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Anyone else buy some bum HK lipos lately?

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Anyone else buy some bum HK lipos lately?

Old 12-14-2011, 03:13 PM
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ftherrmann
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Default Anyone else buy some bum HK lipos lately?

Bought three 3s turnigy 2650's and one 6s zippy 5000. The 5000 zippy had one bad cell (wouldn't charge above 3.99v) and one of the 3s turnigy's had the same problem.

I naturally got the same run-around at HobbyKing. i.e. take a picture, weigh it, turn in a circle 3 times and jump, ect,, ect...

I sent them back to the USA distribution site and now they tell me it will take a long time since I didn't have an RMA. I basically told them I'd take it up with my bank if I don't see some positive action in a couple of days..

Here's a little known HK warranty page that the "customer service" guy tossed me when he was giving me the run-around. What a bunch of BS! Every battery must be returned to Hong Kong for warranty... A cell with a voltage difference of .245v is considered good.. Geezzz I wonder how long that cell is going to last before it puffs and burns up along with the plane it was sitting in and/or my home!

I'm a "Platinum Member", I wonder how the "Copper Members" get treated???


HobbyKing® Lithium Polymer Battery Warranty Policy.

Due to the complexity and delicate nature of Lithium Polymer Batteries, please note the following points prior to making a claim.

Please keep the following in mind before making a claim;
We check all battery pack voltages prior to shipping. It is a simple process and takes us 3 seconds per pack. Doing so assures us that the battery is fit for use, is within the voltage range and has no shorting.
This process does not remove slightly unbalanced packs.

1) You can only make a claim for 'Under voltage' the same day the parcel arrives and prior to the lipoly pack being charged or cycled. 'Under Voltage' means that 1 or more of the cells in you pack has a voltage lower than 3v per cell. After the battery has been cycled or used, no claim for 'under voltage' can be made.

2) We do not replace burnt batteries. All batteries are checked prior to shipping, if a short on the balance connector was to happen, it would happen prior to shipping. Burnt batteries are also impossible to examine, therefore they are not warranted.

3) We do not warrant crash damage, of any kind. If your pack shows signs of an impact or trauma, we will not replace it.

4) Never disassemble your pack. Regardless of your skill level, expertise or qualifications. We will never replace a disassembled or 'inspected' pack.

5) Rapid Capacity Loss. Should your pack fall well short of it's stated capacity, please indicate to us how you achieved capacity claim. We will test packs for charge and discharge values. Should the battery have severe capacity loss, we will test each cell for maximum and minimum voltage charge as well as I/O. This can indicate to us if the pack has been over-discharged. Packs which are over-discharged will not be replaced.

6) Because of the complexity and nature of these batteries, all packs must be returned to our Hong Kong office. Packs sent to any of our warranty agents, will be rejected.

7) Packs which have a cell voltage difference of less than .245v per cell cannot be replaced. Please balance your packs if your packs appears to be unbalanced.

8) Should you be too concerned about sending the parcel back to us due to safety reasons. We will not warrant the pack. Purchasing any battery from HobbyKing.com, constitutes an agreement to this warranty policy.
Each battery brand has it's own warranty time limit. Our standard Lipoly warranty limit is 30 days, unless otherwise stated in the product listing.
Old 12-14-2011, 05:22 PM
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guver
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Default RE: Anyone else buy some bum HK lipos lately?

HK has undoubtedly witnessed countless returns of packs that are without problems. I have no problem with the warranty personally because I use the same initial 3 second procedure they use. If the pack passes this test then 99% sure it is a good pack. The key to an initial pre-check is in number 7. "Please balance your packs if your packs appears to be unbalanced" and would go well to handle over 90% of the problems I see posted on this forum. There are countless posts that clearly indicate that a user doesn't understand a distinction between series charging and balancing.

It is bad that you have trouble with 2 packs already. If you don't want to jump thru the warranty hoops or are too late then perhaps someone here on the forum can assist you with the 2 packs.

ps. My last 2 batches of packs were equal voltages for all cells (about 3.8-3.85)
Old 12-14-2011, 06:53 PM
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ftherrmann
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Default RE: Anyone else buy some bum HK lipos lately?

Guver,

Apparently you didn't read what I initially posted.. i.e. Each of two packs had cells that did not charge above 3.99v. Impossible to balance a pack when only 5 of 6 cells charge to 4.20v. These are four brand new batteries from HK that were never used. Basically took them out of the box. It's pretty obvious that HK shipped these batteries knowing that the cells was defective.

I won't fly a unbalanced battery. Especially when it comes defective straight from the store...

If you don't have a problem with the ridiculous HK warranty and are happy to eat the cost of bad lipos that HK won't take back then more power to you.

Fred
Old 12-14-2011, 07:39 PM
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Default RE: Anyone else buy some bum HK lipos lately?

I certainly did and is typical of 90% of the lipo problems here on the forum. A cell has no choice in the matter of charging. It's voltage will climb right past 3.99 (or 4.2 for that matter) Without clarifying what you mean by (wouldn't charge above 3.99v) it is hard to tell what's going on with a cell or pack. My guess is that you are attempting to balance a pack by series charging it. Just because charger manufacturers are now integrating balancers into the chargers doesn't mean we are forced into combining the two processes. Your two "bad" packs may or may not have a "bad" cell , but chances are they are just out of balance and the answer to an imbalanced pack is almost always the same. It is as described exactly in number 7 above. The pack may just need balanced that's all.
Old 12-14-2011, 08:06 PM
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ftherrmann
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Default RE: Anyone else buy some bum HK lipos lately?

Guver,

What the heck do you think I'm charging my batteries with? A 500 watt 12 volt power supply? Give me a break. I use the same "balancing" chargers that I use for all of my other lipos, which work great and charge to 4.2v/cell plus/minus a few hundreths of a volt. Assuming of course that the lipo is good.

If you want to defend HK and their crazy business practices I think that's just great. Personally I'm not doing business with them from this point on. Their run-around customer service crap is more than enough to turn off anyone, with certain exceptions of course which seems to include yourself.

Fred
Old 12-14-2011, 08:08 PM
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ftherrmann
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Default RE: Anyone else buy some bum HK lipos lately?

Please feel free to read this thread on rcgroups.com :

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...0#post20139992
Old 12-15-2011, 09:55 AM
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Default RE: Anyone else buy some bum HK lipos lately?

Hi
I agree completely. Absolutely the worst warranty return policy I've ever seen. I had posted in this forum about 2 brand new LiPo (Nano-Tech) from HK. Will not charge, has one bad cell. No warranty!! I had purchased 5 servo's that had the same (some better) specifications than a Hitec. What a joke. I sent them all back stating exactly what the problem was in all areas, ( speed was slow, torque WAY below spec's, chattering, they would hang up, etc., etc. They acknowledged receiving them. That's it. 2 months and they are still looking at them!! Have anyone ever had a warranty problem fixed? I have never read of anyone returning anything and getting a positive outcome. They sell cheap stuff cheap. You get what you pay for. The cheap prices keep them in business.
Their product reviews are total BS.
Old 12-15-2011, 11:39 AM
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ftherrmann
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Default RE: Anyone else buy some bum HK lipos lately?

Flynow1,

That's why I didn't even bother going thru their crazy warranty review. It's just a diversion tactic for those people out there that really believe HK will actually replace the defective junk they sold you. I ordered some small motors about 6 months ago from HK. One of the motors was missing the prop saver adapter ($2 part) which I actually wasn't planning on using anyway. So just for kicks I put in a request for the missing part. They said they would ship it out to me. 6 months later I still don't have the part.

These devious business practices eventually catch up with even the largest outfits. That's why you start seeing places like Tower Hobbies selling under the name OmniModels and will totally disavow any connection with them even though they are the same company. Bananna Hobbies, aka Nitro is also one of these.

Outfits like HK would see the light if people would only use credit cards for purchases and then send the defective junk back and have the bank do a "CHARGEBACK". A very simple process that has gotten me my money back every time without fail.

If this were the case HK would simply know what will happen if they don't make things right and realize that it makes better business sense to DO THE RIGHT THING!
Old 12-15-2011, 04:52 PM
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Default RE: Anyone else buy some bum HK lipos lately?

ORIGINAL: ftherrmann

Guver,

What the heck do you think I'm charging my batteries with? A 500 watt 12 volt power supply? Give me a break. I use the same ''balancing'' chargers that I use for all of my other lipos, which work great and charge to 4.2v/cell plus/minus a few hundreths of a volt. Assuming of course that the lipo is good.

If you want to defend HK and their crazy business practices I think that's just great. Personally I'm not doing business with them from this point on. Their run-around customer service crap is more than enough to turn off anyone, with certain exceptions of course which seems to include yourself.

Fred
Perhaps you misunderstand the distinction between series charging and balancing. No amount of series charging will ever balance packs that are out of balance. While any balance chargers do a fine job with packs that have minimal imbalance or none at all , a pack that is as severly imbalanced as yours needs to be balanced rather than series charged with a "balance charger" To put it another way, it doesn't matter what you are using to charge the pack , rather just that you ARE charging the pack is the trouble.

Defending HK or not , here's what I'm saying in a nutshell. "you may just have an imbalanced pack or two" I guess I cannot get my point across , it is the same as number 7 above. I begin to think that the trouble is me not being able to clearly articulate this concept because you are not the first one who after repeated attempts on my part seem to gloss over this concept. Unfortunately I only have 1 more way to demonstrate it.
Old 12-15-2011, 05:38 PM
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Default RE: Anyone else buy some bum HK lipos lately?


ORIGINAL: guver

Perhaps you misunderstand the distinction between series charging and balancing. No amount of series charging will ever balance packs that are out of balance. While any balance chargers do a fine job with packs that have minimal imbalance or none at all , a pack that is as severly imbalanced as yours needs to be balanced rather than series charged with a ''balance charger'' To put it another way, it doesn't matter what you are using to charge the pack , rather just that you ARE charging the pack is the trouble.

Defending HK or not , here's what I'm saying in a nutshell. ''you may just have an imbalanced pack or two'' I guess I cannot get my point across , it is the same as number 7 above. I begin to think that the trouble is me not being able to clearly articulate this concept because you are not the first one who after repeated attempts on my part seem to gloss over this concept. Unfortunately I only have 1 more way to demonstrate it.

Guver,

The balancing chargers I use balance the cells as it charges. Hence the name "balancing charger". It's pretty obvious if you watch the charger it's continually monitoring the cells as it does a "series" charge of the pack and loads any cell that has a high voltage. (don't ask me what the algo is because I don't know). I do know however that 99% of my cells charge to 4.18v +/- 0.02v.

99% of the lipos I've purchased charge and balance just fine. If it gets to the point where the lipo doesn't charge and balance correctly it's removed from the inventory. Any cell as I previously mentioned that does not charge above 3.99v obviously has a problem. As such if I receive a new pack I expect it to charge correctly just like the 99% of batteries I now have. If it doesn't, it goes back. That's my rule of thumb and that's what is working out well for me.

Old 12-22-2011, 05:05 PM
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Default RE: Anyone else buy some bum HK lipos lately?

might try to put a storage charge on them..... "or discharge rather.. if allmost full" ....... then do another balance charge to full cap. I have had good luck doing this with new packs with a weak cell......... do it a couple times and it usually gets better. hope that helps.
Old 12-22-2011, 10:58 PM
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Default RE: Anyone else buy some bum HK lipos lately?

Hobby King's warranty service has come up countless times on RCU. They are not a retail operation. They are a distributor. Once the shipping label is on the package, they are done with it. HK is great if you want to buy a large quantity of batteries for super cheap because if one out of 5 of those Zippy's are bad (seems to be the average for them) you still saved money compared to most other brands. But if you want a company to stand behind its products then buy from someone else and pay the prices.
Old 12-25-2011, 08:57 AM
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Default RE: Anyone else buy some bum HK lipos lately?

I bet you saved a bunch of money

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