U Cant Do good Elevators? Try Spoilerons!
 

For those like me new to 3D, I wanted to share that I just added a spoileron mix in for my U CAN DO. Spoilerons is a setup where the ailerons are moving together AND in the SAME direction as the elevator proportionally to your elevator input. Before the spoilerons I had really bad wing rock and really was impossible to keep from stalling during an "elevator". Now with the spoileron program added in, with full up elevator input the plane will descend very quickly with the plane flat with only a tiny amount of wing rock, that can be stopped with just a little rudder and aileron input to steer.
Another thing, as suggested, I put the spoileron mix on a spring switch so that when you let go of the switch it pops back to normal flight control. This is because , obviously, spoilerons are NOT condusive to lift and if you accidentally leave them on you will more than likely crash.

Are there any other uses for spoilerons?

RE: U Cant Do good Elevators? Try Spoilerons!
 

I use spoilerons for tighter waterfalls and they work great for KE spins. At least on my UCD. I have tried them on a couple other planes. Sometimes they help sometimes they hurt.
later,,,basmntdweller
I have also used them on planes that refused to flatspin otherwise.

RE: U Cant Do good Elevators? Try Spoilerons!
 

What % mix are you using for spoilerons? I'm gonna change mine to the spring switch. Already pancaked a FF Taco because I couldn't get my finger on the switch fast enough!

RE: U Cant Do good Elevators? Try Spoilerons!
 

There's a radio setup guide at www.3drc.info .. you might find tips handy. i'll be adding to it shortly.

I've been using spoilers on the spring switch from day 1 and never had any accidents from it.

RE: U Cant Do good Elevators? Try Spoilerons!
 

re; basmntdweller; its the same with flapperons... the hype 3d for instance is awesoem with flapperons and doesnt mind spoiler either, but many 3d funfly's are more 'picky'

RE: U Cant Do good Elevators? Try Spoilerons!
 

I mix 100% spoilerons on my Funtana. It works great for elevators like you said. It also makes for an awsum wall.
At the bottem of your fall on that elevator, blip the throttle to make the nose stand straight up and go into a torque roll.
I also use the mix to do waterfalls. It wont waterfall without them. I dont know about the spring loaded switch. It seams like a lot to do when your flipping it around. Are you holding it with your middle finger or what?
David

RE: U Cant Do good Elevators? Try Spoilerons!
 

With most of my 3d ships I use spoilerons for harrier, elevator, wall ,blender, hover, torque roll.. pretty much everything, however with my 2m funtana, i very often take the spoiler out once in a harrier, and i also take them out just before touchdown in a harrier landing, just to cushion the touch. I also use them to tidy up snaprolls, and dependant on the model for tumbles. They also seem to work well for tailslides.

RE: U Cant Do good Elevators? Try Spoilerons!
 

JoeBob,
I have 100% spoileron mix as well. Reason being,, a buddy with a 30% Lanier Edge Im guessing has maybe 10-20% in and it still wingrocks pretty badly on elevators. So I figured on a spring switch I would go for it and then if its no good I just let go, land and adjust. But 100% worked out really well for my U CAN DO. The difference it made was stunning to me. With 100% mix and full up elevator the plane sat flat and level and fell almost straight down, with just a little steering required. Looks way cool.

Daveopam,
I fly with thumbs so have it on the spring switch(default assignment snap roll/trainer) located top left rear switch on my 9C. I just reach up and grab it with my index finger and fly as usual with my thumbs. When Im done I let go and fly out. That 3D site Welsh is talking about really spooked me about losing lift with spoilerons and crashing so I took the conservative route and put it on a spring switch as they suggested, but its really comfortable ergomonically in that location on my transmitter. I do my snap rolls by hand, and my trainer is on an Airtronics transmitter so I figure if I train anyone anytime soon it wont be with this transmitter.

Welsh3D,
Thats the website I was referring to that I used to get started. Excellent advice you gave from another thread.

I also took your guidance on the site and added flaperons on a regular on/off switch( linked to elevator same as spoileron, but movement in opposite direction as elevator travel and same 100% rate) , waterfalls got mucho tighter. Knife edge spin went off the charts too, when you hit full throttle you better pray the stab or wings dont come off cause it is spinning unbelievably fast. :D I got some serious compliments from my RC mentor, hes about 70 years old and he really dug it!

I printed out the 3D tips from the site as well, only thing missing I wanted was how to do a harrier.

I have been trying so hard to torque roll or hover but I just cant seem to figure it out.[:o]

Otherwise Im having a blast[8D]

RE: U Cant Do good Elevators? Try Spoilerons!
 

I'd love to try the spring switch but both my radios are heli versions and the spring switch is on the right hand side of the tx. It would be pretty tough to hang on to the switch and still fly the ailerons and elevators. I put my spoilerons and flaperons on the three position switch to the left of my aileron DR switch (Futaba 9C). Up is spoilerons and down is flaperons.
basmntdweller

RE: U Cant Do good Elevators? Try Spoilerons!
 

dweller,
I am just now learnig to use spoilerons. Will the plane fly out well enough to give you time to switch out of spoileron mode pretty comfortably so you can make the switch? Being fairly new I have a tendency to fumble around a bit looking for my switches. I put all of my control surface rates on the same switch just to the right of the triple rate switch you are using. That way I fumble less. Its finally starting to get automatic switching back and forth. Plus I have enough expo in my high rates that all I really use low rate for anymore is takeoff and landing..

RE: U Cant Do good Elevators? Try Spoilerons!
 

Why not try setting up and using snap spoilerons instead. You have to have 5 point mix available to to this though. I set my spoilers to go up at 75 percent of the elevator throw. Much better than having it on a spring switch IMO.

RE: U Cant Do good Elevators? Try Spoilerons!
 

Hi Guys,

I am following most of the U Can Do 3D threads as I am building a 60 size for winter flying. It's nice to see people sharing their ideas and experiences. I will definitely be using some advice from here including the spoileron mix. I have a Futaba 9CAP as well and now have two Edge 540 Ts I will be flying this summer and do use some mixes. For the guys who are putting your mixes on a spring loaded switch because of reaction time or not remembering to switch off the mix, I would suggest you don't. If you are serious about 3D there will be more than one mix you will need and will not have a bunch of spring loaded switches to use. I have a really bad memory too but try hard to remember my switches. I also have all my switches programmed for one direction so if I am in doubt, I flip all my switches up before landing. You are starting a bad habit and will have a hard time if you got into giant scale aerobatic planes. Just try to practice and remember to switch off the mix. By avoiding the need to remember to turn your mix off is not helping you to become a better pilot. Flying has a lot to do with discipline and memory. With practice the switching will become automatic as you add up elevator while turning. As the old saying goes practice, practice, practice. I use my spring loaded switch to kill my ignition on my gas engines and my glow engines as well. I build on board glow for my glow engines and the carb has to closed all the way before the engine quits running. So my memory is programmed to hit that switch for engine kill, is automatic the minute I land. Why not use Switch B on the 9 CAP? The use of a TX neck strap helps as well as it leaves more fingers free for switching. There is also an after market manual for the 9CAP which has a lot more info than the original.

RE: U Cant Do good Elevators? Try Spoilerons!
 

I use a 9cap, all the switches are selectable, and mine are on the right hand side... I have spoilers on the big spring at the back and flaps on the small one in the front. If you cannot reach these switches, you might learn to hold the tx a little higher and reduce your stick height, I have ail and ele on the right and personally i think it's easier than throttle on the right, but its only what youre used to at the end of the day.


IMO having them on any type of fixed position switch is less than ideal. A friend of mine also flies 3d and uses a WC2.... He holds the tx slighly different to me and finds it difficult to operate the long spring switch at the back (my advice) Needless to say he tried all switches, and it did result in some spectacular harrier crashes?! when he couldnt get the spoiler out quick enough... Not quick field repairs though....ruins the days flying!!
Right now we're working on setting 3d mixes onto the slide sliders, completely up for spoil, down for flap and all of the neutral area for nothing.

I personally wouldnt bother doing anything low if your not on a spring switch, it's just too risky, it only needs a gust to put you in the wrong position, and at that poinbt you're already concetrating so hard on the flying, you dotn want to be fumbling over your aileron stick to flick a switch down!!

another use of spoileron, but you have to think really fast, I had a deadstick out of a tailslide, id say about 30 feet i had to pull out with a 3styla, wouldnt have been quite enough room to pull out with my setup (at the time nose heavy) I got to about 5 foot off the floor and it was still about 25 deg nose down, i pulled in the spoilers and it levelled off perfectly, it was a heavy landing but didnt damage anything... dread to see what had happened... so they can get you out of the s##t sometimes!

RE: U Cant Do good Elevators? Try Spoilerons!
 

i use a Futaba FF6 and my spolierons are on the spoiler switch. I havent used it much except to taxy as it keeps the plane on the ground. Ive tried it in an elevator but it makes the wings wobbe more. Any help pls, its a tipless flip 3D i fly.

RE: U Cant Do good Elevators? Try Spoilerons!
 

i trust you have them at a set value nd not proportional to the elevator input?!? they do need to be proportional for the best results.

RE: U Cant Do good Elevators? Try Spoilerons!
 

I also use spoilerons for most of my 3D the same as nathan...and have the FF9 and also i have it on the spring switch which makes it easy to get at...

Dean

RE: U Cant Do good Elevators? Try Spoilerons!
 

Nath. Ive got my elevator at 0% and my flaps at 50%. I flck the switch and the flaps go up. Nothing else. I will mix them into aPMX when i go flying next. I would heve used theese for KE apart from it only uses 1 aileron insted of both to mix it out.

Ian

RE: U Cant Do good Elevators? Try Spoilerons!
 

To get it to use both use 2 Pmixs..... problem then is u start running out of mixes....

RE: U Cant Do good Elevators? Try Spoilerons!
 

Does your pmix have a parameter is the setup to "link" on or off? If so and your second aileron/flap is on channel 6 you should be able to turn the link on and control both surfaces from from 1 mix. You may have to set the rates opposite,i.e. one -50% and one +50% but it should work that way if you have it??

RE: U Cant Do good Elevators? Try Spoilerons!
 

Yes link should be on.... edible engine uses a T6X, which doesnt have the option to link or select switch.

If you all read up on the radio guide at www.3drc.info it says there. If anyone would like to assist me by giving details about setting up for different brands of radio, that would be much appreciated.

RE: U Cant Do good Elevators? Try Spoilerons!
 

I just got a 9C for christmas. If I read the book correctly, you can set the spoilerons to become active with a preset ELEV position. In other words it can be set it to kick the spoilerons in @ 90% of elevator stick movement. Will have to experiment with it once it's in the plane. You guys might also try putting a piece of fuel line on the switches you use the most. It makes them a lot easier to find.

David

RE: U <span class=
 

Great thread BigNed, just the info I've been looking for. I'm gonna try this setup on my JR388 w/ spring switch for my Flip. Will post results soon...Thanks!

RE:
 

daveopam,
If you figure that out let me know, I looked into it but couldnt figure it out. It would be great to only have the spoilerons kick in at a high elevator input.


Thanks Johnny, we newbies have to help each other out.

I found this clarified version of the 9C manual on the web. I dont know who wrote it.[link=http://www.hobbypeople.com/hobbypeople/download/FF9.pdf]Link to 9C Manual[/link]

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Hello everyone I'm mike in Kalamazoo this is my first post. I'm asking basmntdweller how he programed his 9c for the flaperons and spoilerons ? or if any body can help me with this.

thanks the old fart

RE: RE:
 

Excellent post ned, thanks for sharing the info. I am new to 3D and still am learning what some of these terms really mean and this thread helped alot! I will program this for my UCANDO as well now!!

keep it coming guys!



matt

RE: RE:
 

I just got a 9Z, so I'm going to try snap spoilerons this season. I tried to make them work on the 9C, but it's not capable. The "snap" part of the equation eliminates (at least for me) the need to hold a switch for a wall, parachute, or waterfall. You can program the radio to bring spoilers up or down to a certain position (and hold it there) given a certain elevator position. For example, at 75% elevator throw, spoilers come up to 50% and hold, regardless of how much the elevator goes up after 75%. At elevator throw 0% - 75%, spoilers stay down.

So, if you are in bind, and need to get out of a harrier, you know anything less than 75% elevator (for example) will bring the spoliers down.

For those of you interested, the 9C (with a 5 point curve) can snap the spoilers up, give a certain elevator position, but continue to rotate after they've snapped up. They will not hold in a give position. 9Z will hold them, or so I'm told.

Drew

RE: RE:
 

I think your right about the 9C Drew. I have spent several hours trying to get the spoilerons to only work at 90% ELEV. I just cant get it done. It will do one AILE with the wing mixing of but not both. For now I have the spoilerons on the trainer switch like was suggested here.

David

RE: RE:
 

David,

the 9C will do it, partially. Go to 5 point curve (mix 6) set the following --- Master = Elevator, Slave = Flap, Link = On, Trim = Off.
Curve settings:
1=75% (or whatever flap position you want)
2 = 0
3 = 0
4 = 0
5 = -75%
You also need to activate Flaperon.

What does all this mean? When elevator stick reaches point 2 (which is between neutral and full elevator stick movement) spoilers will start to come up, but they don't snap to a certain position. As you move from point 2 to point 1, the spoilers will come up to 75% at a linear relationship. This info contradicts my previous email. I just looked at my 9C, and remembered how it works.

In a nut shell. When you pull back on elevator to 50%, spoilers start coming up. When you pull all the way back on the elevator, the spoilers come up to 75%.

I hope this helps.

Drew

RE: RE:
 

I just got the 9C myself and was wondering the exact same things you guys were. This thread definatly cleared a lot of things up. I have the Morris the knife plane with a ys63 on it. I am very anxious to get into the 3D world with my new radio. Spoilerons and flaperons were confusing me a bit but you guys cleared that up. I went ahead and bought the Hitec neck strap for my remote. I anticipated from owning the T6XAS that switching all of the mixes was going to be a pain while holding the remote with one hand or partial one hand. Not to boot the 9CAP is much heaver than the 6XAS. Already I feel more comfortable I can let go of the radio wiht my left hand and still manuver my plane while I quickly flip a switch. I didnt think a little neck strap would of made such a big difference but to me it did. I to set up spoilerons and flaperons on my Morris I used one of the triple switches to turn the mix on and off and then they will deflect according to the amout of throw I put into the elevator. I use the center position as off. I dont quite know how this will work but i feel comfortable with it so far.

RE: U Cant Do good Elevators? Try Spoilerons!
 

Drew I guess the radio is smarter then me.(not very difficult) I still cant get it to do both AILE. It will only do one or the other. I think I'll set up another plane in model two. then tinker with it some more. It's working Ok on the trainer switch for now.

David

RE: U Cant Do good Elevators? Try Spoilerons!
 

Dave,
This may be a totally stupid question. Im at work so I cant look at my radio but in the flaperon mix if there is a place to do it, is the link function "ON"? If it is not, only 1 aileron or the other will work,,,, if Im thinking right. [&:] Also I think you have to be plugged into channels 1 and 6, if you are on 1 and 7 or ailevator is enabled I dont think it will work. I dont think you can use ailevator and flaperon/spoilerons at the same time. Im going off memory so just ignore me if Im off base:eek: