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More on the D 10 Election

Old 03-07-2006, 12:29 PM
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J_R
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Default More on the D 10 Election

Since it appears that the other thread I started about the D 10 election is going to take a somewhat different path than had been intended, here is another. Perhaps we can keep it on track and on the intended topic.
Old 03-07-2006, 12:32 PM
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Default RE: More on the D 10 Election

-----Original Message-----
From: Wes De Cou [mailto:xxx@xxxx]
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 9:05 AM
To: 'Jean and Debbie Rondot'
Subject: RE: D 10 election

J_R:

District 10 is, in terms of membership, the largest in the Academy, and deserves a full-time, dedicated leader.

Flying Site Assistance is critical to the longevity of the organization, and requires a full-time, dedicated leader.

I’m weighing my personal thoughts on where I can be of the most value.

No decision as yet.

Wes
-----Original Message-----
From: Jean and Debbie Rondot [mailto:xxx@xxx]
Sent: Monday, March 06, 2006 8:55 AM
To: wesdecou@xxx@xxx
Subject: D 10 election

Hi Wes

Do you have any interest in running for D 10 VP this year?

Jean-Pierre Rondot (J_R)
AMA 732

Old 03-07-2006, 05:29 PM
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Default RE: More on the D 10 Election

I would love to run IF the following happened.....

JR would also be on the ballot
Wes would be on the ballot

I feel that way the AMA members of this district would be in a win/win situation. If I were not to win, I'd sure volunteer to be one his AVP's!

Jerry
Old 03-08-2006, 01:28 AM
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Default RE: More on the D 10 Election

JR,
I read your comments in the other thread but think you ought to consider running. Your knowledge of all things AMA is unsurpassed and you have first hand knowledge of the problems of the largest population concentration of the district. I have long felt that our current AVP has ignored Southern California and I never see any mention of him attending events in this area. The lack of flying sites and the recent loss or diminished flying allowed at some of the local fields is in my mind the most pressing issue we face and has not been addressed by the outgoing AVP to my knowledge.
Old 03-08-2006, 02:25 AM
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Default RE: More on the D 10 Election

BasinBum - Just curious exactly what steps you feel the current VP has failed to take to remedy the problems you see.

What diminished flying has occurred and what should Mr. Hanson have done to prevent or change it? What fields have been lost that would not have been lost except for the ineffectiveness on Hanson's part??

As far as event attendance goes, I think you have not been reading the AMA column too closely. In fact Rich gets around his District, the largest in both area and membership, better than most VPs do. Almost every column has coverage of some event, be they small club events or larger events. It is of course impossible to get to every event, but what events should he have gotten to that he did not??

I have no problem with being critical of a person's performance as long as you can back it up with facts and solid recommendations for how things should have been done.
Old 03-08-2006, 02:42 AM
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Default RE: More on the D 10 Election

El Toro, Redondo Esplanade, Jet's at Prado there are others that I can't think of right now. I don't know if he could have done anything but it seems that he hasn't been involved at all. I read MA and always look in the D10 section to see where he has been. I can't recall him attending events in SoCal but I could be wrong.

I'd love to give you a bunch of facts but I'm just speaking from the impression I have. I know he is popular and considered an effective VP but I havn't met him or heard of him being around anywhere I frequent. I've met Sandy Frank out at the Basin yet have not heard of our own VP visiting the bussiest flying site in the district.
Old 03-08-2006, 10:55 AM
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Default RE: More on the D 10 Election

ORIGINAL: BasinBum

El Toro, Redondo Esplanade, Jet's at Prado there are others that I can't think of right now. I don't know if he could have done anything but it seems that he hasn't been involved at all. I read MA and always look in the D10 section to see where he has been. I can't recall him attending events in SoCal but I could be wrong.
Well your first post certainly made it seem like you thought he failed to act in these cases. Let me add a few facts since I am intimately aware of two of the field you cite since I am a member at both places and have knowledge of both situations.

First Prado. This was caused by the failure of the CD of the Best of the West Jet rally to properly enforce the altitude limits that were prescribed in the lease between the club and the County. The County came down like a ton of bricks after an incident during the event and nearly closed the field permanently. It was in fact closed for nearly a month. The ONE AND ONLY WAY that the county would even consider re-opening the field was with a modification to the lease that banned jets (turbines). The club had absolutely no choice in the matter and there was nothing AMA, or Rich, could do. The county held all the cards. If the club had not accepted the jet ban along with new wording on zero-tolerance enforcement of the long established altitude limits (400 feet) then they simply were going to close the field forever. Period.

El Toro - Rich was involved with that site from almost the first day. He was there for several site walks early on and attended the grand opening. The field was lost due to the new owners being absolute hard nosed about some things. Each time the club met the new owners absurd demands, the owners made up new ones. It was a no win situation. Again, this was totally out of the District VPs hands.

Redondo I do not know anything about and cannot comment on that one.

Rich, along with AMA Staffers Carl Maroney and Wes DeCou have been involved at the request of the Harbor Soaring Society in their efforts to secure a long term lease with the City of Costa Mesa for the flying site near Estancia High School. All three met with the club folks at their site and have helped behind the scenes with document review and comments. Not everything ends up in the magazine!!

Rich attends not only events, but club meetings and various other club functions in the District. Again recall that the District is HUGE. So he may not hit every event and every club function, but he does get around. Take some time and go back and review his columns. I think you will see that he does get around. Bear in mind that while each District VP has a budget for travel and such, it is a very small one. Given the size of District X it is unreasonable to expect the VP to get to each and every field, event, or club function.


I'd love to give you a bunch of facts but I'm just speaking from the impression I have. I know he is popular and considered an effective VP but I havn't met him or heard of him being around anywhere I frequent. I've met Sandy Frank out at the Basin yet have not heard of our own VP visiting the bussiest flying site in the district.
And there you go. Post a scathing criticism based on an impression without really knowing the facts. Which is what I took exception to. It is funny you mention Dr. Frank. I know you have been around these forums for a while and you certainly know that he is not universally loved even in his own District. Again, I have no problem with anyone having an opinion, but I pay more attetnion to opinons that are based on actual facts as opposed to misinformation or incorrect assumptions.

And to be clear, while I know and like Rich none of my comments are meant to defend only him. ALL of the District VPs have similar problems. Even in the smaller Districts it is impossible for a VP to get to each and every club event, regional events, or other functions. Also recall that the magazine severely limits the space of each column and also dictates how many photos can be included.

But getting back on subject here, I think everyone needs to keep these realities in mind as we evaluate what the potential replacements have to say about what they can do in the District. Jim Giffin is a current AVP and has put a great deal of time and energy into helping makes things better up in his neck of the woods (NORCAL). He has worked closely with Rich over a long time and knows the issues that face the District better than most. He also has the time and the desire to pick up the ball and run with it.

Wes DeCou has the experience of being a District VP before and knows the inner workings of the AMA better than many others would. He has been working as a paid AMA staff member for flying site assistance in the western US. He has a huge area to cover. He knows the special challenges that we in the west have to deal with when it comes to flying sites. Here in SOCAL the amount of open land available for sites is very limited and what is available is tremendously costly. One of my clubs pays nearly $20,000 a year in lease fees to the site owner! It would cost us nearly 50 MILLION dollars to buy the land we fly on and over!!

And lastly, do not forget that the District VP job is a VOLUNTEER position. They do not get paid one single penny for doing the job. And from what I have seen it ends up being nearly a full time job if done even close to right!!
Old 03-08-2006, 01:05 PM
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Default RE: More on the D 10 Election

Well you certainly are more familiar with those situations than I am and thanks for the updates. I still think JR would make a good AVP and my personal interests in having the next AVP in close proximity to SoCal would be met. As you say the District is large and travel is limited so the closer the better.
Old 03-08-2006, 02:20 PM
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Default RE: More on the D 10 Election

ORIGINAL: BasinBum

Well you certainly are more familiar with those situations than I am and thanks for the updates. I still think JR would make a good AVP and my personal interests in having the next AVP in close proximity to SoCal would be met. As you say the District is large and travel is limited so the closer the better.
Yep, and then the folks in Arizona, Utah, and Nevada can complain

In my mind it takes more than an internet presence and local proximity to be a good VP. What factors are you weighing in your support of JR??
Old 03-08-2006, 03:04 PM
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Default RE: More on the D 10 Election

ORIGINAL: Phaedrus-MMVI
>SNIP<
What factors are you weighing in your support of JR??
It makes zero difference. I have always said I am not interested in either an elected nor an appointed position in the AMA. Nothing has changed.

BasinBum

While I disagree with our Greek philosopher about the nature of the clubs' problems, and find their problems more internal than external, I agree that Rich has done a great job. If there is a knock on Rich, it is that he is too devoted to his district. He was one of those from the AMA that was there to save Torrey Pines in a situation where the AMA could play a role. He then got Torrey Pines named as an AMA historical site. He was the one that went to bat for Miramar when it was burned out in the San Diego fires. He is the one that spent over 3 years writing and developing a re-write of a portion of the by-laws, only to have a single individual stand in the way of submission to the leader members. This list could go on and on. Rich is not big on the words "me" or "I" and he does what he does out of the limelight.

I believe I know who Phaedrus is now. I will not publicly "out" him, whether I am right or wrong. If he is who I think he is, he may well, in the future, run for VP. He has given you every clue to his identity. If I am correct, he is someone I could support should he choose to run in the future. I do wish he would disclose his identity, but…

Phaedrus

The Redondo situation was a bunch of non-AMA guys that were opposed to rules. Making a long story short, their antics drove the City Council to ban model flying in Redondo Beach. A move that did not set well with those on the Council. Hitting a Councilwoman in the head, and hitting cars with their planes left the Council little choice. There is a long thread in this forum if you want further details. At any rate, there was nothing, IMO, that Rich, or the AMA could have done.

Jerry Festa has been an author in several model magazines over the years and I think most would agree that his all around expertise is more than enough to qualify him as a VP.

I am not of the opinion that a VP must/should serve as an AVP before being a VP. That is a position that I can well understand that you might not agree with. We should certainly, as a district, be able to field three qualified candidates for VP of the largest and most populace district in the AMA.





Old 03-08-2006, 03:29 PM
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J_R
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Default RE: More on the D 10 Election

Speaking of internet presence, the single area where D 10 is sub-par is it's web presence, IMO. For a district of this size to have such a poor website is unacceptable.
Old 03-08-2006, 03:44 PM
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Default RE: More on the D 10 Election

ORIGINAL: J_R

Speaking of internet presence, the single area where D 10 is sub-par is it's web presence, IMO. For a district of this size to have such a poor website is unacceptable.
Then I guess that will be one of the changes you would make were you to run and be elected??

Questions I would ask any candidate are:

1 - What is the single biggest issue facing our District and what do you plan to do about it?

2 - What do you plan to do differently and why?

3 - What skills do you bring to the table that have prepared you to successfully represent the District on the Executive Council? Have you worked in this type of management by committee environment before??

Old 03-08-2006, 03:58 PM
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Default RE: More on the D 10 Election

You seem to have taken offense to my last observation. My goodness, are you now, or have you ever been the webmaster for D 10?

Is there something about not running that you do not understand? Is there something that I was not clear about on your question 3 when it comes to me?

Are you ready to disclose your identity, or has Rich prohibited that?


ORIGINAL: Phaedrus-MMVI

ORIGINAL: J_R

Speaking of internet presence, the single area where D 10 is sub-par is it's web presence, IMO. For a district of this size to have such a poor website is unacceptable.
Then I guess that will be one of the changes you would make were you to run and be elected??

Questions I would ask any candidate are:

1 - What is the single biggest issue facing our District and what do you plan to do about it?

2 - What do you plan to do differently and why?

3 - What skills do you bring to the table that have prepared you to successfully represent the District on the Executive Council? Have you worked in this type of management by committee environment before??

Old 03-08-2006, 05:02 PM
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Default RE: More on the D 10 Election

ORIGINAL: J_R

You seem to have taken offense to my last observation. My goodness, are you now, or have you ever been the webmaster for D 10?
No offense taken and I'm sorry if it came across that way. And yes, I was in fact the District X webmaster for a couple of years back around 99 to 01. The issue was and still is, content. You can have all the willing people to do the site that you want, but you need something to put in there and that quickly becomes the issue!! I simply asked if this was something you felt to be an important issue, which apparently you do.


Is there something about not running that you do not understand? Is there something that I was not clear about on your question 3 when it comes to me?
My question was not directed specifically at you, but you have not really answered it either. But that is not the point. These questions are ones I think any person running should have answers for.


Are you ready to disclose your identity, or has Rich prohibited that?
My name is Bill Malvey. I live in Orange County. I am currently an Associate District X VP and have been for 3 years. Prior to that I worked in an unofficial capacity helping both Rich, and his predecessor, with various issues within our District. I actively fly giant scale aerobatics, helicopters, and thermal duration competition soaring and belong to PVMAC, OCMA, and the Torrey Pines Gulls. I am also active in IMAC and am the current Chairman of the IMAC Rules and Standards Committee. Prior to that I ran the JR-SCAT Series and was the CD of 27 large scale aerobatics contests held in Arizona, California, and Nevada. How's that? And for the record, I have no interest in being the VP. I like flying too much and from what I have seen that job ends your flying career!!

And anyone who knows me knows that I generally do not let others tell me what to think, say, or write.

I know two of the other people whose names have been mentioned (Jim and Wes) as potential candidates. I think both would do a fine job. I have never met Jerry Festa, but know him form his magazine writing. I have no way of knowing at this point if he would be a good VP.
Old 03-08-2006, 05:33 PM
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Default RE: More on the D 10 Election

Hi Bill

First, I have to apologize for baiting you. I knew you had been the web master because you had told me so in the past. I took the shot at Rich in hopes that it would force you to reveal your identity, there was no substance to the question.

I am really glad you identified yourself. You have too much to offer in this forum to remain anonymous. As I said earlier, when your time comes, I will likely support you for VP.

JR
Old 03-08-2006, 05:39 PM
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Default RE: More on the D 10 Election

ORIGINAL: J_R

Hi Bill

First, I have to apologize for baiting you. I knew you had been the web master because you had told me so in the past. I took the shot at Rich in hopes that it would force you to reveal your identity, there was no substance to the question.
The other, easier and more straight forward way to "out" me was to simply ask me. Not as much fun, but it gets the same result.

I am really glad you identified yourself. You have too much to offer in this forum to remain anonymous. As I said earlier, when your time comes, I will likely support you for VP.

JR
Most people already know who I am (including BB since he and I have exchanged PMs before). I only use the screen name for fun.

And thanks for reminding me about Rich's involvement with Torrey Pines nd Miramar. Frankly I think the next guy has some pretty big shoes to fill.
Old 03-08-2006, 06:31 PM
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Default RE: More on the D 10 Election


ORIGINAL: tailskid

I would love to run IF the following happened.....

JR would also be on the ballot
Wes would be on the ballot

I feel that way the AMA members of this district would be in a win/win situation. If I were not to win, I'd sure volunteer to be one his AVP's!

Jerry
You guys got it made. Jerry, Jean, and Wes. Get nominated. Then there is Bill Malvey. That makes FOUR extremely well qualified people.

The nominating committee will remove one. 90% +/- change of the membership will set on their butts, and take no interest. Then some 10% will have a popularity contest and one gets elected. Sounds like a good thing to me.

BTW, Bill, one can be a DVP and still be very effective while flying in a significant number of events. BTDT. You sound like a "fast-burner" and probably would be a good DVP.

As JR used to say when he was running me down for D-8 VP, what any DVP does effects the entire AMA. [>:]
Old 03-08-2006, 06:37 PM
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Default RE: More on the D 10 Election

ORIGINAL: Hossfly


ORIGINAL: tailskid

I would love to run IF the following happened.....

JR would also be on the ballot
Wes would be on the ballot

I feel that way the AMA members of this district would be in a win/win situation. If I were not to win, I'd sure volunteer to be one his AVP's!

Jerry
You guys got it made. Jerry, Jean, and Wes. Get nominated. Then there is Bill Malvey. That makes FOUR extremely well qualified people.
Thanks for the kind words, but to quote a well known Texan:

If nominated I will not run
If Elected I will not serve!

Too much on my plate and I'm happy to play second fiddle in this band!!!
Old 03-08-2006, 09:11 PM
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Default RE: More on the D 10 Election

Well I stand corrected. Yes JR, Bill has never made his identity a secret. A lot of folks would rather he resume the Scat series rather than run for DVP because they are very popular indeed.
Old 03-13-2006, 08:25 PM
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Default RE: More on the D 10 Election

Having seen Rich Hansen at many events over the years I will say that he has made quite an effort to get out of AZ and kick the tires in California. Rich attended a couple events held at our home field (SGVRCL) in South El Monte. I also enjoyed meeting Rich at the IMAA Castle AFB giant scale event, the QSAA events in Las Vegas, Condor giant scale event, pylon races at Madera, Redlands and Apollo field. Don't forget about the IMS and Ontario shows. Sure he's not everywhere but he was out and about.

In fact he even stopped by for a Tuesday night club meeting. He attended the entire meeting and was available for any and every question thrown his way.

Kudo's to Rich on his efforts in representing District X. Enjoy your second retirement, friend!


Dan

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