edge,cap, extra, giles...what's the difference?
 

Hi
I'm a total newbie and I'm looking 2nd plane that I can use for aerobatics. I was just wondering what's the difference between the different designs of an extra 300, cap 232, giles 202, and edge 540? Do they all fly the same or is one better than the other when it comes to stability, or certian patterns?

Thanks

Ron

edge,cap, extra, giles...what's the difference?
 

any one of those you listed should NOT be a 2nd plane.... some of them could be if they were setup with things... but you would be better off with something else as a 2nd plane.... something a little more tame...... and i can only speak for caps..... because they are my favorite planes :D now... people say they have bad tip stalling tendencies... well i have found that not to be true... as long as you keep the weight down as much as possible and not have TOO much power... a little extra is good :D but not TOO much....



David

Good second plane!
 

I agree with 3dkid! You want to get an inbetween plane before jumping into one of the "big boy" planes!! I recommend the Hanger 9 Advance 40! This was my choice for a second plane, because I was looking for something with a low wing, tricycle gear and enough power (OS 46FX) to be dangerous when I want to be!! This plane is very forgiving right out of the box! Just be sure to keep the speed up on landing and you'll be knife edging in no time!! With a 10x6 prop it will hover for a few seconds then eventually fall off! But for learning the aerobatic basics this is what I recommend! Good Luck and have fun!! :cool: :D

edge,cap, extra, giles...what's the difference?
 

i had a ADVANCE for my 2nd plane too! :) loved that plane... but as far as i know they don't make them anymore do they? thats what i would have said he should get.... but they don't seem to be making them anymore...



David

Why ?????
 

I bought mine about 6-7 months ago... I'm sure there are still a few out there!! That makes no sense to me?? Why get rid of a great aerobatic trainer. Oh well at least I still have mine! I was thinking of selling it to help fund my new Edge, but now I think I'll keep it around for Sunday flying!!

edge,cap, extra, giles...what's the difference?
 

yeah i wish i still had one to mess around with... but i have my profiles so i'm cool :)




David

edge,cap, extra, giles...what's the difference?
 

I disagree with all of you.
On low rates, a 1/4 scale Sukhoi, Extra, Edge, Cap or Giles would make a good second plane. A 60 size Extra was my second plane and a 1/4 scale Sukhoi was my third. I set the Sukhoi up so that several of my friends have flown it (on buddy box) with no problems.

Re: edge,cap, extra, giles...what's the difference?
 

Greetings Ron and welcome to RC Universe,

Lots of information posted however to answer your question here goes:
Difference of the planes above? If you put all the names of the ones you listed and picked one out of a hat you wouldn't make a bad choice. There is less than 5% differences in them overall since they have all been designed to accomplish the same task.
The Edge has a straight leading edge (makes it slower to stall and is very popular in 3D and freestyle flying).
The Giles has a straight trailing edge and performs rolling maneuvers very axially.
The Extras and Caps both have a tapered wing (leading and trailing plus thickness called a 4 way taper). The CAP has the stab forward of what the Extra does which makes it more pitch sensitive. Overall I would select the Extra for overall performance. I own all except an Edge (but have flown several for other pilots). My favorites are the Extra and CAP (hence EXCAP232). The Sukhoi flies much like an Extra it just has more frontal area from the radial shape of the full scale.

I disagree with Geistware and don't recommend any of these as a second plane. I much prefer to see a set of steps rather than leaps in learning. Some do well however most don't and need the learning curve to gain the necessary reaction to a situation. I have seen all too often trying to fly an aircraft beyond piloting capability end a modeling career. A properly set up aerobatic plane is a joy to fly and I have let quite a few pilots try mine. While they were capable of flying under supervision it would not be the best approach in my opinion for either the learning curve or from a safety standpoint. I have spent much of my career teaching and these methods have been proved by many others in many different fields.

The above is my opinion. Others opinions may well differ.

Good luck,
EXCAP232

edge,cap, extra, giles...what's the difference?
 

EXCAP232,
While stretching to a 1/4 scale or larger plane as your second plane is not for everyone, if you are patent in flying and constantly practice the basics, a aerobatic plane is not a bad choice. While I don't profess to be an expert with may years experience, My second plane was an aerobatic plane, I know Tim Mills cousin, soloed on a Breitlin Cap. In both cases, the pilots and their instructors emphasized patience and the continuous pursuit of the basics!

Those who have seen Tim Mills fly can attest to the fact he is a great pilot. When he gets a new plane he practices landing it. I have seen him burn a gallon or more of fuel in one day doing nothing but landing. I asked him why and he told me that regardless of what happens, he wants to be able to bring the plane down in one piece. While I don't use an entire gallon, my first 3-5 flights do nothing but trim the plane for straight and level flight, then landing!

With all due respect
 

Geistware,
While there is the exception to the rule for the majority of those learning anything it is best to make steps. Some solo or teach themselves to fly or whatever? I have seen many who say they taught themselves to play the (insert favorite musical instrument name) and have endured many a bad musician's try. Yes there are the exceptions and some even win the lottery. The odds are just about equal. It seems we have a difference of opinion (as you stated "I disagree with all of you." which is your right and priviledge.) Most however don't in my opinion. Shall we agree to disagree?

This is off topic so if you wish to discuss this further send a PM or email as this is not helping the member that started this thread.

Best regards,
EXCAP232

edge,cap, extra, giles...what's the difference?
 

If you're interested in growing your skills, you might want to consider a profile plane such as the Morris Topcap. On low rates, it's as tame as a trainer...

edge,cap, extra, giles...what's the difference?
 

Although it's not on the list and also not 1/4 scale I think a Sig S.E. with the rates turned way down would be an excelent 2nd plane. I know it will land slower than a trainer and when your ready, yeeehaw, then step up to that 1/4 scale aerobat.

edge,cap, extra, giles...what's the difference?
 

I agree go with something like an advance or SE.. both EXCELLENT flying planes.

edge,cap, extra, giles...what's the difference?
 

I would also add the Hangar9 40 size ultrastick. This is a very very good 2nd plane in my opinion because it keeps you learning and you can add many more maneuvers to your repituore as time passes by.
Because this plane has the option for flaps and ailerons ( I would suggest you build it that way) all sort of tricks are possible like truly slow vertical dives and forward flight with the crow feature deployed, Tail bitting waterfall maneuvers with flaps working in conjunction with elevators and very stable hovering type maneuvers with flaps going up as spoilers.
Also chances are that as a newbie you probably have a lot of questions about computer radios and there features, the planes manual gives all the info you need on setting up a computer radio for the particular maneuvers as well as what certain radio features do like Expo and Program mixes.
And at only $129.00 this makes this easy to build and easy to fly aerobatic trainer a great bang for the buck. All the maneuvers that a cap and extra at this size would do, this plane will do and many more. Add an OS .46 fx with a Dubb Jett or Dynathrust tuned muffler and you will never regret it.

edge,cap, extra, giles...what's the difference?
 

Check out section 18 and beyond.

Pdf file....
http://horizon.hobbyshopnow.com/shar...675-manual.pdf

edge,cap, extra, giles...what's the difference?
 

1.20 and .40 size


http://horizon.hobbyshopnow.com/shar...llery1-800.jpg

edge,cap, extra, giles...what's the difference?
 

edge,cap, extra, giles...what's the difference?
 

I'll take an even slightly different approach and recommend the UCD as a second plane. It is bigger than the SE and the advance, but as long as you fly it with very low rates it's basically like a trainer. The nice thing about the UCD is that when you gain more skill you can really ring it out. After you master the UCD you'll probably be ready for the Edge :)

edge,cap, extra, giles...what's the difference?
 

Yep, the UCD would make a great aerobatic trainer. The only thing that distinguishes it from the rest of the bunch is that you will either learn throttle management very quickly, or you will learn about flutter the hard way.

Thank You
 

I really appreciate all your suggestions and now I will start looking into both the SE and UCD. I have seen the SE fly before and it looks like a really fun plane. The UCD looks cool too. I was also looking at GP Ultra sport 40 + Kit too. I'd like to do a kit, but I don't have the space right now to build it.

Again, thanks for all the info. I actually just came back from flying my trainer. I'm so addicted.

Ron

edge,cap, extra, giles...what's the difference?
 

i have owned both the ultra stick and the u can do in my opinion the u can do is the more capabel of the two it has a wider range in speed and aerobatics and a lower wing loading wich makes it more stable and easyer to recover from any manover you can learn any manover with it as for fluter i haven't encounterd any i have a satio 91 in it and have 15-6 prop on it start out mild and work your way up you wont be disapointed as far as aerbatic scale planes go i have flone them all in my opinion the edge is the best because of it's mid wing plasment hope this is some help

edge,cap, extra, giles...what's the difference?
 

I agree with the others about the UCD 3D. However that's only if YOU have the determination to learn the basics and MASTER the basics before you attempt the wild maneuvers this plane is capable of. With the abilities of this plane with the appropriate engine, there will be A LOT of temptation to try the wild stuff before you learn how to get your ***** out of trouble. Also you would need a computer radio with the UCD and have someone set it up to mix out the rudder coupling this plane has while in knifedge. You could start with a standard radio and then eventually work into a PC radio with mixing and expo.

Best of luck!!..............Mark

edge,cap, extra, giles...what's the difference?
 

ron

edge,cap, extra, giles...what's the difference?
 

sorry about the glich ron but what mark points out is imporant you must be patient learn the bacis one step at a time don't be in a hurry to do 3d having said this i still think the u can do is your best bet it will do bacics very good when you learn the bacis the plane can take you to the next level without the expence of another airplane another advantage is that you will be framiler with how the plane reacts wich is imporant when learning the hier risk 3d manuvers bob

edge,cap, extra, giles...what's the difference?
 

I have to agree with Gistware,
I don't think any of those planes would make a bad second plane. However, I agree with all of you suggesting not to as well. The difference is you need the experience in how to set up the arobatic planes. Sloppy linkages, wrong CG, mal-adjusted engines- wrong throws will crash the plane every time. and every time I seen someone with one of these planes as a second crashed for those reasons. When trimmed out and set up right, they fly gracefully and easily. Just be carefull of a nasty stall if try to use too much control input or slow it down to much.
RickP