Rolling Circles
 

OK guys is it easier for you to roll inside the circle or outside the circle?

For me its far easier to roll outside.
Example, roll left and have the circle go to the right.


How about you?

Rolling Circles
 

I'll respond like Quique when asked about a maneuver:

"It's quite easy... like all of the maneuvers."

:D

Rolling Circles
 

I'm not an expert at that , I can only do a rolling circle on a good day. I find it much easier to roll to the out side.

outside
 

I'm still pretty much a roller beginner, but I find it easier to roll outside too. I think that's because it's natural to push a bit early when rolling to inverted. Push early rolling outside and it helps you move in the "circle direction". Push early rolling inside and you go the wrong way.

Want to cheat a roller? Set the CG so that inverted flight requires no down stick. Then trim your plane via the radio so that it tucks on one knife edge and pulls on the other. Now you can do a pretty good rolling circle with virtually no elevator input required :D

Rolling Circles
 

Thats like using codes on computer games. (whisper) newbie ;)

Rolling Outside
 

Hello Wayne and all, Rod & Chris here in PA.
I just voted ouside also (now 77 %) , it just seems much more natural.I have to think to hard to roll well to the inside, but like anything else , if we practice enough - we can do it !
Keep Having FUN and the nose UP !! Rod & Chris

Rolling Circles
 

Hey everyone. Guess I'm the odd guy out. Rolling to the inside was so much easier for me to learn, by myself. Believe it is because rolling and adding up is how we learn to make our turns from the first flight out.

I personally have a difficult time with outside rolling circles, and it isn't done that way until Unlimited in IMAC as all Advanced rollers are to the inside. Also have found Rudder is paramount in an Outside roller, but to the inside, is not as important, as I learned to do them without rudder. May just be me!!

Glad to finally be on this board.

ed

Rolling Circles
 

I have been praticing inside rollers on G2. Its not that bad once you've seen what it needs. I had to break it down 1/4 roll at a time.
Inside rollers are still kinda sloppy but, getting there.

You can roll outside the turn?
 

I can only roll to the inside, never even attempted rolling outside on a real plane, but can do it on fms sim. Rolling inside feels much more natural, and I can do it without rudder input, but I find (in the world of simulators)that some rudder is needed to roll it outside. I know a real rolling circle should have rudder control either way, but I'm working on one thing at a time ;)

Rolling Circles
 

I am finding that rolling circles for me are easier to the inside. But best done kinda high, because man I get dorked up real quick! :D

Rolling Circles
 

Definitely outside!

I can do very nice outside rolling cicles low to the ground. But my inside rolling circles turn into rolling loops. :D Need more practice with those I suppose!

I go both ways
 

With the rudder that is :stupid: I'm trying real hard to make the rudder an autonomic response no matter which direction or maneuver I'm doing. Snaps, slow and point rolls and rolling circles use different inputs for different directions. The plane even acts differently sometimes when doing maneuvers in one direction or another. Oh well, back to G2 for awhile_Bob

Rolling Circles
 

If you're interested in competition, you will have to learn them in both directions anyway. Practice is the key here.. Smart practice. Build into it.. don't go out and try to do a full 4 roll circle if you're having trouble with the 1st roll. Just do the 1st 90 degrees w/1 roll until that's smooth.. then add the next roll.

Once you're happy with a 4 roll circle in one direction.. do it again in the other direction.. then change the roll direction from inside to outside (or vice versa).

Then start reducing the number of rolls.. :-)

In all cases.. the slower you can roll the better, since you can watch what the airplane is doing easier. I tend to make circles as big as I can stand.

-Doug

Outside makes the rudder natural.
 

With the outside roll, the rudder is coordinated just as when rolling to knife-edge, leaving only the elevator input to learn. That makes it easier and more natural to learn.

However, DCronkhite is absolutely correct...learn them all and in both directions. With discipline, one can learn them in a season. Practice your slow rolls in both direction, knife-edge too, to limber up the brain and the thumbs, then work your rollers starting by the quarter.

By the end of the season, you will be twice the pilot you were before.

Mark

Rolling Circles
 

Gee, rolling is easy...right, left, inside, outside, no problems at all! Now, if I can only get the "circle" part down!!

I still seem to have a tough time of it, been working on G2 to try and help get the fingers to do what they are supposed to do, but for some reason, it's been one of the hardest manuevers for me to coordinate!

But, that's going to be my main emphasis in practice this coming flying season, so hopefully both the inside and outside, will be accomplished come fall...

Rolling Circles
 

Outside is somewhat easier, especially when you do one roll in a 360 turn. Multiples are easier outside as well perhaps due to torque varations along with all the other variables!

Rolling Circles
 

Guys iam 17 and it isnt that bad. Try doing the circle while rolling one outside the one inside for each roll around the entire circle ....now thats fun....

Rolling Circles
 

I can only roll to the inside and they only look nice when I do the circle in a clockwise direction. I need to do as Doug has sugested and start practicing the other direction more.

But here is a hint for learning that helped me. A couple years ago the IMAC advanced sequence had a manuver where the pilot would fly a circle with half rolls at each of the 90° points. I watched the advanced guys fly this manuver and was intrigued. So I tried it, and after a short time I began strecthing out the rolls. I progressivly stretched out the rolls more and more and worked on the timing. Pretty soon I was doing a 4 roll circle with the plane upright at each 90° point. I think breaking down the roll in the beginning helped a lot. Of course, lots of regular 4 point roll practice was thrown in too.

Wiz

Rolling Circles
 

There's a video clip of an alternating roller on my site listed below.

Rolling Circles
 

Hi Ed, I'm new here also, looks like it's gonna be fun though. Regarding rollers, I started doing them outside because it looked "Kewl", rolling one direction and turning another. You're right, though, IMAC's rollers are inside, so gotta practice them also (right and left!).

Rolling Circles
 

Me? Inside is the easy one. If you do it inside and to the left you will have torque helping you. The rolling circle is easy if you rember to make your turn with the elevator. Think of it as a horizontal loop and "pull" the nose into the circle when the planes top is toward you and "push" the nose around the circle when the planes bottom is toward you. The only confusing part is when the plane is comming back at you. Control reversel big time. Keep praticing, then bring it down on the deck to really wow the crowd. Pete

"Aint no substitute for cubes"

rolling circles
 

I learned them to the outside first, which was easier at first. Now I am comfortable with them to the inside too, although I still have to concentrate more to the inside than to the outside. Try a rolling circle and loop combo :D Both to the inside and outside.

Wheats

Rolling Circles
 

I learned mine on G2 going to the outside first.
I thought it looked real cool rolling one direction and turning another.

Know i love doing an inside rolling turn right on take off, and then switching the heading of the turn while still rolling in the same direction thus performing an outside rolling circle.

Rollers!
 

I too find Insiders to be much easier, since no rudder input is necessary. I was told they can't be learned on a LT-40 Kadet. O Well! Now, insiders are like second nature. I've tried outsiders, but they do seem to require rudder input in order to complete them in a controlled manner. On insiders with out rudder, the elevator is what carves the circle. It's just a matter of timed application.

A very helpful article on the subject was written by Dan Wolanski in the March 2000 MAN. It breaks the manuever down in such a way that helps you learn it in individual components which makes it easy once you put all the components together. It seems like Dan likes outsiders better also!

Re: Rollers!
 

Bralex, you're right, rollers are fun to do. If you have a fast roll rate, then you're right in saying that the timed application of the elevator works to carve the circle and maintain altitude. It really doesn't matter whether inside or outside, with a fast roll rate and properly time elevator inputs, both will work equally well.

What causes rudder to be required is slowing down the roll rate, and slowing down the number of rolls in the circle. The more time spent in the knife edge position, the more rudder is required to maintain altitute. A roller with, say, only three turns or two turns, (or even a single turn) in the circle requires the rudder to be equally as effective as the elevator in carving the circle and maintaining altitude.

There's a video clip of a 3 turn roller with alternating inside and outside rolls here: www.rcsites.net/tmills . Just click the plane picture of the Extra, and see what I'm talking about.