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AMA Discounts for Disabled Flyers

Old 09-10-2005, 06:28 PM
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Default RE: AMA Discounts for Disabled Flyers


ORIGINAL: RWLewis2nd

...Proof of that potential can be found in the widespread knowledge of what the AMA's annual budget looks like. With that information which I have asked for and been told it is too secret for modelers to have, ...Jim Branaum AMA 1428

Jim, I'm not trying to change the subject of the post, but are you saying that the AMA won't provide the annual budget? If that's the case, I find that extremely troubling. I never thought about it until your post. They (We?) obviously don't publish it anywhere then? Thanks!
Yes sir, that is exactly what I am saying. No problem about the subject, I think we beat it up pretty well. I suspect part of the problem is that 'they' are afraid that folks on the Internet will rip it apart saying this and that can be done cheaper. Uneducated action of that nature was taken over the cost of mowing the grass a few years ago. I also suspect there is some (unfounded and cowardly?) fear that the average modeler will not understand that people need to earn a living, even if they work for the AMA.

Last year (or was it the year before?) I asked for a copy of the line item budget and was (after a long time and a second request) told that it was not to be shared with the membership. I understand that answer was paid for by our dues money at the lawyers office, but wonder what the big secret is. I thought that there was some requirement about openness of public organizations such as ours.

Abel's comments scare me even more because the implications are that we are guiding the future of the organization with information that is over a year old (annual report's available on line) rather than a written plan. Wonder who has the hip pocket (that is yours and my hip pockets) desire to build a new burial pyramid in Muncie? One would think that serious candidates for EVP would have noticed this, but it appears that is not the approved AMA way.
Old 09-17-2005, 01:10 PM
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Default RE: AMA Discounts for Disabled Flyers

I can not belive how blown out this simple question got you know its getting so bad on RCU you cant even say nothing because of all the BS you have to hear.and you wonder why people quit RCU
Old 09-17-2005, 03:31 PM
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Default RE: AMA Discounts for Disabled Flyers


ORIGINAL: layback2

I can not belive how blown out this simple question got you know its getting so bad on RCU you cant even say nothing because of all the BS you have to hear.and you wonder why people quit RCU
Is your point that we should all shut up and accept what ever our "betters" in Muncie say, or was there something else? Please educate me.
Old 09-18-2005, 08:10 PM
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Default RE: AMA Discounts for Disabled Flyers

NO jim iam not says that what iam fed up with is a person can not come on here to ask a simple question with out hearing all the bs witch has nothing to do with the question in the first place i know what your saying about AMA and i agree with you but that was not the question...........
Old 09-29-2005, 12:48 AM
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Default RE: AMA Discounts for Disabled Flyers

i didn't realize how much discrimination there was for the handicapped,reading some of these replies has sickened me.a man loses the use of his legs,or his arms,or eyes.or someone that was born handicapped.a man that has been gainfully employed all his life,then a tragedy happens.i read that some people think because you can type you should be able to work,or if you can fly an RC airplane you can work,try being on the other end of this.put in an application for work and list yourself as handicapped and be told that you are a liability and not qualified for the job.all some of you can see is your own side of this if you aren't disabled.i parked in a handicapped parking space once and had a fella ask me you don't look handicapped i asked him what does a handicapped person look like he looked at me almost in shame.i don't need any hand outs or sympathy,a man still has to try to have some sort of dignity in his life,there are people that are a lot worse off than i am and i try to be as self sufficient as i can.try this one time if you will.park in a regular parking space with cars on either side of yours and get a wheelchair out of your back seat,or go into a bathroom stall that isn't wide enough with a wheel chair.i never really gave the handicapped much thought either until i became one.this man just ask a simple question and a simple answer would be all that is needed,instead people went off in twenty different directions and vented about things that had nothing to do with his question.i have young children that i am still having to raise,and a house payment and other bills i have to pay and because i am unable to go work a regular job making the money i was before i became handicapped it is hard to do.i manage but i don't ask anyone for anything ,the only thing i do demand is some respect as another human being,what i have read here is a lot of assumptions and little understanding.if this has offended anyone here i am sorry i was also offended as a handicapped person. it was my take on the things i have read on this post...god bless us all we need it.
Old 09-29-2005, 06:54 AM
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Default RE: AMA Discounts for Disabled Flyers

Horace,
It would seem to me that this thread started with a simple question by yourself and turns into a political contest of wit by others.

Good luck in your quest
Old 09-29-2005, 07:17 AM
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Default RE: AMA Discounts for Disabled Flyers

Well Said horace315 I agree! you just can not ask a simple question here if it turns out as a political BS or just wonders off some were in space or someone is trying to sell you something never can get a straight answer to most questions
Old 09-29-2005, 07:43 AM
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Default RE: AMA Discounts for Disabled Flyers

i didn't realize how much discrimination there was for the handicapped,reading some of these replies has sickened me.a man loses the use of his legs,or his arms,or eyes.or someone that was born handicapped.a man that has been gainfully employed all his life,then a tragedy happens.i read that some people think because you can type you should be able to work,or if you can fly an RC airplane you can work,try being on the other end of this.put in an application for work and list yourself as handicapped and be told that you are a liability and not qualified for the job.all some of you can see is your own side of this if you aren't disabled.i parked in a handicapped parking space once and had a fella ask me you don't look handicapped i asked him what does a handicapped person look like he looked at me almost in shame.i don't need any hand outs or sympathy,a man still has to try to have some sort of dignity in his life,there are people that are a lot worse off than i am and i try to be as self sufficient as i can.try this one time if you will.park in a regular parking space with cars on either side of yours and get a wheelchair out of your back seat,or go into a bathroom stall that isn't wide enough with a wheel chair.i never really gave the handicapped much thought either until i became one.this man just ask a simple question and a simple answer would be all that is needed,instead people went off in twenty different directions and vented about things that had nothing to do with his question.i have young children that i am still having to raise,and a house payment and other bills i have to pay and because i am unable to go work a regular job making the money i was before i became handicapped it is hard to do.i manage but i don't ask anyone for anything ,the only thing i do demand is some respect as another human being,what i have read here is a lot of assumptions and little understanding.if this has offended anyone here i am sorry i was also offended as a handicapped person. it was my take on the things i have read on this post...god bless us all we need it.

Yes, I too was offended as a disabled person. And like you, still have a family to take care of and two pre-teen children to raise.
Thank you for your post. It was well thought out and well written, and expressed my feelings exactlly.

One other point -
In all this bashing and discrimination of the disabled, did anyone ever answer the original question?
Rememeber - The simple question - Is there any discount for the disabled? ???
Old 09-29-2005, 09:20 AM
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Default RE: AMA Discounts for Disabled Flyers

There is allways a job available at Wall Mart for the disabled. did ya ever see some of those people. They are very proud they can work and earn their way, and deserve our respect. Of course there should be a lower cost to those disabled for AMA membership for those who need it.
Old 09-29-2005, 11:24 AM
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Default RE: AMA Discounts for Disabled Flyers

The simple answer to the simple question is no, there is no AMA discount for disabled people.

The real issue here is priorities. Priorities should be food, clothing, shelter, medical care, and transportation, in that order. Flying R/C is not a priority, and if you can't afford to do it, then you shouldn't be doing it.

Okay, everyone here certainly understands your plight. You're disabled. You can't work. You've got lots of time on your hands. You're going stir crazy just sitting around watching TV. You need something to keep your mind focused and sharp. Does that mean we should have to subsidize your PLAY TIME, your HOBBY, your TOYS? No.

Whoever is responsible for the circumstances that caused you to get run over by a steam roller are the ones who should be buying you a lifetime membership in AMA, and all the planes you could ever hope to own. They should be sending you to the Hobbies Aloft flight school or at least to Clarence Ragland for flight training so you can fly your planes without crashing. It was their negligence, incompetence or complacency that put you in your current position, not ours.

There isn't a person here who doesn't sympathize with you and your situation. Don't ever forget that.
Old 09-29-2005, 12:22 PM
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Default RE: AMA Discounts for Disabled Flyers


ORIGINAL: Ramon081850

i didn't realize how much discrimination there was for the handicapped,reading some of these replies has sickened me.a man loses the use of his legs,or his arms,or eyes.or someone that was born handicapped.a man that has been gainfully employed all his life,then a tragedy happens.i read that some people think because you can type you should be able to work,or if you can fly an RC airplane you can work,try being on the other end of this.put in an application for work and list yourself as handicapped and be told that you are a liability and not qualified for the job.all some of you can see is your own side of this if you aren't disabled.i parked in a handicapped parking space once and had a fella ask me you don't look handicapped i asked him what does a handicapped person look like he looked at me almost in shame.i don't need any hand outs or sympathy,a man still has to try to have some sort of dignity in his life,there are people that are a lot worse off than i am and i try to be as self sufficient as i can.try this one time if you will.park in a regular parking space with cars on either side of yours and get a wheelchair out of your back seat,or go into a bathroom stall that isn't wide enough with a wheel chair.i never really gave the handicapped much thought either until i became one.this man just ask a simple question and a simple answer would be all that is needed,instead people went off in twenty different directions and vented about things that had nothing to do with his question.i have young children that i am still having to raise,and a house payment and other bills i have to pay and because i am unable to go work a regular job making the money i was before i became handicapped it is hard to do.i manage but i don't ask anyone for anything ,the only thing i do demand is some respect as another human being,what i have read here is a lot of assumptions and little understanding.if this has offended anyone here i am sorry i was also offended as a handicapped person. it was my take on the things i have read on this post...god bless us all we need it.

Yes, I too was offended as a disabled person. And like you, still have a family to take care of and two pre-teen children to raise.
Thank you for your post. It was well thought out and well written, and expressed my feelings exactlly.

One other point -
In all this bashing and discrimination of the disabled, did anyone ever answer the original question?
Rememeber - The simple question - Is there any discount for the disabled? ???
My response (Post #19, I believe) contained no bashing, and gave a hint about Spam Blockers, which can prevent AMA communications from getting through. I also suggested a phone call to AMA, which is the proper source for a response.

It does not hurt to ask for a discount. The worst that can happen is a refusal. I am aware of discounts for senior citizens, from several retailers, and I suspect the AARP had something to do with negotiating those discounts.

If the AARP can negotiate a discount, I suggest that a consortium of people with disabilities could negotiate discounts. The original poster might look into that, since he has time on his hands and can write & Email.

I would also suggest one not get overly insulted by other people's views, on a public internet forum. There is little respect for ARFs, Electrics, Slimers, glider people, 3D people, people who fly in circles, people who don't fly (warbirds, 3D, etc). I don't know as I would expect any better consideration if I was disabled, retired, or different in other fashions.

However, the original question has been answered, good suggestions have been made, and I'm not hearing that the original poster is satisfied with these responses. Not that I take offense, but it would be nice to hear a thanks, and not have to wonder if I'm being lumped with the critics.

Like it or lump it, I'm still Dave Olson
Old 09-29-2005, 02:28 PM
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Default RE: AMA Discounts for Disabled Flyers

The simple answer to the simple question is no, there is no AMA discount for disabled people.

The real issue here is priorities. Priorities should be food, clothing, shelter, medical care, and transportation, in that order. Flying R/C is not a priority, and if you can't afford to do it, then you shouldn't be doing it.

Okay, everyone here certainly understands your plight. You're disabled. You can't work. You've got lots of time on your hands. You're going stir crazy just sitting around watching TV. You need something to keep your mind focused and sharp. Does that mean we should have to subsidize your PLAY TIME, your HOBBY, your TOYS? No.

Whoever is responsible for the circumstances that caused you to get run over by a steam roller are the ones who should be buying you a lifetime membership in AMA, and all the planes you could ever hope to own. They should be sending you to the Hobbies Aloft flight school or at least to Clarence Ragland for flight training so you can fly your planes without crashing. It was their negligence, incompetence or complacency that put you in your current position, not ours.

There isn't a person here who doesn't sympathize with you and your situation. Don't ever forget that.
First - Thanks for answering the original question.

Second - No one knows priorities better than I do now. Since the time my condition became bad enough to totally disable me, it has been not only the hardest battle in every way, but also a learning experience just about every day. Only a doctor that treats the disabled, or a person that has been disabled for several years can understand the extent it affects not only every aspect of life but also the changes that happen to the rest of the body parts.

Doctors have tried to put me on the disabled list since I was a young man, but I didn't want that at all and just kept working as much as I could and pushed on through the pain. But after working a little over 33 years straight, without breaks or vacations I might add, I could no longer function well enough to hold down any job. And I wound up in this position. One that I never planned on being in. And this could happen to any of you.

Third - I did not, nor do I know of anyone, asking you to subsidize anything for me, or them. My wife and family decided that, like my psychiatrist at the VA had said, that I needed a hobby for good mental health, and they made the sacrifices to pay for the RC equipment.

Next - I have never been one to try to pass the responsibility for me or my actions off on anyone else, like is popular these days. That is one reason I worked as long as I possibly could. So I didn't run to the courts to try to sue someone else for my condition. I did apply for my Social Security disability - which I had paid into for over 33 years. I would have just ended it all except that there was and is a family that has to be taken care of. That's why I applied for my Social Security.

As for medical care - without insurance I would have had none. The Veterans Administration clinics and hospitals now take care of that since I'm disabled and a veteran (USMC).

As for how others feel - What am I supposed to think, when most of what is shown in this thread is contempt for the disabled? I see that every time I am taken out to the stores and my vehicle parks in the handicapped space. It gets old, but I know that for the most part it's just that most are ignorant about disabled people.

So many are like the poster that thinks it's just a simple 'go get a job at Wal-Mart'. It ain't that simple for many of us. Many of us cain't even do that.

So don't waste your sympathy on me. I'm used to having to fight every day, 24/7 for what others do and get effortlessly all the time.
But at least my caring and compassion isn't disabled, like some that posted in this thread. They have a more serious and worse disability than I do.

Old 10-27-2005, 12:49 PM
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Default RE: AMA Discounts for Disabled Flyers

This is really a disturbing thread, I first started flying because I visited a club that the members were a botherhood, and had a family atmosphere. A group of men doing what they enjoy and careing about each other even handicapped pilots. What a concept. This man asked a simple question, and then was attacked by many who have the luxury of doing so at the expense of many a disabled veteran. It used to be that We helped those that needed help without thinking of ourself, sometimes it still happens and people become disabled from it ( Military, Fire and Police, as well as any one else honorable enough to put his life on the line for another). I am all for AMA discounts for the Disabled and would be willing to contribute funds on a voluntary basis ( that way those who attacked in this thread would not be offended) and can be justified in their viewpoint to them self. Some of the responses in this thread are almost as if they are upset because someone is disabled, and able to participate in the same hobby as them. As for AMA discounts to disabled, there are many, many pilots that pay the dues yearly and have never had a claim, so I don"t think it would bankrupt them. I know that many will not like my post but the same disabled vets made sure that I could state my opinion as well so I will excercise that right, so their sacrifice does not go in vain. Lastly all you that have been so insulting to the origional poster, you are truly the most disabled people I know of.
Old 10-28-2005, 03:30 AM
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Default RE: AMA Discounts for Disabled Flyers

Sheesh. What a mess. I am with Ramon. I too am a disabled guy. I flew CL planes 30 years ago and only got back into this hobby since becoming disabled. I happened to be on the receiving end of a nasty virus. In it's worst case it kills you. In my case it leaves you looking ok but with pains that are like ice picks jabbing at you, minor aches that are similar to the worst case of the flu you ever had and temporary blindness that comes and goes and there are more symptoms that are just as crummy. My Dr.'s are now trying to repair the damage tho it isn't likely. In the meantime, when my body and the weather are on the same page, I try to fly. Worse, it's those ungodly electrics. I fly over the farm behind my house but would like to try landing on grass now and then so I joined the AMA. What a mistake. They don't care for electrics and now I see it's full of mentally disabled folks. Lordy.
There are weeks on end that I am stuck in my house. There are days when I can't read. There are other days when you'd never know there was anything wrong. I ask for nothing. I want nothing. Well, maybe a better pain killer. I walk with a cain as feet feel like I'm walking in shoes that are too small and are full off marbles. I don't care as I can see where I'm going. I fly electrics but I don't care because I built it myself. I quit the AMA because I could.
I have met some of the best people right here on RCU. I would feel honored to have these guys be my next door neighbors but most of you on this thread ...I don't think so. I'll gladly swap these shoes, give you my cane and these trying eyes. I'll be 52 in a couple of weeks. I am happy to have met those of you that haven't bashed those that are different. To the rest of you I hope you get well soon.
See you on the Badius Owners Club.
Lou
Old 10-28-2005, 06:09 AM
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Default RE: AMA Discounts for Disabled Flyers

Well said Lou. While I am not for any discounts as the same services should cost the same amount to all consumers (can you say 'Flat Tax'), it really makes me angry to see the mockery and lack of compassion expressed by others on this thread. I am very blessed to have good health for me and mine. Since the AMA fee is so insignificant as some others here have made it clear, maybe it wouldn't be so hard to help someone less fortunate with their renewal by chipping in. After all, isn't RCU the home of the Pay It Forward thread? Or does that charity only work when you have already made the choice not to pile on some fellow who is down on his luck. Public displays of largess and ignorant lynchings, although polar opposites in kindness, seem to both happen here depending on which way the wind is blowing.

I always thought it would be fun to print out some of these threads and post them in the churches, town halls, and refrigerator doors of where some of the participants live. It would be interesting to see how many people stand by their harsh words then. The internet is such a cowardly place to make a stand.

David Brown
Old 10-29-2005, 02:42 AM
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Default RE: AMA Discounts for Disabled Flyers

Thanks Dave.
First, let me express my thanks for their service to our country to Ramon and Art. Thank you. At the Age of 18 when I registered for the draft I was labeled 1H. To the Service that meant that they would have to bomb L.A. before they would take me. I had a disability back then that made me undesirable but not so much so that I couldn't work. In 1975 I volunteered but was rejected again. So it goes.
Ramon. I was born at the San Diego Naval Hospital on November 10th, 1953. Good day, huh? It's the Marine Corp Birthday for those that don't know it. My wifes birthday is July 4th. Year unknown to all but God. These dates seem to explain our patriotism.
But back to this disability business at hand. Ramon said in one of his statements that he would have ended it all if it weren't for his family and that he flies for his mental health. This is my frame of mind exactly. My wife budgets RC stuff for me so that there is something that I enjoy that I can do myself and thru RCU, share with others. This may seem strange to you rat besturds that seem to think that I should be at Wal Mart if there is a couple of hours that don't have some semblance of misery in them, earning a living somehow. Until 1 and 1/2 years ago I have had a job since the 3rd grade. To the petty bureaucratic snake Red, I think that you should be not only completely embarrassed, but removed from any level of responsibility at RCU that deals with the public. Such disregard for people that don't look, act or think like you is a disservice to those that cut your paycheck. To those that were supportive of the basic question and to general kindness, my thanks.
Sincerely,
Louis Marsalis
Old 11-01-2005, 01:40 PM
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Default RE: AMA Discounts for Disabled Flyers

Just a question. How can you (or anyone) fly under the influence of such strong drugs?

Thanks

Terry
Old 11-01-2005, 02:31 PM
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Default RE: AMA Discounts for Disabled Flyers

Simple. The drugs aren't to get loaded. They are to take away the pain. A fine line you may not be aware of.
Old 11-01-2005, 02:41 PM
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Let me try to explain it a little better. The pain pills are to remove the pain. After a great deal of trial and error, you and the Dr.'s find out where that fine line is. Once it is discovered, you can be coherrent without the druggie look. It isn't always possible but at the same time it isn't like you run around like a stupid drunk. Many of us have run into people that are functional alchoholics. They can do their jobs just fine loaded to the gills. But they are still drunk. A guy that takes pain pills under a Dr.'s care may be a tad loopy but that doesn't mean he can't communicate or do some basic stuff. Things are still a struggle but he still tries. Few guys like those disabled people that responded on this thread want to be loopy. We usually stay on the pain side verses the loopy side so we don't make stupid mistakes. But then again, this is my opinion. Others can chime in with their opinions if they feel the need. Anyhow, ask away. I'm never offended by a question about what happened to me. It makes it easier for me and who ever is near me easier. To understand my limitations is to understand my achievements. They are small to some but pretty big to me.
Thanks.
Lou
Old 11-01-2005, 03:17 PM
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Default RE: AMA Discounts for Disabled Flyers

I gusee the real question becomes are you impaired when you use these medications. If you were pulled over by a law Police offices would you be considered impaired? In Virginia you could be written a DUI.

THanks

Terry
Old 11-01-2005, 03:26 PM
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Default RE: AMA Discounts for Disabled Flyers

One thing that I di is to set the timer on my watch so that if I forget the last time I took a pill, all I have to do is look. Some days are worse/better than others. On the same note, some days I can drive, some I can't. I suspect I could get written up in any state if I drive on a day I shouldn't. If I do make a mistake, write me up or arrest me. Shouldn't be on the road causing God knows what kind of haveck. Most days I can't drive and I'm fortunate enough to know the difference. Some days I can't fly my planes. Some times I try anyway. Since I fly over a farm when no one is around, it doesn't much matter and usually makes for a funny story.
Old 11-01-2005, 03:55 PM
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Default RE: AMA Discounts for Disabled Flyers


ORIGINAL: cattop1000

I gusee the real question becomes are you impaired when you use these medications. If you were pulled over by a law Police offices would you be considered impaired? In Virginia you could be written a DUI.

THanks

Terry
In any state you could be written a DUI based strictly on chemical analysis of what's in your body. The fuzz have no other way (that would make a case) to measure your 'impairment.' I spent months in a hospital after a car crash left me with more gashes, contusions and bone fractures than Evil Knievel had racked up. I was a whole helluva lot less impaired while on Demerol (pretty hard narc) than I was during the come-down phase when I was given placebo injections.

Abel

Old 11-01-2005, 04:01 PM
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Default RE: AMA Discounts for Disabled Flyers

HHmmmm. Demerol.
Old 11-02-2005, 04:49 AM
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Default RE: AMA Discounts for Disabled Flyers

To those of you asking about the pain medications:

I asked one of my doctors why was it that I could take several times the amount of pain killer medications that would make most people VERY drunk, or drugged, or impaired and all it did for me was knock the edge off my pain and I was still functional and NOT impaired in any way, except by the pain that is still there.

His response was that the high level of pain "ate up" the medication. Fact is - I am usually in a better shape with some pain meds than without because of the effect of the pain. And like Lou said, I always look for the minimum amount of pain killers that I have to use instead taking too many. It is better to take a bit too little than too much for many, many reasons.

I had to stop driving years ago. Not because of the medications, but because of the effect of the pain on my body. I didn't want to kill someone out there on the road.

It is almost impossible to explain to someone that is "normal" what it is like to be disabled. And it gets even worse when the "normal" person thinks they know better than you what it's like.

The amount of pain killer that I have to use just to get through some of my 'bad' days would make a "normal", healthy person not just drunk, or drugged, but could possibly kill them. At least that is what has been told to me by people in the medical field that should know.

If you can understand that my body reacts differently to medicine than yours, you will just BEGIN to understand the situation.

Lou has more patients than I do. He has hung in there to try and explain some things to you. IF, big IF, you folks REALLY want to know about the meds and effects - then read and listen to what the man says. Of course if you are just wanting to argue and try to somehow make yourself 'right' and the rest of us wrong - then no amount of explaination is going to help.


One last point though - the original poster wasn't asking FOR a discount - just IF one was available.
Just thought that needed to be pointed out to all of you that are afraid it might cost you a nickle extra.
And for what it's worth - I just got my AMA card back a couple of days ago - And I paid the full amount. That should satisfy some of you.
Old 11-02-2005, 07:03 AM
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Default RE: AMA Discounts for Disabled Flyers

I thank you both for the information you have brought forward.

Terry

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