Best Trainer a SPAD or ARF or RTF
 

What is the best trainer a SPAD or an ARF or RTF ? My situation is I don't have any time to build . I just want a plane that has good flight characteristics doesnt take time to assemble and is somewhat crash proof . If it is a SPAD could you specify a specific model and why, what are the advantages to SPAD or balsa or foam. Any comments or suggestions would be greatly appreciated. From what I have seen so far I am leaning towards SPAD aircraft and would eventually consider a balsa / foam construction plane. Mention of specific models would be much appreciated . I plan on using engines in the size of .46 - .61 2 stroke

RE: Best Trainer a SPAD or ARF or RTF
 

reapr,

First off.. no SPAD !! They fly on power, not the wing.... and would be very difficult to learn how to fly with.

There is no such thing as "crash proof" with a trainer. Your best "Crash Protection" is a good instructor and a buddy box.

Since you say that time is a big issue with you... I guess I'll have to suggest an ARF....(don't like those)..so...2 suggestions.

1. With an instructor... and Hangar 9 Alpha package.... takes no more than one hour to assemble ( I did one in 28 minutes from box to test flight at the Festival of Flight in Fayetteville, NC). Has a good engine/radio/flight charactoristics and comes with the engine/radio pushrods and clevises installed. Horizon did a great job w/this package. Also easy to get a buddy box setup done.

2. Without an instructor... A Sig LT-40.... You still have to assemble the plane but you will also install the radio/pushrods/engine/fuel tank etc..... Flies super stable... too stable if you have an instructor.... the plane is basically a big powered kite... would be a great free flight plane if you had the room. Sig did a great job on this plane... but I consider it too stable for instruction... but excellent if you are trying to teach yourself.

Hope this helps.. and welcome to R/C... it is a GREAT HOBBY !!!


Deadstik [8D]

Carolina Custom Aircraft

RE: Best Trainer a SPAD or ARF or RTF
 

I'll disagree about the SPADs...

The SPAD Debonair will fly on the wing with no problems. If you have a decent paved runway it will fly on a .25. If you use a .40 LA onit with the correct prop its OBVIOUS it is not flying on pure power. (Takes a .61 to be flying it on power) it makes a fine trainer.

You are correct that there is no indestructable airplane. I have seen a SPAD Debonair that had rammed into a dumptser full throttle... split the engine in half the hard way, destroyed the fuselage... just dented the wing a little. The guy was about to try flying another... with no help :eek:again:eek:

Without an instructor... the LT-40 won't do appreciably better than the Alpha... either is going to end up in little bits and pieces. (might as well try to learn with a Dazzler if you are going to try with no help... it'll end up splintered too.)

I won't advise trying to learn on your own with a glow powered model. (one possible exception but you won't want it... Dynaflite Butterfly... .15 ci engine, 99 inch span and 12 mph stall speed about 30 mph top speed It basicly flies itself.)

RE: Best Trainer a SPAD or ARF or RTF
 

If you are learning with a good instructor then your choice is fairly simple.

Find a trainer SPAD or balsa doesn't matter. Your instructor will teach you to fly not the plane!!!!

If you are going to teach yourself then I would buy a simulator like realflight yes FMS is free but I think realflight is more realistic.

Fly the sim. do your crashing there not at the field:D

Then pick a trainer. No guarentees but you'll most likely learn quicker and with less expense if you use an instructor

RE: Best Trainer a SPAD or ARF or RTF
 

The SPAD you still have to build. so, with little to no time to build, it's kinda out of teh running.

there are some good 'combo' kits, such as teh Alpha trainer, and this new Nexstar. Nice thing about these, is that they require little work. the nextsar does have teh bonus of a simulator bundled with the kit, along with the radio and engine.

trouble is, what to do first: build and charge teh batteries, or play with the flight sim!!!!

Except for a few hours building time, a few hours to charge the battery, and some basic feild equipment, both the Nexstar and the Alpha Trainer are probably your better choices.

then any ARF / RTR trainer out there, such as the LT-40... (but you need to buy the radio and engine, and install them....)

Show up at the local feild, and get an instructor!

It's easier to learn the proper habits, than to break the bad ones....

RE: Best Trainer a SPAD or ARF or RTF
 

First i'll try and help with the Q's
A SPAD is tougher than just about any other trainer i know BUT you can still destroy one, i've done it on 3 or 4 ocasions, what a SPAD will do is outlast any balsa plane for those hard landings and crossed thumbs on final.

A basic SPAD trainer (BUHOR, Debonair) is pretty ugly to some people but than so are the balsa ARF's when you look at the shape under the glossy graphics.

A sctatch built SPAD is a LOT cheaper than a balsa plane but takes time to build and you need a few skills, an ARF SPAD is marginaly cheaper than a balsa ARF (30%) and about the same as a sturdy birdy or duraplane


Incorect, they do NOT have to fly on power any more or less that any plane. The trainers like any trainer set up corectly they are very docile an have great glide characteristics. Take the DPS (not a trainer i know) most guys fly it with a 46, mine has a 40fp and does everything but knife edge (thats the fuzz profile though) and hapily tools around on a 28 or 32 if the runway is long enough. they are also no easier or harder to learn to fly with, i learmt to fly with one (and that WAS a heavy pig) and 3 others i know are learning to fly on them no easier or harder than a balsa trainer.



Not so, there are several good SPAD ARF supliers heres one http://boogerboyhobbies.com/ and here there are links to more http://www.spadtothebone.com/misc/ARF.html also if you do decide to build a SPAD is a much quicker scratch build than just about anything i know, even IKEA

RE: Best Trainer a SPAD or ARF or RTF
 

A beginning SPAD builder can go from raw materials to RTF model in under 6 hours work... (some who are adept with the knives and stuff... can build at the rate of 2 hours per plane after the first one...)

The SPAD kits are nice... but heck... its a SPAD, it is supposed to be made of scrap sign salvaged from the "QuickieMart." ;)

RE: Best Trainer a SPAD or ARF or RTF
 

If it weren't for the durability and ease of build I wouldn't be in this hobby. I have cartwheeled my deb trainer across the field with only breaking the prop. Try that with a balsa!!!! I am a 9 month pilot and would say that training on a spad is the best simply because of #1 cost and #2 durability.:D

RE: Best Trainer a SPAD or ARF or RTF
 

Bottom line: Balsa flyes better, but SPAD's are more durable. Take your choice, but you cann't have both.

RE: Best Trainer a SPAD or ARF or RTF
 

You've never flown a SPAD have you?

They are not lead sleds! I can produce a .25 powered 48 inch span SPAD trainer that will float right with a Tower Trainer 40. (and keepup with it at max speed) How do i kow? I've got the wing from the one I made sitting in my living room right now. (something about not expecting the speed out of it and not putting the tail on firmly enough...:eek: My fault... not the constrution method's[:@])

RE: Best Trainer a SPAD or ARF or RTF
 

Hey, look up JKAerotech's foamie t-52 trainer, put an .061 norvel on it and go!...Rog

RE: Best Trainer a SPAD or ARF or RTF
 

I have two Spad Debonairs each powered by a TT Pro.46 with an 11x6 MAS prop and they fly great. These planes are surprisingly resilient and can take a real beating. One of my Deb's crashed due to signal loss while flying at about 60' and as it began its descent I said to a friend who was standing next to me, "Well, that plane is history." Surprisingly though, it only suffered a broken prop and engine mount.

RE: Best Trainer a SPAD or ARF or RTF
 

Yes I have. One was an ARF and the other I built from plans. And I stand by my statement based on my personal experience. Like everything in life, there are pro anc cons. Just accept it. BTW, I do enjoy SPADs, but I also like balsa.

RE: Best Trainer a SPAD or ARF or RTF
 

I built Suitcase a spad debonair with a 46FX and taildragger gear. He learned to fly on it and I learned at the same time with the same instructor with a Balsa USA Stick 40. My trainer lands a little slower and cruised a lot slower. His Spad really groves nicely and seems to fly better than mine in higher winds. We both still have our planes and he has built a new wing with only 2 1/2 in of dihedral and use 2 aileron servos. It flys more like an intermidiate sportplane now just by changing the wing. He has crashed it hard many times, new fusulage once, 2 engine mounts, and one wing and it flys better than ever. I am tired of my trainer while his spad is still fun to fly. Not bad for a few hours work to built and a lot less money.

RE: Best Trainer a SPAD or ARF or RTF
 

I appreciate all the responces. It reminds me of a guy I know who flew for the RAF during WWII. He was biased to the Spitfire as that was more manueverable and what he flew most of the time but in many more words basically said the P51 Mustang was a more durable plane. The Zero was a very manueverable plane and was more like a spit . So the question is balsa or coroplast .
I know real planes can't really equate to models but it's an analogy.
I would like to hear from those what have flown a trainer version of both SPAD coro or balsa wood or foam combo .

Should I just buy a US Aircore trainer ? If yes or no ... why?

RE: Best Trainer a SPAD or ARF or RTF
 

RC airplanes ARE real ;) the exact same laws of physcs and aerodynamics apply as for the man-carrying machines. (and if you saw some of the scale bombers... you'd know that if it were legal... they could carry a man...[X(]They ARE that huge![X(])

Its more a matter of personal preference and a bit of prejudice based on some of the early poor designs of the Coro aircraft. Newer designs are lighter, just as strong and look much better. something about using 2 mm coro for wing skins instead of 4 mm... and other things that are being done to improve the results.

RE: Best Trainer a SPAD or ARF or RTF
 

Best Trainer for $: Spad Debonair. You can build about 7-10 Debonairs for the price of 1 ARF. The Debonair takes about the same amount of time as building an ARF such as LT-40, plus the savings in $$$ can go toward other flying gears.

I started flying with the LT-40 till I found out about the Debonair. You'll feel less stress when learning how to land (with the Debonair) for the first couple of times (at most, you've crashed a $15 plane). I've cartwheel, hard-drop, and sideway landed the Debonair many times without any damage. I don't think my LT-40 would have survived those earlier landings without serious balsa repairs.

Go with the Debonair (especially if you live in a windy area). You won't be disappointed.

RE: Best Trainer a SPAD or ARF or RTF
 

Have built diffrent types of Spads in the last year--I love those planes--Build a Deb trainer and you will be hooked--A DPS and WOW--A low wing Deamon--A bi plane--the list goes on an on an on--Order kits from Spad To The Bone--Either way the best way to go--Real planes are plastic and metal with lots of push--MMM'um sounds like a SPAD

RE: Best Trainer a SPAD or ARF or RTF
 

Rubish!!!!
a well designed and set up plane will fly great regardless of what it is made from, i've only ever built SPAD and foam, some fly great some fly crap, same for balsa, saying SPAD fly better or worse that Balsa is a complete load of crap.

RE: Best Trainer a SPAD or ARF or RTF
 

Okay I'll take anybody that wants to meet in person and see which plane flies better! One of my SPAD trainers against your balsa trainers. Simple as that. My Pro Trainer SPAD will fly as slow, fast, handle or anything else you can think of! And most of all will outlast 100X! Bring it on! Boogerboy







www.boogerboyhobbies.com