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Separate Aileron Servos for Duraplane Trainer

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Separate Aileron Servos for Duraplane Trainer

Old 01-28-2007, 01:51 AM
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toti88
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Default Separate Aileron Servos for Duraplane Trainer

Hi everyone!!! I am building a Duraplane Trainer 40 and I want to fly it with two separate aileron servos. This is because I bought a new computer radio and I want to test it with this non expensive and resistant plane. Do you guys think that the extra wight will have a significant effect on the balance of my plane? Do you have any recommendations? Thanks,
Toti
Old 01-29-2007, 11:11 PM
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BMatthews
 
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Default RE: Separate Aileron Servos for Duraplane Trainer

I've seen Duraplanes do their poor imitation of flight and even helped a new student with one. In my estimation adding an extra servo won't make it any worse than it is already.

There isn't a word in the dictionary to describe how terrible those things fly... oh wait... there is. I just found it. The word is "anchor".
Old 01-30-2007, 12:29 PM
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HighPlains
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Default RE: Separate Aileron Servos for Duraplane Trainer

They fly about as well as a helicopter, after the rotor has stopped turning.

The good thing is that they are indestructable.
The bad thing is that they are indestructable.

It is against the law in 46 states to use the word airplane in the same sentence.
Old 02-03-2007, 01:48 PM
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JustErik
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Default RE: Separate Aileron Servos for Duraplane Trainer

LOL.....geez guys, I sure hope Toti doesn't have an emotional attachment to his Duraplane.

Go for it Toti, it shouldn't make much difference as long as it balances properly.
Old 02-03-2007, 02:10 PM
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Default RE: Separate Aileron Servos for Duraplane Trainer

Yeah, you're right.

Toti, I'm sorry if I hurt your feelings but it's the truth. The Duraplanes really are that bad. They NEED to be crash proof because they cause their own crashes far too often. The fellow that I helped to fly with one was all over the place and was having an awful time learning to fly well. I was the second instructor that assisted him and when I saw how he was doing and how the model was to fly I urged him to trash the Duraplane and get a lighter model that was intended to fly and not to crash. In my opinion Duraplanes were one of the blacker moments in our hobby.

An exageration? Not to me or that student or the other one that I saw a fairly experienced pilot try to fly. Snap rolls on takeoff and sudden stalls on landings encouraged him to explore the crash worthiness far too often.

Really Toti, get a better model. I assure you that you'll enjoy the hobby far more. And I'm saying this not to discourage you but to ENcourage you.
Old 02-03-2007, 05:41 PM
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toti88
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Default RE: Separate Aileron Servos for Duraplane Trainer

I actually bought this model to test my new computer radio for a Sig Somethin Extra that I am starting to build. I guess it wasn't a very good idea. I am going to add the extra servo to the duraplane and fly it next weekend. I will tell you guys how it goes, and if it really flies so horrible, i guess it isn't that bad since I only payed $40 for it and I have a Sig FourStar and another Trainer 40 that fly perfectly. Thanks for your comments. If someone has still something to say, I will be checking in daily.
Toti
Old 02-09-2007, 01:22 PM
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MadScientist
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Default RE: Separate Aileron Servos for Duraplane Trainer

You know, if you're looking for a good plane to use as a test bed for multiple servos on the wing, my suggestion would be a 40 sized Ultra Stick. They fly great, the are cheap, and they have the option to set up the wing with either two servos for ailerons, or four servos for ailerons and flaps. If you're looking to exploer how your radio works with these features, this plane is great for that, and while you learn your radio, you'll have fun flying. My guess is after you learn your radio, you'll still keep the stick for flying on days when you just want to goof around in the wind, or not worry about carrying that big plane to the field. Just my opinion.

Oh yeah, the best thing for that Duraplane is a quick and painless death. Do you have access to a trash compacter?
Old 02-15-2007, 10:12 PM
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MTK
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Default RE: Separate Aileron Servos for Duraplane Trainer

Not to add fuel to the KILL THE DURAPLANE contest going on here.....the standard stick type model was invented with exactly this purpose in mind. Noted pattern model designer/pilot and RC System designer/manufacturer Phil Kraft designed the original stick (Das Ugly Stick) circa 1970 to serve as test bed for engines and radios for his pattern models. He should have patented the silly thing.....it's been copied countless times and the royalties alone from the invention would have made him a very wealthy man.

BTW, Duraplane or Dialacrash, take your pick. BMatthews isn't far off...indeed a black moment in modeling that, thank goodness, hasn't lasted that long.

MTK
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You know, if you're looking for a good plane to use as a test bed for multiple servos on the wing, my suggestion would be a 40 sized Ultra Stick. They fly great, the are cheap, and they have the option to set up the wing with either two servos for ailerons, or four servos for ailerons and flaps. If you're looking to exploer how your radio works with these features, this plane is great for that, and while you learn your radio, you'll have fun flying. My guess is after you learn your radio, you'll still keep the stick for flying on days when you just want to goof around in the wind, or not worry about carrying that big plane to the field. Just my opinion.

Oh yeah, the best thing for that Duraplane is a quick and painless death. Do you have access to a trash compacter?
Old 03-09-2007, 10:26 AM
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Thumprding
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Default RE: Separate Aileron Servos for Duraplane Trainer

I am going to go against the grain here. I had a dura plane trainer 40 and it was a fun plane to fly. I will agree it is heavy and it does not float like a kite. I will agree it takes more speed to take off and land and even to fly. But the one thing I will say is that plane can take a beating and keep on going and that is exactly what some people need to learn to fly.


I instructed a number of people to fly. Some learn quick, some learn slow those are fine to train because they learn. The ones that are hard to train are the ones that go prompt stupid flying. I can handle it when there is time to recover but do they go stupid when there is there no to recover? Nooooo!!! They go stupid when they are on the ground or taking off or real close to putting a plane on the ground. It did not matter if I have a trainer cord or a buddy box because there was no recovery time before disaster struck.

The plane is coming in fine to land but the right wing tip is slightly down. No biggie it will land just fine and will level out during the flare. Do they leave it alone? No! They get close and the speed is down and then they decide to jam in a ton of wrong rudder or aliron to get that "perfect" landing. "Let it float, doing good, gentle, gentle, let it come in doing good" It is during this that you see the plane just jump and you hear WHAP and watch stuff break. The other when they are doing fine on a take off and just need to add in a little right rudder to straigten the plane up. That is when you watch the plane shoot to the right and if it is not at full throttle before that it is when it shoots right. Whap right in to post that holds the safety netting. Or better yet they jerk if off the ground before it hits the netting and now it is in the air behind the flight line and just waiting to stall out and crash.

That is when I look over at them and wonder are you that stupid and say to yourself I guess I will have plenty of time to fly my own planes today.

They know they did it but they cannot tell you why. They know they should have left it alone but they did not. You and he both know he can sucessfully land or take off a plane because you have see it and he has done it but this time the brain and thumb went stupid and the plane paid for it big time.

After watching two of these ham thumbed people trash out planes and this process repeat itself over and over is when I have told them go buy a duraplane 40 and build it and when you are done then come back to me. Ground loop it, put it nose first, stall it on a take off going vertical right off the ground it does not matter those planes can take a beating and these people need a plane that can take that type of beating and keep going. I actually remember watching one tail slide then the nose flip straight down and then bury the nose up to fire wall on the run way after a sever dumb thumb take off. The plane was literally vertical and stuck in the ground like a post and we went and plucked it from the dirt. A new prop and a carb pull to clean the dirt out and that plane was back in the air.

"Remember don't jerk the sticks on take off let it fly off the ground."

I have seen these same people just rip the landing gear right out of the plane. I mean tear holes in the PVC fuse. They have looked at me and said I guess I am done for the day. Done? Nope! Now is the time you get to learn how to hand launch a plane and belly land one dead stick. Check the switch to make sure on is forward, and check the prop to make sure when the engine stops it is level with the wing, then gas it up and start it and toss it. It amazes them that one can actually do that. "okay it is yours now fly it until it is close to running out of fuel then start gaining altitude and I will take over and show you how to dead stick belly land.

So before you tottaly write these planes off as a ugly boat anchor that flies like a brick with a engine, give their just due and remember they have a place. Like I said I had one and it was the plane I basically learned to fly with. I flew it and flew it and kept on flying it until flying was second nature and I was doing every stunt that plane was capable of. The only reason I normally quit flying it was the battery packs were getting low.
Old 04-20-2007, 10:25 AM
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Default RE: Separate Aileron Servos for Duraplane Trainer

I have to also go against the grain and agree with Thumprding. I've flown a DuraPlane 40 for nearly 8 months now. Used OS FP40 engine turning an 11x5 prop, four standard Hobbico servos, and an even more ancient Futaba Attack 4ch AM transmitter. Latter is important since it's most advanced feature is servo reversing (i.e. no expo to soften control response). Set up by the book wrt to CG and control throws. That said, had an experienced member make the first flight to trim it and I've flown is solo ever since. I'm self taught using Kyosho AutoKite and 2ch Spirit Select. With my low experience, if it were the rock of a plane that some seem to believe, I would have destroyed it long ago. What I can tell you is that I think the controls are not well harmonized...that's a term from full-size aircraft test and evaluation world ... what it means is that for example rudder is very powerful compared to ailerons and elevator. I find it most noticable during crosswind landings. Does it land a little faster than the typical trainer? Yes. Is it the beast that some describe? Definitely not. I'm a military pilot myself, over 2300 hours in tactical jets and a tour at Pax River doing developmental T&E. Yes, not always directly relatable to RC, but I do know aerodynamics. What I can tell you from observing most RC pilots is they fly the airplane WAY too fast, particularly in the pattern. Too many pilots don't know how to slow down. Why? I think it's because they don't learn to recognize when airplane is getting mushy...or approaching stall. DuraPlane, since it's heavier wing loading than most trainers, forced me to learn to slow down. I can consistently plant the wheels (carrier landing style -- hey, it's my vocation) exactly where I want them on the runway. Touchdown to turnaround and backtaxi is about 50 feet depending upon winds. Put a little drag on the wheels, i.e. tighten the bolts, and you can shorten it up further (however at some cost on takeoff roll). Takeoffs are very straightforward, it flies well at much slower speeds than most folks are willing to attempt. I love the thing. Have, no kidding, over three gallons of fuel through it so far and it's going strong.

Highly recommend it for strength and for durability. /s/ Frank

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