Next plane / First plane
 

So Idon't own my own plane yet but I've had approximately 20-25 or moreflights on my clubs high wingtrainer with an instructor and buddy box. My instructor is very complimentary of me and helps my confidence alot. Idon't know if all clubs in North America or just Canada have the same tests for pilots but here goes. I'm working towards my "Wings A" which at my club, is a take-off, procedure turns, four figure 8's (two towards, two away), landing pattern and landing. I feel like I'm pretty competant at it and once passing I'll be allowed to fly solo at my club but Ilose the use of the clubs high wing trainer. Iknow that Iwant to go with an electric set-up for sure and I'm very interested in two eFlite models but my question is this... Given what I've learnt so far and withthe stick time that I've had on the clubs trainer should my first plane be another high wing trainer (eFlite Alpha 450)or would Ibe able to go to a low wing trainer (eFlite Advance 25e). This is a serious question and I'd appreciate it if answers aren't condenscending. Basically Ijust don't want to buy a high wing trainer and get bored with it right away so all help would be appreciated.

EDIT:Ihave the Phoenix Flight Simulator on the way so I'll be getting more (virtual)stick time from that.

RE: Next plane / First plane
 

I would go for a high wing plane that is also a tail dragger because it is valuable experience imo, I also like to go for planes with no servos if possible. I have always been told eFlite electronics are dodgy (servos specifically), dunno how true it is since I never owned one but I do enjoy installing higher quality servos and ESCs when I buy a plane.
This is a great trainer and I've seen it in action.

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...dProduct=18961

some video of it flying
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QNqTnD9pZEg


What controller will you be using?

RE: Next plane / First plane
 

I have the Advance. It is a nice flying plane, but it's stall speed is quite a bit higher than that of a typical high wing trainer.

I think you would want to be to the point where you can consistently make smooth and soft landings with a high wing plane before you try the Advance.

For a high wing trainer I have the Apprentice. It flies very well and does inverted and basic aerobatics very well for a high wing foam plane. It is also tough, and easy to repair, with parts available at a good price.

I still enjoy taking mine out and shooting landings. With seaplane supply kit, it also makes a good float plane.

Anyway, I guess what I'm suggesting is consider getting a trainer type plane. When you are to the point where you are comfortable with 3D capable sport planes, you may find that doesn't mean you won't still have fun flying the trainer.

RE: Next plane / First plane
 

Thanks for the replies so far. It's funny because all of the older, retired guys at my club have suggested getting a high wing and learning to fly it blindfolded yet the younger guysmostly suggesta low wing trainer. Also Ishould add that I'm not a total noob to the hobby. I've owned a Tamiya and a HPI Pro 4electric in the past and a HPISavage 25. Iwas into the cars and trucks for years and was looking at getting another HPItruck last year when airplanes crossed my mind and it was then that Ijoined my local club. So basically speed and coming toward myself orientation are mostly a non issue with the exception that the airplanes are a lot twitchier.

As for a Radio, it'll most probably be a Spektrum DX6 or DX7.

RE: Next plane / First plane
 

Have you looked at the Ultra Stick 25e?

That would be a good 2nd plane IMO.  I dont have the 25e but do have the mini ultra stick and its a blast.  Just put floats on it to be my float plane since I have a 40 and 60 in GLOW power.

The stick fits 3 of the criteria brought up by people posting in this thread...

1.  Its High Wing
2.  Its a tail dragger
3.  Lands easy like a trainer.

Are you ready for a Stick?  Ask your instructor...sounds like you are in a good club, so I would think he could tell you if you can handle one or not.  The Stick can fly slow and land a lot like a trainer.</p>

RE: Next plane / First plane
 

I just found out Canada had a testing program to be able to fly RC planes a year or two ago. This is the first time I have seen what a new pilot is tested on doing. In the U.S. we don't just fly at clubs so even if we had testing it wouldn't work every place, I fly on a dry lake bed and it has no control other then what we, the regular pilots can enforce. We do a pretty good job of it though. Every club field I have ever been on requires an AMA membership but no flight testing. I like your way better though.
I am just getting into electrics myself, not the little foam planes but I have been converting old 1/2 A kits to electric and just bought my first ARF, the Aeroworks Extra 260 electric powered, I love it!!
I am an instructor, I teach using my own trainer and equipment, I require nothing from the student except they buy there own fuel. My trainer and all my other planes are either glow or gas. After my students have soloed I let them borrow my trainer to fly until they buy there own plane and equipment. I have only lost one trainer. The trainers I use are given to me by friends or just people that feel they no longer want one? Go figure, I love flying a trainer.
Like most people my students want to move onto something cooler and better then the trainer right away, I was the same way myself. I also teach building so if the student wants to build there own plane I try to point them toward the Four Star Kit. If they want to just buy an ARF I point out the Pulse sold by Horizon.
I talk to them about the power system they want to use. Electric has come a long way sense we have the new battery types so electric can be used in anything from little foam planes to huge giant scale planes, it's just the power source.
You don't need to just think about the small foam type of planes, any plane can be powered with electric. I'm now building two float plane and they will both be electric powered a number of reasons.
At this time in your flying I would move away from the high wing planes and get something with a bit more sport in it. The choice of plane is up to you but keep in mind any of them can be electric.
I love flying my little Extra but I enjoy planes just a bit bigger so I can see them better.

RE: Next plane / First plane
 

Would anyone else recommend the Ultra Stick? ATVAlliance does raise some good points however will I be able to execute tail dragger landings? The reason I liked the eFlite Advance is because it has tricycle landing gear like the high wing trainers.</p>

RE: Next plane / First plane
 

I actually converted my Advance to tail dragger, but if I were to do it again I'd have bought the Pulse.

Landing a tail dragger to me is no big deal, but I think I would still suggest getting a high wing, tough, foam high wing like the Apprentice. Getting to the point where you can consistently grease smooth landings on that first I think could save you repairs.

RE: Next plane / First plane
 

Not all tail draggers require the same landing skills. A stick is the easiest plane to takeoff and land that you can get, trainers included. That big tail is pretty effective at preventing ground loops and the straight symmetrical wing doesn't get tossed around by the wind. If you have the skills to pass the flying test you mentioned above, you have the skills to fly a stick with the rates on the mild side. IMO, the Ugly Stick or Ultra Stick is the perfect second plane. It's forgiving, lands slowly, glides well (nice when you have a deadstick) has a very broad speed envelope, can go from mild to wild with a simple servo linkage change, is tough and easy to fix, and handles the wind better than anything else I've ever flown.

I'll also second Gray beard's advice to look beyond the RTF electric planes. If you can afford it, a .40 size Ugly Stick with an appropriate electric power system will handle the wind better and will let you spread out and fly bigger maneuvers than the little park flyer types will. That will make it easier to develop your flying skills and take on new challenges.

RE: Next plane / First plane
 

Not all tail draggers require the same landing skills. A stick is the easiest plane to takeoff and land that you can get, trainers included. That big tail is pretty effective at preventing ground loops and the straight symmetrical wing doesn't get tossed around by the wind. If you have the skills to pass the flying test you mentioned above, you have the skills to fly a stick with the rates on the mild side. IMO, the Ugly Stick or Ultra Stick is the perfect second plane. It's forgiving, lands slowly, glides well (nice when you have a deadstick) has a very broad speed envelope, can go from mild to wild with a simple servo linkage change, is tough and easy to fix, and handles the wind better than anything else I've ever flown.

I'll also second Gray beard's advice to look beyond the RTF electric planes. If you can afford it, a .40 size Ugly Stick with an appropriate electric power system will handle the wind better and will let you spread out and fly bigger maneuvers than the little park flyer types will. That will make it easier to develop your flying skills and take on new challenges.

RE: Next plane / First plane
 

Everyone is different...and I am still relatively new to the hobby as this is just starting my 3rd season in.  But, the Mini Ultra Stick was my 2nd plane...actually my 3rd, the F27C Stryker was my 2nd (i just didnt fly it that much before flying the stick).

I only flew my trainer less than a dozen times before I moved on.  Maybe I was a fast learner...but I really liked the way the Stryker and Stik flew moreso than my trainer.

The biggest thing, for me, was getting used to the stick (and stryker too) not self correcting from a bank.  But I did have a lot of SIM time before I tried the real thing.

Also...the MUS takes off in about 10 feet...I cant imagine the 25e version to take much more, so it being a dragger shouldnt be an issue.  My other planes like my Yaks, Extras, J3 Cub...etc... take a lot more strip to get up to speed (purposely because ALL of them are overpowered and I build up speed rather than punching WOT and hoping for the best) and avoid a ground loop...rudder correction helps with the longer take off too.

I think that once anyone can learn with their high wing trainer to...

1.  Take off
2.  Fly around and put the plane EXACTLY where you want to and not "chase the plane around"
3.  Land ON the runway and taxi back every time

You are ready for a stik type plane of any size.  This, of course like I try to say on most all posts is my own opinion.

If I were only able to own 2 planes, they would be a Stick and a Stryker for sure!</p>

RE: Next plane / First plane
 

Thanks a lot for the great advice so far. I don't really want to go for a foamie high wing trainer though. It can get pretty windy here at times and I imagine that a foamie wouldn't handle the wind aswell as a .40 size balsa plane. I'm not opposed to owning a high wing trainer though and from what I can gather a 25 electric is equivelant to a .40 size glow right? In which case the three planes mentioned (Alpha, Advance and Ultra Stick) are all 25/.40 size. I know the Alpha doesn't actually use a 25 but its close. I think I could handle an Ultra Stick, I also think I could handle the Advance but admittedly I may be feeling over confident. I think the Ultra Stick would be a good compromise though right? Kind of like an in between the Alpha and Advance?

And just to add, I will one day own a Pulse XT, I love the look of that plane but I think thats just a little too hot for me right now haha.

RE: Next plane / First plane
 

No...the Ultra Stik 25e is smaller than a .40 size Ultra Stik.

Its inbetween the Mini Ultra and the .40 size one.

http://www.horizonhobby.com/products...5e-arf-EFL4025

The 25e has a wingspan of 50 inches while the .40 size has a wingspan of appox 58 inches.

The 25e is PURELY electric, while the .40 size one is for glow fuel, but am sure it could easily be converted to electric.

My suggestion would be the 25e and set it up with a good deal of EXPO and half rates till you get used to it.  Then lessen the expo and raise the control throw rates and have a blast with it.

Its the only plane I put together to fly on windy days.  Handles the wind like nobodies business and lands SUPER easy without any bad habbits.

I have 3 sticks...the MUS, a .40 size "ugly" stick (red with white stripe and malteese crosses) and a .60 Ultra.  I dont care for the tricycle gear on the 40 size one but I bought it to make a float plane out of.  Then changed my mind and decided to make my mini the float plane since I dont fly it that much because of having the other 2 larger ones.

I would highly doubt that you would regret going with a stik as a 2nd plane.  They arent the "prettiest" planes in the sky...but the sure fly nice, fast or slow.  Just cant beat one IMO.

goodluck!

RE: Next plane / First plane
 

Yup... Stiks are GREAT planes to move on to and you'll NEVER tire of them... they are just a blast to fly.

ATVAlliance's recommendation is a good one.

I'm also quite partial to even larger Stiks, though strangely I found the .60 sizes to be the most "fun" for me.

I own a Giant Big Stik gasser and while a great flying plane I don't find it as nimble as the .60 size Big Stik I own.
The latter is more "fun" IMHO.

RE: Next plane / First plane
 

I too like my .60 the best. Just put a .91 2s, but the .61 2s flew it fine...just wanted more power/speed.

I really just suggested the .25e because the OP said he wanted to stay electric and thought this would be the easiest plane for someone brand new to attempt to get going all electric.

But, with some guidance and cash...no reason he couldnt get a .40 or .60 and convert it.

Personally...I think the .25e with agood 32brushless(say a NEO 32 or MonsterPower 32 from hobbypartz or even theeFlight 32 if you just want to spend the extra coin) on the nose would be a pure blast!

RE: Next plane / First plane
 

That sounds like a PERFECT Combo to me.

RE: Next plane / First plane
 

Well, that is yet to be actually determined just yet. The only prop I had was a 14x8 which was just too much as I couldnt really tell that much of a difference. I since have put a 14x6 on it and think that will be the "sweet spot" and get me what I want out of the .91.

A fellow club member has the same plane with an EVO 100 on it and it RIPS! Mine with the 14x8 on it was at least 10MPH slower by the naked eye. I didnt get to try the 14x6 because soon as I put it on...the skies opened up and rained me out. Havent been able to fly since and that was 2 weeks ago. Hopefully this Sunday I will see what dropping pitch does for it.

If that doesnt fit my fancy...I'll drop the prop size down to 13 and try a couple props in that range. Plus, I dont think this engine will show its true colors till it gets a gallon ran through it. Its a white box ASP.

RE: Next plane / First plane
 

I've been flying mine with a .75 ST, and though this does very well, it would seem that the .91 would be the "sweet spot" for a nicely overpowered plane... but not so overpowered that you'd rip the engine out or the wings off in flight.

You should have plenty of 3D punch too.

RE: Next plane / First plane
 

I surely wasnt going to do any damage to the plane with the .91 running a 14x8! I had done my "homework" before buying the .91 and knew that a 14x6 is what seems most people run on their Magnum and ASP .91 2strokes. Its just the 8 was all I had.

I flew it 4 or 5 times and it just didnt impress me at all. Maybe a couple MPH faster than the .61 (12x6 prop)...so I knew right away that I was overpropped on the deal.

I really like the value of the ASP engines. This is my first "white box" one though. I couldnt pass it up as hobbypartz has/had them for 78 bucks and free shipping on anything over 50. Where else can you get a brand new .91 for that kind of money?

Plus...I own a couple of the ASP A2's in a 52 and 61 (61 came off the stick) and they have been great engines thus far. I have the 52 on my 40 ugly stik and it rips up the sky pretty good too! I just think the design of the US seems a bit more "sluggish" than that of the Ultra. At least it "feels" that way to me. Maybe I have too much expo on the Ugly though. I'll have to toy around with these planes a bit more before I make my final thoughts.

One thing I do for ALL of my ASPengines is put a small piece of fuel tubing on the high speed needle to seal it.It actually serves 2 purposes, 1. Seals the high speed needle from the dreaded "leaky" o-ring" and 2. Helps keep the needle from vibrating out of position in flight. Ive never ran any of them without this mod to see if it really needed it.Just had read so many posters on the net having to do this...soIve done it from the start. Like I said...my ASPs runny pretty sweet and they are an incredible value. I can buy 3 or 4 of them compared to 1 OS. Not knocking OS, but I just was posting in the heli forum to a guy about me liking to be budget minded on most things in this hobby so I can have a lot more "toys" to play with.</p>

RE: Next plane / First plane
 

Good info thanks... I'll do the same with a plane I am about to build.

I'm about to put a new ASP I got from them into a pattern plane, with a tuned pipe I picked up at the Toledo show in a bin for a whopping $10.00.

The aluminum pipe was covered with some corrosion and lots of hard gunk. It looked pretty bad, but was the right size to fit the pipe mount in the plane.

I tried various solvents and finally found that ( of all things!!! ) toilet bowl stain and rust cleaner removed ALL of the oxidation and gunk.

It looks brand new with only a very tiny bit of pitting on the most oxidized area.

Who would have thought?

RE: Next plane / First plane
 

I love swap meet bargain bins. I have bought a lot of misc items like pitts mufflers and aluminum prop spinners for pennies on the dollar. Heck, some people will just give a lot of that stuff away when it gets closer to packing it up to leave. The last swap meet I went to back in Feb...I ended up with a "re-kitted" Trex 450 for 5 bucks. Had complete head assy and tail with belt...all the bolts and caps and linkages...pretty much everything to build another 450 except for the outter frames.

Also...I always take my son with me. He's 6 and I cant list all of the things people just give him. One time a guy gave him a complete glider. People at swap meets, for the most part...are just good people. Heck, people in this hobby in general are just good people to be around.I enjoy the friendship as much, if not more...than the flying and such. Its harder and harder these days to find people that actually want to help others. Great hobby all the way around.

RE: Next plane / First plane
 

For sure. And it's great that you expose your son to quality people like this.

It helps establish that things are not necessarily as bad or as selfish as what is often seen via media.
This is bound to give him a good outlook on life along with the shared memories and experience.

RE: Next plane / First plane
 

I couldnt agree more! I havent started him flying yet as his attention span just isnt there. He definitely wont be the next Justin Jee! LOL But he does have the interest and its fun to watch him with his field box(I have so many I just gave him one for his own, minus battery of course) and starter and glo plug wrench. He has several planes that hes been given and a couple of old radios. His imagination is huge and he will stand over a plane, holding it back with his heels as if he is tuning it.

Cant wait till next season. He will be half way to 8 years old by then and hopefully will have the desire to learn to fly. Then we can both enjoy this hobby to its fullest together. He actually has the desire now...just I can tell hes not ready because I let him try the SIM from time to time and he wont concentrate on what hes doing. Its hilarious to watch him though!

RE: Next plane / First plane
 

So after I pass my "Wings A" (see first post) and I lose the use of my clubs trainer plane, an Ultra Stick would be a great next step? It just confused me a little when you referred to it as a great second plane yet it'll be my first so I guess you were referring to the club trainer as the first plane? Haha sorry.

RE: Next plane / First plane
 

Not even going to recommend the next plane for you as I can already see that you are getting a lot of good information and recommendations.

What I do want to do is congratulate you on your flying and progression in this hobby. Sounds like you are progressing very well, and most likely could already out fly some of the self confessed experts here in the USA. :D