OmegaSyx

I have to agree with BocaBen. These things are built in someone's basement.

Vince

My Feedback: (1)

FLASH****FLASH****FLASH****FLASH

The Litco Alpha 4 is not mass produced!!!!

It is common knowledge that Litco is a mom and pop operation. This is not a new revelation. Does this detract from the units functionality, or durability? Is there another unit that does what the Litco does to four batteries simultaneously?

No on all counts. My original Litco is going on six years old, and it still works flawlessly. I like it so much that I am in line for another one.

Vince

lennyk

My Feedback: (12)

When were Alpha 4's first produced ?

It seems that Litco has been way ahead of the game for a while.
its only in the last few years that peak detection with microprocessor controlled chargers have come into mainstream.

Vince

My Feedback: (1)

I am not sure just how long they have been around. I learned of them in the rec.models.rc.air newsgroup. That was about five or six years ago. They have been on the leading edge of battery maintenance for quite a few years. I would really like to look at the programming algorithms that control the Alpha functionality, but they are a tightly guarded secret for obvious reasons. Over the years some have advertised "vapor ware" to clone or replace the Alpha at a much cheaper price. They have never materialized.

I would like to see a competitor emerge that would produce a unit that could do what the Alpha does with four ports simultaneously at a cheaper cost, and higher output current.

There are chargers that come close, but do it with only one port. To me this is no advantage. I own several chargers, as the Alpha cannot do all that I need. For what it does do though, it is yet to be matched.

Vince

sfaust

My Feedback: (11)

>> wasn't there talk that there was a self destruct mechanism in the case ?

It was hogwash. I've opened up two. Nothing hard to open them up, no bobby traps, and it went back together and worked fine. I attached a low res photo of the internals. Not exactly hi tech manufacturing.

J roc

Alpha 4 sales began in 93' almost 10 years ago, Demand has been growing ever since. They used to advertise in RCM years ago. I got my 2 a-4's in the days when you could call their number and someone would answer. They are both working flawlessly to this day.

lennyk

My Feedback: (12)

Looking at the pic, those look like 4 lm317's at the bottom on
the heat sinks. I'm sure Litco could upgrade those to
something capable of sending more current than 1A.
It looks like there are 4 diodes at the top right along with
a big electrolytic capacitor.
I am curious as to what those are for since this is supposed to
be dc powered.

zero244

My Feedback: (1)

This is getting interesting......we non Alpha 4 users should start taking bets on who gets in and who doesn’t.

I own an old Litco Multicycle that is about 15 plus years old. It still works perfectly, though it hasn’t been used that strenuously. His stuff might be a little crude on the inside but it works on the outside.

I don’t need an Alpha 4......but based on other user comments I would not hesitate buying one.

Someday I might try and get one just to experience the glow of satisfaction of owning one. Become a part of the legacy that other Alpha 4 owners experience.

If I had one I would display it in a nice glass case and never use it.

Bob Rogers

My Feedback: (2)

I got lucky too. Got on the list for Oct 2nd ship date. Had no Idea I'd get in on one of the first runs. Had to come up with the cash by Sep 28th. Had to scratch a bit since I thought I'd have a couple of months to come up with the coin.

doubleloop

My Feedback: (6)

I just can't understand the fuss with so many good cyclers around that will more than do the trick for us modelers. If they don't want to expand, then let them keep their charger. I, for one will not participate in that game that they are playing. Many people think that the more that it costs, and the harder it is to get, makes it better. NO WAY

sfaust

My Feedback: (11)

I wish I could say that was the reason people wanted them so bad. However, it isn't. The charger fills a need that doesn't exist elsewhere in a single charger.

That need, is the requirement to charge the larger aerobatic planes with 3 and 4 batteries, whether its NiCad or NiMH, all in one package that is easy to use. This doesn't exist in other chargers, unless you pay lots or, or buy multiple charger.

Consider this. You are at a contest or event. You have two planes that need to be charged and turned around for the next day. You also have your transmitter that needs to be charged. You want to setup a charger, then leave it, and not be a slave to the charger moving it from one battery to the next until they are all done. Basically, you have 9 batteries that need to be all charged and ready for the next days flying.

With dual Alpha's, all one needs to do is connect everything up at the end of flying, and go have dinner then retire to the camper for the night. In the morning everything will be ready.

With one Alpha, they can setup one plane/transmitter at the end of flying, then move the charger to the other plane just before going to sleep. In the morning, everything will be ready.

If you don't have an alpha, you either need 4 or more dual port chargers, or a more expensive 4 port charger. I've looked at every conceivable option available, and have yet to find something that will be as useful, easy, and versatile as the Alpha.

I am not defending Litco, as I think they suck as a business.
And when I do find an alternative, I'm going to be the first do dump the Alpha's solely based on the pains Litco goes through to make life difficult for its customers. No check, no credit cards, or order list, must send an e-mail within a 2 minute window, no confirmation or response if you are not 'accepted' on the list, very short warranty period, must send you payment within a specific window or you're order is canceled, no phone calls, and an order cycle of 6 months (ie, 3 month wait to get on the list, 3 months for your item to ship).

If they didn't fill a very specific need, they wouldn't still be in business. Once competition enters the scene, I estimate their order list with dry up once the word gets around.

rthorne

My Feedback: (29)

Stephen sites the reasons I purchased a more expensive Sirius Quad charger. Yes it was $100 more, but I was able to get one and if needed I can contact Sirius for warranty issues or questions which, by the way, I have not had to do.

The Quad charger handles 4 batteries both nicad and nimh. While it doesn't have a cycler, another $50 or $60 for the Sirius Test, I don't have a need for a cycler at the field.

Anyways, I spent more but I received the charger in a couple of weeks and I know I can get hold of Sirius if needed.

doubleloop

My Feedback: (6)

Please don't misunderstand. I don't know from personal experience, but from what I have read and heard is that the litco charger is the best, BUT, it would not be worth the hassle, and from what I heard about the Co. I just would'nt ever do business with a Co. that is so independent and thoughtless about the customer. God forbid, you were sent a unit with something wrong with it. I can imagine the trouble and wait for the unit to ever come back to you. That is if at all they woild accept responsibility.
No, I will go about looking for another unit that will come close to the litco, So that when I bought it( forget the price) I will not get hassled or have to get in line. My dignity is worth more than that!
Stop buying this product and just see how fast litco will wake up.
Read rthorne about his Sirius Quad Charger, That's the Co. I would do business with. The extra cost is worth it!

Forgues Research

My Feedback: (7)

I got mine about 5 years ago when they weren't hard to get. And the fuss is there is no charger on the market that can do what this one can do period.
All of you that don't like the way he does business, your only hurting yourself, because he is still in business.
You can spend what you want, but you are not going to find anything like it.
The only people that are negative about this charger are the ones that have never owned on.

lennyk

My Feedback: (12)

I tried in the last shot and got in, mine is due next week
so I will see what all the hoopla is about.
I do have 3 batteries to charge so wall warts no longer cut it
and it is going to be put to immediate use.

Granted the company from its website does not inspire any confidence however it appears to have many years of good
reviews from owners otherwise I think many would not buy it.

I agree it is a hassle to go thru the motions to attempt to get one. But if I wasn't successful I doubt I would let it bother me.

Vince

My Feedback: (1)

Yep, it's true.

Vince

Bob757FL

My Feedback: (15)

And as DoubleLoop says, as soon as they have a worthwhile competitor, they are finished. Why would a reputable company NOT keep up with demand? We aren't talking about a Stradivarious, we are talking about an electircal applicance, a battery charger for pete's sake! Your right, I don't own one and never will.

Forgues Research

My Feedback: (7)

Bob,
It might be just an electronic piece, but where are the competitors? If it was that easy, it would be out there for sure.

sfaust

My Feedback: (11)

Competition is looming on the horizon. I know of one product that is will do everything the Alpha does, exceeds the 1amp limitation, and is nearing production. The prototype is currently putting charge into batteries, which is one of the major milestones. And the designer has experience bringing products to market on a large scale.

When it will be done, don't know. But I am very confident that it will be done in the near term. I keep putting the electric prod to him every now and then, so I can sell my Alphas.

I do have to add in response to the comment about worrying about getting the Alpha repaired, is that Litco has been fine in that regard. While its miserable to get one, they are good about repairing and returning units in a timely manner. Oh well...

sfaust

My Feedback: (11)

And that is part of the demand for this product. You spent $100 more, and still don't have all the functinality that the Alpha has. Even if you spend another $50 or $60 on the cycler, would would still be short on features, and you are now $160 over the Litco price, and have multiple units to deal with instead of one. And, you would also be limited to discharging one port at a time, rather than being able to discharge up to 4 ports.

Many of us like to discharge our batteries and capacity check them on a semi-regular basis. Being able to do it 4 at a time is nice. Doing it one at a time, is much slower and required intervention on our part.

If you think in terms of the giant scale airplanes, with multiple batteries as a single unit, and the Alpha 4 as a battery maintenance system for that unit, its easy to see what the Alpha is in high demands for those that fly giant scale.

You are not cycling, charging, or maintaining a battery or two, you can maintaining a plane that has anywhere from two to four batteries in it. When I charge a plane, I charge all 4 batteries at the same time. When I cycle and capacity check, I do all 4 batteries as the same time. It saves me a tremendous amout of time, and everything is done with one action, and ready overnight.

The fact that it also makes a nice field charger for fast charging, handling NiCad, NiMH, wet cells, gel cells, ni-starters, etc is just icing on the cake.

rthorne

My Feedback: (29)

Your right, it would be nice to have a product for $250 do to it all.

But I'm not waiting around and won't play the get in line game. I'm going to support an outfit that supports its customer's on a regular basis.

The chargers I use work great for me. I normally just fly my planes on the weekend, so I have plenty of time during the week to recharge and cycle if needed. But since there is no need to cycle nimh (other than the initial charging for a new pack) a quad fast charger is plenty for my flight box.

I'm not negative on the product, I just won't wait and play the game everyone else is. I hope the product does well and continues on I just won't own one.

Forgues Research

My Feedback: (7)

That does sound interesting, do you have any projected price for this unit.

So far I don't need anythng better then the Alpha. When I charge my Extra, I charge the 3 onboard batteries plus my Tx. and because my Tx is Multiplex, it has only 6 cells instead of the standard 8. I'm able to program it the way I want.
As I said the only way I would like another so called better unit that you mentioned is to fast charge all 4 batteries at the same time as right now with the 1000ma or 1 amp max it then charges at 250ma each of the 4 outputs is all are used at the same time

sfaust

My Feedback: (11)

I am curious now... Why do you feel there is no need to cycle NiMH packs? How can you tell when the pack if failing, loosing a cell, capacity, or just plain going bad if you are not cycling them? How do you know when you are below the 80% point of capacity where things are suspect? How do you get the data if you are not cycling? NiMH are not different than NiCads in regards to the reasons for cycling them.

I couldn't fly my planes confidently without cycling my packs on a regular basis. From my trainers, my giant scale, or my turbine. With NiCads, NiMH, or Lithium batteries. If only flying weekends, or week long events such as Joe Nall. I just couldn't. I need to know how my battery is performing, and without cycling, I have not found any other reliable way. Capacity in, capacity out, remaining capacity. Its been pushed for years and years as the best preventative maintenance against battery failure, and highly recommended that everyone cycle and test their batteries regularly. If you are not cycling your batteries, its worth starting a process as regular maintenance. At least a few times a year at minimum.

As for dealing with Litco. I can't agree with you more. Your needs are not the same, which would make it very distasteful to go through that process. Heck, its even distasteful for those with the need, but there is just no other alternative on the market. Everything else has some major drawbacks in our applications.

We jump through the hoops because there is no other path. Once there is another path, you can bet either the hoops will be removed, or fewer would be going through them. Litco has a monopoly share of a niche market. Many of the people in that niche are willing to go through the hoops because the product is perfectly matched to their needs, and there is no other source. If you were in the same niche, it might be a harder choice to make.

For what its worth, of all the Alpha owners I know, most of not all would jump on another manufacturers product and dump the Alphas even if just flood the market with used Alphas to take the sales away from Litco. In all of RC, I have found Litco to be the most hated company out there. He must be laughing all the way to the bank knowing he is taking money from the very same people that hate his company so passionately. Oh well....

rthorne

My Feedback: (29)

I do cycle to check capacity on a regular basis. I have the Sirius Supertest to handle that.

I guess the point I was making is that I don't need a single unit that handles everything. The only thing I need at the field is my fast charger and a battery checker (with load). Out of habbit I always charge between flights to be sure I have plenty of capacity.

The issue with Litco is clear, availability is limited. Obviously for the price its a tough combo to beat.

In the mean time I need to go to the garage and cycle my batteries with the equipment that was easy to obtain. We can't fly here in Amarillo today, windy, cold and rainy. :-)

Vince

My Feedback: (1)

This sounds exactly like the "vapor ware" rumors that were frequenting the rec.models.rc.air newsgroup a number of years ago. Those threats, or rumors never materialized, as these never will. With the advancements in electronics manufacturing it would be very easy to reproduce the Litco cheaper, if you knew what the unmarked chips were and did, let alone the programming algorithms. people only consider the replication of the hardware, and never think of the proprietary programming that runs the thing.

Vince