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Another Drone Pilot does it Again

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Another Drone Pilot does it Again

Old 04-07-2015, 03:15 PM
  #951  
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Originally Posted by Silent-AV8R View Post
It appears he was talking about IMPBA racing. The other boat racing group, NAMBA, has no such testing requirement. NAMBA is bigger in the west/southwest, IMPBA is more mid-west and east coast.

Here is the NAMBA District 19 schedule for 2015:

http://www.namba19.com/Schedule.php

25 races mostly in California and Arizona. Most gas boat races are seeing 40+ people racing in multiple classes. Head up to Legg Lake in Whittier Narrows park most any weekend and you'll see a good group of local boat racers. Boat racing (gas, nitro,fast electric) is very much alive and well in the US and in the SW especially.
2014 saw 125 individuals post scores over the season. Compare that to the approximately 55 souls who competed in IMAC in 2014 in the SW region.

So I think your statement is fairly inaccurate.
AEF usually 150+, 500+ show up to IRCHA each year, 150+ at SEFF, local car race series like JBRL have 80+, bigger races like Reedy or Silver State pick up 200+ entries.

Sorry, but much like building aircraft (which I like to do) from a forest-in-a-box, boats are a niche market. Everyone loves the craftsmanship, but few actually take the time to do it.

If boat racing was a big enough market one would see more of that at local hobby shops.

But that is a bit off topic now.

People needing to be licensed to play with toys would thin out the hobby. The point of the hobby is for enjoyment, the most amount of fun for the least amount of work. Very few people want to go to school to play with their toy.

Last edited by TimJ; 04-07-2015 at 03:25 PM.
Old 04-07-2015, 09:41 PM
  #952  
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I have seen plenty of the videos taken of trees and grass by the cameras mounted on rc planes or FPVs !
Most are never recorded, they are not for entertainment but for better control of the aircraft.
Old 04-07-2015, 11:52 PM
  #953  
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Originally Posted by Silent-AV8R View Post
It appears he was talking about IMPBA racing. The other boat racing group, NAMBA, has no such testing requirement. NAMBA is bigger in the west/southwest, IMPBA is more mid-west and east coast.

Here is the NAMBA District 19 schedule for 2015:

http://www.namba19.com/Schedule.php

25 races mostly in California and Arizona. Most gas boat races are seeing 40+ people racing in multiple classes. Head up to Legg Lake in Whittier Narrows park most any weekend and you'll see a good group of local boat racers. Boat racing (gas, nitro,fast electric) is very much alive and well in the US and in the SW especially.
2014 saw 125 individuals post scores over the season. Compare that to the approximately 55 souls who competed in IMAC in 2014 in the SW region.

So I think your statement is fairly inaccurate.
Actually, the two clubs in Washington state that run strictly 1/8th scale unlimiteds DO, IN FACT, TEST PROSPECTIVE RACERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Now, let's look at the reasons why:
1) COST: Our boats, in general, cost $2000 and up to complete, not counting all the support equipment and spare parts. When you consider the average marine engine is running at 25,000+ RPM at racing speeds, they tend to wear out faster than a comparably sized aircraft engine that runs at less than 50% of that speed, so having several hundred dollars in spare parts in not abnormal. For this very reason, all NAMBA District 8 races have a beginner's class that is closely monitored by experienced racers, regardless of the type of boat the new person has.
2) PROXIMITY: Our boats tend to run at 50+ MPH WHILE INCHES FROM OTHER BOATS!!!!!!!!!!!!! If you have someone that doesn't know how to drive, several boats could be severely damaged, if not destroyed, in a few seconds. Since our hydroplanes are much wider than other styles of racing boats, the room needed around them is much greater than a vee hull, for example
3) WHERE AND WHEN: Our rules specify where we can drive our boats and when. We use a clock start that requires all boats to be on the water and running 30 seconds prior to the start. We are not allowed to start a boat until three minutes prior to the start. Crossing the infield is allowed only from front straight to back, not the other way and only while meeting other requirements in the rules. Moving in front of another boat is restricted to prevent disabling a competitor.

I've only just scratched the surface on what we have to deal with at a standard race. Now, picture a rogue boater launching and running a boat that doesn't know the rules or how to handle his boat. That is what the people ignoring or just not knowing the rules are doing with the FPV planes and quads.
Now, let's take this one step further. A week or two ago, two Seattle TV station helicopters were filming a news story from around 1500 feet up. A quadcopter was spotted by one of the camera operators flying around the rotor of the other helicopter. The helicopter pilot followed the quad back to the operator who, very quickly, packed up and ran into the house he had been standing in front of. A few minutes later, a police car arrived and upon questioning the person that answered the door, the police left, being told there wasn't a quad on the property. So, now the question is what would have happened had the quad actually got into the rotor blades of the manned helicopter? Would a test have prevented this? Maybe. Would knowing the penalties of being caught make a difference? Who knows but, to me, it's something that could be tried since being required to know the rules would eliminate the excuse of "No one told me that"

Last edited by Hydro Junkie; 04-08-2015 at 01:20 AM.
Old 04-08-2015, 05:39 AM
  #954  
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OK, the club itself requires testing, but it is not a requirement of NAMBA to test drivers. And while the scale boats are fast, almost all other gas boats are faster, and have no testing required on the part of the National organization.

Thanks for your post, since it supports my main point that RC boat racing is alive and well.

And I know a bit about fast boats, a few years back I held the NAMBA SAW (Straightline) records for Fast Electric boats in the T offshore and S offshore classes. Both were close to 80MPH. The current T Catamaran (10S) record is 138 MPH.

No question boats are fast!!
Old 04-08-2015, 06:04 AM
  #955  
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So, that brings up this question:
Would you have made your SAW runs with a rogue boater on the water?

Now, let's go back to aircraft, would you want to fly your airplane, full sized or R/C, with a rogue quad/FPV flying around your flying site that has no idea about what's actually going on?
Old 04-08-2015, 06:49 AM
  #956  
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To the boat guys and others that have infiltrated the thread with such discussion...whether IMPBA, NAMBA, or NAMBY PAMBY...Just join AMA...since AMA also covers RC boating, just pay your $58 dollars like the rest of us good little people do and forget about all the tests and become all knowing like the rest of us here...simple stuff really...
Old 04-08-2015, 07:17 AM
  #957  
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I don't have to be an AMA member to know what's going on. What it comes down to is a bunch of idiots are scaring the FAA into trying to take over the control of R/C modeling by classifying everything without an onboard operator as a drone. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to know it's only a matter of time and anything that's R/C will become a danger to the country and be regulated to death
Old 04-08-2015, 07:21 AM
  #958  
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Originally Posted by Hydro Junkie View Post
It doesn't take a rocket scientist to know it's only a matter of time and anything that's R/C will become a danger to the country and be regulated to death
Hmmm...another one in the Franklin, HoundDog group????
Old 04-08-2015, 07:39 AM
  #959  
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Originally Posted by littlecrankshaf View Post
To the boat guys and others that have infiltrated the thread with such discussion...whether IMPBA, NAMBA, or NAMBY PAMBY...Just join AMA...since AMA also covers RC boating, just pay your $58 dollars like the rest of us good little people do and forget about all the tests and become all knowing like the rest of us here...simple stuff really...

Gotta admit , I always thought it was a bit of a reach for an organization named the Academy of Model Aeronautics to concern itself with RC cars and boats , I'd think the "aeronautics" aspect is gettin stretched pretty thin at that point (and no , I don't want to hear about the downforce wings on racecars , please) ....


PS , the boat guys had best wish that the FAA keeps honoring the "aviation" part in the middle of it's name , we all know how organizations just LOVE them "power grabs" ....
Old 04-08-2015, 07:49 AM
  #960  
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Originally Posted by init4fun View Post
Gotta admit , I always thought it was a bit of a reach for an organization named the Academy of Model Aeronautics to concern itself with RC cars and boats , I'd think the "aeronautics" aspect is gettin stretched pretty thin at that point (and no , I don't want to hear about the downforce wings on racecars , please) ....
If we can get the numbers up ten fold, we might have a small voice...instead of a little squeak... at least I think that's the rationale.
Old 04-08-2015, 08:36 AM
  #961  
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Originally Posted by littlecrankshaf View Post
To the boat guys and others that have infiltrated the thread with such discussion...whether IMPBA, NAMBA, or NAMBY PAMBY...Just join AMA...since AMA also covers RC boating, just pay your $58 dollars like the rest of us good little people do and forget about all the tests and become all knowing like the rest of us here...simple stuff really...
BAHAHAH! That is pretty funny LC!

Silent-AV8R, no matter how you slant your stance, the boat scene in numbers does not match up to the rest of the hobby.

Now to address the testing deal, it is an interesting thought. However, the AMA does have "special" waivers for people who enjoy turbine aircraft, or aircraft that are over 55lbs. Which in both aspects require a proud bank account. But these special circumstances do not separate normal size or power system craft from the high-speed jets or massive 55lb+ aircraft. Some clubs required you to earn your "wings" before you can fly solo, demonstrating that you can control the aircraft ......So who knows, certification may just help make everything safer. Then, there would be a need for a team of certifiers, preferable people who actually fly (within the past 6 months) and enjoy the hobby. Then their is the need for a team of enforcers, preferable that they do not care about the hobby and don't have buddies in the hobby.

So now that we have the pilots "safe", it is now time to focus on the electronics, power systems, and airframes need to be certified and tested.

Do you see where this is going?.......

Last edited by TimJ; 04-08-2015 at 08:41 AM.
Old 04-08-2015, 09:05 AM
  #962  
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Originally Posted by Hydro Junkie View Post
I don't have to be an AMA member to know what's going on. What it comes down to is a bunch of idiots are scaring the FAA into trying to take over the control of R/C modeling by classifying everything without an onboard operator as a drone. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to know it's only a matter of time and anything that's R/C will become a danger to the country and be regulated to death
In the Internet world of redicilous possibilities why do you boat guys think you are exempt?

Just wait for the first seaplane crash from hitting a RC boat on landing. 😩
Old 04-08-2015, 09:05 AM
  #963  
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Originally Posted by TimJ View Post
BAHAHAH! That is pretty funny LC!

Silent-AV8R, no matter how you slant your stance, the boat scene in numbers does not match up to the rest of the hobby.

Now to address the testing deal, it is an interesting thought. However, the AMA does have "special" waivers for people who enjoy turbine aircraft, or aircraft that are over 55lbs. Which in both aspects require a proud bank account. But these special circumstances do not separate normal size or power system craft from the high-speed jets or massive 55lb+ aircraft. Some clubs required you to earn your "wings" before you can fly solo, demonstrating that you can control the aircraft ......So who knows, certification may just help make everything safer. Then, there would be a need for a team of certifiers, preferable people who actually fly (within the past 6 months) and enjoy the hobby. Then their is the need for a team of enforcers, preferable that they do not care about the hobby and don't have buddies in the hobby.

So now that we have the pilots "safe", it is now time to focus on the electronics, power systems, and airframes need to be certified and tested.

Do you see where this is going?.......
I do.... $$$$
Old 04-08-2015, 10:21 AM
  #964  
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Originally Posted by littlecrankshaf View Post
To the boat guys and others that have infiltrated the thread with such discussion...whether IMPBA, NAMBA, or NAMBY PAMBY...Just join AMA...since AMA also covers RC boating, just pay your $58 dollars like the rest of us good little people do and forget about all the tests and become all knowing like the rest of us here...simple stuff really...
Can't race either IMPBA or NAMBA without being a member. Sure, AMA covers the non-com[pepting boat racer, but it does not allow you to race.
Old 04-08-2015, 10:31 AM
  #965  
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Originally Posted by TimJ View Post
BAHAHAH! That is pretty funny LC!

Silent-AV8R, no matter how you slant your stance, the boat scene in numbers does not match up to the rest of the hobby.
Not RC overall to be sure. But I know for a fact that there are more boat racers in the US than IMAC and pattern pilots (competitors) combined. So no slant, just a fact.

As far as testing goes, I have not seen any evidence that it really does much. I have belonged to clubs that have a testing program and I cannot say that I felt any more safe flying there than at any number of other clubs. Using the AMA Safety Code as a basis for safe operations has worked fairly well over the years, Year in and year out the largest percentage of claims with the AMA are self-inflicted prop injuries. The low number of claims overall, and especially large liability claims I think provides ample proof that what the AMA has been doing is working just fine without a whole new bureaucracy built around testing and certifying pilots, instructors, etc.

Last edited by Silent-AV8R; 04-08-2015 at 02:36 PM. Reason: ThaiPoh
Old 04-08-2015, 10:52 AM
  #966  
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Originally Posted by Sport_Pilot View Post
Test results? Funny that the one proposing this is likely the one least likely to pass.
But Sporty U and all who post here and belong to a chartered AMA Club
would be Grand Fathered so UR are Safe ....

Gone Flying AGAINE
Damrn Speels ckkr died
Old 04-08-2015, 11:04 AM
  #967  
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Exactly my point Silent-AV8R, but you beat me to the punch line. I was trying to lead the horses in first. LOL

Look, on the boat deal, I raced electrics in the 90's, I am fully aware of the numbers for boats. I really wish that the trend would make an up swing again and boat racing would become popular once more. Boats in the U.S. a very small blip on the radar in the scheme of the hobby. Very few hobby shops support boat racing with needed parts. I can only think of two shops in Socal that carry octura or prather and even then, anything of significance like a selection of hauls or boat racing engines need to be ordered online. One can walk into a hobby shop and purchase racing car parts all day long and at just about any hobby shop that calls themselves a hobby shop. One can find more selection of small pylon racing aircraft at a local hobby shop than they will racing boats. Boats are still a small niche market. Not matter how you compare it.
Old 04-08-2015, 12:14 PM
  #968  
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Just wait for the first seaplane crash from hitting a RC boat on landing. ��
The same people who think an RC plane will cause a 747 to go down in flame losing all aboard will probably tell you that a float plane will flip on its back when it hits the toy boat.
Old 04-08-2015, 01:59 PM
  #969  
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Truth.
Old 04-08-2015, 02:39 PM
  #970  
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Originally Posted by Sport_Pilot View Post
The same people who think an RC plane will cause a 747 to go down in flame losing all aboard will probably tell you that a float plane will flip on its back when it hits the toy boat.
Based on my experience you will never see this even as a possibility. Guys who run boats are not racing where they are flying float planes. But I recognize this as another absurdist argument along the lines of how many downwind turns can dance on the head of a pin.
Old 04-09-2015, 05:10 AM
  #971  
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https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=427376147443911

Jet engine ingesting a foreign object.
Old 04-09-2015, 11:31 AM
  #972  
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Originally Posted by init4fun View Post
Gotta admit , I always thought it was a bit of a reach for an organization named the Academy of Model Aeronautics to concern itself with RC cars and boats , I'd think the "aeronautics" aspect is gettin stretched pretty thin at that point (and no , I don't want to hear about the downforce wings on racecars , please) ....


PS , the boat guys had best wish that the FAA keeps honoring the "aviation" part in the middle of it's name , we all know how organizations just LOVE them "power grabs" ....
Think of it as a benefit. If you fly RC it is likely that you might try RC Cars or RC Boats even rockets at some time. Your AMA insurance covers all these activities. Not going to get into a primary/secondary argument, that has been done to death.
Old 04-10-2015, 05:03 PM
  #973  
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This is dispite some people belief that it soesn't pertain to our TOY airplanes when it most deffinatly will if inacted as written.

Every AMA member should of gotten this Notic from the AMA Read it Watch it And Comment on the NPRM before April 24th. It's Vital to our hoby with what the FAA wants and will do if we don't make objection to it ... For those that belive the NPRM as written and feature FAR's it will make DO NOT only pertain to Comerical Use of sUAS and TOY MODEL AIR PLANES. It (if inacted as written into FAR's it will out lay any thing over 55 lbs any thing over 87 MPH Max altitude 500' ext.


Please read and watch the video and then comment to the FAA before ther take yout TOY airplanes away or make tham Useless and worthless, if they can. Government will take anything U don't veitmently protect.

U should of recieved this today but check It out Here.

http://view.exacttarget.com/?j=fe561...0575741372&r=0

[TABLE="class: link-enhancr-element, width: 450"]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #E5E5E5, colspan: 8"]
[/TD]
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[/TD]
[TD="width: 1, bgcolor: #E5E5E5"]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="colspan: 2"]Take Action to Help Preserve Model Aviation's Future. Comment on the FAA NPRM.


[/TD]
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[TR]
[TD="colspan: 2"]
[/TD]
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[TD]View on view.exacttarget.com
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Last edited by HoundDog; 04-10-2015 at 05:38 PM. Reason: URL
Old 04-10-2015, 07:56 PM
  #974  
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Originally Posted by HoundDog View Post
This is dispite some people belief that it soesn't pertain to our TOY airplanes when it most deffinatly will if inacted as written.

Every AMA member should of gotten this Notic from the AMA Read it Watch it And Comment on the NPRM before April 24th. It's Vital to our hoby with what the FAA wants and will do if we don't make objection to it ... For those that belive the NPRM as written and feature FAR's it will make DO NOT only pertain to Comerical Use of sUAS and TOY MODEL AIR PLANES. It (if inacted as written into FAR's it will out lay any thing over 55 lbs any thing over 87 MPH Max altitude 500' ext.


Please read and watch the video and then comment to the FAA before ther take yout TOY airplanes away or make tham Useless and worthless, if they can. Government will take anything U don't veitmently protect.

U should of recieved this today but check It out Here.

http://view.exacttarget.com/?j=fe561...0575741372&r=0

[TABLE="class: link-enhancr-element, width: 450"]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #E5E5E5, colspan: 8"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #E5E5E5"][/TD]
[TD="bgcolor: #000000"]
[/TD]
[TD="bgcolor: #E5E5E5"][/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[TD="colspan: 2"][/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[TD="width: 1, bgcolor: #E5E5E5"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="colspan: 2"]Take Action to Help Preserve Model Aviation's Future. Comment on the FAA NPRM.

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="colspan: 2"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]View on view.exacttarget.com[/TD]
[TD]
Preview by Yahoo
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[/TR]
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Here's my understanding: You can go directly into AMA competition and make money off the winnings. You can test fly new designs of model planes, and get paid for it. You can get paid for teaching someone to fly a model airplane. All you need to do, is GET A LICENSE. What's wrong with that?
Old 04-11-2015, 05:19 AM
  #975  
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All you need to do, is GET A LICENSE. What's wrong with that?
Because it could kill our hobby, the AMA and others. No one is going to get a license to fly in a competition, they will either break the law, not give compensation to the winners, or stop having contests (the latter if the FAA is fussy). Only the larger companies will have licences airframe testers. The smaller ones will either break the law, don't test, or close shop. Furthermore it is another freedom lost!

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