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-   -   Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions) (https://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/arf-rtf-75/6494380-top-flite-b-25-arf-tecnical-tips-suggestions.html)

timothy thompson 10-24-2007 08:57 PM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
man we should all get together for a b-25 fly in. how would we tell them apart though LOL i have a corsair ive been doing for 2 years now. Got the maiden in and now superdetailing. go to the top flite gs thread to see pics, i have over 500 brass srews to simulate actual dudz fasternes and threaded bolts the f4u had. i like the arf concept as i can have a flyable scale model in a short time
but i also love building so all is good!

RCKen 10-24-2007 09:02 PM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
It is big. It barely fit in the back of my truck to bring it home.

Ken

norm 10-24-2007 10:07 PM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
Hello Ken / tim. I have observed on the nacelle frame that there is a little piece of wood across from the strut well. It must be removed in order to have the retracts to function. For Tim; how does the wooden lever to operate the gear doors perform... Would you suggest to look into pneumatic cylinders with a sequencer valve; will it be easier to install? For the whole build this door lever system is the only thing bugging me. For the noze gear. The pull pull system has long cables. it would be advisable to install elastics to maintain the wire tight. The robart main gears should have been 5/8 and noze wheel 1/2 instead of 1/2 & 7/16. weight, weight, weight...

Airnondas 10-24-2007 10:14 PM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
Hi Norman

Do you have any pics for us to see your Big Beautiful B-25 ?

___________________

Airnondas

norm 10-24-2007 10:20 PM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
I'm about to do that but I think every one will find me rertarded...the plane has been put together, nothing is glued or bolted..only the wings installed to the fuse. The nacelled are far from being installed, I'll do it tomorow (the picture), I'm about to go to bed...Ok a picture tomorow jut to make you laugh.

krproton 10-24-2007 10:34 PM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
Hi normandouellette.

Yes. The leftover wood "spacer" must be removed to install the retracts. I assume modelers would figure this out for themselves.:eek:

The lever system performs really well I must say. I was a little concerned when we were developing it, but it has performed flawlessly during testing in prototypes, on our show model that Greg Hahn has flown several times in public and on my personal model from production.

As for your question about converting to pneumatic cylinders, sequencers, etc., well, the whole lever system we came up with on the B-25 eliminates the requirement for all those parts (and the added complexity and expense!), but hey, it's a free country! If that's the way you'd rather go, by all means! :D

For the nose gear cables, there is no requirement for anything to keep the cables tight (I assume you mean when the gear is retracted and the cables are slack). But again, if whatever"floats your boat..."

I think from here on out I am going to stop trying to "un recommend" other people's preferences/modifications to systems already proven (over the course of approximately three years in development with over four prototypes!) or defending the way we did it (hey, it's a hobby and doing your own thing is partially what it's all about, right?).

But I have to part with a comment on your suggestion for the strut sizes--again, the Robart struts/gear sold, as is for the Top Flite B-25, have been proven in development (flying off a paved runway, very bumpy/rough grass/dirt and a nicely-manicured grass strip as well).

Good night all and I'll check in tomorrow!;)

Tim



pettit 10-25-2007 07:10 AM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
I got my B-25 box yesterday here at work and took it home in the afternoon to do inventory and start the assembly process.

In the box were more boxes, bags inside the boxes, more bags inside the bags and that was just on the top layer!

Whoever designed the packing arrangement should get an award.

I ran a heat gun over the 4 wing panels and found only one bubble that popped up. Time will thell, though.

I also like the FLAT finish on everything, even the graphics.

Tim, there are 2 addendum sheets, each packed in a plastic bag, with a separate complete set of graphics.

You may want to check that. I got 2 sets of graphics.

The ailerons and flaps got hinged last night with Pacer Hinge Glue and I skipped to the elevator and rudders since I was in the "hinging mood".

Nacelles, engines and retracts tonight.

I can see why this kit is worth every bit of the $650.00 it costs.

camdyson 10-25-2007 07:44 AM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
Anyone in Oz tried to get hold of one of these? If so, pricing? The way the dollar's going, should be pretty affordable if they come in.

Cam

pettit 10-25-2007 08:28 AM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
I weighed everything in the box that will actually fly.

I didn't include the fixed gear stuff, which weighed 13 ounces.

The stock foamie wheels weigh 3.2 ounces and the Robart plastic wheels weigh 5.2 ounces, not too bad.
The stuff in the box weighs 11.2 pounds.

Add 2 engines, 10 servos, wiring, receiver, battery and retracts and we're talking between 18 and 19 pounds.

If my TF Cessna 310 flies great at 20 pounds, this should be a piece of cake!

danrc2 10-25-2007 09:16 AM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
i also got mine yesterday. i opened everything up. i also agree. this package job was very well done. i just wanna say one thing, i put together many ARF over the past few years. this ARF is very well build and the quality of the job is very well worth every dollar. i do have to say i thought it was a little much at first. but after looking at everything last night. WOW!!!!!!!!!!!

will start the build over the weekend.

dan

p.s. tim, i also got two sets of decal sheets!!! were we suppose to????

timothy thompson 10-25-2007 09:31 AM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
im getting mine in 4 hours. My wife thinks im nuts! its really funny how they say were nuts but they will pay 800 for a stupid purse that does nothing

norm 10-25-2007 09:36 AM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
About the decals.

There is a memo included in the decal bag indicating to excahnge the decals. Has anyone been able to determine why we are supposed to substitute one set for the other?

pettit 10-25-2007 09:40 AM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
Remember, I said that there were 2 addendum sheets in the kit.

I did not say I actually READ THEM!

krproton 10-25-2007 10:18 AM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
The situation with the decals is the first sheet (the one separate from the addendum) is missing a few decals (bombs, the white text that goes under the canopy on the left side of the fuselage, and a few other monor things). The decal sheet included with the addendum that says "use this decal sheet, not the other one" is improved. Also, when you get to the end of this project--the very, very end, and you are working on the instrument panel, you will notice the top I.P. (instrument panel) decal that is supposed to have clear windows over the gauges, is in fact filled in with white. What I did with mine was punch out the white "windows" with brass tubes sharpened on the end. If this doesn't suit you, we will shortly be getting in replacement I.P. decal sheets that you will be able to get through Product Support. We should have those in a few weeks.

timothy thompson 10-25-2007 11:11 AM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
ill scratch a scale cockpit 1 hour to go till i get it ill take pics

krproton 10-25-2007 12:01 PM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 


ORIGINAL: pettit

I ran a heat gun over the 4 wing panels and found only one bubble that popped up. Time will thell, though.

I can see why this kit is worth every bit of the $650.00 it costs.
Dick, regarding tightening the covering, my advice (not that you asked!) would be to forget about the heat gun. Go back to the second or third post I entered in this thread and read my suggestions for tightening MonoKote on ARFs. You need to get the covering adhered to the balsa underneath. The heat gun isn't going to do that for you.

Carry on! :D

Tim

pettit 10-25-2007 12:05 PM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
I use the heat gun not to shrink the covering but rather to "locate" where the unsecured covering may be hiding.

This is pretty much what the sun would do to a plane outdoors.

I then use the covering iron with a sock on it to actually secure the covering down onto the wood.

A bad covering job looks like "Grandma's Stockings".

Not so with the TF B-25.



flaviosi 10-25-2007 02:22 PM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
Hi, Tim!

Thanks for starting this thread! It's a very neat idea, specially because you're the guy totally involved on the project.

Anyway, I'm planning to buy this ARF, but I'm kinda scary with 2 engine airplanes.

What I plan to do in order to reduce my chances of a dead engine is to use 2 electric engines AND a sound simulator, because would be a waste to don't have any sound on this beautiful and historic bird.

I have no idea on which electric motor to use nor batteries, BECs, etc. I'm a gasser and a glower and never had an electric plane before.

What do you think about this project?

Thank you very much in advance for any help.

Flavio

krproton 10-25-2007 03:05 PM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
Hi Flavio.

Please stand by.

Brief instructions with motor/battery recommendations have been written (by Greg Hahn) for this model. Please stand by for a few more days, then check the Top Flite web site. The instructions and a few photos will be posted soon (with the specific motor and battery recommendations).

Thanks!

(And you're right about me being totally involved with this project--I've now built four B-25s to completion--not to mention all the development/tinkering/testing done with other individual parts/systems/assemblies with this bird!) [sm=spinnyeyes.gif]

Tim

flaviosi 10-25-2007 03:17 PM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
Hi, Tim


Brief instructions with motor/battery recommendations have been written (by Greg Hahn) for this model. Please stand by for a few more days, then check the Top Flite web site. The instructions and a few photos will be posted soon (with the specific motor and battery recommendations).
Wow! I'm speechless! With the fast response and to have a tested answer for my project!! Does Greg also tried any sound simulator ?


(And you're right about me being totally involved with this project--I've now built four B-25s to completion--not to mention all the development/tinkering/testing done with other individual parts/systems/assemblies with this bird!)
Well, I could tell it from the excellent tips you're providing. Once again, thank you - and I'm sure I can speak for the whole community - so much for those inputs.

I'll pre-order the kit from Tower (they'll have it on late Oct) and Robart retracts. Since I'm in Rio, it will take a while to reach me here, beeing plenty of "standing by"... :)

Thanks again, Tim.

Flavio

flaviosi 10-25-2007 04:09 PM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
Timothy,


its really funny how they say were nuts but they will pay 800 for a stupid purse that does nothing
You've got that right!

Flavio

timothy thompson 10-25-2007 05:08 PM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
1 Attachment(s)
heres some pics

timothy thompson 10-25-2007 05:13 PM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
1 Attachment(s)
more

krproton 10-25-2007 05:24 PM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 


ORIGINAL: flaviosi

Timothy,


its really funny how they say were nuts but they will pay 800 for a stupid purse that does nothing
You've got that right!

Flavio
No, no. You guys have it all wrong. The $800.00 purse does do something. It makes your wife happy. And it balances out the $650.00 for your airplane (plus radio, engines, retracts!), which makes YOU happy! [sm=shades_smile.gif]

Think fellas![sm=idea.gif]

timothy thompson 10-25-2007 05:41 PM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
ok here are electric specs 2 axi 4130-16 2 jeti77amp esc 2 14.6v 5000mah packs hooked in series thru a y harness. bec must be disabled and seperate rx batt. this setup will be perfect. Where do the batts go you ask well in the scale bomb bay i will be cutting into the aircraft that will open and close via a servo. batts on the cg so they dont affect balance 8s 5000mah will give you 10-13 minutes scale flight according to electrcalc.

timothy thompson 10-25-2007 06:15 PM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
with two tims this is going to get confusing fast! Im the Tim who loves electric birds so ill post pics on that part of the build. greg also went e power i dont know what he used.

Michel 10-25-2007 06:35 PM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
Hi Stormin Norman

I was watching the other week , when you were testing with youre Deul Ace and you gyro , on the rudder . I watched a few large , twin engine war birds . A couple of them went very well , others not so well . Two I have seen crash on there maiden ( very sad ) , one on takeoff and the other 200 ft high with an engine out . When the engine went out it was very noticable . his left engine quit , and the pilot was fighting the air craft , he ended up doing a cartwheel down the runway . from what I understand about the pilot , he was experienced , but the plane didn t show it

While watching youre deul ace with the left engine out , and the gyro , it was not very noticable . I just may try this trick myself , put the gyro on the rudder . I m hopeing to see you at the field with youre B-25 within the forth comeing weeks . it will be extremly interresting .

Looks like there will be some good shows at the field within the next few weeks .


Michel ;)[8D]

rcmorrow 10-25-2007 07:09 PM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
Hi All,

Looks like some great information here about the B-25. I got mine from the shop two days ago and have been working on the various arrangements for the set-up.

Timothy-Thanks for the ideas and electric set-up information you provided. I will also be making mine electric, but I am not certain if I'll use the Axi systems or a pair of E-Flite 60 motors (6s pack for each motor and CC 80amp speed controls). I will also be using an independent power source for the receiver and servos. I like to keep my flight control system power supply separate from my motor power to isolate any possible failure and not loose control of the aircraft.

I am very interested in your idea of the bomb bay and actuation for it. Would enjoy seeing some photos of your modifications when you decide how to set up everything. I have been scratching my head here a bit to decide the placement of the lipo packs. I want to keep them near the cg, with the ability to shift them to have correct final cg of the plane. Shouldn't be hard to set them up with ply plates and velcro with velcro securing straps to hold everything in place.

Looks like I'll be waiting just a bitfor my retracts though, but it shouldn't be long.

I'll take some photos when I get things started here.

Final note is to thank Tim and Top Flite for making such a great ARF. The quality of the kit is really fantastic, and I know it will be a real joy to fly once I get mine completed. Tim-thanks for starting the thread and also for the information you were able to share with me !

timothy thompson 10-25-2007 07:56 PM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
i used the same eflite setup on the 310 . the axis require two 4s 5000ma packs more power and lighter

rcmorrow 10-25-2007 09:55 PM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
Timothy, I'll look into the Axi systems, sounds like you have done some very good research on this one. Thanks for the suggestions and information.

timothy thompson 10-25-2007 10:08 PM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
see you use only 2 packs 4s 5000mah making 8s 5000mah and the axi 4130 is a 60-90 glow equivalent. in my 310 there is no room for batts in the nose so they go in the nacelles creating a heavy plane. it flys well but if i could stuff two lipo packs in the nose i would loose 2.5 pounds cause i would run off 6s 5000 in series. the axi is more poweful . if you want to spend some money get some geared hacker inrunners they run 600 a piece for the motor only!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

flaviosi 10-25-2007 10:17 PM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
Hi, E-Tim! (how's that for making less confusing Tims),:eek:


ok here are electric specs 2 axi 4130-16 2 jeti77amp esc 2 14.6v 5000mah packs hooked in series thru a y harness. bec must be disabled and seperate rx batt. this setup will be perfect. Where do the batts go you ask well in the scale bomb bay i will be cutting into the aircraft that will open and close via a servo. batts on the cg so they dont affect balance 8s 5000mah will give you 10-13 minutes scale flight according to electrcalc.
It's a shame but I have to tell ya this is "greek" for me... Can you translate that into something more idiot's proof? :) Or, even better, it would be real helpful to have that "recipe" translated into "Tower Hobbies" links...

Thanks in advance, Tim!

Flávio[&:]


timothy thompson 10-25-2007 10:27 PM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
axi 4130/16 those are the motors from hobby lobby


jeti opo 77esc speed controller from hobby lobby

need 2 of each about 650 worth there

batts from prodigy batteries 14.6v 5000mah 2 needed 88 a piece


disable the bec on the esc by using a y harness to connect the two. Cut a section ( 1 inch) out of the middle wire on each end that plugs into esc. now plug the y harness into throttle channel on rx and power rx with a good quality nimh jr 6volt 3000mah

timothy thompson 10-25-2007 10:32 PM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
how big are the spiders in Brazil? got any pics of them? i like spiders

krproton 10-25-2007 10:35 PM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 


ORIGINAL: timothy thompson

how big are the spiders in Brazil? got any pics of them? i like spiders
EEEEEEEEEEEEUCK!!!!!!!!!!!1[sm=stupid.gif]

(Actually, we have a spider relocation program in my house--when my wife or step-daughter find a spider, after they get done freaking out, I catch it and let it go outside.) :eek:

timothy thompson 10-25-2007 10:51 PM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
well im a biologist and they fascinate me. without them insects would rule the Earth and we would waddle in a carpet 1 foot thick of insects i wouldnt want to tangle with the sydney funnel web they are deadly to humans but not to dogs or cats!

timothy thompson 10-25-2007 10:55 PM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
i am in awe of this plane have any been modified with bomb bay doors

flaviosi 10-25-2007 11:16 PM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
Hi, Tim!


how big are the spiders in Brazil? got any pics of them? i like spiders
Actually, I live in a big city (Rio de Janeiro) and there are no spiders here, but I've heard that in Amazon forest we have those big hairy scary ones... I did some research and found a good google link for you with tons of brazilian spiders! Check them out!

http://images.google.com/images?sour...=1&sa=N&tab=wi

I hope you like it!

Flavio

flaviosi 10-25-2007 11:28 PM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
Tim,


disable the bec on the esc by using a y harness to connect the two. Cut a section ( 1 inch) out of the middle wire on each end that plugs into esc. now plug the y harness into throttle channel on rx and power rx with a good quality nimh jr 6volt 3000mah
Well, a Grand for the whole setup plus $400 for the sound system, not to mention my import taxes... It's not cheap stuff, so it's better be good! :) Thanks a lot for the great explanation above.

Talking sound systems, I was told Benedini Sound System is great. I did some research on the website http://www.aerosoundrc.com/ and found the sound simply AWESOME!!!

Do you have any experience with those?

Thanks!

Flavio


flaviosi 10-25-2007 11:31 PM

RE: Top Flite B-25 ARF (Tecnical, tips, suggestions)
 
Hi, Tim!


(Actually, we have a spider relocation program in my house--when my wife or step-daughter find a spider, after they get done freaking out, I catch it and let it go outside.)
Hahahahahaha!!! Check the link I sent Tim (The Spiderman). Those beasts are huge! To relocate them you'll need an U-Haul truck.

Flavio


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