I am flying the new Magic 3D with a Rossi 45. Great palne and really fun, but it will not snap! The RX battery is positioned behind the rear of the fuel tank do it is not nose heavy. I have tried everyhing from giant control surface throws (almost 2 inches) and small throws (1/2 inch) with no snaps, but obviously different response rates. Is the Rudder to small on this plane to make the wing quit flying or what?? Full rudder, elevator, and aileron results in a tight spin but the plnae does enter into it in a snap roll as with most airplanes. An avalanche is out of the question. Any help will be appreciated. Rcmaniac6

Good question. You using standard servos?
Mine used to snap fine, and would spin fine, too... for about four outings.
I was having great fun with flatspins and such, too.
All of a sudden, I lost the ability to snap/spin/flatspin, all at one time.
I've found that I can hold the rudder straight, while giving full control at the stick,
and stall the servo, so I'm guessing I just wore out the rudder servo.
I'll try a stronger servo on the rudder, when I can get one, and see how that does...
but it just struck me as odd how it was doing it fine one day, then not the next

My CG is at 5 1/4" back from the leading edge, btw... I mounted the battery above the
elevator servo, just under the wing. that put me at 5" with no tailweight, with an OS 46.
I recently added tailweight to bring the CG back further, but no change in snaps/spins.
They just disappeared completely. Snaps are now barrel rolls, and spins are spiral dives instead

Rcmaniac6 replies to Reply: Yes, I am using 94102 standard Airtronics servos. Come to think of it, my first day out I was to able to snap and do flat spins. Then for all outings afterwards none of the same fun. Huh! You may be on to something here. I have not tried shifting the CG further back because I measured it as plenty far back already. It will not knfe edge either so with the pull-pull system that does not make sense either. If the servo is not strong enough then that would answer both issues. Thanks. Maybe more Magic owners will have more oppinions. Well see. Rcmaniac6

Rcmaniac6,

It may be the servos you're using does not have enough torque or are not fast enough. Try a very fast (less than .10 sec) speed servo on your rudder thay has at least 60 oz-in of torque. The HiTec 925 coreless isn't too bad on price and may be just the ticket.


Rob

I would try the cg. Even slow servos should make it snap. If the cg is too far forward, the plane would be too stable. That is my suggestion. Just dont move it a ton all at once.

If it also does not do knife edge you definetly have a problem with your rudder servo or with the pull-pull setup.

I have had one for over a year and rebuilt and crashed many times. I even put a modified 3D tail with huge oversized counterbalanced surfaces and fast sevos. It still won't positive snap. It will negative snap flat spin blender and all kinds of stuff. Just won't snap. I think its the hershey bar wing.

CG can't be it... both his and mine snapped just fine, first time out,
then lost the ability to do so. This is with no changes, on mine, at least.
I'm leaning very hard toward weak servos.
I noticed on the fourth time out, when it would still flatspin, that
after I wound it up flat, in another five or six turns, it started coming out.
It didn't do that the first three times out.
By the fifth day of flying, it wouldn't flatspin, nor snap, whatsoever.
Nothing changed at all in my config. Now it won't even enter a "regular" spin.
Whenever I get the extra dough, I'll swap in a couple servos to find out


As for the knife-edge, I think that's just the result of the small fuselage.

Just an idea, the pull/pull wires that came with the kit have way too much friction and will draw the servo down. I changed mine to kevlar thread and both the rudder and elevator became much more responsive.
My $.02.
basmntdweller

That's a very real possibility... you are correct in that those stock pull pulls
are very draggy. Thought about going to cables or 20 lb. test Firewire, myself.
As a matter of fact, I think I will, before I fly it again.

Also, forget about knife edge with this plane. It just isn't worth doing. You have to put in so much cross corrections and pitch correction that it puts so much drag that it hardly flies at all. It can be done but I have only been successful at full throttle and with a bunch of mixing. It's just not worth it.
basmntdweller

That theory the servo idea has great merit. I hope you guys a right because that would be an easy fix.

That's what forums are all about, people helping people! Thanks for all the ideas. Think I will try pull-pull cable first since I have that on-hand, and add my own idea. I read you get more servo power out of 6 volt RX batts than 4.8 volt. That may help, right? Rcmaniac6!

If your Magic WAS snapping and then quit, the servos theory is probably correct.

However, unless your MAGIC is built wildly different than mine or the hand full of others I have seen, your C.G MUST be WAAAYYY forward!

My Magic is powered by a fox 40 (9.5 oz), I have all mini servos, and a 250 mah batt wedged in the former aft of the tank. I still have 1 oz of lead in the tail. Test flights were performed without the additional lead, and the plane flew OK, but moving the C.G. back (adding the lead) unleashed this plane's potential. Snaps and loops tightnend unbelievably, hovering, elevators and high AOA flight were all noticeably easier as well.

Other magics at our club are powered by OS 46 fx's (13.2 oz). Some of these planes have up to 3 oz of lead in the tail!

My point is that your plane with a Rossi 45 (14.8 oz!!!) without any tail weight and with the batt behind the tank has got to be WAY WAY WAY nose heavy.

My magic exhibits NO bad habits with the aft CG, just be care-full in the event of a dead stick landing. You have got to keep the nose down for any kind of glide slope. Pull the nose up and she just sinks FAST...no tip stalling though.

Move the C.G. back...you'll like it!

Hope this helps
Michael

Hey I have the same problem with a new Weston Cougar 2000 and my old beat up Magic. I'm going to tiewrap a dumbell on the rear of both of them until they snap like a frozen twig in a tornado. Thanks

Rcmaniac6 here, the guy that started this thread! I am laughing my ass off at mups53's last post! Great attitude. I feel that way sometimes when working to overcome some of these RC challenges! I think my Rossi will pull that bumbell!! Love it and it's unlimited verticle! I will fly this weekend and will try the CG fix first. Then I'll go to the pull-pull wire fix. Then I'll try the powerfull servo fix if still no success, although I do not have anything but standard servos at present Think I'll go to the 6 volt RX battery before the high power servo. Thanks again to all. Looks like I have hit on a good issue here. Wonder what the Magic manufacturers have to say if the problem is thiswide spread? Rcmaniac6!

Mups is on track, for sure. If your's ain't snapping and spinning like a raped ape , then CG is probably the issue. I fly my magic with a bunch of garbage servos , one $30 Hitec 605 on the rudder and a really crappy old .46 two stroke . I even used the junky pull-pull hardware that it came with, friction and all.

However, I DO have a dumbell under the tail and that made a world of difference. OK, not a dumbell maybe, but a solid 3oz or more of lead laying right next to the tailskid.

I have been diggin' this plane

Hehehehe cheech,

I got all standard 3003's on mine, with the battery near the tail, stock linkage on the rudder. I can lose orientation on it, it snaps soo fast. I have about 3/8 of an oz back there, and my cg is at 5 inches or so. at 5 1/4 inches, it get a lil toooo tailheavy. It doesnt really do a true snap, like a sport model, but it flits and flings itself around like the videos showin a monkey on crack. It also helps to make sure you have alot of throw, at least 35 degrees on everything.

Steve

My rudder goes almost 90 degrees each way . It's ridiculous. The aileron throw is outraegous. The CG is aft of 5"; maybe at 5 3/8" or so. It was just beyond 5" then I lightened the front by adding the moose carbon fiber landing gear for eighteen bucks.

You sure are on target with "flits and flings itself around". That it does for sure. Neat plane

Mine is tail heavy alright. Pretty sporty.