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Remind me why do we fly glow planes, compare to electric planes,

Old 03-20-2007, 09:47 PM
  #26  
oceansfiftyseven
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Default RE: Remind me why do we fly glow planes, compare to electric planes,

I started with electrics. I flew them for several years, buying bigger and better stuff. After a crash destroying a $200.00 battery pack I bought a $200.00 saito .56. then another and another and so on. I fell in love with glow. Later I tried electrics again. The big Mega motor w/ gearbox the pheonix 80, bec and 2 $250.00 battery packs. Now for an $800.00 power system I can fly twice for 5 whole minutes with less power than a good .40 can provide. So once again all my electric stuff is on the shelf. If you have lot's of money to blow, electrics are good but their no longer good for me. It is a total lie to tell somebody that the cost of flying a .40 size and up electric airplane is comparable to glow by justifying the cost of batteries as the same as fuel. Even if you can get 100 cycles out of a $250 battery. Thats about 500 minutes. >.56 at 5 minutes = 3 0z. fuel x 100 = 300 oz of fuel. That is about 2 1/2 gallons =$50.00. No waiting for a charge either. Anyway. Sorry about the rant...
Old 03-20-2007, 10:29 PM
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Default RE: Remind me why do we fly glow planes, compare to electric planes,

ORIGINAL: oldhippy1

I GREW UP ON NITRO AND WILL STAY THAT WAY!

For all new parents out there, don't try this with your child. [X(] Stick with mothers milk or formula or your child will end up a nitro addict like so many of us at this site!
Old 03-20-2007, 10:30 PM
  #28  
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Default RE: Remind me why do we fly glow planes, compare to electric planes,

Orenda, I'm one of three people in our club who fly diesels from time to time. The oily mess and the smell are the reasons diesels aren't more popular. But they are the only way to go when you need to swing a big prop, and they sound fabulous when you throttle down for a touch and go or a slow fly by. Then there's the mess and the smell....

Jim
Old 03-20-2007, 11:19 PM
  #29  
B.L.E.
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Default RE: Remind me why do we fly glow planes, compare to electric planes,

I also tried diesels for a short time. The fuel is just as expensive as glow fuel and a lot harder to find. (no they don't burn pump diesel, it's a mixture of kerosene, ether, castor oil, and small amount of amyl nitrate, not an easy ingredient for the home brewer to aquire) If you think glow engines are messy, wait 'til you try diesels. My experience with these engines mostly made me appreciate just how terrible glow engines are not!
If you want to turn big props, try a smaller carb on a glow engine and maybe a head shim to lower the compression.

Of course, nothing turns bigger props than electrics do. The e-flite power 60 BL in my scratch built .60 size plane converted to e-power turns a 15x10 at about 7500 rpm, making enough thrust to take this 7.16 pound plane veritcal.
Old 03-21-2007, 06:58 AM
  #30  
tIANci
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Default RE: Remind me why do we fly glow planes, compare to electric planes,

Its the most pathetic statement to say that electrics are for people who have no idea about mechanics and real men fly nitro ... that is soooooooo lame. Have a look in the giant sized electric planes and see what's inside. Everything is the same save for the power plant. They already have QQ Yak of 102" up in the air. Go tell those guys that they are sissies.

Go to SEFF and see how many people attend the event ... its all electric and they have big and fast planes. Read all your plane RC magazines ... its mostly about electrics, there is a surge in electric plane interest. Maybe there are just a lot of sissies growing up in the US and the magazines and manufacturers noticed that. This is a hobby, as long as you enjoy it, who cares ...

Cost is always the major issue with electrics over 40 sized ... batteries will not be cheap and they have the tendency to bloat.

Also just over the weekend I saw a newbie fly his pattern plane that has a nice Saito 82, he attempted a split S, he hesitated and it was downwind. Smashed the plane, the Saito lost its head ... seen the same with a F90 that ran a YS140 ... its part and parcel of the hpbby. Crashes are costly to both glow and EP.
Old 03-21-2007, 08:36 AM
  #31  
k3 valley flyer
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Default RE: Remind me why do we fly glow planes, compare to electric planes,

Finally an honest answer! Go glow.
Old 03-21-2007, 06:15 PM
  #32  
B.L.E.
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Default RE: Remind me why do we fly glow planes, compare to electric planes,


ORIGINAL: kenny norris

if your a man go glow if your a sissy go electric. where i come from real men like real things they can work on and see the difference. electric is for people who are not mechanically inclined and thinks a ceiling fan is something you fly.hope this helps you out. kenny from albany ga

Let's see, I scratch built an electric plane but only because I don't have the mechanical aptitude to build or fly a glow plane or maybe those glow engines scare me, right? Me, the person who flew glow engines successfully for many years, and who still doesn't own an electric starter to start them with. Me. the person who has totally disassembled and rebuilt at least four motorcycle engines, three car engines and two different car manual 5-speed transmissions.
Real men fly what they want to without worrying about what the rest of the world thinks. If they want to fly a pink electric plane, they will. If they want to build a free flight rubber band powered plane, they will.
Most of the small minded people who worry about being seen as sissys that I have met mostly bolt their engines into ARFs and pack up and go home if their electric starter dies.

It takes at least an elementary knowlege of electrical power, propeller properties, and gearing to build a good electric plane and be sucessful with it. It's not hard to throw together a mediocre electric power system that burns up motors and ESCs and overheats batteries or flys like a dog.

I get my share of messing with mechanical stuff at my job. When I go to the flying field, I want to fly, not tinker with engines. If I wanted to constanly tinker, I would buy myself an old Triumph or Norton motorcycle.
Old 03-21-2007, 07:47 PM
  #33  
sowega flyer
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Default RE: Remind me why do we fly glow planes, compare to electric planes,

For me, 75% of the reason I fly is the glow engines. Ever since I was thirteen and got my first R/C model- a boat- I was hooked on these tiny powerhouses. I like to tune them, especially challenging ones, to make them run perfect when everyone else says "trash it". The sight and sound of a good running engine that I tuned is almost as rewarding to me as a successful maiden. Its the same feeling when a buddy has an engine that he can't quite get right, and I'll tinker with it until it runs perfect- then they can't believe how good it runs. This goes with weedeaters, lawnmowers, chainsaws, cars, etc...

So I guess you could say that I fly airplanes just to play with the engines.


Electric? Yeah- they're cool, but just not for me- not yet anyway.
Old 03-21-2007, 10:13 PM
  #34  
somegeek
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Default RE: Remind me why do we fly glow planes, compare to electric planes,

Nothing wrong with either.

I have an electric stryker that allows me to get a pack or two in on the way to get stuff at the grocery store. "Sure honey... I'll run to the store for you."(grabs stryker and flight bag on way out the door * Very convenient when I don't have a few hours to go to my club field and I need a fix.

However, I really enjoy building and flying my glow powered planes. No substitute for a fuel powered engine IMO... and in the end that's what it is - my opinion.

Each has their place. My preference is balsa kit built glow fuel powered planes.

somegeek
Old 03-21-2007, 10:28 PM
  #35  
agexpert
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Default RE: Remind me why do we fly glow planes, compare to electric planes,

Funny,

I am quickly moving to gas. By the end of the summer I will likely keep one glow-plane for the heck of it and have only gas and electric, (both of which are cleaner and arguably more hassle-free than glow).

I admit that the only electrics I intend to bother with are 3D foamies, but glow is not in my future for much longer. Especially at $20 a gallon.
Old 03-21-2007, 10:32 PM
  #36  
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Default RE: Remind me why do we fly glow planes, compare to electric planes,

I fly electric and glow, and greatly prefer glow. Electrics are easy but I have to make new battery packs all the time, as they don't live long. High winds are a problem as well with the light structures. I make my own fuel using no nitro, so it is very cheap. I can fly in windy conditions and can build larger planes, important with poor vision. In short I like the ease of electrics but love the power and size of fuel powered, and on a budget can't afford to build big electrics.
Old 03-22-2007, 06:25 AM
  #37  
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Default RE: Remind me why do we fly glow planes, compare to electric planes,

BLE - great retort but some may accuse you of covering up all that sissyness by building kits and rebuilding real engines and all, hahahahaahahaaa I still can start glow engines without using a starter motor or a chicken stick.

The fact is some people love the engine, the sound and the scent, can't blame them, its thrilling for sure. I remember when I organised a Fun Fly to a nice little town. We had like 30 flyers and I maidended my WM Super Chipmunk that was converted to EP. The night before I was getting it ready at the hotel meeting room, all my pals were helping me fix little bits and solder stuff. When we ran that 16x10 prop, the room was filled with the roar of the prop, everyone was shocked, me also as I have never had an EP that large.

The next day I maidened the plane, everyone stopped flying to see her go ... once she was airborne the heckling started "Hey there is no sound" ... "Dead stick!!!" They heckled out of jest but they did realise what the power of EP is nowadays. Once battery prices go down and they start not to bloat, many more will join in. Again, this will not see that much decline in glow/gas.
Old 03-22-2007, 06:35 AM
  #38  
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Default RE: Remind me why do we fly glow planes, compare to electric planes,

Engines are supposed to be noisy, dirty and require attention.

Electrics and foam airplanes rank right down at the bottom of the fun list analogous to fat ugly women and golf. If you like those things have at it but another faith healer telling others what they should like is unwarranted. Rationalization is not necessary.

Old 03-22-2007, 07:33 AM
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Default RE: Remind me why do we fly glow planes, compare to electric planes,


ORIGINAL: orenda635

Smaller planes are better with electric.
Bull!!!!

Three channel (A,E,T) , .020. It's a rocket w/ unlimeted vertical or a gental flier when throttled back.
Darren
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Old 03-22-2007, 12:40 PM
  #40  
tIANci
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Default RE: Remind me why do we fly glow planes, compare to electric planes,


ORIGINAL: BillS

Engines are supposed to be noisy, dirty and require attention.

Electrics and foam airplanes rank right down at the bottom of the fun list analogous to fat ugly women and golf. If you like those things have at it but another faith healer telling others what they should like is unwarranted. Rationalization is not necessary.

Some mothers do have them ... one born every minute ...
Old 03-22-2007, 09:54 PM
  #41  
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Default RE: Remind me why do we fly glow planes, compare to electric planes,

If I was starting out today I might go the electric route.
A lot of the appeal though is the internal combustion engine, I would really miss that part of it.
Old 03-23-2007, 12:18 AM
  #42  
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Default RE: Remind me why do we fly glow planes, compare to electric planes,

SMELL, SOUND, AND SMOKE BABY!!!

brushless is cool for foam.. but 40 size and up?? that things gotta have some combustion...
Old 03-23-2007, 06:38 AM
  #43  
B.L.E.
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Default RE: Remind me why do we fly glow planes, compare to electric planes,

Everyone mentions the noise of glow engines. The funny thing about electrics is that when you go to the ultra-high performance models, they aren't that quiet anymore. An pylon racing prop turning 28,000 rpm makes one heck of a sound no matter what is turning it.

Listen for yourself http://flyemfast.com/files/BestVen.wmv
Old 03-23-2007, 07:05 AM
  #44  
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Default RE: Remind me why do we fly glow planes, compare to electric planes,


ORIGINAL: tIANci

BLE - great retort but some may accuse you of covering up all that sissyness by building kits and rebuilding real engines and all, hahahahaahahaaa I still can start glow engines without using a starter motor or a chicken stick.
Being a real man or a sissy has nothing to do with what kind of toy airplanes we play with. I went electric mostly because I wanted to try something new.

Cleaning up baby poop aint exactly for sissys either.
Old 03-23-2007, 07:56 AM
  #45  
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Default RE: Remind me why do we fly glow planes, compare to electric planes,

One thing everyone has to admit is the bottom line in the difference between glow and electric is the cost. Period.

Compare a Sig Something Extra, for instance (just grabbing a plane to talk about here, and because I have one ) in glow and the same plane in electric. The kit is about 80 bucks. That goes for for both electric and glow because this is a glow that one would convert to electric.

These are all for-instance items with actual costs. Costs will vary with different equipement, I understand that, but just for instance:

Glow engine OS 46 AX. Cost: $109.00

Electric conversion: Axi Brushless Out-Runner 2826/12 Gold $95.00 (this is marginal for this plane, but it will work).
Battery: LiPo 14.8V 3200mAh 20C $150.00
ESC: 40-Amp Brushless ESC $55.00

I won't include the electronics because you need an RX/servo's and TX for that plane no matter what.. electric or glow. Both need a battery, but a 5 cell 1200 mah NiCd or NiMH costs about 20 bucks and lasts for 4 - 6 flights and takes about 30 minutes to recharge.

SO, the conversion comes to about $300 vs. t he $109 for the glow. And, you must keep it light, so ordinary servo's will not work as well as lightweight high-torque servo's. Those are another added cost, but consider only the difference from a, say, standard servo at about $30.00 each x 4 for electric and 5 for glow... probably a wash with the difference in the number of servo's required in glow (5) vs the number required for electric (4).

Added to that, you cannot charge the LiPo with a normal NiCD charger. So, add that additional about $125.00 for a decent charger/cycler and you have a good idea of the cost between glow and electric.

This is not intended to discourage someone from getting electric, but just to point out that it isn't that simple to compare. Cost IS an issue.

Add to that is the flight duration, which is, for the most part, about 10 minutes then recharge time... one hour minimum. If you want to fly more than once a day, you need at least two, maybe three batteries. Compare that to the cost of a gallon of the most expensive glow fuel. And, don't say that batteries last longer because they may last for two flights, they may last for 10. But, they do wear out, burn up, whatever.. where a glow engine lasts for many more than one or two gallons of fuel.

With all that said, I do own and fly both glow and electric. I have a couple flat foamie profiles, a BUG, two electric conversions, and two electric specific balsa planes. I also have one of those electric F4F4's that come already built, add your motor battery, ect. I would hate to add up how much I've spent on all that stuff, including all the ESC's, motors, special servo's, Berg receivers, and so on.. that are specific to electric.

My glow stuff costs are much less, and I have that duration of flight. It flys the same throughout the tank of fuel with no degradation of power as the battery drains.

The only thing I didn't mention was the cleanup after flight. Well, considering the cost difference, a roll of paper towels and a bottle of Windex is perhaps $5.00 and will take several flying days to run out of that stuff. To me, that is not even a consideration, and is part of the 'bull session' time when the day's flying is done and everyone is talking about the day as they clean up.

I like the electrics, but would never even consider going 100% electric. They have a purpose and I use them for that, but would never drop my Glows.
Old 03-23-2007, 09:19 AM
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smosher9
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Default RE: Remind me why do we fly glow planes, compare to electric planes,

I don't have any electric's but I do have both 4s and 2s and I like the screaming sound of the 2s as it whisses by

Steve
Old 03-23-2007, 09:27 AM
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Default RE: Remind me why do we fly glow planes, compare to electric planes,

To answer the question I fly with glow engines because
1. That is all I know
2. I like the sound of a plane with a 4 stroke engine.
3. Cost. I have every thing I need for glow. I have nothing for electric.
4. I am satisfied with glow performance.
5. A plane is supposed to be powered by a fuel buring engine is it not?
Old 03-23-2007, 09:42 AM
  #48  
RhyanO
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Default RE: Remind me why do we fly glow planes, compare to electric planes,

CGRetired -- Well Stated.

The only thing stopping me from getting into 40 and 60 sized electrics is the cost, in particular
the cost of the batteries.
@ $150.00 each.... you will need 2-3 packs for a days worth of flying (To have some charging while you are flying)
Thats $300 - $450 just in batteries....

That equals about 15 - 20 gallons of fuel at $20/gallon.
So if you fly A LOT in a season you might break even, then the next year you will be money ahead flying electrics.
For myself with work, family, and other commitments im lucky to use up 6 gallons of fuel in a season.
So it would take me 3-4 flying seasons just to break even by using electrics.

40 Size Glow -- Electric Cost Comparison

Glow Electric
Plane: $80.00 $80.00
Engine: $110.00 $95.00 (motor)
$55.00 (ESC)
$300.00 (2-batteries)

Total: $190.00 $530.00
*** Assuming the same reciever and servos are used in both electric and glow ***

So for a weekend flyer who is on a budget like myself I can not see any logic in choosing electric over glow.
I can think of a lot better uses for the extra $340.00 that I saved.

Im positive that the cost of batteries will come down in a few years and make electrics more cost comparitive,
but until then ill stick to glow.

Ryan
Old 03-23-2007, 10:44 AM
  #49  
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Default RE: Remind me why do we fly glow planes, compare to electric planes,

I run electric motors in my boats.

My airplanes are just platforms for my glow engines to be operated from. I love mechanical things. I love engines. I love tuning and tinkering with them. I love the smell of burnt nitro and castor. I hate the smell of burnt electric motors and batteries.

I do believe there is a "sissy" factor involved with electric airplanes. Almost to a "T", electric flyers call glow airplanes SLIMERS because they hate to clean up the expended lubricating oil from the airplanes after a flight. Lubricating oil is life blood to an engine. Without it, it is dead. I don't mind wiping down the airplane afterwards. Just like I don't mind washing and waxing my own car. I can feel the curves, the shapes. I can also see if something has come loose. If you never wipe down your airplane you may find too late that something was loose.

I have heard giant electric planes fly. The sound doesn't compare to a nice four-stroke glow engine. I will take the sound of the four-stroke any day. I have heard a 200 mph electric plane blip the throttle, as well as fly. Most impressive, and scary. I still prefer the sound of a screaming two-stroke coming on the pipe.

So, we all will have to agree to disagree. I prefer glow. You may prefer electric.

I fly slimers. You fly flashlights.
Old 03-23-2007, 07:00 PM
  #50  
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Default RE: Remind me why do we fly glow planes, compare to electric planes,

Good thread this,
I have always flown with glow or petrol (Gas is used in cookers!!!). The cost is a very big factor but I really like the fact that I can land, refil the tank, and take off again. If I want to get some quick practise in after work before the light goes there is no other option. Charging takes too long.
I do fly electric indoor foamies, and in the last 4 months I have had 3 batteries die. Not impressed. But it is at the end of the day, up to you to choose.
By the way Orenda, diesel has it's place, in something with 18 wheels and a tattooed arm sticking out of the window.

Only joking,

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