4ch or 6ch?
 

Hey,


I was wondering, would a 6ch radio be able to control a 4ch plane while still using 4ch configuration? Basically, my dilemma is whether or not to just buy a

6ch radio or a 4ch for now (I have a 4ch plane, but I plan on buying a 6ch plane in the future).

RE: 4ch or 6ch?
 

You don't have to use all the channels on a radio. Simply use what you need. Personally, I'd get the 6 channel. They usually have more bells and whistles, and will last through many planes, especially if you eventually want to go with flaps and/or retracts.

Dr.1

RE: 4ch or 6ch?
 

Get the best radio that you can afford.

I have a 9 channel radio, and only use 2 channels on my glider.

RE: 4ch or 6ch?
 

I've got a 6 channel, works fine. For the extra money I would have spent on a 9 channel, which would come with lots of features most people will never use, I've bought a couple more planes instead! ;)

RE: 4ch or 6ch?
 

Thanks guys!

You have solved my dilemma!

With that in mind, I may get a 6+ch, if not I'll definitely get the 6ch.

Thanks again!

RE: 4ch or 6ch?
 

Hi Model Mavrick,

I agree with the 6 channel advise and would add that you select the major brand radio with the greatest model memory you can afford. You will be amazed how quickly the little devils multiply.

Cheers,

Colin

RE: 4ch or 6ch?
 

Isn't that the truth. I just removed the receiver and wiped out the memory for one of my planes so I could put another in the air.

RE: 4ch or 6ch?
 

STANDARD vs. COMPUTER RADIOS

I think you will find the economics of computer radios have changed in the
last 2-3 years. This is partially due to the advance in electronics and
partly because people are buying that second, third plane much sooner. We
have flyers in our club who have been flying less than 6 months who have 3
planes already. The cost has dropped so much, and the availability of ARFs
and high quality kits have made it cheaper and simpler to get the next plane.
There is little to hold them back.

I recommend new pilots go directly to the computer radios. If they start with
an RTF, then they use that radio to fly that plane. When they buy the second
plane, they get the computer radio.

A quality electric ARF parkflyer or simple to build kit, with the motor, can
cost as little as $40. A flight pack for that plane can be as low as $70.
You can put it in the air over a weekend.

An ARF 2 meter sailplane can be $90. The electronics to put that in the air
can be around $70 and can be completed in a couple of evenings.

In the glow and gas powered world these low costs and rapid adoption of second
and third planes might be different. I can't say.

BACK TO RADIOS

Just as computers have wiped out the typewriter, so the computer radio is
making the standard radio obsolete. Today, nobody buys a kid a typewriter
to type his school papers. They get a computer.

I have come to the conclusion that the only reason to buy
a standard radio is lack of confidence that you plan to go forward, or
the standard radio came as part of an RTF package.

Here is a quick look at some key points.

Economics - Let's compare - Tower Hobbies catalogue

Hitec Laser 4, std Radioand 4 standard servos - $120
Futaba 4 EXA computer radio, receiver, 4 standard servos $149
Hitec Flash 5SX computer radio, receiver, HS-325 servos - $156

Difference is $30-36

Looking at the Flash, you get 5 model memories so you can instantly switch to
any of 5 models without having to reset anything. If we ignore servos and
receiver, the Flash covers your next four planes for about $9 each. With the
standard radio you need to reset for each plane, carefully keep all planes
tuned identically, or buy a radio for each plane so you can tune it to the
plane and keep the settings. That would cost about $60 per plane for each
standard radio, or an additional $240. And with the flash you only have to
charge one radio and bring one radio regardless of which plane, or how many
different planes you wish to fly.

That's $36 extra for one radio that handles 5 planes or an added 240 to have
each plane's settings retained with a standard radio. And the Flash 5SX does
a whole lot more than just provide model memories. This is an excellent first
radio.

Big savings and convenience with the computer radio!

In the Tower hobbies catalogue:
Futaba Skysport 4 with 4 S304 servos and receiver for $129
Futaba SkySport 6 with 4 S304 servos and receiver for $149
Hitec Laser 6 with 4 similar servos and receiver for $139
Futaba 6EXAS 6 Ch computer radio-same servos & receiver $179

For $30-$50 the 6EXAS gives you 6 model memories and a whole pile of features
the SkySport and Laser Standard radios can't touch.

What else can these entry level computer radios do?

Split Ailerons/flapperons: -

You can install two aileron servos and connect each to a separate channel on
the computer radio. This makes it very easy to trim each servo to get each
aileron just right.

You can set up aileron differential, if you wish, to improve effectiveness
while reducing drag. Very popular on sailplanes.

Or let's say you have a plane with ailerons but no flaps. You fly the plane
normally. Then flip a switch and turn the ailerons into flapperons. Now you
can use your ailerons as flaps during landings. Flaps on a 4 channel plane
that doesn't have flaps. You can just as easily set them up as spoilers, which
are commonly used on sailplanes during landings.

Cool!

Coordinated turns - Mix rudder into your ailerons so you have a coordinated
turn. On a standard radio you have to do this manually. With the computer
radio you can do it manually too, or you can focus on the plane while the
radio handles the coordination for you. You can override the mix and add or
reduce rudder at any time.

Exponential, dual rates, model memories, channel mixing, digital trims and
lots more. Some of these features can be very helpful in getting new pilots
in the air.

Are computer radio hard to use?

No! In fact if you want, you can just use it as a standard 2, 3 or 4 channel
radio until you want to use the other features.

Take a look at this thread, starting at post 49. This guy talks about using
flaps as ailerons for flying and flaps for landing on a R/E/F sailplane.
Pretty cool idea. Can't do that with a standard radio!
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...6&page=4&pp=15

So, for an extra $30-50 over a standard 4 channel or 6 channel radio, you get
a radio that handles multiple models and lets you do things that the standard
radios can't do. Go up a another $25-50 to the Hitec Optic 6 or Futaba 7C and
it is amazing what you can do.

Will you need this on the first plane?

Differential can be very helpful to a new pilot. Most radios that
come with RTF packages, and most standard radios don't have all these
features. You don't have to use them right away, but it is great to know that
you don't have to buy ANOTHER radio when you realize you would like to have
them. The price difference over a standard radio is now so small that for
all but the very few, the computer radio is now the economic entry level radio
of choice.

If you get into even semi serious aerobatics or sailplanes, a computer radio
is a huge benefit and for some things, almost a requirement to bring the plane
to its full potential. Even the pilot of a 3-4 channel parkflyer, or someone
flying a simple R/E sailplane with spoilers or flaps benefits from a computer
radio.

There is only one reason to buy a standard radio these days. "I don't know if
I will like RC flying so I want to spend as little as possible". Or the
standard radio came in an RTF package like an Multiplex Easy Star RTF, a Great
Planes Spirit Select RTF or a NextStar Glow RTF.

I have used Hitec and Futaba as examples here because I know those lines best,
but JR, Airtronics, Polk and others have entry level computer radios that are
a much
better value than any standard radio. In many cases these entry level
computer radios will serve the needs of the pilot for many years to come.

Get a computer radio, save a bundle of money, get a bundle
of features and really have fun with your RC flying.

RE: 4ch or 6ch?
 

Rudder, throttle, elevator, ailerons can actually use 5 ch's when u have 2 independent servos for the ailerons.

RE: 4ch or 6ch?
 

On the Hitec Flash 5SX and a few others you can do this with a 5 channel radio and a 5 channel receiver. But most of hte time you need a 6 channel computer radio to have separate channels for your aileron servos. Makes life so much easier when you are trimming the ailerons. And of course you can now invole flapperons or ailreon differential if you wish.

All of this requires a computer radio.

RE: 4ch or 6ch?
 

How many channels do I need?

First it is important to realize that you should be able to fly almost any
plane with a standard four channel radio. That is enough to control rudder,
elevator, ailerons and throttle. If this is a sailplane, then four channels
will allow you to handle R/E/A and flaps or spoilers to help with precision
landings. With four channels you can fly an indoor plane, an electric park
flyer, a sailplane or a giant high powered plane. Jets might require more
than 4.

With a 6 channel standard radio, with no computer mixing, you can add control
for landing gear and flaps to the R/E/A/T functions mentioned above. However
you can't mix them together in the radio. You have to do it manually. A
coordinated turn requires you to add rudder to the ailerons. When you
deploy flaps you will have to push and hold the elevator forward to keep the
plane from
ballooning up. If you deploy spoilers, then you probably need to pull and
hold some up
elevator or the plane will go into a dive.

These are complex things to handle. I know I could not get a good balance
between the up elevator and spoilers when I was trying to do them manually.
Most people find them easier to do with a computer radio which can coordinate
more than one servo from a single input. It made a world of difference for
me.

Computer radios let you do things that a standard radio can't do no matter how
many channels it has. So we start to see that our answer to, "how many
channels"
it is more than just the number of channels.

If you have more channels AND a computer radio, you gain flexibility. For
example, you can put two servos on the ailerons and control them individually.
That is something the 6 channel standard radio can not do. It has enough
channels but it can't mix them the way a computer radio can. If you are going
to beyond the standard 4 channels, you should be looking at a computer radio
where you can really take advantage of the extra channels.

Here is a typical channel breakdown, how many and what they are used to
control. These apply to electrics, glow and gliders.

Rudder - 1
Elevator - 1 or 2
Ailerons - 1 or 2
Spoilers/Flaps - 1 or 2
Motor 1
tow hook 1
landing gear - 1

That makes 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9 or 10 depending on what kind of plane you have.

Could you use 12? Sure, if you have the money? Bomb drops, smoke, lights,
and other stuff, all take channels.

I am not pushing a given number of channels, just trying to help establish
what they are used for.

In my opinion, many sport flyers will be well served with a 6 channel
entry level computer radio, like the the Futaba 6EXA, that
can handle two aileron servos with some special mixing. They can
automatically mix rudder with ailerons for coordinated turns. They can
usually add some elevator compensation mixed with the flaps or spoilers to
keep the plane level when the flaps/spoilers are deployed. These may be all
the channels and all the mixing many flyers will ever need. These entry level
6 channel radios may not be able to do all of these things at once, but
they can do some of them and you can choose which is the most valuable for
you.

If we step up in computer sophistication with 6 or 7 channels we find radios
like the six channel Hitec Optic 6 or a seven channel Futaba 7C. I consider
these advanced sport computer radios. With this class of radio and channel
count, you have about all you need to fly almost any sport plane. The Optic 6
and 7C can do some pretty sophisticated mixing. More importantly they add
more custom mixing that allow you to select what you want to mix and can
handle more mixes at once.

For most of us, a six or seven channel advanced sport computer radio would be
all we would likely ever need. You typically don't have spoilers and flaps on
the same plane, a motor and a tow hook then six or seven is enough. While
landing gear is very rare on sailplanes it is common on power planes. Most
sport planes and mid level sailplanes don't need two flap servos. So six or
seven will still usually do it.

Four servo wings

Here we see radios like the Hitec Eclipse 7, the Futaba 9C, the Multiplex Evo
9 and other advanced radios. I call these midrange radios which handle
complex planes and may carry you into serious competition. These have seven
or more channels but more importantly they have much more powerful computer
software to handle all the servos and how they are mixed and how the mixes can
be changed while the plane is in flight.

If you step into the world of full house sailplanes, now you are into some
complex mixing requirements as much as the number of channels. These planes
have 4 servos in the wings which must each be controlled on their own channel.
That's four channels. Rudder and elevator and you have a full house
sailplane needing 6 channels and sophisticated mixing to allow the pilot to
reshape the wing while the plane is in flight. Normally you want at least 7
channels for a full house sailplane as some of them have motors for launching
or tow hooks for being towed up into the sky.

For aerobatic power planes, you can add two elevator servos that can follow
the ailerons in their function. Each needs its own channel so now we are up
to eight channels and, again, sophisticated computer mixing to fully utilize
all those servos. For the aerobats you may want a nine or more channel radio
so you can handle smoke, lights and other things.

It is worth noting that we are not yet into the professional radios yet which
can have 10 or more channels.


Summary

So, back to the original question of how many channels. The answer is not as
simple as we might have thought. Four is adequate to fly. A computer radio
with 6 can do a lot. I feel 7 channels on an advanced sport radio should
carry most flyers for most or all of their flying career.

If you have your sights on full house sailplanes or advanced aerobatics then
it better be at least 7. For people with their eye on scale sailplanes, I
would say 8
or more channels and a very sophisticated computer radio to
handle it all.

Hope these posts have been helpful.

RE: 4ch or 6ch?
 

also generally 6 channels will have dual rates for atleast 2 channels. I find dual rates a handy feature, though i don't use it much anymore!! it is good for maiden flights :)

RE: 4ch or 6ch?
 

Well, I'm gonna buck what Aeajr has to say. I usually don't recommend that student learning to fly get a computer radio. I have nothing against them having the computer radio, but in all reality it's hard for anybody to not play with all the "bells and whistles" of the radio. And a student doesn't need those bells and whistles. A student needs to learn to fly the plane. Plain and simple. They can't learn to fly a plane if the radio is doing mixes and other features that a computer radio offers. For this reason I usually like to see new pilots on a basic 4/6 channel radio. If they can get the computer radio and not use any of the fancy extras from that radio then that is fine too. But that does take a lot of self control on the part of the student, but they will be a better pilot in the end of they can avoid doing this.

I own 3 computer radios and I do use some of the features that are available, but I try to resist if I can. Why?? Because I think that I am a better pilot if I avoid relying on the radio instead of skill. For example, I used to have an aileron/rudder mix on my radios that I would use when I was making a crosswind landing. I got to where I could make those landing pretty good like that. Then a flying buddy challenged me to do it without the computer radio. I couldn't do it. No matter how hard I tried. So I started practicing manually using the rudder on a crosswind landing. I've gotten my landing down now without relying on the radio. And the landings are so much better than I could ever do with the radio mixing. Why?? Because I have a feel for what the plane is actually doing, I'm flying the plane instead of the radio doing it for me. And that "feel" has helped me in a lot of my other aerobatic maneuvers. The loop for instance. Some feel that the loop is a simple trick to do. But do it in a crosswind. Because of my time on the rudder stick in landings my left thumb knows exactly what to do in a loop during a crosswind to keep the loop tracking straight. It helps almost all of my flying.

So to sum it all up. Learn to fly and don't rely on the radio as a crutch. You'll be a better pilot because of it. I do urge pilots to take advantage of the features of a computer radio, but after they can fly the plane without it.

That's my 2¢ worth.

Ken

RE: 4ch or 6ch?
 

Bear this in mind -- a four channel basic radio will be usefull for many years with many models.

These are also basic flying skills that will remain undeveloped by "dumbing down" the degree of difficulty through the employment of mixing.


The economics of computer radios are undeniably good, but they have disadvantages as well as a host of advantages -- they encourage electronic bandaiding of airframe faults, they suppress airmanship (for example, I fly my KE loops without using mixing) & they discourage the development of design/building skills & problem solving that come from engineering capability into an airframe, instead of dialling up a solution. There are a few things that can't be done without a computer radio, but there are a lot more that can with a bit of thought on the part of the builder -- for example, there are simple mechanical configurations for elevon functions that don't need computer radios.

I'm not against the use of computer radios -- I use them every time I go flying, but I also regularly use non-computer radios & I match the equipment to the needed end use. What I don't do is use the computer radio to "fix" a poorly flying plane, or to perform a difficult flight evolution -- I like to fly the plane myself..

RE: 4ch or 6ch?
 

Whoa. Thanks for the 'book' guys :) Really helped me a lot!

I would like to say that, although this is in beginner forums, I'm not a complete newbie, so I think I will get a computer radio. I was a little uneasy about them at first, but after reading aeajr post, I believe there are the ones for me!

Thanks everyone (again!)

RE: 4ch or 6ch?
 

Just to throw another wrinkle in the mix..

Don't forget the Tower discount codes when thinking about your radio (that is if you plan to buy from tower.)
Right now they have a 25 off $150 on the main page code 010KY

The 4ch Skysport is $119 w 4 servos
The 4EXA is $149 w 4 servos but after the discount it's $125.. Spend $5 more and get a computer radio? Yeah I can handle that..
It has 4 model memory

Or spend $35 more than the skyport and get a 6EXA for $155 after discount.
It has 6 model memory and can do PCM if you wanted to upgrade recievers later.

Or better yet $85 more than the skysport will get for a 7C for $205!
10 model memory, way more programing options and can go PCM.

All these radios come with the R127DF reciever so if you can't get a 7C today you could always get a 4 or 6EXA then upgrade later..

Personaly I'd go for the 7C or if $$ is a bit tight get the 6EXA.. At a minimum get the 4EXA.. You'll never miss the extra $5!

Oh yeah.. when it comes to adding that 2nd or 3rd plane..

Oh yeah.. Why bother with the flight packs at $119 when you can get a whole new radio kit for $15 more then keep the extra TX for a buddy box or SIM controler.. or just sell it to some guy who needs an upgraded Tx.