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Quoted from the IMAC list.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Peter Goldsmith
> Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2003 10:52 AM
> To: Dist: TeamJR
> Subject: TOC
>
> Just talked to Steve Rojecki and he has said that MRS. Bennett has
> decided not to continue the Tournament. Looks like this is an end of an
> era. I worked out MR. Bennett has donated over $9m towards the TOC,
> Scale aerobatics and RC aviation in general. All good things must come
> to an end, but please think of where our industry would be without MR.
> Bennett's contributions.
>
> It's bitter sweet for me, I'm going to miss the many fun times I had at
> the event, the promotional opportunities it has given JR and other
> Horizon brands, plus the many friendships I reacquaint each tournament.
> The good news is I am looking forward to using the extra time working
> closer with the Team members and spending more quality time with the
> family.
> Finally a special thanks to Steve Rojecki, who unselfishly gave his time
> each tournament to be CD. For those that have attended the Tournament, you
> know what a great job Steve did.
>
> Kind regards
>

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Does anyone else think this would be the perfect time for the ama to work with corporate sponsors and host the event in muncie (ama headquarters) Seems like a logical step to me, although I realize a lot of West coasters would be less than pleased

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Instead of pontificating about it, maybe you should contact your DVP and suggest it to him. Who knows? The people that run the AMA are not the drooling vegetables everyone makes them out to be. Maybe they've already thought of it, and just need a push from the membership.

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Their Not? :D

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sounds like a good idea to me.The AMA could do something useful with all that money they have instead of spending loads and loads on crap that doesn't benefit us as modelers.
They could also get some judges that might be a little more unbias and more of the neutral kind for such an event.

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I'm all for promotion of our hobby. But is the promotion worth monies spent on the TOC. Not sure that it is. I think more time should be spent on the middle and small size planes, not giant size. For example I think you can attract a lot more newcomers with parkfliers.

Now if they can somehow get some TV coverage on ESPN or something, that would be a differant thing.

Sad about Bennett dying. He was one of the pioneers of our hobby, I believe he started the TOC in 71 or 72.

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You may not have noticed that there are beginning to be small electrics that some of the IMAC guys are using to hover. This is evidence of better power densities in the battery packs and better electronics in the ESC's, RX's, servos, and motors. This is the entry to some sort of lower cost and more widely attended competitive event.

I doubt Bennett would approve hole heartedly, but I bet he would not frown if the same moves were made down the price scale where most of the rest of us live.

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It appears to me the TOC was a very exclusive event attended by the very rich in our hobby. It was good for a limited few. I am not sure what it did for the hobby and nine million dollars could have helped to secure additional flying fields , for example, and other things that would have brought our hobby further into the public eye. I can think of many things nine mil would have done for the Muncie Site. I am all for competiton but think it should be for all, not the chosen few.

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AMEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Competition by definition is an exclusive activity. There are those who can compete, and those who can't. There are levels of competition, where people of comparable skill level are pitted against each other.

I don't know where you get your figures, but the AMA's expenditure on the TOC did not come anywhere near $9 million. The AMA doesn't bring that much money in in a year...

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Thank you for opening the door and shedding some light on a misunderstanding. Mr. Bennett spent HIS OWN money supporting something he believed in very much. I think the AMA spent whatever it costs to provide a sanctioned event insurance coverage. But as others will attest, I have been wrong before.

The second comment that deserves a close look is the financial realm of competition. I used to do the 1/4 mile drag race scene and the one thing I took away from that which applies to ALL competition that involves engines is a well worn and widely known rule. Cubic money always beats cubic inches.

Having said that I also must point out the great growth in power plants, airframes, radio systems, DIGITAL servos, and a myriad of other things that are beginning to become available to the average modeler because the competitor needed them. Most of you are not aware that the SECOND generation of digital servos is out there, but you may have heard, seen, or used some of the first generation units now making the general hobby market.

Contrary to the impression I know some of my comments in other threads, I think we NEED competition and we benefit from it. I just think the average modeler needs a slightly faster rate of return on OUR investment. IOW, the 'good stuff' needs to trickle down faster!

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I don't agree on the numbers but I wish that there were like mini nationals for each and every district,I work in the summer time and don't have a lot of time to travel great distances.I'm a heavy equip op and usually work 60 to 70 hours a week for 9 months straight,It would be nice if each and every district would have their own top gun or toc or some kind of program that would be able to include all of us good/or bad.Do it in a way that would eliminate contestants throughout the year and then at the end of the summer have the top gun for your district.I believe this type of format would involve literally hundreds of pilots who would otherwise never think about competing in other contests nation wide.Then at the end of the year have each winner from each district compete together at a neutral spot such as muncie,or a state in the middle somewhere where it would be fair for all to attend or travel to.Just a thought!!

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I agree with Jim,as the average joe that is not sponsored or has loads of cash at hand can't compete with the people who do!!!.There are guys out there who put countless hours into building and flying and are just as good as most of the guys competing in either Top Gun or the TOC,but will never get there because of jobs traveling time or the biggest thing of all MONEY.This is where I think each seperate district should host their own tourneys for their own people.Instead of the AMA spending countless dollars on overseas tournaments or things like fai that most of us do not benefit from anyway,give the money to the districts to get us average joe's a chance or atleast the opportunity to compete against others from neighboring states and towns.
I don't know about anyone else but I can't take the time to run all over God's green earth to try to compete in a tourney in Arizona (TOC) or Lakeland Florida (Top Gun)or where ever the nationals are being held each year.Lets have something that is available for all within a reasonable distance from our own doorsteps in each district.More people/Modelers would compete if they felt they could!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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I am a little surprised that there is so little accurate information about Bill Bennett and what he did. Mr. Bennett loved models. If memory serves, he was an AMA Fellow. He had an empire in Las Vegas. He ran (was the major stockholder) the Circus Circus conglomerate for a long time(Circus Circus, Excalibur, Luxor and others). He, at one point, had a Hobby Shop/Distributorship in Las Vegas known as Circus Circus Hobbies. In more recent years, he owned the Sahara. He was one of the richest men in the world, according to Forbes. I am not sure about the early years of the TOC, but, in the later years it was not an AMA sanctioned contest (if for no other reason, there was no weight limit on the planes). He put the contest on to showcase the best pilots in the world. It was invitational. The invitations went to those that the TOC committee deemed to be the best. The money he put up as prize money was his, not that of the AMA, as Jim pointed out. I would like to say that he did it as a money making draw for Las Vegas (which was his reasoning to his shareholders), but, in my heart I know he lost money on it every time the TOC was held. He did it all for his love of modeling.

With the level of money that was offered as prizes and the cost of staging the TOC, it is highly unlikely that the event will continue without a large sponsor or group of sponsor's, in it's current form. Certainly, the AMA could not afford to do it.

JR

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Like JR said Mr. Bennett was and avid fan of our hobby his old home in las vegas had an airstrip on it he had an asfalt runway the size of the sam boyde field and that was for him to fly his planes from when he was at home I lived in vegas fo about 10 years or so and I drove Limos there and on several occasions I was called to his old home to pic up clients and the strip is clearly visable there it is not used for the reason it was put there anymore dont know if the owners of the home even now what it is. and Im sorry to hear that Mr. Bennett has passed I do not live in vegas any more but am planning to move back very soon. does any one know if the Bennett field is still gonna be there and open for flying. is the parks going to keep the property open for the pilots there or is it going to be closed down? I used to fly at that field every chance I had when i was in vegas and would love to fly there again when i come back I have been to several TOC events and loved them every time and every time the croud grew a little bit every time sure it is an event for the high dollar hobbest but its a starting point possably for some if you now what I mean if you think about it lets say some of those kids that where at the last event i went to said I would like to do that where do you theink they are going to start out with a trainer like every one else did right? so sure it is a high dollar event but it does peak courisetys to those who are not in the hobby and might even have gotten at least 1 in to the hobby over the years it was held even 1 added to our hobby is better than none at all
:D :D :D
Rick