Balloon thoughts........
03-03-2023, 05:36 AM
#1
Balloon thoughts........
I'm just wondering.......
Has anyone else had the thought that in all of this recent regulation of our hobby, WHY can it possibly be legal to set free so called "research balloons" into our airspace with absolutely no accountability to applicable regulations whatsoever????
We are in line of sight control of our models and are in full control of them, an ideal situation for avoiding a collision with manned aircraft. The "research balloon", however, is under no such control and some of these are carrying payloads of instrumentation of such size as to pose a clear and present danger to manned flight. And while we are being regulated literally to the death of our hobby, the "research balloon" gets a free pass on regulatory enforcement. Some may say "But the chances of a balloon / full scale flight collision are so small for it to be a non issue" , , , well, even if the chance is something like .00001%, that means that there IS still the chance, however small, of a collision! Just because it hasn't happened yet, there is no telling if tomorrow could be the day when a collision finally does happen.
Shouldn't applicable air safety regulation/enforcement apply to ALL man made objects being operated within our airspace????
Three unidentified objects shot down by US fighter jets since Friday may turn out to be balloons connected to “benign” commercial or research efforts, a White House official said on Tuesday.The US has not found any evidence to connect the objects to China’s balloon surveillance program nor to any other country’s spy program, national security council spokesperson, John Kirby, told reporters.
“We haven’t seen any indication or anything that points specifically to the idea that these three objects were part of the [People’s Republic of China’s] spying program, or that they were definitively involved in external intelligence collection efforts,” he said.Instead, a “leading explanation” may be that the objects were operated privately for commercial or research purposes, Kirby said, though no one has stepped forward to claim ownership.
The unidentified object shot down by a US fighter jet over northern Canada on Saturday was a “small, metallic balloon with a tethered payload below it”, according to a Pentagon memo.
Has anyone else had the thought that in all of this recent regulation of our hobby, WHY can it possibly be legal to set free so called "research balloons" into our airspace with absolutely no accountability to applicable regulations whatsoever????
We are in line of sight control of our models and are in full control of them, an ideal situation for avoiding a collision with manned aircraft. The "research balloon", however, is under no such control and some of these are carrying payloads of instrumentation of such size as to pose a clear and present danger to manned flight. And while we are being regulated literally to the death of our hobby, the "research balloon" gets a free pass on regulatory enforcement. Some may say "But the chances of a balloon / full scale flight collision are so small for it to be a non issue" , , , well, even if the chance is something like .00001%, that means that there IS still the chance, however small, of a collision! Just because it hasn't happened yet, there is no telling if tomorrow could be the day when a collision finally does happen.
Shouldn't applicable air safety regulation/enforcement apply to ALL man made objects being operated within our airspace????
"Three objects shot down after Chinese spy balloon may be benign, White House says"
The flying objects could be commercial- or research-linked, while US military admits first shot at object over Lake Huron missed.Three unidentified objects shot down by US fighter jets since Friday may turn out to be balloons connected to “benign” commercial or research efforts, a White House official said on Tuesday.The US has not found any evidence to connect the objects to China’s balloon surveillance program nor to any other country’s spy program, national security council spokesperson, John Kirby, told reporters.
“We haven’t seen any indication or anything that points specifically to the idea that these three objects were part of the [People’s Republic of China’s] spying program, or that they were definitively involved in external intelligence collection efforts,” he said.Instead, a “leading explanation” may be that the objects were operated privately for commercial or research purposes, Kirby said, though no one has stepped forward to claim ownership.
The unidentified object shot down by a US fighter jet over northern Canada on Saturday was a “small, metallic balloon with a tethered payload below it”, according to a Pentagon memo.
Last edited by init4fun; 03-03-2023 at 02:18 PM. Reason: clarify my point.....
03-03-2023, 05:50 AM
#2
And here's another thought; things that make you go hmmmm....
Since when did the US adopt a shoot first, and figure out what it is later policy? They keep telling us they don't know what they shot down. If they know what they shot down, but can't tell us what it is for, "security" reasons, they should just tell us that, not lie to us and tell us, "We don't know what it is".
It's all fake news........Go about your regularly scheduled life, folks, don't mind the man behind the curtain....
Astro
Since when did the US adopt a shoot first, and figure out what it is later policy? They keep telling us they don't know what they shot down. If they know what they shot down, but can't tell us what it is for, "security" reasons, they should just tell us that, not lie to us and tell us, "We don't know what it is".
It's all fake news........Go about your regularly scheduled life, folks, don't mind the man behind the curtain....
Astro
03-03-2023, 07:17 AM
#3
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03-03-2023, 08:20 AM
#4
It looks like the feds should start regulating hobbyist's Pico Balloons.
https://aviationweek.com/defense-spa...shot-down-usaf
https://aviationweek.com/defense-spa...shot-down-usaf
03-03-2023, 10:18 AM
#5
14 CFR 101 Sub Part D - Unmanned Free Balloons:
https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-1...-101/subpart-D
https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-1...-101/subpart-D
03-03-2023, 02:13 PM
#6
And here's another thought; things that make you go hmmmm....
Since when did the US adopt a shoot first, and figure out what it is later policy? They keep telling us they don't know what they shot down. If they know what they shot down, but can't tell us what it is for, "security" reasons, they should just tell us that, not lie to us and tell us, "We don't know what it is".
It's all fake news........Go about your regularly scheduled life, folks, don't mind the man behind the curtain....
Astro
Since when did the US adopt a shoot first, and figure out what it is later policy? They keep telling us they don't know what they shot down. If they know what they shot down, but can't tell us what it is for, "security" reasons, they should just tell us that, not lie to us and tell us, "We don't know what it is".
It's all fake news........Go about your regularly scheduled life, folks, don't mind the man behind the curtain....
Astro
14 CFR 101 Sub Part D - Unmanned Free Balloons:
https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-1...-101/subpart-D
https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-1...-101/subpart-D
If we are to believe the Govt. that these appeared to be "research balloons" that were shot down, thanks to Franklin providing the copy of the regulations I see multiple violations here. I am as skeptical as Astro is about the actualities of what transpired and the shooting down of 3 "unidentified" objects. "Shoot first & ask questions later" ????
And yes Hobby Inn, perhaps my opening post coulda been worded better, as per "why isn't there regulations?" VS the actual intent of "why aren't applicable regulations being enforced".
Welcome to the AMA subforum.....
Last edited by init4fun; 03-03-2023 at 02:15 PM.
03-03-2023, 02:19 PM
#7
03-03-2023, 04:08 PM
#8
Senior Member
After letting a Chinese spy balloon meander around recording our nuclear missile sites for 6 days, not sure there's an issue here other than the political theater of shooting down non-threats. Could it be the US government, who sends up almost 100 of these every day, and the US Air Force are not aware of weather balloons?
"On any given day, nearly 1,800 weather balloons are launched across the world, including 92 here in the U.S. and U.S. territories, according to the National Weather Service. Each flight lasts around two hours, during which a balloon drifts up to 125 miles and can reach an altitude of 100,000 feet. However, NWS Public Affairs Director Susan Buchanan says 125 miles is unusual. While weather balloons can drift as far as 180 miles, they typically travel only 30-35 miles downwind from their launch site,"
"The few launches done by amateurs every day are just a drop in the bucket ..."
https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/weat...s-turns/story?
id=97082985#:~:text=How%20many%20weather%20balloon s%20are%20there%3F,to%20the%20National%20Weather%2 0Service.
"On any given day, nearly 1,800 weather balloons are launched across the world, including 92 here in the U.S. and U.S. territories, according to the National Weather Service. Each flight lasts around two hours, during which a balloon drifts up to 125 miles and can reach an altitude of 100,000 feet. However, NWS Public Affairs Director Susan Buchanan says 125 miles is unusual. While weather balloons can drift as far as 180 miles, they typically travel only 30-35 miles downwind from their launch site,"
"The few launches done by amateurs every day are just a drop in the bucket ..."
https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/weat...s-turns/story?
id=97082985#:~:text=How%20many%20weather%20balloon s%20are%20there%3F,to%20the%20National%20Weather%2 0Service.
03-03-2023, 05:03 PM
#9
After letting a Chinese spy balloon meander around recording our nuclear missile sites for 6 days, not sure there's an issue here other than the political theater of shooting down non-threats. Could it be the US government, who sends up almost 100 of these every day, and the US Air Force are not aware of weather balloons?
"On any given day, nearly 1,800 weather balloons are launched across the world, including 92 here in the U.S. and U.S. territories, according to the National Weather Service. Each flight lasts around two hours, during which a balloon drifts up to 125 miles and can reach an altitude of 100,000 feet. However, NWS Public Affairs Director Susan Buchanan says 125 miles is unusual. While weather balloons can drift as far as 180 miles, they typically travel only 30-35 miles downwind from their launch site,"
"The few launches done by amateurs every day are just a drop in the bucket ..."
https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/weat...s-turns/story?
id=97082985#:~:text=How%20many%20weather%20balloon s%20are%20there%3F,to%20the%20National%20Weather%2 0Service.
"On any given day, nearly 1,800 weather balloons are launched across the world, including 92 here in the U.S. and U.S. territories, according to the National Weather Service. Each flight lasts around two hours, during which a balloon drifts up to 125 miles and can reach an altitude of 100,000 feet. However, NWS Public Affairs Director Susan Buchanan says 125 miles is unusual. While weather balloons can drift as far as 180 miles, they typically travel only 30-35 miles downwind from their launch site,"
"The few launches done by amateurs every day are just a drop in the bucket ..."
https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/weat...s-turns/story?
id=97082985#:~:text=How%20many%20weather%20balloon s%20are%20there%3F,to%20the%20National%20Weather%2 0Service.
03-03-2023, 06:03 PM
#10
Senior Member
1800 weather balloons per day worldwide. India, 2018, "An Air India plane carrying 180 passengers was forced to make an emergency landing at the Indira Gandhi International Airport here on Sunday, after a balloon used to measure weather parameters was allegedly sucked into one of its engines, forcing it to shut down.": https://www.thehindu.com/news/nation...le23721645.ece
Weather information is vital for air travel.
03-03-2023, 06:27 PM
#11
Nearly 100 weather balloons per day over the US for decades, one incident over Pennsylvania in 2019, "While hitting a weather balloon may sound scary, it seems as though the effects were minimal as the aircraft didn't declare an emergency or deviate from its flight path:"https://simpleflying.com/air-canada-weather-ballon-collision/
1800 weather balloons per day worldwide. India, 2018, "An Air India plane carrying 180 passengers was forced to make an emergency landing at the Indira Gandhi International Airport here on Sunday, after a balloon used to measure weather parameters was allegedly sucked into one of its engines, forcing it to shut down.": https://www.thehindu.com/news/nation...le23721645.ece
Weather information is vital for air travel.
1800 weather balloons per day worldwide. India, 2018, "An Air India plane carrying 180 passengers was forced to make an emergency landing at the Indira Gandhi International Airport here on Sunday, after a balloon used to measure weather parameters was allegedly sucked into one of its engines, forcing it to shut down.": https://www.thehindu.com/news/nation...le23721645.ece
Weather information is vital for air travel.
Meh, maybe better to go back to ruthlessly bashing the AMA, eh?
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04-01-2023, 03:29 PM
#13
Overzealous hobbyists don't care about potential risk to others
Just look at all the folks who make it their hobby to drive, [or do drugs] and then drive.
One of the most funny things I've ever seen was at Traffic Court about 50 years ago.
A real burned out looking Hippy was called to stand in front of the Judge.
The charge was that the Hippy sat in his car through 6 consecutive signal changes at a very busy intersection.
The Cop said that the Hippy had a tight grip with both hands on the steering wheel, with both eyes looking straight ahead and and his mouth wide open.
Everyone in the courtroom was laughing so hard at that Fried Potato...
Just look at all the folks who make it their hobby to drive, [or do drugs] and then drive.
One of the most funny things I've ever seen was at Traffic Court about 50 years ago.
A real burned out looking Hippy was called to stand in front of the Judge.
The charge was that the Hippy sat in his car through 6 consecutive signal changes at a very busy intersection.
The Cop said that the Hippy had a tight grip with both hands on the steering wheel, with both eyes looking straight ahead and and his mouth wide open.
Everyone in the courtroom was laughing so hard at that Fried Potato...
04-10-2023, 07:13 AM
#14
Hey guys, RCU is not the place for politics. I'm closing this thread and the next person to bring up stuff like this is going to be permanently banned from the site. You've got a million other places to discuss that stuff.
