with the hinges,after boiling them,if all fails im going with flap tape

cheers m8
thanks again

mike
http://youtube.com/watch?v=joQisLVePwg

ive been praticing lol




Old 01-14-2008, 08:19 AM
  #253  
wedgewing
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Default RE: GREAT PLANES FLATOUTS

I fly mine outside with 7.5s and I have carried a camera, and often a 3 cell 2100 lipo. this plane can carry cargo if it is flown right. You would never do that for the Gym-Gram-Guys and they would cringe at the mention of it which is why i have to mention that I fly mine outdoors. If you have three 6 gram servos and you are worried about the weight 4 paperclips would have on the performance of the aircraft, by all means use the 6 gram ones.

You asked about wing mods, if you scroll back to a previous post of mine I talked about ones I do for these planes that would be recommended if you were going to fly outside where "ginger landings" on grass are rare and these are not meant to take aircraft carrier landings, which is why I placed some foam squares under the wing where the landing gear go through the wing on my RCU Bipe

where the carbon rod stops, I place a plastic zip-tie with the connector cut off and glue it along the exposed leading and side edge. if you are not sloppy you can use (yes, I am going to say it) hot glue. you don't need a huge zip tie and they sell thin ones at places like home depot or other stores. I included a shot with a leading edge view to show what I am talking about. This plane is almost two years old an has been beat up more times outside and is still a blast to fly. In the picture I noticed some aileron bends, and I plan on building another one of the winter, but will keep flying this one till the big one takes it away. with the wing mods and foam under the wing for the landing gear I have never had a wing crack, torn, or gear slash through the flight surface.

the zip tie edges are also a good idea to run along high stress areas of the body of the aircraft top and bottom edges. if you are flying outside, you will always have wind, and if you put a good deal of stress on them into a wind, you will hear a crack or see an elevator half pop off (good news is the plane flies fine with one until you get it back down). those were events that happened prior to the mods, and my first plane did not last the season ( I was doing silly things with it).

Again, these are things you would want to do to fly outside. This thing does not weigh a ton either so go big with those extra 1.5 gram servos, it will help in the wind

Enjoy



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Old 01-14-2008, 02:48 PM
  #254  
eastcoast
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Default RE: GREAT PLANES FLATOUTS

thanks again wedgewing
yeah i was thinking that the little weight diff would not matter,sounds good....,yes i did read the earlier post for the mods,and i am intending on doing them,
i am really considering building the whole plane with the hot glue,or 5min epoxy,not sure yet!!!
i cant wait too get it and start my project...

im sure ill be doing silly things with mine too,hahah but for 25 dallors,it will be fun im sure...

thanks

Mike

Old 01-14-2008, 04:17 PM
  #255  
wedgewing
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Default RE: GREAT PLANES FLATOUTS

eastcoast

I risk getting smacked around by saying this, but I did indeed build the entire plane with hot glue........Shhhhhhhh.

Again, my caveat being I don't live buy a gym or indoor flying area that I know of, and I just like to see that the wind streamer in the yard is gently flopping and run outside and get a quick 10 minute flight with the 3 cell 910 mAh which is out of spec and considered heavy or goodness, even more time with a 3 cell 2100 (insanely out of spec) and flies. no doubt, with these the lighter the better (olive branch), but I like to fly outside, and for longer than a couple minutes.

If you go hot glue, the best thing you can do is go easy on the glue, find a decent gun than is better than the one they would sell at Wal-Mart and one that has a finer bead and low temp glue. when you do the carbon rods, only glue a little section at a time so you don't go nuts on the stuff. also your plane will fly with some cobb webs left over by some glue. I had to trim one out of the picture. I totally owe the longevity of my current plane to some necessary reinforcement and some well applied hot glue.

I watch the RC Universe review film of the RCU Bipe flight in the wind the author did and mine can do the same things so I know it is not a lead sled.

Maybe someday I will use the CA for one of these, but when I originally did it, my technique was not as elegant and the lack of any remaining finger prints on my skin from CA melt would have made me a good witness protection candidate

Enjoy the plane, save the spare foam for repairs

KP
Old 01-14-2008, 05:57 PM
  #256  
eastcoast
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Default RE: GREAT PLANES FLATOUTS

nice,hahah sounds good,i just got stock battery and the rimfire combo coming,hopefully this week!!!!,yeah im going with the hot\warm glue idea i think,but im kinda leaning towards the 5 or 10min epoxy cause you have time for moving\fittin perfect where as hot glue dries pretty quick

what i meant by the wing re-inforcement with the a extra carbon rod,running tip too tip of the wing,dead in the center of it,giveing it extra strenth in regards too the flexing!!!,the zip ties are good for the dings of hittin the ground and what not...but im refering too the totol wing flex.
Old 01-14-2008, 08:31 PM
  #257  
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Default RE: GREAT PLANES FLATOUTS

eastcoast

I get you. I had more issues with body twist, which is why i had a couple really long zip ties run the length on top and bottom and you will notice after you glue them that the mere width of the tie prevents twist even on the wing, on top of protecting against dings

you will have a carbon rod on the leading edge and on the trailing edge (your clips will use as a hinge point for control surfaces). there is about 5 inches between that and what you are going to deal with is some twisting from forces wanting to make the wing look like a helicopter blade.

Maybe you should look at the RCU Bipe, because you are building a box of carbon because you have all of this on top and bottom and when you add in 8 carbon support struts this thing is solid, and very fun to fly. I am the last guy to shy you away from additional carbon reinforcement based on how mine are built. Never thought of it based on how strong the Bipe is with 4 carbon edges.

When this one finally buys the farm, I will get another one and post pictures of the RCU TriPlane

I just checked back to see your shock flyer, and that sim is good. the only reason I think it is a sim is because there is only one shadow below the plane. Nice performance

KP
Old 01-14-2008, 10:54 PM
  #258  
eastcoast
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Default RE: GREAT PLANES FLATOUTS

thank you,yeah that sim is great for the price,i bought that about 1month prior too getting my HZ SuperCub,its helped me alot,cause when flyin towards yourself,i think is the hardest too get used too,but with the sim ,its a brezz now,i probally wount get too finish my CAP anytime soon,cause i go back too work Sunday for 3 weeks,in the canadian Artic so i hoping too get it this week so i can aleast look at it lol,so mid feb,ill be able too really get into the build,im getin excited Just talkin about it lmao

cheers
mike
Old 01-16-2008, 08:26 PM
  #259  
eastcoast
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Default RE: GREAT PLANES FLATOUTS

well i go too the hobby store for parts for my Revo today,and while looking around,ic a flatout redbull kit,for 14 bucks. so ofcouse i buy that up,im waitin on my cap in the mail from tower,started 3 pm today everything is going good,boiled the plactic parts,and no broken things yet[8D]

takin PICs as the build progresses
Old 01-17-2008, 06:37 PM
  #260  
eastcoast
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Default RE: GREAT PLANES FLATOUTS

LMFAO
Old 01-17-2008, 06:41 PM
  #261  
eastcoast
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Default RE: GREAT PLANES FLATOUTS


ORIGINAL: PilotLight


....my bit is small but I forget what size exactly.


Seems to be everyone's problem lately.
LMFAO LMFAO
Old 02-10-2008, 11:59 PM
  #262  
drumbum
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Default RE: GREAT PLANES FLATOUTS

I got the RCU bipe for some backyard practice. first foamy ive done. I enjoyed putting it together as it was so much different than the typical ARF in wich im bored of putting together repeditively.took me about 8 hours but i didnt rush anything . I have not had a chance to fly it yet due to 15-50 mph winds today but I will soon
Old 02-12-2008, 05:47 PM
  #263  
cornj
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Default RE: GREAT PLANES FLATOUTS

All
I bought a Great Planes Reflection; after looking at instructions and kit pieces realized how much time was involved to build; no way was I going to invest that much time for a plane that probably wouldn’t survive long.
What to do: buy 2 sheets (12x36) of 9mm White EPP, 1 sheet (12x36) of Black EPP, 6 1/8†carbon fiber tubes and some hot glue plus gun. Use the Reflection kit parts as a template. Construction time less than building original kit, hot glue is fast on EPP. Also has hot glue hinges. Plane flies great with Hacker A20-26M Prolite 3S1P-910. Plane in PIC with red dots is Reflection, the rest are copies of wood 3D planes in EPP.
Couldn’t count the number of times I’ve hit the ground or gym floor without damage, if damage happens just carry a BIC lighter and hot glue stick.

Forgot flies well in the wind
Tony
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Old 03-31-2008, 11:40 AM
  #264  
chrisrafter
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Default RE: GREAT PLANES FLATOUTS

Disgusted. Disillusioned. That's all I can say I feel after 3+ weeks building this thing (Flatouts CAP 580) and having it fly for 20 seconds then crash, out of control yesterday. This was my first build, and I learned a lot, so much so in fact that I could probably re-write the manual (doubling its size) and probably get a good build out of the kit, knowing what I know now.

Blame my newness, lack of experience, which I freely admit, but SHOULDN'T I be able to follow the instructions (including reading them completely through several times) and get a halfway decent experience out of this kit?

This is my 4th plane, definitely the least ARF I've ever attempted (how they can call this an ARF is well beyond me).

I appreciate and was sucked in by the $24.99 price. How bad could it be? $25? Heck. Well, technically yes, but count the additional $15 on foam-safe CA, kicker, tape, and extra parts.

In theory, and with an experienced builder, this kit could be very nice, IF everything came together correctly.

1. CONTROL SURFACE LINKAGES: WORST EVER! UGH!!!

By far the worst feature is the control surfaces. They don't tell you there's a technique to installing those mini clips to the carbon bar. You have to keep pressure on the two "jaws" or else they will crack. It also helps to approach the bar at a 45 degree angle, approaching the bar with the side edge of the clip's jaws. It probably changes the flex requirement by maybe a third of a millimeter, but it is the difference between breaking and not breaking.

If I had it to do over, I would glue the carbon bars to the top of the wing instead and use actual control hinges inside the foam, the "snaps off in a crash" claim is BS, those little suckers will either break, separate or the foam will crack before they "snap off". Had they used even a slightly more flexible type of plastic, it might work, but these guys are very brittle.

2. PUSHRODS, Z-BEND THINGS + CONTROL HORNS! 2nd worst thing.

Some real manufacturing tolerance issues here. We have a simple-sounding 3 part assembly: a nice carbon push rod, plastic z-bend ends that get glued to either end of the pushrod, and plastic control horns that the z-bend ends snap into, which in turn connect to either the servo head and the plane control surfaces. BUT - Not a single part fits the way it should out of the box. Why? The manual tells you to hone the edges of the carbon rods with sandpaper so they fit through the z-bend ends. I succeeded in turning mine into a sharp spike that nearly skewered my finger several times trying to push it though the z-bend end. It still didn't fit. Then I wondered why I was sanding the hell out of a 10 inch, 1/2 millimeter thick carbon rod, weakening it, when I could just make the damn hole a smidge larger. Then the z-bend things don't "snap" into the control horns unless you drill the hole a bit larger. But guess how you get to discover this?

You haven't experienced fun until you've glued in your entire aileron assembly, then snap the top off of each control horn in turn trying to get the damn z-bend things in. This is not tight because it needs to be a friction joint, either. They tell you to use CA to lock each joint. Would it kill them to mold them a hair bigger so I could get the parts in? If you drill out the control horns and use a micro-drill to drill out the z-bend ends, the parts fit together a lot better, then comes the glue. How hard would it be to either TELL YOU THIS, or better, manufacture them correctly?

2. THE TAIL

The front of the plane is not so bad. I was actually impressed with the foam doublers on the firewall to where I mounted my outrunner. Even though it's just foam, glue and a small wooden mounting plate, it's solid. The tail, however, is another story. It's pretty lean. The elevator is not too bad, but my rudder needed a lot of reinforcement. Gluing a carbon rod to a piece of foam 5" long edgewise EFFECTIVELY, where you can only use glue on about 50% of the surface (due to the hinges) is a tall order. Were I to do it again, I would put a reinforcement bar at the very bottom of the rear fuse and bottom of the rudder (this area is prone to scraping on the ground, and it's just raw edged foam. It would have been nice to have a stiffener bracket or something to bolster the raw foam along the bottom of the rear-fuse. They did a great job of this on the front with the foam doublers, where the outrunner mounts. Those make the foam very stiff and durable.

3. FOAM SAFE CA and KICKER

I learned a lot about this material. First, it rarely bonds instantly, unless you are using a pinhead size amount. The kicker helps (I used a clean printer-ink syringe with the needle crimped flat by pliers to apply it, this gave me a hair-thin stream of the stuff and great control with applying it.) The CA itself actually works OK, especially when you let it dry on its own (w/o kicker). The kicker worked, but it also seemed to shrink the CA slightly, causing it to curl up and pull off a bit from the surface. Wasn't huge, but sometimes you want the glue to stay exactly where you put it.

4. BATTERY LOCATION

So the heaviest single item, (the battery), is located off-center. Not sure why this is designed this way. I pushed it up as tight against the centerline as I could. The manual tells you to counterbalance it, but then you're adding weight. WHat would have been wrong with. The servos are all located along the plane's centerline, they counterbalance. Wouldn't it have been smarter to put the servos on one side (where practical) to counterbalance the battery's weight? I was really, really tempted to cut a hole in the center of the fuse so I could center the battery. I was worried about doing so, but after witnessing its first flight, this is necessary if you are using anything larger than a featherweight 350 mAh lipo. On mine, I will probably cut a hole in the fuse above the center carbon spar, right below the grey cockpit, and secure the battery flat somehow, maybe with a velcro belt or rubberbands.

So yes, this kit could be pretty good. IF you spend about $30 on some extra parts, like real control horns and pushrods. That will remove a lot of the stress in building this thing as well, especially if you can learn from this thread on where to listen to the manual and when you should go off on your own and do something differently. Great Planes should hire 2 editors, take this thread, which is in the public domain, and re-engineer this kit. Doing so will give buyers a much more satisfying and successful building experience.

Old 04-20-2008, 04:17 PM
  #265  
mattm55
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Default RE: GREAT PLANES FLATOUTS

OK, my Flat Out Cap 580 never made it out of the garage. I think the instructions were wrong and I had the pushrods come up short(wrong hinge location sides). Same issues as others, hardware breaks, flimsy and add the wrong instructions caused me to save any more frustration/aggravation and I stepped on the plane... hee hee... made me feel good I didn't waste any more time on it=> period!!!

Matt
Old 05-03-2008, 01:58 PM
  #266  
zooman
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Default RE: GREAT PLANES FLATOUTS

Wow
The good the bad and the ugly.
The redbull flatout was my first plane to build and fly. Seven plus hours to build with modds.
The Flatana is my second plane and took about six hour to build with learning from the redbull and doing other modds to it.
They are like a kid with glass. It's going to get broken. I'm a foam repair expert now.
For 20 bucks I can't complane much but these are my first experence to build and fly.
The redbull is in rough shape but it still flys great. I haven't flown the Flatana yet. Waiting for a nice evening LED's in all.
since I just got into flying I can't compare these to other planes. But they have made me understand the way a plane works and functions and taught me to fly. I'm sure when I'm ready to up it to another class these will of help me greatly and kept my costs down.


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Old 05-08-2008, 12:17 AM
  #267  
PilotLight
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Default RE: GREAT PLANES FLATOUTS


ORIGINAL: eastcoast


ORIGINAL: PilotLight


....my bit is small but I forget what size exactly.


Seems to be everyone's problem lately.
LMFAO LMFAO
Thank goodness, somebody get my point.
Old 05-08-2008, 12:18 AM
  #268  
PilotLight
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Default RE: GREAT PLANES FLATOUTS

got
Old 06-15-2008, 09:14 PM
  #269  
BradSD
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Default RE: GREAT PLANES FLATOUTS

I bought the Cap 580 GP foamy and it got destroyed before flying, a storm blew it off the table in my garage and busted it up. I am selling everything that was on it and going back to nitro full time. It consist of Rimfire engine, ESC 8Bl, two lipo batteries, A brand new micro flight pk by Futaba, a charger, and many other items. you can click on my name and scrooll to bottom of profile and check out my sale. Make me a fair offer and its yours. I have no interest in electrics.
Thanks,
Brad
Old 06-15-2008, 10:09 PM
  #270  
hellblastervolly
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Default RE: GREAT PLANES FLATOUTS

Brad.

Too bad to hear that you are not staying on electrics. Foamys are more fragile than balsa but they are lot's of fun and easy to repair and cheaper. Maybe you could try an electric ply/balsa Arf.

Fernando
Old 06-21-2008, 11:14 PM
  #271  
zooman
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Default RE: GREAT PLANES FLATOUTS

BradSD
Don't feel bad. My first plane was the redbull. I built it prefectly. I held it up to see if it was straight and put it into the ceiling fan. It was on of course. Busted the tail right off. Just glued it back on after some very very bad words.
Old 06-22-2008, 10:49 PM
  #272  
BradSD
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Default RE: GREAT PLANES FLATOUTS

I might give it another go with a more typical type of airplane, I really like a bipe I saw on the Tower sight the other day. Was blue and white but I cant think of the name of it. I actually went to college for electronics go figure LOL. I still like the nitro better!!!
Later,
Brad
Old 06-22-2008, 11:31 PM
  #273  
oly_rcer
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Default RE: GREAT PLANES FLATOUTS


ORIGINAL: BradSD

I might give it another go with a more typical type of airplane, I really like a bipe I saw on the Tower sight the other day. Was blue and white but I cant think of the name of it. I actually went to college for electronics go figure LOL. I still like the nitro better!!!
Later,
Brad
possibly the plane you were looking at is the great planes reactor bipe,was looking into one myself really nice looking and the reviews look good
Old 06-23-2008, 12:36 AM
  #274  
hellblastervolly
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Default RE: GREAT PLANES FLATOUTS

Brad.

The Reactor Bipe it's awsome a friend of mine have it I have the mono version of it. I also did have the RCU Bipe it was my first electric it fly nicely a little fragile but easy to repair. I also have the Byp Yak it's a great plane and stronger than the RCU. There is a few awsome Bipes just Pm if you like to know. Nice to know you like to give another shot. Welcome back.

P.S. By the way I still fly nitro and always will but now I have more choices and places to fly.

Fernando
Old 06-23-2008, 12:46 AM
  #275  
BradSD
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Default RE: GREAT PLANES FLATOUTS

Well its not the electric part that botherd me to be honest, it was that crapy foam flatout cap 580. I hated ever thing about it LOL. I have built TF warbirds but I struggled with that Flatout crap. If someone would put it together for me I might enjoy flying the thing LOL.

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