Radios
 

Hi guys, I just have a question about radios, so far, I've only got a "flying egg carton" parkflyer (Syma off e-bay for $5), but it varies the speed of the dual engines to initiate turns so there are only "throttle" and the "turn" inputs. I was just wondering what all the toggles and stuff do on higher quality radios. Like I know you have 4 channels or more, but only 2 sticks, so how does that all work?

RE: Radios
 

A 4 channel is actually "almost" required to fly an airplane. The left stick controls the throttle(up/down) and the rudder(left/right in a four channel set up), while the right stick controls the elevator(up/down) and either the ailerons(left/right) or rudder(left/right in three channel set up-no ailerons). Other switches on the 6, 7, 8, 9 and 14 channel radios control things like flaps, retractable landing gear, lighting, bomb bay doors and dropping bombs/candy. The larger and/or more complex the plane, the more channels that may be required, which is why these are normally flown by pilots with hundreds of hours flying time and thousands of flights under their belts. This is another reason why a scale warbird isn't a good plane to learn on. A Top Flight Mustang would need six or seven channels(throttle, rudder, ailerons, elevator, flaps, retracts, and possibly wing rack release) just to be able to fly "scale like", giving the new pilot too many things to think about, while an LT-40 has just the basics, meaning a student only has to think about controlling the plane.

RE: Radios
 

http://www.easyrc.com/radiosystems/index.html

RE: Radios
 

The "extra" switches and toggles are not just extra channels... Some planes do require more... The trainer I keep around is basic, just 4 channels.... My Twist adds a 5th channel, each aileron (one on each wing) has a servo dedicated to it.... Since they use different channels the radio can mix them differently... My p-51 ads a 6th channel on top of that (landing gear)...... My Raptor (heli) uses 8 channels (fore/aft cyclic, left/right cyclic, throttle, collective pitch, tail rotor, gyro gain, governor speed, governor on/off)... Switches on computer radios are generally assignable... You can make them operate channels (like gear, gain, etc...) or you can make them activate mixes... For example you might put "flapperons" (making both ailerons act as flaps while they still work as ailerons) on a switch... You might put elevator to flapperon mixing (adds flaperon when you add elevator... this can be used to make very "square" turns for "square loops" etc...) You might mix in elevator with rudder to keep knife-edge flight more stable, etc... On my heli I have a switch to "hold" the throttle... This keeps the engine idled and not engaging the clutch, but still lets me control the collective pitch... I also have an "idle-up" which makes the throttle act like a "V" instead of a "/"... In other words, at the mid stick, the throttle is at it's lowest point, but as you raise OR LOWER the stick, the throttle comes up... This allows inverted flight, etc...

RE: Radios
 

awesome info guys, thanks. So should I look into a basic 4 channel to begin with, or should I look at 6 channel and just use 4 as needed? It's probably a cost vs. features type of thing I suppose.

RE: Radios
 

To be honest with you, more channels give you more capabilities but to many may confuse you, too. It becomes a choice of what you want and what your needs are and how much you want to expand.

For instance, many airplanes have two servo's for the ailerons. One on each side. They can be controlled one of two ways: Y connector so one channel goes to both servo's via a servo extender cable, or one channel per servo (typically channels 2 and 6) then the radio is setup (using the computer capabilities) as Flaperons.

Channels can be used for other things, usually channels 1 - 4 are reserved for throttle, rudder, ailerons, and elevators. Then other channels are used for such things as retracts, bomb drops, flaps, spoilers, and so on. The more channels you have the more things you can do.

One big advantage to an upper level radio (meaning one that has a computer control) is that they will have multiple model memories. For instance, I have an Airtronics RD6000 Sport radio. It is a six channel radio with a 4 model memory. That means that you can use the same transmitter with four different models. That can save you some $$$ when you start to expand. You only have to buy a flight pack consisting of a receiver, battery, and any number of servo's that you need. The RX is about 50 bucks, the servo's are around 20 - 25 each, and the battery is about 20. So the difference is what you would have to pay for a completely new system with another transmitter. Just a thought. I have five flyable aircraft right now, four on the RD6000 and I bought a new RD8000 (8 channel and 10 model memory) which, right now, has one model on it.

Hope that helps.

RE: Radios
 

ya, I want to get something with a few model memory, and right now I will only need 4 channels, but I may need 6 someday. I'm going to a local shop tomorrow to make a "wish list" hopefully I can get up and flying sometime this summer. I am also having trouble deciding what kind of plane I want. I would like a glow plane, but I would also like electric so I can take it to a nearby park and fly. Is one or the other easier to learn on? I know that it's not recommended, but I am going to try and learn to fly on my own, that's just the way I like to do things, I realize I will crash more and it will cost me more money, but I like the process of learning. I taught myself to play guitar and I think I enjoyed it more than if I had lessons. Who knows, after a few crashes and an empty wallet I may come back with my tail between my legs praising the value of instructor (most on here do). Actually every sunday at our local rec. center (huge gym), you can go fly. It's not a club yet, but it may be the reason I go electric. Anyway, don't flame me too bad cause I'm not getting an instructor!!

RE: Radios
 

Here's something else to add to the mix. Futaba and one other manufacturer have some radios with frequency modules. These let you change the frequency of the transmitter without having to send it in to be retuned. The Futaba 9C has modules for all the 72MHz bands AND all the 75MHz surface bands. This radio not only keeps model settings in a memory, it lets you use the same transmitter for cars, boats AND planes. Granted, the modules cost between $50 and $75 each, but it's much cheaper than buying one 9 channel computer radio for aircraft and a second for cars and boats. I'm getting a 9C on 75MHz and ordering a separate SYNTHESIZED module on 72MHz for aircraft. This will let me fly on ANY of the aircraft channels using just one module. The synthesized module costs more than a single frequency type, but I won't need any others to change radio frquencies in the 72 band.

RE: Radios
 

You really need to decide if you're going to go glow or electric for your plane. The reason is there is a significant difference in the flight packs for the two types of planes. Park fliers, and planes that can be flown in a gym, are small, and require small receivers and servos. As with other electronics, the smaller ones cost more. The typical glow plane can use a standard receiver and standard servos. These are usually less money.

On to the subject of transmitters. A beginner can get by just fine with a 4 channel transmitter. If you are on a budget, this is a good radio to begin with. A slightly more expensive option is a 6 channel computer radio. These give you many nice to have, but not required, features, and will serve the average flier well for a long time. Personally, I think any more than this, 7 or 9 channel transmitters, are overkill for a beginner, unless you've got an unlimited budget. Note, if you start with a 4 channel, you can always buy a more full featured computer transmitter, or entire system, later. The cost of the 4 channel system was probably only a little more than the cost of a flight pack (receiver, servos, receiver battery, crystal, etc). Choose a compatible brand on the same frequency as your 4 channel. The computer transmitter will be able to control the flight pack from the first radio. The 4 channel transmitter will work as a spare in case you ever need to send the computer transmitter in for service.

RE: Radios
 

Glow, or electric, I'm just not sure...I'll talk to the guys at the hobby shop tomorrow and then consider... Thanks again for all the info, now to remember it all!!

RE: Radios
 

One more comment... I dunno why this is, but airplane guys (not picking on ya, I fly planks too! ;) always seem to buy "just what can get them by"... I did the same thing... I started out with a 4 channel AM, then moved to a 6 channel FM, wasn't long till I built a model I needed a 6ch computer... Then later needed another channel... Had to move to an 8ch computer...etc... Over a 10 year or so period of flying I had spent a FORTUNE! in radios... I see other guys at our club do the same thing all the time... Once I got into heli's I wised up... All the heli guys will tell you the same thing... Get the absolute best radio you can afford... I'm not really suggesting you go out and get a 14mz, but at least consider a 9C, or if you can find a used one cheap, a 9Z.. Either are great radios... Neither is really terribly expensive, and you'll NEVER regret it... As was pointed out, either the 9C or 9Z are available with a synth module... That means no matter what aircraft you have, and what channel their receiver is on, you'll always be able to fly with one radio... I use my 9C for EVERYTHING I fly... I still keep an old backup, so if something happens to the 9C I can still fly some things, but I rely on it like it was gold... ;) If I would have bought an 8U heli 12 or 13 years ago I'd probably have only ever had to buy that single radio... (More money to spend on aircraft.. LOL ) Another issue is heli versus airplane... In my experience, most airplane guys have never used a heli radio... Most heli guys use nothing but heli radios... ;) If your lucky enough to have a shop that carries both, try them out... I like them a lot more... The switch layout is great, even for planks... The throttle is smooth rather than being ratcheted... Once I started flying with a smooth throttle, I can't STAND a ratcheted throttle now... Not to mention, if you ever decide to venture into the land of heli flying later, you'll be better off... Ohh, and the heli radios come with higher capacity ni-cd packs too, so you don't have to worry about your batteries going dead....

Anyway, just my two cents and all just my opinions anyway... take it for what it's worth.. ;)

RE: Radios
 

The reason we do this is because we also consider all the people who:
1) buy a trainer, try it for a while and drop out.
2) Are on a budget and can't afford $300-400+ for a radio when they are just starting.
3) NEVER go past the point of using more than 4 channels because they don't choose to participate in helis, 3D, competition aerobatics, serious scale planes (with retracts, flaps, bomb drops), etc.
4) Feel that buying more radio than they need in the next 1-3 years is just a waste of money.

I, and MANY others that I've known over the years, have gotten along fine with 4 or perhaps 6 channels. Only 1 of the 5 planes I have flying right now actually NEEDS more than 4 channels. If one did a survey, I suspect somewhere between 70 to 80% of the R/C community would be in a similar category. For the minority who do end up needing more channels, an initial investment in a basic 4 channel is still sound. The transmitter will serve as a spare and the flight pack will work with the more expensive one they buy when they branch out past basic planes. Knowing this is what causes me to continue to recommend basic 4 channel, or perhaps a basic 6 channel computer, setup to beginners.

RE: Radios
 

Went to the shop today, and I looked at a sweet Hitec 6-channel computer radio. I liked it a lot and it was $250 CDN, which I didn't think was too bad for a pretty good radio. But does Hitec rank up there with JR and Futaba? I also think I'm going to start with a park flyer. My parents live in a small town and my dad works at a truss company in the old airport hangers there (it was a training site for WWII) but the runway is rarely used, so I would imagine I could go there with a glow plane. There are some Yamato trainers on e-bay right now (check em out [link=http://cgi.ebay.ca/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=19164&item=5966530 510&rd=1]here[/link]). Are these good trainers, I thought if I can get one of these cheap now and go with a park flyer (RTF) in the meantime until I can afford the engine and a good radio. I dunno, what do you guys think?

RE: Radios
 

Those are very good points. I guess I should have worded my earlier post a little better... I think for someone who has the budget, you might as well just get the best you can afford... Afford being the key word there... For someone just starting out, I agree totally that a 4 or 6 channel basic radio is just fine, and like you said, can always serve as a backup later... Just so long as they don't start down that "constant upgrade" path.. ;) That's really what I was getting at I guess... Buy the best you can to start (even if you get out of it later, you will get much more resale out of a nice radio that a cheapy one), and if you like many others of us get totally hooked on it and find yourself wanting more planes, etc.. Just go get a nice radio... Don't keep upgrading every time you want a new plane.. ;)

As for the hitec vhawk... To be honest with you, I myself have never used one... They really aren't very popular in my area, most everyone here uses Futaba and a few JR guys here and there... However, I have heard a lot of good things about them. Most of the guys I've heard that have them love them, I've especially heard a lot of good about the RD6000 and RD8000... I CAN tell you this much though.... You'll find Hi-Tec servos in about 75% of my aircraft.... They're very affordable, and I like them just as much, and sometimes more than their futaba couter-parts.... I also use their Electron 6 micro receiver a couple of micro helis and foamie I have... Never had a bit of problem out of any of them... Lots of others comment about how the electron 6 has a MUCH better range than other comparable micro receivers... So... There you go... My two cents again.. ;)

RE: Radios
 

Good good, what about that Yamato thing? Oh and the foamy trainer I was looking at was the Powerline Tiger Wing, it's kinda ugly, but it is a complete kit with radio, etc. I know it's not the best radio or anything, but the dude said it was a good starter, especially if I'm going to crash, I mean fly, alone. He also suggested the GWS Tiger Moth, if I was going to buy a radio, but he said expect to spend at least $300CDN+radio to get it in the air. I would have to get micro servos instead of the regs that come with the 6 channel radio, so that's an extra expense...anyway, your thoughts??

RE: Radios
 

^^^^Guys??? Opinions?? What would you recommend for a good electric trainer??

RE: Radios
 

One point is the budget factor, of course. The other one is how many planes are you going to own/fly? I dunno.. I have five flyable. That ends up being one more than my four model memory RD6000. So, I kept the RD6000 and upgraded to the RD8000 which has 10 model memory. Perhaps in a few years I may move up to the Stylus.. $$$$$ then again, I may not...:)

RE: Radios
 

I have Hitec transmitters only: Flash 5X, Prism 7X and Optic 6. IMO they're of excellent quality. Most Futaba and JR guys don't want to hear a word about Hitec transmitters but would use Hitec servos (especially digital ones) and sometimes receivers. If there were three identical radios branded Hitec, Futaba and JR I would go for Hitec. Well, I'm biased[8D]

RE: Radios
 

Ya, I was looking at the Optic 6...I liked it a lot ergonomically (not having anything to really compare it to). So is the Tiger Wing a good electric trainer or what? And what about those Yamato trainers on e-bay? (I know that one is gas, but I thought I could get the body for cheap and then add to it a bit at a time and fly a foamie RTF in the meantime)

RE: Radios
 

^^^ No one?? with an opinion??? Am I on the right forum...???

RE: Radios
 

Holy crap, do I smell bad or something?? I can't believe no one has anything to say... did I piss everybody off somehow?? The first few days of this post I got lots of replies, now nothing in 3 days....anyway, just bumping to catch your attention maybe..

RE: Radios
 

LOL, i don't think you pissed anyone off... It's just probably that nobody is familer with those models... I myself have never heard of them, and in general most people try to shy away from hobby stuff on ebay... As for the Tiger Wing, I've never seen one of those either, so can't really comment on how well it flies... The Tiger Moth, probably fine, but probably not for a beginner either....

RE: Radios
 

You're up against several problems. As has already been said, probably nobody is familiar with the planes you mentioned. Additionally, a significant portion of the people who follow this forum fly glow rather than electric. One last thing is it's best for beginners to buy a known trainer from a local source, if you have one. It's important to be able to go to someone for help. If you don't have a local shop, buying from a well known online vendor would be better. I took a quick look at the Yamato trainer. The picture looks ok, but without seeing one up close, it's impossible to tell. What happens if something is missing, or a part is broken, warped, etc? When you add up the auction price, and the unreasonably high $35 (40 for Canada) shipping, you're at about the same price as a known trainer, such as the Tower Trainer 40. So, my advice would be to avoid eBay until you have the experience to tell what is and is not worth buying, and the skills to deal with something that may not be right when you get it.

RE: Radios
 

Well put Piper Chuck. I couldn't agree more. I would recommend the Tower Trainer 40, The Kadet LT-40, or any other readily available trainer. I've read too many horror stories in the boating forums over E-Bay specials. I just ordered a Futaba 9C Super from Tower, along with a 4.8 volt 1500 mah receiver pack and a couple of servo mounts. My total cost (after a $40 internet discount) was $390, including shipping(around $8 through UPS). If someone is charging $35 to $40, they had better be sending whatever they sold by next day air, as Tower only charges $20(more or less) for next day delivery. Sounds like someone is trying to line their pockets at the buyers expense[:@]

RE: Radios
 

It's partly that, but mostly to avoid eBay closing fees.