Pusher AP plane build thread
03-11-2006, 09:40 PM
#226
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RE: Pusher AP plane build thread
ORIGINAL: kd7ost
OK,
What's a Goose Man?
Dan
OK,
What's a Goose Man?
Dan
03-12-2006, 02:47 PM
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RE: Pusher AP plane build thread
My computer motherboard was quickly giving up the ghost and so I have been down for a day or two. Had to order a new mobo which in turn meant a new case and power supply, which in turn meant a new processor....ahhhh! Ah well up and running now, much faster and it's stable...wahoo! OK, back to topic at hand.
03-22-2006, 08:46 PM
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RE: Pusher AP plane build thread
ORIGINAL: Skycam41
Maiden flight is scheduled for this coming sat pm...weather permitting.
Maiden flight is scheduled for this coming sat pm...weather permitting.
03-22-2006, 08:49 PM
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RE: Pusher AP plane build thread
ORIGINAL: yardlight
good to know I'll bring a video camera!! Good Luck
ORIGINAL: Skycam41
Maiden flight is scheduled for this coming sat pm...weather permitting.
Maiden flight is scheduled for this coming sat pm...weather permitting.
03-25-2006, 07:43 PM
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RE: Pusher AP plane build thread
The yellow goose flies!! With no wind, grey skies and no excuses it was time to quit kicking the tires and get rolling. First observation is that I have to have more ground clearance to the prop. With a 12x6 I have very little room at all for any kind of rotation and flare. Maybe I can bend the main gear in a bit to give more clearance.
OK, taxi's very nice and very stable. Throttle up, tracks well, power up to full and just a hint of up and it basically lifted up on its own. Hmmm, nice aileron repsonse and whaooo is it ever elevator sensitive...and I thought my elevator might be too small...haha. Two clicks or right trim and two up and we are flying hands free
It basically flies like a heavy cargo plane....slow and boring, just like Dan said it would be! With the new Irvine .53 that has only had minutes on it I was quite suprised how spirited it was in the air. Take off took a fair bit of room but ut seemed once flying it would zip right along. OK, up high, throttle back and it wants to come down but with some up elevator it held in there pretty good and would fly pretty slowly. I think if I had a dead stick this thing would be down pretty quick though! Speaking of landing I lined up, reduced the throtlle to idle (fast idle) and let it settle in. This is where I really noticed the lack of ground clearance as I have virtually no room to flare. Slight hop on landing but not too bad at all.
I did try the flaperons and this suprised me, the plane pitched hard down!? I thought it would pitch up but it just dropped the nose right away...any thoughts? I had about 30% of total aileron throw for the flaperons to drop.
All together had four flights. I do have it on video if anyone is interested?
OK, taxi's very nice and very stable. Throttle up, tracks well, power up to full and just a hint of up and it basically lifted up on its own. Hmmm, nice aileron repsonse and whaooo is it ever elevator sensitive...and I thought my elevator might be too small...haha. Two clicks or right trim and two up and we are flying hands free
It basically flies like a heavy cargo plane....slow and boring, just like Dan said it would be! With the new Irvine .53 that has only had minutes on it I was quite suprised how spirited it was in the air. Take off took a fair bit of room but ut seemed once flying it would zip right along. OK, up high, throttle back and it wants to come down but with some up elevator it held in there pretty good and would fly pretty slowly. I think if I had a dead stick this thing would be down pretty quick though! Speaking of landing I lined up, reduced the throtlle to idle (fast idle) and let it settle in. This is where I really noticed the lack of ground clearance as I have virtually no room to flare. Slight hop on landing but not too bad at all.
I did try the flaperons and this suprised me, the plane pitched hard down!? I thought it would pitch up but it just dropped the nose right away...any thoughts? I had about 30% of total aileron throw for the flaperons to drop.
All together had four flights. I do have it on video if anyone is interested?
03-25-2006, 08:43 PM
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RE: Pusher AP plane build thread
Hi Skycam41,
I would love to see the video of the flight. Glad to hear you you got her back in one piece. As far as the flaperon problem about the only thing I can think of is to reduce the throws perhaps try 10%, graduating up to ---%. I've never encountered this problem with flaps before as the nose should pitch up with flaps deployed. Great to hear of the successful flight! Ben
I would love to see the video of the flight. Glad to hear you you got her back in one piece. As far as the flaperon problem about the only thing I can think of is to reduce the throws perhaps try 10%, graduating up to ---%. I've never encountered this problem with flaps before as the nose should pitch up with flaps deployed. Great to hear of the successful flight! Ben
03-25-2006, 09:41 PM
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RE: Pusher AP plane build thread
The raw video...no music, just 2 stroke and wind! [link=http://www3.telus.net/flyinking/goose.wmv]Video link[/link]
A very special thanks to Mike & Dan for their inspiration and help with this project. I was not nervous at all on the maiden, the plane design instills confidence. I need to work on just a few things like ground clearance etc but have a look at the video and let me know your observations, comments etc.
A very special thanks to Mike & Dan for their inspiration and help with this project. I was not nervous at all on the maiden, the plane design instills confidence. I need to work on just a few things like ground clearance etc but have a look at the video and let me know your observations, comments etc.
03-25-2006, 09:49 PM
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RE: Pusher AP plane build thread
NOTHING SAYS SUCCESS LIKE VIDEO!!!
Very, very nice Mike. It sounds so much like my Grey Ghost when it passes and Im using a .32 heli engine! It flies awesome, ground handling seems really responsive, I just cannot say enough about this project, Mike.
WELL DONE!!
Mike
Very, very nice Mike. It sounds so much like my Grey Ghost when it passes and Im using a .32 heli engine! It flies awesome, ground handling seems really responsive, I just cannot say enough about this project, Mike.
WELL DONE!!
Mike
03-25-2006, 10:26 PM
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RE: Pusher AP plane build thread
Congratulations Mike,
You did a great job building and flying that plane. I've seen factory designed trainers that didn't do that well on a maiden flight. It looked very solid but did seem to be ready to fly again once it touched down. The prop clearance is certainly a concern in these designs. I would replace the main gear with a taller one or bend it or whatever, but still make sure that it's pretty stiff. I would straighten the nose gear up and flip it back around. That will get you better clearance. I would make sure the landing gear is set height wise so that on the ground the main wing is sitting 0 to -1 degrees incidence.
The down pitch you see with your flaps is correct in a plane like this. It's all about where the flaps are generating lift with respect to the mass and drag. In a conventional aircraft, the wing is pretty far forward. Close to the nose. Flaps deployed lifts the wing and the nose as a result. If the wing was in the rear, like a delta or flying wing, the flaps would lift the wing trailing edge and the rear end. In your mid high wing design, their are a couple of other factors. Your fuselage is out front with a lot of horizontal surface area. (Big flat top) Vertical ascent, (pushing the plane upward) with the flaps and drag induced by the front section while you have the very small drag free booms in the back will cause what you see in your plane. The rear end will move upward easier than the front end. It's nothing to worry about and is simply a factor of the dynamics. You would simply mix up elevator with flap instead of down.
Nice job Mike. I watched the Video 3 times before posting. You did good.
Dan
You did a great job building and flying that plane. I've seen factory designed trainers that didn't do that well on a maiden flight. It looked very solid but did seem to be ready to fly again once it touched down. The prop clearance is certainly a concern in these designs. I would replace the main gear with a taller one or bend it or whatever, but still make sure that it's pretty stiff. I would straighten the nose gear up and flip it back around. That will get you better clearance. I would make sure the landing gear is set height wise so that on the ground the main wing is sitting 0 to -1 degrees incidence.
The down pitch you see with your flaps is correct in a plane like this. It's all about where the flaps are generating lift with respect to the mass and drag. In a conventional aircraft, the wing is pretty far forward. Close to the nose. Flaps deployed lifts the wing and the nose as a result. If the wing was in the rear, like a delta or flying wing, the flaps would lift the wing trailing edge and the rear end. In your mid high wing design, their are a couple of other factors. Your fuselage is out front with a lot of horizontal surface area. (Big flat top) Vertical ascent, (pushing the plane upward) with the flaps and drag induced by the front section while you have the very small drag free booms in the back will cause what you see in your plane. The rear end will move upward easier than the front end. It's nothing to worry about and is simply a factor of the dynamics. You would simply mix up elevator with flap instead of down.
Nice job Mike. I watched the Video 3 times before posting. You did good.
Dan
03-25-2006, 10:36 PM
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RE: Pusher AP plane build thread
I should add, if you invert the engine and move the mount higher on the firewall, you'll get the crank shaft higher up and get more prop clearance that way too. Probably a couple of inches. The carb will still be in the correct elevation in relation to the fuel tank too. I put my engine that way to get the prop hub higher up.
Dan
Dan
03-25-2006, 11:21 PM
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RE: Pusher AP plane build thread
Thanks Dan for the insight. You are right on about the flaps. I remember moving them (flapeons) upwards slightly and it caused the plane to pitch up so that confirms it all.
I will work on the relatively small adjustments so I can get some flare for landing. It is just so rewarding to see the results of many hours planning, building and finishing to actually get the plane in the air. I kept saying to myself, "I can't believe it's flying!!"
I will work on the relatively small adjustments so I can get some flare for landing. It is just so rewarding to see the results of many hours planning, building and finishing to actually get the plane in the air. I kept saying to myself, "I can't believe it's flying!!"
03-26-2006, 05:02 PM
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RE: Pusher AP plane build thread
Congratz on the test flight. Just watch the temp of the engine when your on the ground. Remember that tractors have the benifit of blowing air across the motor.
03-26-2006, 07:11 PM
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RE: Pusher AP plane build thread
Thats one reason I used a heli engine, bigger head, better cooling, however Ive never had any problems with my other twin boom though, the pusher pulls air across the head just like a tractor pushes it, maybe not as much though.
Mike
Mike
03-26-2006, 07:28 PM
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RE: Pusher AP plane build thread
ORIGINAL: W4UAV
Thats one reason I used a heli engine, bigger head, better cooling, however Ive never had any problems with my other twin boom though, the pusher pulls air across the head just like a tractor pushes it, maybe not as much though.
Thats one reason I used a heli engine, bigger head, better cooling, however Ive never had any problems with my other twin boom though, the pusher pulls air across the head just like a tractor pushes it, maybe not as much though.
03-31-2006, 12:41 PM
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RE: Pusher AP plane build thread
Skycam 41,
Congrats on your build! Well done. Thanks for sharing it with us.
I have just ordered a Bronco ov-10 that I plan on converting from twin tractor to single pusher (electric). Looking forward to it.
Norb
Congrats on your build! Well done. Thanks for sharing it with us.
I have just ordered a Bronco ov-10 that I plan on converting from twin tractor to single pusher (electric). Looking forward to it.
Norb
04-07-2006, 08:41 AM
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RE: Pusher AP plane build thread
Thanks guys for all your kind words..
Updates:
I found a local source of 6061 T6 aluminum and I can buy a 20' length for only $20 CDN and then I found another shop that just gave me two 24" pieces, better still
After bending and making the landing gear the thought came to me why not just use a 3 bladed prop. It seems that 3 bladed pusher props are quite rare but Zinger does make one that you can actually change the individual blades out from the hub so I have a 11x6 coming which I am anxious to try.
No more flights yet as rain has definatley suspended play [&o]
Updates:
I found a local source of 6061 T6 aluminum and I can buy a 20' length for only $20 CDN and then I found another shop that just gave me two 24" pieces, better still
After bending and making the landing gear the thought came to me why not just use a 3 bladed prop. It seems that 3 bladed pusher props are quite rare but Zinger does make one that you can actually change the individual blades out from the hub so I have a 11x6 coming which I am anxious to try.
No more flights yet as rain has definatley suspended play [&o]
