rgburrill

TimJ, that attitude is exactly where the AMA screwed up many years ago. They should have started a campaign to get the responsible manufacturers and distributors to not support this kind of activity. Back then they could have concentrated on FPV equipment. They could not possibly get all manufacturers to agree but they could have turned some around. But no, they buried their heads in the sand just like you are doing.

DIJ and others came up with a solution to the problem - Horizon bypassed that soution. There was NEVER any reason to have those disabling kits available to the general hobby store public..Nor was their ever a reason to have video downlinks on uncontrolled 2.4GHz frequencies instead of keeping them on licensed Ham channels.

porcia83

My Feedback: (8)

How was the AMA supposed to take two major companies and make them change they way they did business? It's doubtful any company is going to let a small group of people dictate how they run their business. I'm not sure what "kind of activity" you mean as well, do you mean flying a MR with a camera? There isn't a company out there, big or small, that is advocating or recommending unsafe use of their products. To do so would be a disaster for their bottom line.

What did DJI come up with that HH passed on? All of the products out there can be hacked and modified as needed, however the average customer isn't going to know how to do that.

TimJ

It's easy to sit back and say this. The first time in the late 90's that Multi-Rotors hit the scene, the only way to get one was to build and program one yourself. It was a typical fad in R/C that faded away. What we are experiencing now is a second wave (if you will) of a trend in R/C. Many of us sat back and laughed and thought MRs would fade away again. Except this time the fad exploded quicker than what anyone realized. The genie was already out of the bottle. It was too late for any one organization to do anything.

mr_matt

My Feedback: (10)

So which is it? the AMA policy was wrong but it is too late to fix it, or the AMA policy was right all along??

Chris P. Bacon

My Feedback: (4)

http://www.modelaircraft.org/aboutama/whatisama.aspx

rcmiket

No and I wouldn't look for any. There was a "survey" sent out a few months back to AMA members some members have reported never seeing it and some have It dealt with the AMA and "drones". The results were never published.

Here's a link to another survey they did on sUAV's.

http://www.modelaircraft.org/members...uassurvey.aspx

I don't recall these every being posted either.
Looking at the 2 polls here you can draw your own conclusion about how we feel on the subject.

Mike

porcia83

My Feedback: (8)

I don't recall when it was posted, or where, but I'm fairly certain it was either here at RCU or on the AMA blog and it noted a figure of 2,000. There is no way to validate that, so take it for what it's worth. Might be high or low, to me it sounds about right. I'm not sure how it would be validated even by the AMA for that matter, i know you can check off what you fly when joining, but there might be folks that joined that are MR focused, but have fixed wing too. In my club, as of this month, we have 3 new members that joined AMA and our club that started as MR only, but every one eventually bought a fixed wing too.

I don't know that it's an automatic cause/effect that the sales of drones will automatically mean more AMA members. The majority probably won't, and don't forget the whole club mentality on the issue as well. Many are not exactly friendly and open to new members, let alone MR. Many clubs have already banned them (a shame really), even though they allow helis (sometimes grudgingly so). I'm glad the AMA opened their arms to MR use, and think they have a place in the hobby in many ways (not a popular view here of course). Accepting them and recruiting them are two different things as well.

Not sure what the use would be of "disclosing" how many MR users there are, and if only MR/Drone etc.(or how to even determine that) The important thing I would think is that they are dues paying members. The most recent survey wasn't sent to everyone, it was sampled. The pro/cons reasons for that being previously discussed. I'm curious to see the results of the one from 2014, as well as the most recent one. Not sure why it's not posted on the AMA page as they said it would be, it would be nice to see it, as not posting it only feeds more speculation. I wrote the guy who send this most recent one (he's an AMA employee), who eventually got back to me and said the results were finalized last month I believe and were being presented to the EC. Had to take a while to work through all the comments and bucket them. I haven't responded to him yet, but if I get any info I'll post it up here. With different polls and questions it would be hard to do an apples/apples comparison, but would still be interesting to read.

TimJ

That is an opinion for you to form.

Chris P. Bacon

My Feedback: (4)

Not sure where you received that misinformation from, but as I stated the last time you mentioned this, there are absolutely no laws in place that require proof of an FCC amateur radio license in order to purchase an amateur radio transmitter. If you believe otherwise, please state the section where this appears.

rcmiket

It would go a long way in justifying the actions of the EC to the membership, with all that has transpired over the last year.

Mike

Chris P. Bacon

My Feedback: (4)

I bet it was. Jeff is an avid R/C Helicopter pilot and shows up at R/C heli events on occasion.

Lamoilleriver

Thanks guy's for responding, try as I may, I was not able to access the survey results. I'm not anti-AMA, drone, new technology, etc., I'm anti-operators who are not safe, also anti-registration, the process may be simple and inexpensive to start, but have been around long enough to know that it doesn't stay that way. If the AMA supports drone operators and the drone operators are not supporting the AMA(membership) then the AMA should reexamine it efforts. Need information to determine a cost/benefit analysis.

rcmiket

Yep, results need to be measured to determine if the results are worth the expense.That's all any of us are looking for.

Mike

porcia83

My Feedback: (8)

Justify it how, as if a number will some type of metric to gauge something by? Why a year also? Why not look at this going back to when MR first came into popularity, or perhaps in 3 years after the discounted membership issues are realized. I get the desire to see a number, and then try to hold it up against either the 250, or lets even use 1 million dollars like some like to do...that comparison would be very one denominational. A lot has happened over the past 2-3 years really, and will probably continue forward for the next year or two. It's a painful process for sure. Also, without kicking up the whole "we pay their salaries they work for us" discussion, I don't think the AMA has to justify anything they have done to the membership. They have clearly laid out what their plans were, kept up generally up to date on things, and how they plan to proceed forward. I say this not to get into a back and forth, it's just that what is done is done. It's doubtful that it will be undone. If what has transpired to date is so distateful to the whole membership, then their opportunity to change the direction of the AMA will be to either get personally involved, or vote out the current admin. Based on the past, and what is written here, that doesn't seem likely (for better or worse).

porcia83

My Feedback: (8)

With rare exception, and I'm talking teeny tiny rare, I think almost everyone agrees it's the operators who have really caused this issue, unsafe, reckless, and in some cases non-apologetic even when caught doing something that they shouldn't have been doing. I also agree that the registration isn't the way to go, it won't stop something from happening, and the rouges will still be rouges.

I responded to Mike's comments before I saw yours, so I'm repeating here, but I doubt you will ever see specific numbers. Not because they will be kept and hidden, but I think they will be hard to qualify. The survey might help a bit in that area, but wasn't sent to every member. Also, one doesn't have to note what they fly or even why they joined the AMA. With more than a million sold, I would like to think the AMA picked up membership in general.

I'm more interested in the survey results, and what if anything will be done with it. They asked for a pulse check in 2014 and I presume they got it (I don't recall getting that one). They asked again this year, and the results are in. Although I suspect the questions were different, they still dealt with the same issues. So it will be interesting to see what the results were of both. I will actually respond to the AMA dude right now, and as noted I will update the thread when I hear something.

You getting any of the heatwave we're getting down here? Was out flying again today in just a sweatshirt!

Lamoilleriver

[QUOTE=porcia83;12139812]With rare exception, and I'm talking teeny tiny rare, I think almost everyone agrees it's the operators who have really caused this issue, unsafe, reckless, and in some cases non-apologetic even when caught doing something that they shouldn't have been doing. I also agree that the registration isn't the way to go, it won't stop something from happening, and the rouges will still be rouges.

I responded to Mike's comments before I saw yours, so I'm repeating here, but I doubt you will ever see specific numbers. Not because they will be kept and hidden, but I think they will be hard to qualify. The survey might help a bit in that area, but wasn't sent to every member. Also, one doesn't have to note what they fly or even why they joined the AMA. With more than a million sold, I would like to think the AMA picked up membership in general.

Enjoying the warm weather, let the wood stove die out, this is supposed to be building season. Waiting for the lakes to freeze over for some winter flying. Do a lot(almost all anymore) of float flying, water is open, but the boats have been put away. Get to CT on a regular basis, have a child in graduate school in New Haven, any good LHS in the area or along I-91?

rcmiket

Well if we could verify that the "Drone" crowd was joining the organization that would justify the expense wouldn't it? So far all we have to show for the expenditure is........................... just what was it i can't seem to remember.
When I submitted my AMA application I recall checking off just where my interest was. I could be tracked along with age and so on.

Mike

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ay7iKzN5Pxs

Chris P. Bacon

My Feedback: (4)

..

astrohog

My Feedback: (1)

And that proves how much it cost HOW? typical Crispy twist! LOL

Astro

porcia83

My Feedback: (8)

[QUOTE=Lamoilleriver;12139821]Hog Heaven in Sturbridge MA is probably the best one for you. Right off 91. A nice little place, excellent selection of the little parts and dodads that we need, in addition to the more popular stuff as well. Great folks to deal with, they always support the clubs in the MA area. The best one in CT is in Winsted, very much off the beaten path in the opposite direction. Our club is about 2 miles off of 91 South, we've hosted plenty of fellow Vermonters at our events, you're welcome to stop by anytime and fly as a guest. Just drop me a PM, I'll be there. Can't remember the club or the name of the guys, but I saw them again this year at the NEAT Fair, they are from VT and do a little show with a Multiplex Mentor catching on "fire" and the pilots having the bail out. Funny and cute!
Hog H

porcia83

My Feedback: (8)

As noted previously, I doubt there is a realistic way to put up one number and compare it to expenditures, and give it a thumbs up and down. That approach is to simplistic (imo) and doesn't take everything into account. Lots of programs have been created and run without a specific goal of attracting X amount of member. I don't think anyone can say with reasonable certainly exactly (or even closely) how much was spent..and for what (for this specific situation). This if course will be a bone of contention in and of itself, perhaps better discussed in the 'dues" thread. Anyway, of the video releases to date, this is my favorite. I doubt the cost of these way anything significant, but of course, even that get's questioned as if it was to much. We finally have some "famous" people who the general public might recognized, and the AMA produces some good videos with them, and immediately the thought is oh god, how much were these. Another damned if they do/don't moment.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/HDGaQ6fMqiU" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Chris P. Bacon

My Feedback: (4)

..

Sport_Pilot

A drone is any radio controlled aircraft, so this poll makes a lot more sense.

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

As long as you stick to a definition that is incomplete and outdated, you have nothing to contribute to any discussion about how we can better define the differences between drones and what Traditional RC really is.

TimJ

Sorry combatpig, Webster Dictionary doesn't agree with you. Here is an official Webster Dictionary definition of "Drone" used as a noun:

[h=2]Definition of DRONE[/h]1: a stingless male bee (as of the honeybee) that has the role of mating with the queen and does not gather nectar or pollen


2: one that lives on the labors of others :

3: an unmanned aircraft or ship guided by remote control or onboard computers


http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/drone

IF you like to read science journals like I do, most in that sphere of influence would not call something remotely piloted a drone. But thanks mostly to news media, the multi-rotor aircraft have been labeled drone. Much like a copy machine, most people call the Xerox. Doesn't matter that the machine was manufactured by Canon, people will still call it a Xerox machine.

So after all of the babble, the end game is public recognition of what they perceive things. When the public observes a Multi-Rotor, they see "Drone". When the public observes a Model Airplane, they see Toy R/C airplane. Those labels are in place, and it would take an act of congress to change that perception......